Rowan & Pine: A Feminist Folklore & Mythology Podcast - Spill the Tea Leaves #5 ｜✨Witchy Special w⧸ Katie Ortiz, Author ✨

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00:02:19.480 Welcome everybody to a special edition of Ronan Pine Spills the Tea Leaves.

00:02:26.660 If you're new here, this is our sort of, I wouldn't even say it's like a regular segment

00:02:32.460 because we haven't done very many of these.

00:02:35.080 But Emily and I tend to yap a lot and we have a lot of stuff to talk about.

00:02:40.460 And these make it into extra bonus pop culture episodes where we talk about things that we have been reading, watching, playing, Googling in the time in between creating episodes.

00:02:52.300 But I have a very special guest this time. I am joined by author Katie Ortiz.

00:02:59.240 Hi, Katie.

00:03:00.520 Hi, I'm so excited to be here and a chat with you today.

00:03:04.220 We have some really cool witchy media that we're going to talk about because Katie is about to release her debut novel.

00:03:13.400 So, so exciting. She's releasing her debut novel the month that this episode drops.

00:03:18.800 If you're following us on social media, you will have seen a lot of Katie's lovely face showing up on our reels and in our tags and mentions because she was kind enough to provide me with an advanced copy of her book.

00:03:32.760 and i have been getting into the cozy vibes i've been putting on my ambience playlists on youtube

00:03:40.720 and just getting snuggly and reading our book and uh getting into the the witchy goodness um

00:03:47.740 so we're staying on theme we're getting witchy and this is going to be a witchy spill the tea leaves

00:03:53.360 so katie's novel is called the southern sorority of superstitious witches and it drops on is it

00:04:01.580 october 6th yes six okay that's good good round number um and and i thought it would be a great

00:04:09.960 excuse to talk about witchy media get some of katie's recommendations maybe some things that

00:04:15.120 have inspired her along with some of my own rona pine which she which she finds so katie what is

00:04:23.000 your relationship to witchcraft um are you just like you just love everything witchy do you

00:04:28.560 practiced? Do you have any little spells that you like to do? What is it? I've always loved

00:04:34.960 everything witchy. Um, I think it's just such feminine power. Um, I've always connected to, 1.00

00:04:43.260 yes, to connected to that. Um, I also love, you know, fall and Halloween and I feel like those

00:04:49.420 things intertwine very well as well. Um, I love tarot cards. I love to, you know, at the beginning

00:04:57.760 of each month i blow cinnamon through my front door and of course all the superstitions of

00:05:03.320 knocking on wood and things and i like to put out water during a full moon and have some full moon

00:05:08.260 water and um i manifest and i have candles and i just all the witchy goodness that i can get into

00:05:16.760 i do absolutely adore and lots of pop culture witchy things of course yes um you can see so

00:05:24.640 much of that in your book like you can see that it's just sort of a a natural like part of life

00:05:30.640 for you that you're you know you've woven it in through the pages and we'll get into your book

00:05:35.300 a little bit later on um in our chat but for the book if you were to I said like mood board in my

00:05:43.860 notes but like I know a little bit more up to date now is Pinterest so if you were to make like I

00:05:48.820 don't know if you made a Pinterest board for your book like what would be on it like what kind of

00:05:53.260 like aesthetics movies tv shows like what what are you putting on there yeah so when i start a

00:05:59.480 project before i ever even start drafting i always make a mood board well okay a pinterest board

00:06:05.380 um so i actually went back and looked in my pinterest board that i made three four years

00:06:13.040 ago when i was getting ready to write this book and there were lots of um women's rights activists

00:06:21.200 from the 1800s, lots of photos and things from that. There were also lots of kind of dark academia

00:06:29.060 books, libraries, typewriters, letters, dripping candles. And then there's also like the nature

00:06:37.960 and the southern aspects. So like there were lots of pictures of woods and full moons and cornfields

00:06:46.240 dripping glasses of sweet tea with perspiration on the side.

00:06:51.880 Oh, my God.

00:06:52.180 Just all the main three elements kind of intertwined within each other.

00:06:58.180 And then I also had a lot of inspiration for the outfits

00:07:01.060 because, you know, the outfits in the 1800s were very intricate,

00:07:05.100 had lots of pieces and things.

00:07:07.320 And so I saved lots of inspiration for the different outfits,

00:07:11.620 especially since my three characters are kind of from three different...

00:07:16.240 societal classes so they kind of have three different wardrobes and one of my characters

00:07:21.800 goes through this process of kind of getting a makeover because she's a little more on the

00:07:26.020 tomboy side and she doesn't really want to wear all of the things the corsets and the crinlins 1.00

00:07:30.760 and the petticoats um so she had to go through that so i had to save a lot of outfit choices

00:07:36.260 and options so you're saying if this got made into like a movie or tv show you already have

00:07:41.380 the starting points you're ready to send those off yeah oh yeah for sure please come my way

00:07:49.000 I would be the exact same I would need to see like everything like obviously because it helps

00:07:55.700 you like with your process if you're trying to plan something it's so cool to see things that

00:08:00.880 like yes that is exactly what I'm talking about or like you can see it in your head first of all

00:08:05.400 and then when you see like somebody like because there's so many talented people on like Pinterest

00:08:09.560 and online when they have like captured exactly what you're going for i think that really helps

00:08:15.100 yes and another thing i think as well is um music so is there any sort of like soundtrack i know

00:08:23.400 your book is post-civil war would that be right like just yeah so is there any like music that

00:08:29.760 you were listening to was it either for that time period or just maybe from characters or

00:08:34.700 um so along with the mood board I'm a very multi-sensory creator so when I start drafting

00:08:43.180 I have my mood board and then I create a whole playlist and I also usually pick out candles and

00:08:48.840 teas so my god very multi-sensory but I pulled up my playlist that I made um for this book that

00:08:56.000 listened to the whole time i was drafting it and it's mostly mostly uh feminist leaning songs kind

00:09:05.880 of female rage songs and witchy songs um some of my favorites that i know i must have listened to

00:09:13.860 more than a thousand times uh labor by paris paloma huge one i mean my anthem in life in

00:09:22.240 general but also my books anthem 10 out 10 if you have not heard that song please go listen to it

00:09:28.820 i also recommend listening to labor the cacophony absolutely phenomenal the female rage oh it's so

00:09:37.380 good do you remember when she sort of because it was just labor that came out i don't know if you 0.84

00:09:41.960 were like following her at the time i remember that song just blew up and then she released a

00:09:46.180 video where she had compiled everybody like yes doing the lip sync oh my god goosebumps it was

00:09:52.480 just the most amazing i remember that and she just blew up and it was phenomenal i also have

00:10:00.120 um let's see hecate by wendy rule i mean the devil by soap and skins

00:10:08.840 girl with one eye by Florence and the machine yeah burn your village by Kiki Rockwell 0.58

00:10:16.600 oh my gosh I feel like Kiki Rockwell is like every time we are moving into a new era in like

00:10:25.300 Rowan and Pine where we're like oh we'll do witchy this time or we'll do more myths Kiki

00:10:29.320 Rockwell for some reason is doing the exact same thing like we're um we just released like our

00:10:35.000 our sea timbre episode as we're recording this and uh like last year our sea timbre episode was

00:10:41.400 on selkies and she literally just dropped a video on selkies like a music video like oh my god she's

00:10:47.180 so like she's so interesting such an interesting artist i love i love her work what a good icon

00:10:53.400 to be on the same level as i know and like where's this going from i choose to believe she's getting

00:10:59.460 inspiration from us but yeah let's make a new theme song yeah exactly exactly so yeah i think

00:11:07.660 i leaned more um feminine rage and uh feminist witchy vibes for the playlist there's a lot of

00:11:15.440 songs that are very similar to each other um us and pigs by sophia isella was also a really big

00:11:22.640 yes oh amazing you guys you're just like listing out and everything that like emily and i would

00:11:29.140 have put on a playlist i think for like feminine rage and yeah so so good um but yeah we're here

00:11:36.700 to talk about your book so first of all i just want to stop off um i know in your goodreads

00:11:42.680 listing you mentioned both wayward and wishcraft for wayward girls um do you have any other like

00:11:50.320 witchy books that you've enjoyed or anything that like you're like do i we could be here all day

00:11:57.040 yeah boy do i um i think half my library is witchy books i had to actually narrow down a list

00:12:06.080 for this and which i saw you had some listed as well but um one of my favorites and it was a huge

00:12:13.340 inspiration for this book was the once and future witches by alexie harrow it's very um feminist

00:12:20.740 leaning women's rights. It goes big into suffrage and getting the right to vote. And it just has 1.00

00:12:27.680 some phenomenal witchy elements. It also has three POVs of three different women going through 0.94

00:12:33.800 different things. They're actually three sisters, but just phenomenal read. I try to recommend it

00:12:39.900 all the time. Of course, Wayward is also phenomenal. I think it has a lot of the same

00:12:44.740 vibes is my book um and i love that wayward is a three different timeline yeah point of view books

00:12:53.220 it's very intricate and very well woven together the lost apothecary by sarah pinner is also a

00:13:01.780 really good one and it also has two different timelines i believe that's that is on my tbr

00:13:09.560 just like as you're saying that i can see the cover in my in my head like yeah that is definitely

00:13:14.400 on my tbr yeah for sure it's so good 10 out of 10 recommend um i also wrote down the year of the

00:13:21.980 witching by alexis henderson it's on the darker more like religious cult side it was super

00:13:29.500 intriguing i've been reading back through it actually uh for some inspiration for my next

00:13:33.980 book, but I also have The Witches of New York by Amy McKay. It has a lot of really good historical

00:13:40.180 elements in it. I love when books have like elements of different media, like newspaper

00:13:47.740 excerpts or letters, things like mixing in those different media outlets. I love that. And that

00:13:53.840 book does it in a really, really beautiful way. I love that too. And I love that the letters in

00:14:00.480 your book as well like i i love that when you turn a page and there's a letter you're like oh

00:14:04.520 what is this you know it's just it sort of breaks up like the prose a little bit too it's it's really

00:14:09.380 fun yeah i love that as well and that's actually those letters are inspired by real life letters

00:14:15.780 that i read between the two people that inspired my main character lucille and henry so i read a

00:14:23.660 whole book of their letters and it was so interesting and intriguing and it's so surreal

00:14:29.260 reading like real life letters that real life people wrote 100, 200 years ago and hearing their

00:14:36.420 words. It's just. So were they like figures that you were familiar with from like history or are

00:14:43.860 they like local to you or the inspiration? I mean, no, I wish they would have been more familiar to

00:14:50.740 me. I wish they would have been more people that were brought up in history class and whatnot.

00:14:55.700 i actually the first time i ever heard about lucy stone was i was listening to another podcast i

00:15:01.640 love podcasts and i think the podcast is called things we didn't learn in history class which is

00:15:09.480 very accurate um and the whole episode was about lucy stone and she was one of only seven women

00:15:18.060 invited to test out co-education which is the premise of my novel and where i got that inspiration

00:15:24.660 from. And she also courted and married Henry Blackwell. And they had just a whole slew of

00:15:33.420 letters between them. And when they got married, she was one of the first women of the time to

00:15:40.220 not take his last name and to keep her own name. I can see the connection with Lucille in your book.

00:15:47.280 Definitely. Yeah. So that was huge inspiration. And their letters were a huge inspiration. And

00:15:53.000 i just knew that i wanted to include that epistolary element and bring in like direct

00:15:58.700 quotes and things from their letters as well gorgeous i love that so much um so yeah for

00:16:06.620 uh i pulled a few from my i had to deep dive in my goodreads i'm like i'm so bad for i'll remember

00:16:13.400 the vibes of the book and i'll remember characters but like remembering the names of books i'm just

00:16:18.460 so bad i don't know what it is absolutely so first i pulled uh spells for forgetting by adrian young

00:16:27.120 this one is like a cozy practical magic uh vibe paired with murder mystery and it's got a second

00:16:34.100 chance romance trope which i am a huge sucker for um so just the quick blurb is emery blackwood's

00:16:41.860 life changed forever the night her best friend was found dead and the love of her life august salt

00:16:47.160 was accused of murdering her years later she is doing what her teenage self swore she would

00:16:52.220 she never would living a quiet existence on the misty remote shores of Saoirse Island and running

00:16:58.520 the family's business Blackwood's tea shop herbal tonics and tea leaf readings but when the island

00:17:04.860 rooted in local folklore and magic begins to show signs of strange happenings Emery knows that

00:17:10.540 something is coming the morning she wakes to find that every single tree on Saoirse has turned color

00:17:15.620 in a single night August returns for the first time in 14 years and unearths the past that the

00:17:21.540 town has tried desperately to forget so especially like the little like town shop um that is very

00:17:29.060 practical magic and like it's very like short of like reading the practical magic book I think

00:17:34.560 it's probably the closest that anyone could get um next I have Circe by Madeline Miller

00:17:42.680 this is a gorgeous retelling

00:17:45.840 of Cersei the demigoddess 0.96

00:17:47.780 daughter of Helios

00:17:48.860 the book is a love letter to her

00:17:50.760 and how she essentially 0.91

00:17:52.340 creates or discovers witchcraft

00:17:55.000 anybody who's watched the Odyssey

00:17:56.800 the portrayal of Cersei

00:17:59.620 in the Odyssey is actually very close

00:18:01.500 to Madeline Miller's Cersei

00:18:02.940 with her 1.00

00:18:04.940 she has a history of sexual violence against her

00:18:07.640 and her distrust of men

00:18:10.000 stemming from that 1.00

00:18:11.980 um is very that's that's the way madeline miller really honed in on her character and 0.68

00:18:18.360 portrayed her which is really interesting um the next i have next one i had is the ex-hex

00:18:24.640 by erin sterling this is a fun kitty's nodding her head have you read this one i love that book

00:18:30.520 it's so fun actually lives not far from me she lives maybe two hours from me oh that's incredible

00:18:37.460 i think what like the moment this book was sold for me and it was like because she's like doing

00:18:43.800 a spell in the first in the first chapter with a bath and body works candle and i'm like that's

00:18:49.580 incredible i love that so much so that is just the vibe of that book it's a cute modern cozy

00:18:57.040 mystery featuring a flawed heroine and the rich broody one that got away and he's from like

00:19:02.400 sort of witchy like a witchy dynasty it's it's very cool it's really well done um next is the

00:19:10.820 book that i finished right before i started katies um and it is slew foot by brahm um have you read

00:19:18.340 slew foot as well it's fantastic it's incredible it is um i actually meant to send emily a voice

00:19:28.040 clip because emily is not a horror movie gore movie person um and she was asking me a while ago

00:19:35.360 if i thought she would like to watch the film the witch um the robert eggers film she asked if i

00:19:43.120 thought that she would be able to watch the witch and i was like i think it's a little bit gory for

00:19:46.780 you but i think that she to get the vibes of it she should read slew foot um because it's very

00:19:53.200 much the colonial like edge of civilization you know being tempted by this like wooden a woodland

00:20:02.640 uh well in slew foot it's like a woodland uh entity um i'm pretty sure in the witch it is

00:20:09.700 actually the devil but there's a lot of yeah all those like dark spooky witch trial vibes um it's

00:20:17.920 it's so good it really transports you to puritanical times and delivers just everything

00:20:22.760 that you would want from the premise um and then next i don't know if you're a gamer katie do you

00:20:28.820 play any games my husband is a gamer um but i have i've never really uh played video games

00:20:36.200 i've always just been reading books yeah i am the same so like uh my husband is also a gamer and our

00:20:42.900 thing would always be he would play a game in the same room that i would read a book yes exactly

00:20:47.500 yeah it's the perfect duo it's like parallel play it's so fun it's nice um but i recently so he got

00:20:54.980 a nintendo switch and he found he like keeps finding these games he's like i think you would

00:20:59.940 like this and i'm always like i get so frustrated with games like i always want to be perfect at

00:21:05.380 something right away so like the learning curve is just so bad for me yeah it's why i could never

00:21:11.880 like master an instrument because i can't go through the process of being terrible at it

00:21:15.620 help so it's so rough for perfectionists um but there are three games that i have fallen in love

00:21:26.000 with because there are is very little that you need to actually be able to do um and you're just

00:21:30.880 sort of farming um the first one is witchwood it's a crafting adventure game set in a land of

00:21:37.580 gothic fables and fairy tales um you play as the old witch of the woods you explore a strange

00:21:43.540 countryside collect magic ingredients brew sorcerous spells and pass judgment and upon a

00:21:50.160 capricious cast of characters it's a lot of fun um it's uh like some like nice like witchy old

00:21:57.760 grumpy old lady humor which i i really love um the next one is wildflowers uh you follow tara

00:22:06.060 on a heartfelt journey to become a witch in wildflowers farm by day cast spells by night

00:22:11.620 and there's like a whole like cottagecore vibe to it and a storyline that you you follow and then

00:22:18.620 last one is one that i'm currently playing although i haven't actually played it in a while

00:22:23.280 because we're getting ready for spooky season in podcasting so there's no time to do anything else

00:22:28.900 um it is moonlight peaks now this one you're technically a vampire but it is set in a magical

00:22:37.200 town full of werewolves witches mermaids and more and you get to make potions and cast spells

00:22:42.100 so this is just for anybody who needs to like just not scroll and maybe you're in a reading slump um

00:22:47.920 that you haven't like been able to get out of for whatever reason it's a it's another uh witchy

00:22:52.800 alternative for anybody that's out there um because i my scrolling lately has gotten a bit

00:22:59.020 much so maybe a game would be a better alternative to just doom scrolling yes because it's almost

00:23:05.080 impossible like there's nothing worse than when you're reading and then you blink and then you

00:23:09.200 realize you're looking at your phone it's so annoying you're just like why am i doing that

00:23:12.960 happens yeah i need to put my phone across the room or something it's awful um okay so now we'll

00:23:20.300 get into some witchy movies and tv so katie if you were having a movie night what would your

00:23:26.800 like triple feature be your three witchy movie picks and i gave you some like prompts so the

00:23:32.900 first one was for the witchcraft aesthetic what what would be your favorite movie for that

00:23:37.400 i this was a hard one i also i'm like emily i don't like gory movies very much um which is so

00:23:47.720 funny because i can read anything i've read very gory books and i can read whatever but movies i

00:23:54.020 stick to cozier things i guess just because with books i can imagine it kind of any way i want in

00:24:01.400 my head yeah yeah but whereas movies you can't so for the witchcraft aesthetic i did pick practical

00:24:09.760 magic um because i loved the whole i mean everything i loved everything but i loved the

00:24:18.280 big grimoire they had i loved when they did the witchcraft and the different things and then i

00:24:24.340 also loved how she was supposed to put something white on the guy's body and she's like what was

00:24:30.440 it whipped cream yes i love that i love that um i don't know is there like a name for that trope

00:24:36.920 where there'll be something like witchy uh but they have to have have it modern like when they

00:24:42.000 use the the vacuum cleaners um in practical magic yes exactly sabrina the teenage witch she used to

00:24:49.000 fly around on a vacuum cleaner as well i love that when they like update it yeah it just makes

00:24:54.660 it more realistic you think in your head like that's probably what i would do too yeah it's

00:24:59.680 great it's so fun um so the next one is for the spookiness now I do I know you've said that you're

00:25:05.580 not really like a horror fan but like spooky doesn't need to be scary it can just be like a

00:25:10.260 yeah I okay yeah so again I'm not a super big horror movie fan I love any books but movies a

00:25:20.280 little iffy um so I picked the witches which is based off the book by Raul Dow um I read it to

00:25:28.400 my class every year and then we watched the movie together and I do remember as a kid thinking that

00:25:34.080 this movie was very spooky and so I always have to warn my students ahead of time like when there's

00:25:39.420 a part that might be a little spookier for them um so when I think like spooky witchy movies

00:25:45.420 I think the witches even though it's it's a kid's movie it's probably not spooky there's so many

00:25:52.640 people that they're like that's there's a lot of horror fans that they're like I watched that and

00:25:57.180 that's when I realize I love horror and then there are other people that are just like that like

00:26:01.440 traumatized me as a kid which there are some parts of those movies like that movie like that it's

00:26:07.200 just yeah I can't believe I feel like they wouldn't be able to do it now like people would

00:26:12.360 like complain you know yeah I agree with that um and for a cozy time what what would you choose

00:26:22.260 i love disney witchy halloween movies like yes i love hocus pocus i mean who doesn't i love

00:26:32.320 hocus pocus halloween town twitches those are kind of my go-to cozies i watch them every year

00:26:40.700 sometimes multiple times a year why not um so i i think out of those three i'd probably pick

00:26:46.480 Hocus Pocus it's my all-time fave it's so good like it's I know there have been sequels of both

00:26:54.820 Practical Magic and Hocus Pocus I don't know if it's nostalgia or like I'm not a huge fan of how

00:27:00.440 like polished the newer movies look I love it yeah I agree with that I have I'm actually going

00:27:07.180 to see the new Practical Magic movie tonight I haven't seen it yet but I have seen the new

00:27:12.160 hocus pocus movie and it just looks too modern it just looks too bright and shiny and i don't i

00:27:23.000 can't even explain it it just doesn't have the gritty grittiness to it yes i feel like they

00:27:27.500 should put like a 90s filter over them or something exactly surely we have the technology for that

00:27:32.920 right like because i think i said like when i first saw the practical magic 2 trailer and i

00:27:38.800 have not also not seen it um so i can't really comment on the actual movie but i remember seeing

00:27:44.400 it and going like the colors are wrong or like it just didn't feel like it felt like there was too

00:27:49.380 much like it was too sparkly or something i don't know yes exactly i totally get what you're saying

00:27:54.720 yeah thank you i feel validated

00:27:57.280 um so my three picks were for the witchcraft aesthetic um i chose the craft mainly because

00:28:06.880 the outfits are so good and like the whole like 90s wicca sort of vibe of the craft is just

00:28:16.200 incredible it's there's a reason why like every like clothing brand that's even slightly

00:28:22.900 alternative seems to bring out like this is our craft collection because everybody wants those

00:28:27.740 outfits it's oh it's incredible um for the spookiness i chose the witch um because it really

00:28:36.100 is my husband actually went through a phase of so have you have you seen the witch i've seen bits

00:28:42.800 and pieces i've i'm trying to work up the courage to watch the whole thing well like not to spoil it

00:28:50.660 too much but there is like a a scene with a goat that like whispers and my husband went through a

00:28:57.920 phase of every time like I was trying to go go asleep he would start whispering the goat like

00:29:02.680 the goat's lines to me and I'm like anybody whispering in the dark is terrifying like why

00:29:08.140 are you doing this to me so yeah that's it's definitely a spooky spooky time so yes that's my

00:29:15.580 that's my choice for number two the spookiness and then just for cozy time i did practical magic

00:29:21.460 for this one because i just think like the midnight margaritas the the cozy sweaters that

00:29:29.300 they're wearing all the time the small town vibes like it is just uh unmatched yes i actually thought

00:29:36.880 about picking the craft for my spooky one um i actually just watched the craft for the first

00:29:43.760 time a few months ago which is just wild that i made it this far in life and loving witchcraft

00:29:50.400 type things yeah for me to not watch it but um yeah the craft i definitely agree with that being

00:29:58.800 like the witchcraft aesthetic because you're right it is very kind of wicca and hot topic

00:30:05.120 clothing type of brand um and it does have a little bit of the dark academia too because

00:30:11.820 or in a private school yeah see that yeah I thought that as well like they are also at a

00:30:16.460 school setting so it has the academia vibe um I think if it were on my list I'd probably go

00:30:23.240 spooky just because I'm a chicken but no like it's true like and especially like that like um

00:30:30.840 the third act of that movie when you know the relationship really breaks down between the

00:30:36.040 girls um yeah it's definitely spooky and there are some scary witches in in that movie

00:30:41.480 and they really um turn against each other don't they yeah they really do um it's the dark side of

00:30:49.620 sisterhood i think when you i agree when like the the bond breaks down it really breaks down

00:30:55.820 because you know so much about each other you know oh yeah you're right i never i didn't even

00:30:59.920 think about that um so for i was trying to think of like shows that i would put on if it was like

00:31:08.640 a stormy autumn or fall day outside um that i would like you could watch like five or six

00:31:17.100 episodes in a row at least i think would be good so i picked agatha all along from disney

00:31:22.840 um which is really good like i've heard from like uh apparently like from practicing witches

00:31:30.860 they've said that the witchcraft in that is actually really accurate like the yeah the the

00:31:37.980 which i would not have expected from a disney yeah i haven't watched agatha all along i have

00:31:45.120 watched wandavision um so i got to see kind of like the beginning of where that spinoff came

00:31:52.280 from yeah and of course i loved this the theme song of agatha all along yeah in my head for

00:31:57.980 months um but now with you saying that i'll have to go watch that because i would be very interested

00:32:03.800 to see it yes and it is very much um it's all about sisterhood and it's all about like uh

00:32:11.040 finding your coven that's essentially the whole the whole premise of it they're trying to assemble

00:32:15.460 a coven yeah you really do it's it's so good um the next is sanctuary i think outside of the uk

00:32:22.380 it's called sanctuary a witch's tale so this one i feel like it's based on a book although i should

00:32:30.340 have double checked um the premise of this one is uh witchcraft is legal and it's open um but

00:32:38.200 there is a sort of um there's a witch in this small town in in england that is she's essentially

00:32:48.220 like the small town physician but a witch like so people go to her for like minor maladies or

00:32:54.620 like if they need a spell done for something and she is registered with the government and like

00:32:59.280 um and all of that which is it's a really cool premise um I find it a little bit um 1.00

00:33:06.700 a little bit distracting first of all because it's based in the UK and being Irish I could tell

00:33:12.500 that it was filmed in Ireland because I could recognize all these places and a lot of the

00:33:17.540 actors are also Irish and you can hear it in their accents I'm like this is not this is taking me out

00:33:22.480 of it but if if you don't have an ear for Irish accents that probably would not would not bother

00:33:28.300 anybody um and it i think it does have a second season that's coming because there's a whole like

00:33:34.400 witch trial aspect coming um from it which is really cool um the next i had was i had to say

00:33:42.300 chilling and chilling adventures of sabrina because i thought like aesthetically if we were

00:33:48.800 picking like a witchy aesthetic tv show i would have picked that one i just thought it was flawless

00:33:54.000 it just looked beautiful yes and the weird sisters like oh my gosh yeah just like darkly

00:34:02.720 beautiful the whole thing very cinematically gothic and dark academia very much yes so and

00:34:12.700 just oh yeah love it love that show i'm so sad that like it didn't get as long a run as it could

00:34:19.360 yeah um then i had to say the original sabrina because i mean how could you not it's just a

00:34:27.800 classic for a reason and um the only thing that's missing from the chilling adventures of sabrina is

00:34:33.640 salem the actual salem because he's just the greatest cat character i think of all time so

00:34:41.580 absolutely the greatest familiar ever portrayed on screen um we love him so much uh and then

00:34:49.820 charmed now i never watched the charmed reboot but i was obsessed with the original charmed when it

00:34:56.720 was airing um oh my god just incredible it did go a little bit crazy towards the end when they had

00:35:04.340 like a magical school and all of this that was happening i'm just like this started off with

00:35:08.920 like three sisters living in San Francisco how did we get here but it's just yeah I actually

00:35:15.980 think I did watch a little bit of the reboot when it first started up and I don't even know if it

00:35:22.360 continued for very long no I want to say I didn't even watch maybe the full first season yeah just

00:35:31.560 a few of them but it was it didn't seem to get great reviews like but yeah I think it's just

00:35:37.500 when there's something that people loved so much it's so hard to reboot it you know right it is

00:35:44.320 sometimes you just gotta stop while you're ahead yeah yeah absolutely um so i have some like tv

00:35:53.000 adjacent questions if you could wake up tomorrow in a witchy show which one would you choose okay

00:35:58.800 so i don't know how many people are gonna know this show go ahead let's try a little niche and

00:36:04.440 it got canceled after two seasons which just still makes me so upset um it was called the

00:36:11.480 witches of east end okay i remember seeing this this like because obviously my algorithm knows

00:36:18.220 i love witches so i kept getting served this but i never watched it yeah it was just i loved

00:36:25.040 i thought the witchcraft was very i mean it was like hollywood magic of course but they also had

00:36:31.020 tarot cards and it it brought in a lot of the more like celtic and wicca and things like that

00:36:38.800 and the main characters i really adored there were like two aunts which i don't know why there

00:36:44.120 are always two aunts but there are yeah they're fabulous yeah and there was this really neat

00:36:49.520 storyline of kind of like this family curse going on that they were trying to break and

00:36:53.640 And one of the sisters, oh, I think her name was, oh, man, I forgot it now.

00:37:01.340 Imogene, maybe, or something similar to that.

00:37:04.300 Or Ingrid. 0.66

00:37:05.040 Her name was Ingrid.

00:37:05.820 I didn't even start with the I.

00:37:07.700 And I just felt like me and Ingrid would be BFFs.

00:37:11.580 She was a librarian, and she was also a witch.

00:37:14.100 And I just, I adored it.

00:37:16.760 And the second season ended on this massive cliffhanger.

00:37:22.020 and then it got canceled and i mean still to this day am so upset oh my gosh that's awful i hate

00:37:32.520 when that happens when you're enjoying something so was this set where where is this set is it said

00:37:38.740 it's a great question i'm gonna be honest i'm not sure i want to say it's more up north

00:37:44.660 okay like massachusetts kind of um probably one of the ants turn like could turn into a cat

00:37:52.480 nice which i thought was cool it's kind of like a different play on the whole cat familiar thing

00:37:57.120 um i thought that was very neat and there was shape shifters and all kinds of like really fun

00:38:03.080 cool things i just thought the whole vibe it was it was a cozy vibe it was a magical witchy vibe

00:38:09.820 i just loved it and if anyone's listening that cares please reboot that show yes we will start

00:38:18.740 a campaign because yeah i think that's why i maybe did not start it because i knew that it

00:38:24.280 was canceled um which is a shame but it's a shame because you do miss out on so many things but

00:38:30.520 you're like i'm just going to be let down you know and you are and it ends on a cliffhanger

00:38:35.940 and it's so sad that's horrible um are you are there any shows that you think give off similar

00:38:45.020 vibes to your book to like even if it's just like the relationships or the characters or

00:38:55.120 anything are there any that you well now that you mention agatha all along i'm gonna have to

00:39:00.740 go check that out because that does sound very similar um i haven't watched a ton of this show

00:39:08.860 but the mayfair witches it's set in louisiana so it kind of has the southern gothic vibe going on

00:39:19.540 and it's got a very powerful female-centered storyline with like generational magic or

00:39:26.680 witchcraft um but i would say mine is a more cozier and more southern charm and sisterhood

00:39:36.300 um i don't there's lots of elements i think i could pull from different shows and just yeah

00:39:43.280 stir them well that's good like you don't want to have something that's already been made right

00:39:48.500 you want to have like your own thing so yeah if you take maybe the southern gothic vibes of the

00:39:54.240 Mayfair which is the dark academia from um the chilling adventures of Sabrina and then maybe like

00:40:02.120 the more sisterhood vibes of Agatha all along and you put them in a cauldron and you stir them up

00:40:08.120 like a witch do a little spell you'll have my book perfect who could pass that up what a great pitch

00:40:16.200 um so we were talking about like you uh would love to do a movie or tv adaptation if that was

00:40:26.780 ever in the works do you have fan casts for your characters do you have face casts anybody that

00:40:32.760 you're like this is who i would love to play this character say for your like three mains

00:40:39.040 your three main characters um well i mean first of all if i'm getting a movie made or a tv show

00:40:44.520 I'm just a happy camper I'm happy to be there I'm cheering them along you know um but I will say

00:40:54.980 so I have three main characters I have Lucille Catherine and Victoria um I do definitely have

00:41:03.900 a fan cast for Catherine she is very um she's short she's voluptuous she has red hair she's

00:41:12.840 very high class high society and i the whole time i was writing this book i pictured penelope from

00:41:21.560 bridgerton me too when i was reading i was like actress and i love that the actress is very um

00:41:28.480 into human rights and lgbtq plus rights and women's rights and stuff so i think she would

00:41:35.600 be phenomenal as a person but also phenomenal as a fan cast because she I mean that's literally who

00:41:44.620 I wrote the character to look like so yes as I was reading it I was like the curves I mean just

00:41:51.180 yes she would be yes 10 out of 10 Nicola Coughlin is the actress just for anybody who's yelling it

00:41:57.960 thank you thank you i love her so much yes um she would be phenomenal the other two are a little

00:42:05.740 harder for me and i don't know if i quite have an exact pick in my head uh i don't know if have

00:42:13.660 you ever watched fried green tomatoes no i haven't it's it's a very uh well i guess it's not very old

00:42:21.140 but it's an older southern movie um there's a character there's two characters on there that i

00:42:26.680 think are very much like lucille and victoria um one of them is her name is iggy and she's she's

00:42:34.880 got the short choppy blonde hair she's very outspoken you know says whatever's on her mind

00:42:41.020 very loud and then the other main character on that movie i have just forgotten her name but she

00:42:48.420 has the brunette hair and she's more quiet and she kind of keeps herself and she's more introverted

00:42:54.760 so those are kind of who i picture yeah but as far as a modern like right now if i was going to

00:43:02.180 pick someone i don't know who i would quite pick for lucille and victoria i think it's um

00:43:07.820 like it's it's good that like you don't have like your your rigid thing because i mean it shows that

00:43:14.380 because it was it is sort of left open enough is you sort of can picture them but there's no like

00:43:18.880 like settle down like set down like this is exactly who this would be there is somebody

00:43:25.000 that I was I have in my head for Lucille and I'm trying to think what she's been in now you're

00:43:32.220 probably going to see this and you'll be like I have no idea who that person is or like that is

00:43:36.120 not what she looks like at all um I think is she in Silicon Valley I want to say her name is

00:43:42.580 oh I can't pronounce it right Saoirse. Saoirse Ronan? Yes I think she would be a good Lucille.

00:43:50.700 Wow yes um you you would have like two out of three Irish actors because Nicola Coughlin is

00:43:56.400 Irish too. Nice well you know maybe it's like something something in the air. And it's it's

00:44:02.620 always so fun to see other people's fan casts of characters. Yes for sure. Because you're like I

00:44:07.900 wasn't getting that at all but okay yeah I always when I'm reading a book I like to look up a fan

00:44:13.800 cast just so I can picture and I'll see one person's fan cast and then another and they're

00:44:20.040 like complete opposites I'm like wow did we read the same book I know it's it's crazy but like

00:44:27.160 I guess like you also have to think of like there are people that just sort of um

00:44:32.540 they'll like sort of see what they want to see so like if there's if there are certain

00:44:38.240 characteristics of a character that they love or they can attribute to somebody else that's sort

00:44:42.380 of what they'll go with um but at least they're connecting with the character that's always

00:44:46.300 absolutely i would if i saw someone post a random fan cast of my book i think i would cry that would

00:44:52.940 be i think that would might be one of my moments of like i made it i did it yeah yeah that's got

00:44:58.980 to be such a great feeling as an author yeah um okay so let's get down to your

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00:46:06.360 Book. So your book releases on October 6th.

00:46:10.040 I took like a one-line summary of your premise.

00:46:14.300 You can correct me if I'm wrong.

00:46:15.360 So it is post-Civil War witches in Alabama form a sorority to fight the patriarchy.

00:46:21.360 absolutely yeah no you hit it you hit the nail on the head our listeners are immediately looking

00:46:29.380 that up because they're like that just sounds amazing um so you had mentioned that like this

00:46:34.640 book has been part of your life for like was it three years how long how long have you been like

00:46:39.240 thinking about it working yeah so I want to say four years I kind of started thinking about it

00:46:46.840 and maybe about three years that I started writing it and really working on it.

00:46:53.200 It was a long process coming, but the drafting of the book,

00:46:58.380 like the first draft I did in a month, like that was very fast.

00:47:02.980 It is the editing and revising and finding an agent to represent me.

00:47:07.820 That was a long, long process.

00:47:10.000 Oh my gosh. I would say it was like heartbreaking,

00:47:12.620 like because especially there are so many people writing right now.

00:47:16.320 Like so many books coming out and like obviously people are self-publishing or like, you know, writing is becoming a little bit more accessible.

00:47:24.500 So it's, you know, it's got to be really intimidating to like actually try and find representation and get your work out there, right?

00:47:32.020 Yes, absolutely.

00:47:33.180 I think I read a statistic somewhere that said you were more likely to get into Harvard than to get represented by an agent.

00:47:42.640 Oh my God, well, look at you.

00:47:43.940 It blows my mind.

00:47:46.320 that's incredible certainly not getting into harvard

00:47:48.660 that's that's crazy like that's such a such a feather in your cap to be able to say like you

00:47:55.680 you got representation you finished a book first of all like how many people start a book and then

00:48:00.420 just it goes nowhere you know absolutely so and then you're putting it out into the world

00:48:07.140 um so i know you said lucille and henry are sort of based on like real life people were they the

00:48:15.140 first characters that came to you or did you have any other characters that sort of formed first for

00:48:19.620 you? Yeah, Lucille was definitely the very first character because of Lucy Stone's story. I knew

00:48:29.460 right off the bat kind of the direction I wanted to take her in and how I wanted her to form her

00:48:37.140 relationships and how I wanted her character arc to go throughout the story. I would say

00:48:43.940 Victoria might have been the second one that came to me I sometimes when I'm thinking of an idea of

00:48:50.940 a book I like to think on it marinate on it for a while before I start writing anything and I'll

00:48:57.900 just get little snippets of lines in my head and then I'll go to my notes app and write it down

00:49:03.480 really quickly usually I'm in the shower or driving so I have to like yeah find creative

00:49:08.060 ways to write it down. But I just remember the line Victoria says, I think Lucille makes some

00:49:16.400 kind of comment about sleeping with the enemy or something because Victoria goes out and kind of 0.60

00:49:23.920 has a little fling. And the line that Victoria says about, you know, they don't hesitate to use

00:49:31.840 us or find pleasure in us so why shouldn't we with them or something along that yeah that line

00:49:39.440 came to me very vividly I think I was in the shower way before I ever outlined or even really

00:49:49.520 fully knew the premise of the story that was the first thing and then as I got to researching about

00:49:57.460 women's rights and women's rights activists. I really loved reading about Victoria Woodhull 0.73

00:50:04.180 and she was a big advocate for free love. And she was, she actually tried to be one of the first 0.93

00:50:11.680 women presidents and tried to campaign for that and everything back in the day where you couldn't 1.00

00:50:17.820 even vote as a woman. So she was very ambitious and I was very inspired by her. So that was

00:50:24.740 probably the second character I came up with and then along the way I knew I I knew I wanted three

00:50:30.740 very dynamic characters and very um different characters so you could really see yourself in

00:50:39.160 any of them as you're reading but I knew I had this like outspoken farm girl and I had this

00:50:45.440 quiet introverted working woman who worked in a mill and so then I was like well how can I balance

00:50:53.320 out those characters. And that's kind of how I came up with Catherine. And I think Catherine is

00:50:59.180 very much a woman that I see a lot here in the South, a woman of, um, a very Southern woman,

00:51:08.660 a very, um, a woman who maybe doesn't at the start of the story know her privilege and what

00:51:15.600 that means to have privilege and, um, how others don't have that privilege and how others have to

00:51:23.020 live because of that so that was a big part of her character arc and yeah you can definitely see

00:51:29.760 that with Catherine like as she each time that she sort of goes back home and she's exposed to

00:51:35.260 her mother's friends like the church yeah you can see her getting a little bit more well actually

00:51:41.000 this isn't how it's supposed to work and like why don't we do something why don't we use our

00:51:45.600 powers for good you know like our privilege for good it's it's an interesting arc to see her go

00:51:51.020 on it's it's really fun it's it's nice because you're like yes because you can see a kindness

00:51:55.620 in her from the very beginning like she is just she's just a very good person like the time that

00:52:01.180 you spend with her um you're like yeah there's no like harm in her um but you it's just a little

00:52:08.160 bit of naivety I think is is her only issue and I think there's something to be said about when

00:52:13.640 you go off to college and you get away from you know family or people who are influencing you

00:52:20.280 while you were growing up and you start to form your own beliefs and you start to meet people who

00:52:24.660 are outside of your culture your race your social class and you do start forming new opinions new

00:52:32.900 ideas and then when you go home again you're like oh wow you see things from a new lens and a new

00:52:39.620 light and you're like oh okay so this is maybe a little different than I thought it was yeah yeah

00:52:44.800 that's so true and um i did love that like because obviously they're attending university

00:52:51.140 like for the first time um and like they're the first women there like that you didn't shy away

00:52:56.260 from their own sexual discovery and them like being like sexual beings like i think um when we

00:53:03.480 start to see that side of victoria it's almost a little surprise you're like oh i didn't know you

00:53:08.100 were like this victoria you know and she uh she takes like she takes charge of herself which i

00:53:14.600 i think is really cool because it would have been very easy for her to be very retiring and shy

00:53:19.800 in that aspect of her life whereas as she is in the rest of her life like she seems very quiet

00:53:26.240 like she makes a comment at some point about people forgetting that she's there all the time

00:53:30.720 because she's so quiet so i'm like i i have definitely been that person in the room too

00:53:35.540 where people like absolutely forget that you're there yeah I definitely am a lot like Victoria

00:53:41.540 in most areas of life and I'm finding you know during promoting my book and my upcoming book

00:53:50.380 tour I'm very much gonna have to uh embody my inner Lucille and take on that more uh outspoken

00:53:59.240 persona for sure yeah well I mean you created her so she does live inside you in some some way right

00:54:06.160 it's definitely who I want to be I think yeah yeah that's it's nice it's nice that you like

00:54:12.660 you got to express that part of yourself already so you know you know it's you're capable of it

00:54:18.140 yeah you're right so why did you choose this time period I always thought it was a very

00:54:26.900 interesting time period. My mom really loves watching old black and white movies and she

00:54:33.860 loves like antebellum movies and things like that. And so I grew up watching a lot of them

00:54:40.380 and I always thought the big dresses were very pretty. I even, I was in some pageants when I

00:54:47.660 was younger and I just wanted a big old poofy dress. I even got like extra crinoline to put

00:54:53.980 under my dress because I wanted it to really stick out there and it did um so I just I love

00:55:01.340 the time period I love the dress I love um just the different ways of life and different ways of 0.99

00:55:09.840 how they thought and how they handled things I loved the fight in women back then the fight

00:55:16.520 for suffrage and for women's rights i loved everything i read and researched about women's

00:55:24.300 rights activists during that time period i thought was just so inspiring and they did so much and a

00:55:31.340 lot of them never even got to see the what they were fighting for come in to fruition yeah which

00:55:39.900 is so sad to think about now um but i just i i've always been fascinated by the time period and just

00:55:47.420 everything in it it's so interesting to think of these people that lived you know in the same place

00:55:54.020 as us in the yeah you know on this land and just totally different way of thinking and different

00:56:02.240 way of life. A lot of the books I read, I was so astonished by their medical beliefs. And granted,

00:56:10.880 when people ask, like, you know, if you were going to go back in time and live, where would

00:56:16.000 you go back in time? I would not. I would not go back in time. Because I have to have my Claritin

00:56:23.040 every day. And my gosh, yes. Yeah, I can't live without, you know, Tom's and all of our medical

00:56:30.060 knowledge now I would hate to go back to then because they were taking opium and feeding it

00:56:37.180 to the babies and yeah you know we've made lots and lots of growth crazy yeah but I do think it's

00:56:44.180 so fascinating that whole time period yeah and it's fascinating I think it really adds to the

00:56:51.640 the aesthetic of the of everything that you're creating within the book I mean obviously there's

00:56:58.960 not just that they're like the first women to go to this university but it's just it's sort of like

00:57:03.780 an extra character the setting is like an extra character within the book um the time and the

00:57:09.120 place that i just think is it really adds to the whole vibe and it's why like it's such a perfect

00:57:15.280 book to read at this time of year because you're just getting like your some of your descriptions

00:57:20.200 in uh your prose you like really are there like i've never been to alabama but i can picture it

00:57:27.920 so well from reading. So glad you said that because that's what I was trying to go for.

00:57:33.780 I'm so glad that that comes across on the page. I had read another Southern book when I started

00:57:43.160 to write this and the author did a Q&A about having the South and the heat and the weather

00:57:52.900 as kind of this other character in the story and i loved that i loved the whole idea idea of like

00:57:58.760 your setting almost being like another main character and so it was something i was really

00:58:04.280 cognizant of while i was writing and i really wanted to show how the heat of the south and

00:58:11.340 the bugs and the humidity and how that really affects people and things yeah no it like you

00:58:18.820 really achieved it it was yeah so good um can you talk about about a little bit about the

00:58:25.600 superstitions that you open each chapter with which I really enjoyed like there's like a little

00:58:30.900 for anybody who's going to read you'll see a little line below whoever's character point of

00:58:36.980 view it is and it's a superstition some of them I recognized from like my own upbringing and then

00:58:42.460 some of them were new to me so what about did you know a lot of these were these things that you

00:58:48.200 pulled from research where did they come from i knew a lot of them um i grew up with listening

00:58:55.940 and hearing a lot of superstitions um knock on wood throw salt over your shoulder pick up a penny

00:59:03.180 i mean those were just things that i i heard a lot my mom was very into that she still is she's

00:59:09.960 she always makes um collard greens and beans on new year's day for health and good luck and

00:59:17.020 as a kid we were like force fed it you know but now I enjoy it yeah and um so I've always lived

00:59:24.340 with those things there were definitely you know I have almost 50 chapters so I had to come up with

00:59:31.060 quite a few for the beginning of each chapter so I did have to do a little bit of research just to

00:59:36.780 find enough and um sometimes I was looking for maybe something more specific to go along with

00:59:43.300 something happening in a chapter um there was a book and i meant to have it with me um it was

00:59:49.920 called something like old forgotten superstitions or something i just randomly found it in a bookstore

00:59:57.920 while i was writing this book and it it had a ton of superstitions where they came from what the

01:00:05.740 history of them was from. And so that helped tremendously. And in my research. But I would say

01:00:14.280 over half of them, I already knew some iteration of and then I had to kind of do some research

01:00:22.040 and come up with a few more. Yeah, it's such a nice little touch. Because there's Yeah,

01:00:27.660 it's nice when I see one that I recognize, I'm like, Oh, I didn't know that that was some of

01:00:31.620 i thought were just irish and i didn't realize that they were like international superstitions

01:00:36.180 which is really really fun um okay so your book has as we sort of talked about some major feminist

01:00:44.740 elements and themes but sororities generally don't have reputations for feminist activism

01:00:51.540 how does the sorority in your book differ and why do you think that is um and i pulled a little

01:00:57.600 quote from when they decide to call their essentially their coven a sorority so um

01:01:05.040 who is speaking there is it victoria i should have pulled that in katherine i believe katherine

01:01:13.300 okay so katherine says it's a society of women it says so in our entomology textbooks professor

01:01:21.620 compton gave us for language studies i doubted the professor had imagined his textbook would be used

01:01:27.220 in such extracurricular activities as this so this is the scene where they're literally deciding to

01:01:33.360 form a coven but they're hiding it so can you talk a little bit about like sororities and like how

01:01:39.500 you sort of transferred the idea of a sorority to your book yeah I um I was never in a sorority

01:01:48.660 in college and I it was actually because of some of the things I would hear about

01:01:53.280 like the hazing and just how they very much were not feminist leaning and 0.50

01:02:02.340 more it sounded more degrading but I will say I do have my sister-in-law was in a sorority and

01:02:11.100 she swears by it and it was phenomenal experience for her and she has so many amazing friends

01:02:16.700 and sisters that she calls on and texts and sees all the time so I think you can definitely have

01:02:25.320 a positive experience when I wrote the story I knew I knew that it was going to be set in a

01:02:34.400 university because I knew the premise and I thought you know university life women sisterhood

01:02:43.300 immediately in my head I thought okay sororities that's that's part of university life and I 0.96

01:02:51.600 thought well they can't just be meeting and be like oh yeah we're coming come in meeting down

01:02:58.180 the hall um you know especially not in that time maybe now you're good um I would come if someone

01:03:05.140 said that now absolutely yeah um so I was like they can't just go around announcing that they're

01:03:10.760 having these coven meetings and that they're forming a coven so like we need something we

01:03:16.680 need a disguise so I instantly thought okay well what if they are disguised as a sorority

01:03:23.280 um and I think it's it's still more coven leaning than sorority uh just mostly because I

01:03:32.440 I was not in a sorority I don't have that experience and then I think also um sororities

01:03:39.620 in that time probably looked very different than what we experience now yes yes but i it

01:03:48.500 just seemed like the um most obvious choice was like let's disguise ourselves as a sorority

01:03:56.260 so we're not just shouting to the world that we're a coven and we're using witchcraft to

01:04:01.320 fight patriarchy and i think you've also sort of highlighted what the idea behind sororities is

01:04:07.340 and like you know what they should be um like as you said maybe they're not always that way maybe

01:04:13.980 a lot of them are like maybe there are some amazing sororities out there I also have no

01:04:18.740 personal experience with them sort of like a foreign concept to me in Ireland but yeah I just

01:04:24.480 I love that that you had sort of actually gone into like the meaning of the word because it does

01:04:30.120 sound like a coven like it's you know if you actually just just change the activity they're

01:04:35.960 all living together it just sounds a little bit like a coven without the stigma um it does and

01:04:40.920 actually a fun fact down here in the south and i don't know if this is the whole united states but

01:04:46.080 i do know it's down in the south um they cannot have there's like fraternity houses where all of

01:04:52.760 the fraternity members live but they it is illegal to have sorority houses where the whole sorority 0.99

01:04:59.340 lives because under like some really really really old balls um that would be considered a brothel 1.00

01:05:07.340 yeah it's crazy south like tennessee and alabama have like brothel walls about women living in a 0.83

01:05:15.280 building and because of that i guess because of some sort of bylines or something the way it's 1.00

01:05:21.240 phrased we cannot have sorority houses what oh my god like the patriarchy is just so afraid of women

01:05:28.800 coming together so afraid so afraid we gotta outlaw that immediately oh my gosh that's crazy

01:05:35.980 thank you for that it is I love that um so you've talked you mentioned that you have a book tour

01:05:43.580 um what's where is that taking you are you staying pretty local or what are you doing

01:05:49.780 on your book tour um so it is staying pretty local most of my stops are in northern central

01:05:56.700 Alabama. I do have one stop in Tennessee and one stop in Georgia, but it is mostly the south

01:06:04.760 right here. And I have a lot of really interesting stops. My launch party is at a coffee shop. It's

01:06:13.260 at the coffee shop that I wrote my books mostly at. Oh, that's adorable. I know. And the vibes

01:06:18.820 are just so good. It's phenomenal. And then I have a few book festivals and bookstore signings.

01:06:26.400 and I have a couple of authors that are joining me for conversations. I think it's going to be

01:06:31.000 a phenomenal time. Also, I am going to have cornbread and sweet tea for all my guests at

01:06:38.700 my book signings. That's so fun. So if you'd like to try some southern cornbread, southern sweet tea,

01:06:44.680 extra sweet tea. I could do your hospitality. My gosh. Yes. That's amazing. Yeah, because I would

01:06:51.540 love to try that. Like this is, yeah, obviously I'm learning about Alabama through your book. So

01:06:56.080 So yeah, reading about all these little Southern things that I've sort of picked up through

01:07:01.060 like media over the years, TV and movies.

01:07:03.740 Yeah, it's so fun.

01:07:04.800 That's adorable.

01:07:06.620 Thank you.

01:07:07.380 I'm very excited.

01:07:10.020 So what's next in writing for you?

01:07:12.300 I know you're literally just releasing this book, but are you working on anything else?

01:07:17.820 Are you hoping to work on anything else?

01:07:20.580 Yeah, so I actually already have my next book written.

01:07:24.440 um i'm hoping that it will be the next book published um it is also set in the south in

01:07:33.600 the 1800s it's set in the 1873 cholera epidemic in birmingham alabama oh yes and um so the pitch

01:07:45.280 is kind of that the main character her brother was murdered by some men and she wants revenge

01:07:52.480 so she uses her rage to kind of bring to life this scarecrow monster and she tasks the scarecrow

01:08:00.720 monster with killing the men that killed her brother and she's in a small Alabama town so 0.94

01:08:08.220 of course the word spreads and women start coming to her to pay her to use her scarecrow monster to 0.97

01:08:16.060 kill the abusive men in their lives but of course as things happen the scarecrow monster 0.96

01:08:24.560 starts coming alive by itself and picking its own victims and so then they have to figure out how to 0.97

01:08:31.260 stop it oh my gosh that sounds incredible that sounds so good it's kind of like it's like

01:08:38.380 especially with the like women coming to her for help it sounds like a little bit of the

01:08:43.580 aqua tofana like the story in italy where um she was like a an elite poisoner and they would come

01:08:51.900 to her for the little potions yes oh yeah sounds very similar to that i think you said it was on

01:08:57.620 your tbr the lost apothecary it's kind of has that similar because in the lost apothecary she's using

01:09:03.500 poison she's to unalive men um but while i was researching the birmingham cholera epidemic i

01:09:12.860 came across um louise wooster she was a brothel madam during that time in birmingham and i read

01:09:23.820 her memoir i went to her grave site and got to see her grave and people had left lipstick tubes

01:09:31.260 on her grave and she actually during the cholera epidemic stayed in birmingham and her and her ladies

01:09:39.180 helped nurse people who were sick from cholera because so many people just left the town

01:09:44.300 when it started spreading and so one of my side characters in the book

01:09:49.880 is very much based off of her and her life and it's kind of one of those things where everyone

01:09:57.700 thinks she's a brothel madam she's evil or temptress whatever but then as you go on you

01:10:05.280 learn some more things about her and how we are all human yeah I love that and I love um obviously

01:10:13.800 you're having a lot of fun with the historical aspects of your book because you're discovering

01:10:17.600 these people that's like that that must be so great like when you find somebody like that you

01:10:23.880 can sort of bring elements of them into your characters that's for sure especially with her

01:10:29.740 and with her actually being so close oh and I went and stayed I got to stay in a hotel

01:10:35.000 it was the actual building that her brothel was in wow like the bricks of the building were the

01:10:44.360 bricks that were there when she had a brothel and just like touching that and just it was so cool

01:10:50.080 just soaking up the atmosphere wow yeah that's incredible that's great um okay well katie i

01:10:57.340 think that is about it for us thank you so much for joining me on my witchy special of spilling

01:11:05.480 the tea leaves um i am going to have your book uh linked your and all of your socials linked in the

01:11:14.380 description um i know you're quite active on instagram is that the best place that people

01:11:19.700 can follow you yes instagram and tiktok are my main platforms um author dot katie dot ortiz

01:11:27.940 o-r-t-i-z um but if they look up my book they probably also will see lots of my videos come up

01:11:34.880 as well uh i'm i kind of post all over the place yeah we all gotta unfortunately trying to create

01:11:42.400 anything in 2026 you've got to be a content creator as well yes yeah i didn't realize when

01:11:47.720 I started becoming an author that that also meant that I was going to have to be a content creator

01:11:52.240 on social media. Neither do we. But it means that we find each other. So that's what's really cool.

01:11:59.880 Yeah, that's the greatest part about it. Well, thank you so much, Katie. Everybody,

01:12:05.280 please go check out Katie's book. Hopefully you've already pre-ordered it because she

01:12:09.440 deserves those pre-orders. Her book is so good. It's a perfect vibe.

01:12:13.220 and um i'm doing a donation drive so pre-orders uh of my book will count as one dollar that i'm

01:12:22.720 donating to the malala fund which helps fund education for women around the world who can't

01:12:29.340 get it in third world countries and things oh my god that's so appropriate for the subject of your

01:12:35.320 book yes i mean the heart of my book is the right to education for women so i thought the malala

01:12:42.600 fund and i've always loved malala's story in general but i thought that fund was perfectly

01:12:48.520 matched if you're listening to this on release day you still have some time to pre-order katie's

01:13:01.560 book and help with her fundraiser the southern sorority of superstitious witches comes out

01:13:07.080 October 6th and since we talk so much I didn't get to read out the blurb which is when Lucille,

01:13:13.420 Catherine and Victoria are invited to participate in a trial semester for women at Alabama's most

01:13:19.140 prestigious university they each have their own reasons for accepting. Lucille wants freedom from 0.83

01:13:24.580 both her father's control and reminders of her traitorous first love. Catherine wants to escape 0.99

01:13:29.720 an arranged marriage meant to halt her attraction to women and Victoria wants to run from the guilt

01:13:34.380 that haunts her after the death of one of her fellow mill girls. The trial semester will

01:13:39.100 determine whether or not women across the state will be allowed to attend other universities

01:13:43.220 but the enrolled women quickly learn that success is not guaranteed and some of their male cohorts

01:13:49.080 are determined to see them fail. When the men's pranks go too far Lucille, Catherine and Victoria

01:13:54.940 form a coven under the guise of a sorority to call upon witchcraft steeped in the traditions

01:14:00.360 of southern folklore to fight back now if that doesn't sound like a good time i don't know what

01:14:06.440 to tell you thanks again to katie for giving me her time and sitting down for this amazing 0.58

01:14:13.600 witchy chat with me and i hope you enjoy the rest of what we have for you in october fuck yeah

01:14:19.020 folklore

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Rowan & Pine: A Feminist Folklore & Mythology Podcast - October 02, 2026

Spill the Tea Leaves #5 ｜✨Witchy Special w⧸ Katie Ortiz, Author ✨

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