There Are No Girls on the Internet - Nancy Mace's Bot Army; Abortion Surveillance Tech; New Tinder Feature; Scumbag Landlord Tech in the Budget Bill – NEWS ROUNDUP w⧸ Sammy Kanter

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00:01:05.020 I survived nine months in captivity,

00:01:07.980 and I've spent my life exploring how other people survive

00:01:11.700 what should have destroyed them.

00:01:13.700 I'm Elizabeth Smart, and these are the Survivor Files.

00:01:17.400 Every week, I'm with survivors who live through the unthinkable,

00:01:21.100 abducted, stalked, controlled, and nearly silenced.

00:01:24.740 These are stories about what it takes to make it out alive.

00:01:28.800 Listen to The Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

00:01:40.480 There Are No Girls on the Internet is a production of iHeartRadio and Unbossed Creative.

00:01:48.580 I'm Bridget Todd, and this is There Are No Girls on the Internet.

00:01:51.320 welcome back to there are no girls on the internet and this is another installment of

00:01:57.420 our weekly roundup where we dig into the stories that you might have missed on the internet so you

00:02:01.060 don't have to and i am thrilled to introduce my guest co-host sammy canter founder of girl in the

00:02:08.160 gov one of my favorite newsletters thank you so much for being here sammy oh my gosh thank you so

00:02:12.340 much for having me i am such a fangirl so apologies in advance because you see me fainting over here

00:02:19.320 to be on the show beyond.

00:02:21.380 I'm so excited to get into it all.

00:02:22.780 So thank you so much.

00:02:23.760 Oh my God.

00:02:24.200 I'm very excited to have you on.

00:02:25.940 You're one of my favorite Instagram follows.

00:02:28.620 You do something that I think is really tough

00:02:30.660 that I aspire to do

00:02:31.940 where you find a good way of blending

00:02:34.060 all of the fun of social media

00:02:37.360 with also the politics and government stuff

00:02:39.520 that people need to know about.

00:02:40.780 I often feel sort of torn between,

00:02:43.460 well, I want my audience to know about this,

00:02:45.520 like they should know about this,

00:02:46.420 but I don't want to bore them

00:02:48.280 with some, like, government topic, even though it's very important. I feel that you have really

00:02:52.140 threaded the needle on social media of how you do that. Honored, first of all. We'll be clipping

00:02:58.440 that and sending that to anyone I ever pitch for funding in the near and distant future all at the

00:03:03.820 same time. But yeah, it's an interesting way of looking at politics or trying to really essentially

00:03:10.980 get it in front of new eyes. And we've learned anything from the last number of years is that

00:03:16.780 the old formula isn't working. And what I really, you know, try and do, whether it's on Insta or

00:03:22.980 TikTok or YouTube shorts, for God's sake, is figure out a way that it slips into people's

00:03:29.540 day to day, their radars, what they're scrolling through anyways. So if that's an aesthetic outfit

00:03:35.700 video that also happens to have three news stories on it in a way that's explained how we actually

00:03:42.180 speak, then by all means, I'll keep doing it. Okay. Well, the first story I want to talk about,

00:03:46.920 I think kind of fits in your wheelhouse. And that is this story about influencer vibe theft. So

00:03:53.960 the question is sort of, can someone sue you for copying your vibe or aesthetic on social media?

00:04:01.160 Did you hear about this story? I did. And so what was interesting is I heard just sort of

00:04:05.820 the general overview and the people article. And I opened my phone maybe an hour before actually

00:04:11.180 we hopped on here and the influencer that was suing was giving her spiel about like what

00:04:18.100 actually went down and how she felt like the people article and also any other sources that

00:04:22.980 covered it were like missing the beef of it the real you know the real core of what the lawsuit

00:04:29.800 was which I found so interesting and does also show sort of that angle like how sometimes things

00:04:34.880 can get lost in the social media sauce, aka where's nuance. Miss her. Nuance is MIA.

00:04:41.040 So in her TikTok, she says that this is so much more than her trying to copyright a beige aesthetic

00:04:47.060 and that the media is sort of failing to tell this story accurately because they're focusing

00:04:51.460 on the most ridiculous parts of her suit, the beige aesthetic part of it, and ignoring the 0.76

00:04:56.880 more interesting meaty aspects of it. I believe her intention was to look so similar to me and

00:05:02.180 copy my post so similarly that she could profit off my business. A lot of articles are claiming

00:05:08.320 I'm suing over a beige aesthetic. I have never claimed to own beige and I'm not suing anyone

00:05:14.120 over a color or a trend. The story the media is telling is missing so many details and the way

00:05:18.760 that they're spinning it to make it seem like it's all about an aesthetic to create drama is

00:05:23.680 misrepresenting the importance of this case. So the meat of what's happening here is that it's a

00:05:28.300 lawsuit where one influencer is not just saying that somebody else is mimicking her aesthetic,

00:05:32.920 which is this beige neutral vibe, but going so much further to mimic many aspects about her

00:05:38.800 business as an influencer that she argues is being done intentionally to create brand confusion

00:05:44.020 and siphon from her business as an influencer and content creator. So while you might have heard of

00:05:48.760 this lawsuit as, oh, this influencer thinks she owns the color beige, and yeah, that part of it

00:05:54.380 might be kind of funny. The issue is so much deeper than that. It goes to, can someone essentially

00:05:59.740 steal the entire look and feel of someone else's business, even if that business relies on visual

00:06:05.760 aspects or visual aesthetics that may not traditionally be able to be copyrighted as

00:06:10.660 somebody else's intellectual property? You know, the way that somebody wears their hair or a

00:06:14.620 specific tattoo or a specific manicure or a specific pose in photos. So I looked both of

00:06:19.720 these influencers up and it is uncanny like it goes so much further than just a beige look

00:06:26.140 here's what went down influencer sydney nicole gifford did a joint photo shoot with 2023 with

00:06:31.780 another influencer named alissa shiel after this shoot giffords claims that shiel started copying

00:06:37.460 her sort of minimal beige aesthetic and specific poses in her content but it's not just about the

00:06:43.860 specific pose, because when she would do that, you know, well-worn influencer pose where you

00:06:49.460 have the phone in front of your face in a mirror, like obscuring your face, the two are essentially

00:06:54.640 identical. Like it is very difficult to tell one influencer from the other. Like she's not wrong.

00:07:00.700 It is uncanny. And if you're making money from your look as an influencer and somebody else

00:07:05.340 comes in and starts doing that exact same thing to maybe create a little bit of brand confusion,

00:07:09.280 I get it. Then S.H.I.E.L.D. blocked her on Instagram and TikTok. So Gifford sent a cease and desist, and those cease and desists were ignored. So Gifford filed a first-of-its-kind federal lawsuit in 2024 alleging copyright infringement, trade dress misappropriation, and unfair competition.

00:07:28.160 So like you, Sammy, I don't think of this as like a frivolous lawsuit.

00:07:33.820 Like I was like, oh, this is deeply interesting because as we know, influencers and content

00:07:39.760 creators are a big part of the lifeblood of like e-commerce.

00:07:43.420 And so it's like how brands like Amazon become very economically successful.

00:07:47.180 So we're not talking about just like, oh, she stole my look.

00:07:50.360 What she's arguing about is like a very specific kind of copyright and IP dispute.

00:07:55.940 And so it raised the question of, can somebody sue somebody for allegedly stealing their intellectual property on social media?

00:08:05.300 Which, again, I just find super interesting.

00:08:08.100 According to the fashion law site, Giffords, who commands over half a million followers across platforms like Instagram, TikTok, and Amazon Storefront,

00:08:15.040 alleges that S.H.I.E.L.D. systematically replicated her content and online persona to mislead followers and unfairly compete in the influencer marketing space. 0.90

00:08:24.760 Central to Gifford's suit were her claims that she'll copied her copyright-protected 1.00

00:08:28.240 images, mimicked her appearance down to specific physical traits such as a flower tattoo, and 0.99

00:08:33.320 appropriated the distinctive visual and stylistic elements associated with her brand.

00:08:37.720 So something I do find interesting about this is I just, I mean, I'm no attorney, but visually

00:08:44.820 when I look at both women's content, there is definitely a lot of aesthetic overlap happening.

00:08:50.340 one of the women just recently had a child and I'm like oh well luckily that is one way to make

00:08:55.240 like I was like okay well that is a distinction because they're so otherwise they're so similar

00:08:59.940 and it makes me wonder like in the age of Instagram is can anybody claim to sort of be

00:09:08.220 unique or distinct when so much of what gets popular on Instagram because of algorithms

00:09:13.600 is things that seem like copies of each other right like all of the influencers use this

00:09:18.620 specific pose they're all they have a specific manicure a specific look if if both of these

00:09:23.420 women are sort of shilling for amazon's amazon clothing like it's not surprising that they might 0.94

00:09:29.100 have some overlap but the case actually was essentially dropped with the influencer the one

00:09:35.420 accused of doing the copying having to pay nothing so it seems like that case might have answered

00:09:40.280 that question of like can you copyright an aesthetic i'm not an attorney but it seems like

00:09:44.160 from this lawsuit, the answer is perhaps no. Yeah, I think it's super interesting. And what

00:09:50.040 the girl that was suing said in her TikTok was that she had to drop the case because it was 1.00

00:09:56.640 getting incredibly expensive. So had she had the funds, there may have been a continued pursuit, 0.97

00:10:03.420 at least on some frame here, which I find interesting in and of itself. And I do think

00:10:08.940 that in the creator sphere too money money gets in the way right we think about how many people

00:10:14.600 would actually sue if they had the money to do so in terms of somebody copying them we see it with

00:10:20.480 small brands all the time with big brands we have i don't know if you saw this but there is um in the

00:10:27.160 city this vintage brand called kissing cowboys and it's run by also like an influencer one of

00:10:33.420 those people that's just like at the cross-section of many things and brandy melville allegedly

00:10:38.500 copied her logo, which she went on to say that is not just like a Canva logo or something like

00:10:45.500 that. Her and her sister handmade the logo. And the brand has copied and pasted the exact logo

00:10:52.280 onto a t-shirt that they have. God knows how many skews of that they're selling in their stores.

00:10:57.560 And so you have a small creator that has a small brand that doesn't have the funds most likely to

00:11:04.000 soon pursue this. So I think like that also is particularly interesting to me, because if creators

00:11:11.020 had more monetary means and same with small brands, where would that really lie? Like what

00:11:17.220 would the decision process actually look like for that? It just leaves me with more questions. But I

00:11:24.780 do think in this particular case, the thing that gave me the ooh, that's a little creepy, and maybe

00:11:29.500 it's almost like a different angle is seeing the matching tattoos, the blocking, almost the

00:11:34.760 intentionality of it, because you also go into that other frame, right? Like if you are an

00:11:39.120 influencer, you expect people to copy you, right? That's part of the job is to push people to do

00:11:45.840 things that you're doing or to lead them to an idea to consider it. So where does that start?

00:11:52.100 And where does that end? I think there definitely is some gray area when the person is starting to

00:11:56.820 get exactly the same body art and copying things at the same timetable yes uh that's where i'm like

00:12:03.600 she alleges that she got she has a very distinctive flower tattoo on her arm and she says that this

00:12:09.240 influencer who was copying her got the same distinctive tattoo like first of all that is

00:12:14.900 commitment to the bit that is you were really committing to copying this woman but it is uncanny

00:12:20.140 and the fact that they're both specifically amazon influencers they both do the amazon

00:12:24.920 storefront, you know, hashtag Amazon finds, she basically is arguing that she is intentionally

00:12:30.380 trying to confuse what would be their audience market into associating the two, which I think

00:12:36.500 is a very good point. So reflecting on this, Professor of Law and Media, Faculty Director

00:12:41.800 of the Center for Law, Information, and Creativity, Alexandra Roberts, wrote,

00:12:45.540 Surprising or not, deeming any of the Giffords claims plausible for creators posting similar

00:12:49.780 content has serious implications, thanks to the fact that influencer marketing has become

00:12:53.780 increasingly central to commerce and social media content, more broadly, is built on trends and

00:12:58.660 serve to users via algorithms, which are quick to push content related to what users click and or

00:13:03.320 linger on in their feeds. Roberts asserts that intellectual property law has not traditionally

00:13:08.300 protected the way somebody styles their hair, makes up their face, or decorates their home,

00:13:12.700 whether or not those choices are photographed and shared. And I do think it's sort of, I mean,

00:13:17.520 had this case, had the influencer who was making these allegations been able to have

00:13:23.360 the funds to see this case through it could have been very different but had it been you know had

00:13:27.960 it gone differently this could have potentially like set an entire new precedent when it comes

00:13:32.640 to ip online which i just find fascinating totally which i do think could be troubling

00:13:37.680 for the larger creator industry because sometimes you don't understand that like you used xyz sound

00:13:44.700 and it came from this person and they created a trend off of it like what where's the origin

00:13:49.360 It's really hard to trace that origin of a trend, you know, a concept or whatnot.

00:13:54.720 So struggle.

00:14:02.440 Let's take a quick break.

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00:14:54.440 when i was 14 years old i was kidnapped and held captive for nine months i survived and i've spent

00:15:02.240 my life exploring how other people survive what should have destroyed them i'm elizabeth smart

00:15:08.320 and these are the survivor files i just remember this low taunting voice next to my ear saying

00:15:15.940 shut up don't say anything every week i'm with survivors who live through the unthinkable

00:15:22.580 i knew if he woke up without a doubt he was going to hurt me i started feeling that there was 0.90

00:15:30.420 someone at the end of my bed and i just started screaming they are abducted stalked controlled

00:15:37.900 and nearly silenced but these aren't stories about what's taken from them they're stories

00:15:43.500 about what it takes to make it out alive.

00:15:46.480 Listen to The Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart

00:15:49.240 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

00:15:52.420 or wherever you get your podcasts.

00:15:54.920 If your bookshelf and your For You page

00:15:56.920 are equally important to your personality,

00:15:59.340 welcome home.

00:16:00.860 This is Prose Society,

00:16:02.960 the weekly podcast that's part book club,

00:16:05.520 part group chat for thought daughters,

00:16:07.280 pop culture obsessives,

00:16:08.420 and anyone who thinks Pride and Prejudice

00:16:10.300 and Love Island deserve the same level of discourse.

00:16:13.320 I'm Eli Rallo, and every week we're connecting the dots between books, the internet, and the conversations everyone can't stop having.

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00:16:53.080 See you between the pages.

00:17:01.040 And we're back.

00:17:01.900 okay so i have to talk about this story with real page really quickly i will say right up right off

00:17:11.360 the top it doesn't really fit with the content that we usually do but real page is my personal

00:17:16.420 like i think of them as my personal enemy so any time that i get an opportunity to talk shit about

00:17:22.160 them i will take it so indulge me so on the episode last week we were talking about this 0.96

00:17:27.920 provision buried in Donald Trump's big, beautiful budget bill that would ban states from enforcing

00:17:34.080 laws on AI for 10 years. Did you hear about this? Oh, yeah. Yeah. States' rights. Oh,

00:17:42.520 what happened to those? Yeah, exactly. Missing them again. Like, okay. Exactly. So one of the

00:17:48.360 kind of real world examples of how this might impact people that I talked about when we talked

00:17:52.400 about that bill was how scumbag landlords are able to use technology like RealPage that allow

00:17:58.280 landlords in a whole area to work together, to coordinate, to essentially algorithmically 0.89

00:18:03.640 determine how much they can raise your rents, right? So the government has called this price

00:18:08.420 fixing, which I happen to agree. So these are scumbags who make scumbag technology for scumbag 1.00

00:18:14.580 landlords. And as a lifelong renter, these people are my biggest ops. I cannot stand this. I think 1.00

00:18:19.480 this technology is ruining cities, I hate it. In 2022, a report from Republica linked RealPage

00:18:25.120 to rising rent prices across the United States, alleging that its algorithm allows landlords to

00:18:29.800 coordinate pricing. And the Department of Justice in eight states sued RealPage last year, claiming

00:18:34.840 that it deprives renters, like me, of the benefits of competition on apartment leasing terms.

00:18:40.320 So cities like Minneapolis, Jersey City, San Francisco, Philadelphia, and others have passed

00:18:45.460 laws that are meant to ban the use of this kind of algorithmic, AI-based rent-setting software.

00:18:51.120 And other states have legislation like this in the works. But if this budget bill passes,

00:18:56.300 that means that states can no longer enforce those kinds of laws, which would be a real win

00:19:00.760 for scumbag landlords and the company that makes this rent-raising technology, RealPage.

00:19:06.760 So now senators are basically asking, did RealPage pay to get that provision buried in the budget 0.95

00:19:13.800 bill. This week, lawmakers say that they believe RealPage might have spent millions of dollars

00:19:18.140 pushing for this provision. In a letter that they sent to RealPage's CEO, five Democratic senators,

00:19:23.640 Warren, Sanders, Klobuchar, Booker, and Smith, are asking for more information about RealPage's

00:19:29.200 potential involvement. The letter reads, in light of this, we seek information on RealPage's lobbying

00:19:34.500 efforts and how the Republicans' reconciliation provision would help the bottom line of RealPage

00:19:39.260 and other large corporations, allowing them to take advantage of consumers. So I just have to

00:19:44.040 shout that out. First of all, just the feeling of reading senators doing something that I feel like

00:19:52.060 does have a real impact on the lives of constituents. It's just nice to be like,

00:19:56.720 oh yeah, governing. Somebody's out there doing it. For sure. No, literally, especially in these

00:20:03.800 chaotic times it sort of is like is anyone doing anything I think is often how people feel um

00:20:10.360 sometimes there's the feeling versus the reality you know did somebody actually go and go to gov

00:20:15.460 track and see what bills were introduced right there's always sort of like that mixture of things

00:20:19.100 but I think for me when I think about this I'm excited to see that they're actually looking at

00:20:24.040 a tech piece of something right like I think that we understandably look at congress at large and go 0.78

00:20:32.280 oh my gosh these old dudes that have no idea how to even open Instagram unless like some assistant

00:20:38.120 helps them you know how could they ever understand AI and its possible implications and everything

00:20:44.660 else under that sun so I think to even see that they're reacting I mean I'm not surprised that

00:20:48.960 Elizabeth Warren was reacting given um sort of her expertise but elsewise and I hope that it

00:20:54.980 continues to expand because AI, honestly, it freaks me the fuck out. I really, really am not

00:21:04.400 a fan. I know it's integrated into so many things that we do, even the things that we don't even

00:21:08.600 realize, but I just don't like it. I don't think it's a thing for good. Oftentimes, I really think,

00:21:15.020 especially given the hands that it's coming out of, that it's a thing for bad and that if we are

00:21:19.500 going to have it that it needs guardrails. And the fact that this bill would get rid of those

00:21:24.960 guardrails, right? And make it, I mean, if thinking about like how much AI has come into

00:21:31.420 our lives in like literally the last year and a half, how much it's taken over the conversation.

00:21:35.900 I mean, a year and a half ago, I wouldn't even imagine that we were talking about AI as much

00:21:40.060 as we are. So think about what that looks like on an accelerated pace for 10 years.

00:21:44.880 Right. And I mean, I think it comes down to like, do people want a world where the not just the rent in your building, but the rent in your entire city goes up? So the CEO of RealPages scumbag AI price fixing tool can make more money. Is that a better world for you? Probably you and me? Probably not. Definitely a better world for the CEO of this technology company who is making money from it and profiting from it.

00:22:13.080 But yeah, I would just argue like, I can't, I mean, I could talk all day. The fact that this provision would so clearly benefit the owners of this tech company and harm just regular people trying to make rent, you and me, renters, like people who, you know, just regular folks, I think is pretty clear.

00:22:33.180 And so, yeah, I'm with you. I think when you think about the values of the people who make technology like this, I tend to think it's not going to be technology that makes our lives better. I think it's really poised to exploit.

00:22:47.640 And certainly this budget bill is not the way to solve any of those potential problems. We look at this budget bill, too, and how it's going to increase the deficit astronomically over the next 10 years. So you pair that with crashing, essentially, in a long ways, the economy by knocking out the biggest, you know, entry level segment for white collar jobs. What like, what are we doing?

00:23:14.680 Yeah, it's not good. And I have to say like another story that I was reading this week that kind of speaks to the ways that advancements of technology like AI really are hurting us and particularly the most marginalized among us. This story that this came out from 404 Media, like shout out to them for being on this. We use their reporting on the show all the time because they are experts over there.

00:23:36.720 So the vast network of surveillance that we have in this country, like license plate reader surveillance tools, well, all of that is being used to track people who are suspected of getting abortions.

00:23:47.140 This is not shocking. Like it's what abortion advocates and like tech privacy advocates have been warning is going to happen. And it's happening.

00:23:54.080 So 404 Media found that authorities in Texas performed a nationwide search of over 83,000 automatic license plate reader cameras while looking for a woman that they said had self-administered an abortion.

00:24:06.720 including looking at cameras in states where abortion is legal, such as Illinois and Washington.

00:24:12.460 So this technology, this license plate reader camera technology, is made by a company called

00:24:17.760 Flock, and it is usually marketed as being able to track and stop carjackings or find missing people,

00:24:23.580 but it can also be used to surveil people suspected of getting abortion care across state lines.

00:24:28.340 So the Texas sheriff in this case says, oh, we were not trying to surveil her for having gotten

00:24:35.420 an abortion, on May 9th, an officer from the Johnson County Sheriff's Office in Texas

00:24:39.260 searched flop cameras and gave the reason for why he was searching these cameras as,

00:24:45.420 quote, had an abortion, search for female, according to multiple sets of data.

00:24:49.620 So whenever officers are searching flop cameras, they're required to provide a reason for doing

00:24:54.400 so. And so they don't need a court order or a warrant, but that was the reason that he stated

00:24:58.500 that female had an abortion. So he claims that the only reason he did this is because,

00:25:04.680 oh, the woman's family had contacted us and that they were worried. He says,

00:25:08.760 her family was worried that she was going to bleed to death. And we were trying to find her

00:25:12.140 to get her to a hospital. We weren't trying to block her from leaving the state or whatever

00:25:15.700 to get an abortion. It was absolutely about her safety. So I got my start in abortion advocacy.

00:25:21.340 So it's something I know quite a bit about. I have a lot of questions about this because

00:25:24.520 when you're talking about like a self-managed abortion, typically you're talking about a

00:25:28.100 pill-based abortion, which is incredibly safe. While some bleeding is common, the risk of

00:25:33.160 complications and death is very, very low. And so I'm curious why they would think that this woman

00:25:40.100 was at risk of bleeding to death from having what I assume is a pill-based abortion. And even if

00:25:45.960 they were worried about her safety, that doesn't mean she can't be criminalized for it. 404 Media

00:25:50.520 spoke to Elizabeth Ling, senior counsel for If, When, How, a reproductive rights group that runs

00:25:55.060 a reproductive legal rights hotline, who pointed out that many of the criminal cases that they have

00:25:59.440 scene of people being criminalized for trying to get an abortion originate after somebody close to

00:26:04.100 that person reports it to the police. They say that a research report published by the group

00:26:08.260 found that about a quarter of adult cases were reported to law enforcement by acquaintances

00:26:12.800 entrusted with information like friends, parents, or intimate partners. So even if they were like,

00:26:18.600 oh, we were just worried about her, that is not a situation that would protect her from being

00:26:22.860 criminalized, especially in a state like Texas, where abortion is essentially, in most cases,

00:26:28.140 criminalized already a thousand percent and i just i also just question the way it's presented

00:26:35.100 right that the family's first reaction would be to call the cops right help i i can't think of a

00:26:42.620 situation where if i thought somebody was in need of medical care that my first call would be to the

00:26:49.580 cops right when i know when i know that i'm in texas a place where that call could potentially

00:26:55.780 whined with her behind bars totally also like to give like a slight benefit of the doubt i do think

00:27:01.960 that there are so many people in this country in every state that have no idea what's going on

00:27:08.060 with abortion laws this has not crossed their desk like i know it seems like one of those things

00:27:12.400 like how could it not have but i as we've seen with also other cases too people are really really

00:27:20.680 unaware until oftentimes they are in a situation either miscarrying trying to get their own care

00:27:26.240 whatever it may be that they are realizing oh shoot like this is not what I realized our reality was

00:27:33.680 so like yes I could understand a family not understanding that they are actually putting

00:27:39.380 their family member in legal jeopardy but I still just find that being their first call

00:27:47.380 a little strange not like the emts you know or not going after trying to find your relative

00:27:56.620 yourself it just seems strange it's not the behavior that i would think most people would

00:28:02.460 have perhaps i'm in the minority on that but i just find it odd um and i i find it worrying too

00:28:11.000 that this is what we're using this tech for which is yeah again all all the worries are back it's

00:28:17.060 like, if we're going to have certain technology available, we need to be very specific on how

00:28:21.740 we're using that. And there needs to be guidelines, laws, regulations on how that is actually able to

00:28:27.980 be used. The organization Privacy International actually just came out with a new report

00:28:32.420 looking at how much very sensitive data that apps like period trackers are collecting and sharing

00:28:37.720 and how that data can be potentially dangerous in a landscape where abortion is increasingly

00:28:42.840 criminalized. So the news is kind of mixed in that their report showed that apps have gotten

00:28:48.100 better with their privacy policies, but the landscape has actually gotten worse. And so

00:28:52.860 the bar needs to be higher when it comes to privacy. To your point about this is what we're

00:28:57.760 using this technology for, I think that technology and AI makes things that were not uncommon in the

00:29:05.640 abortion fight just much easier to scale. Like back in the day, you know, I was doing abortion

00:29:11.360 advocacy work for a really long time. Back in the day, it used to be that anti-abortion advocates

00:29:15.640 would like stand in parking lots and manually write down the license plates of people who

00:29:20.700 drove into clinics. And then they were incredibly well-coordinated. And I can tell you from like

00:29:24.700 personal experience that they, essentially it felt like the police were on their side, right?

00:29:29.580 And so like, that was just from my experience. It's like they, they would, they were these people

00:29:34.160 who were like incredibly dedicated to, to busying themselves at the business of others. And it took

00:29:40.240 a lot of work and coordination and like in real life, you know, coming out to stand outside of

00:29:45.120 clinics and things like that. But now companies like Block are selling the ability to do that at

00:29:50.160 scale, maybe without even having to like leave your home with this technology. And it's an

00:29:55.540 incredibly terrifying harbinger of how technology will be used to like further surveil and

00:30:01.560 criminalize both the people who need abortions and the people who help them, like people who,

00:30:05.860 you know, in Texas, I believe it's even criminalized to like support or help somebody

00:30:10.680 who was looking for an abortion, right? And so it's just a really scary vision of where we might

00:30:16.220 be heading when it comes to the use of this technology to further criminalize people from

00:30:20.400 getting abortions. Totally. Yeah, I don't think we're headed in a great spot. And I will be

00:30:25.980 curious to see if any blue states react legislatively on anything like this. I haven't

00:30:33.040 seen anything across my desk so far. But I'd be curious to see if anything in terms of data

00:30:41.380 sharing sort of pops up in the next few months for anyone that's continuing to be in session

00:30:47.160 or also next year. Me too.

00:30:54.040 More after a quick break.

00:30:55.340 We'll be right back.

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00:33:49.420 let's get right back into it so i want to switch gears a little bit so i am i am not i don't use

00:33:58.880 dating apps i'm not on the market however i i'm so fascinated by them and when they make changes

00:34:04.460 to like entice users like i'm always like very curious what those changes are well tinder is

00:34:10.180 testing letting users set a height preference so tinder is testing out this feature that lets paid

00:34:16.280 subscribers add height preferences to their profile. So it will not be a hard filter. Rather,

00:34:21.540 the setting will indicate a preference, and that means it won't actually block or exclude profiles

00:34:25.620 with that height preference. But that height preference, if they add it, will inform what

00:34:30.660 kind of recommendations you see when swiping. So this is one of the ways that we already know that

00:34:36.240 dating apps inform people's preferences. As TechCrunch puts it, it is not uncommon to come

00:34:40.860 across profiles where women state they're only looking for matches who are at least six feet 0.99

00:34:44.620 tall, for instance, even if in real life, they would be more flexible about this requirement.

00:34:50.300 So I will say we've talked a bit about this on the podcast before. It's not just about height.

00:34:55.260 We did an episode with sociologist and author of the book, Not My Type, automating sexual racism 0.86

00:35:00.400 and online dating, Dr. April Williams. And she has an entire body of research about this when

00:35:04.900 it comes to race. She found in her research that dating apps oftentimes are not just reflecting

00:35:10.440 our biases, but they're actually reinforcing our biases. And it makes me wonder if dating apps are

00:35:15.820 also doing this thing, the same thing with height. And I actually did want to, I don't want to put

00:35:22.240 anybody on the spot here, but I think we have a short, I mean, you, you, I don't want to put

00:35:28.680 words in your mouth. How, how do you, Mike, producer Mike, how do you identify? How do you

00:35:33.300 identify it no no i'm a shorter guy i'm a shorter guy i am five six and change i will own that

00:35:41.660 it's it's who i am uh and you know a few years ago i was on the dating apps and yeah there were

00:35:48.540 a lot of women who had put in their profiles you know only men six feet or above or whatever their

00:35:54.480 arbitrary threshold was. And that's fine. Like I do have zero interest in dating a woman who would 0.99

00:36:03.700 put that in her dating profile. I wish her luck. I think there's a lot of women out there who 1.00

00:36:08.600 probably prefer a taller guy, but maybe they're open to a shorter guy. Great. That's, you know, 1.00

00:36:16.100 a more appropriate woman for me. So that's fine. I don't know. I feel like there's already a bit 0.96

00:36:24.040 of an auto filter I would put uh my height in my profile just to like skip that whole song and dance

00:36:32.720 so I don't know that this is gonna be like the magic bullet that saves tinder but uh you know

00:36:39.300 let them try yeah I don't think so because also for hinge you automatically have your height on

00:36:47.480 there right so you can pay to filter that I believe I mean you're not gonna find me paying

00:36:52.160 for a dating app like that is ridiculous in my opinion sorry just like like i can't um but it is

00:36:59.580 already a thing so i don't know how they're so late to this feature like i just i feel like it's

00:37:07.500 like we're going back to i don't know 2015 like where where have you been uh in terms of tinder

00:37:13.660 so this is what i think too and this is what i found like almost a little offensive about the

00:37:18.460 story. In the TechCrunch piece on this, they say, the company may hope that the addition of a height

00:37:23.540 setting could encourage more women to use and pay for the app, which tends to be heavily dominated

00:37:28.380 by men in both the US and internationally. So this to me, I think really says it all. It seems

00:37:34.360 to suggest that what women really want is the ability to weed people out by height. And that's 1.00

00:37:41.460 what women are willing to pay for. When in reality, I think the reason why dating apps are in trouble 1.00

00:37:45.720 and that like women don't want to use them 1.00

00:37:47.160 is because they're not serving up women

00:37:49.120 or really anybody good experiences.

00:37:51.380 And they're not serving up good experiences

00:37:52.780 for anybody, men either.

00:37:54.320 And so the people designing these apps,

00:37:56.860 like if that's what they think will meaningfully

00:37:58.840 woo women into paying for Tinder premium,

00:38:02.280 I think that perhaps that gives us insight

00:38:05.020 into like why women are not paying for Tinder premium 1.00

00:38:08.020 or abusing these apps at all. 0.99

00:38:09.160 Because I just don't think that they really

00:38:10.540 are functionally understanding 1.00

00:38:11.900 what it is that women want

00:38:13.480 or like how to give women dating experiences

00:38:15.420 that don't feel so bad also i have to say mike when we were talking about this before we got on

00:38:21.340 the mic you were like oh well we have data that suggests that men are just lying about their

00:38:28.080 heights on dating profiles right like it wouldn't even work oh it's true you're both women so i'm

00:38:32.680 curious if you've ever experienced this phenomenon of a man lying first of all that right like just

00:38:41.120 cut and clip but second to that i mean you know like when you go on hinge for example and the guy

00:38:47.780 says 5'10 that he's 5'8 you have to subtract two inches from any any height sammy it is so funny

00:38:54.260 that you say this because according to okcupid who published this data they say that that is

00:38:58.900 exactly the amount that men are adding so they they're they're suspiciously adding two inches

00:39:04.540 taller to their height so when a man says 5'8 you gotta take two off of that because that's the lie

00:39:09.680 and what i feel like is like okay one inch i'll give you that two that's a that's a little much

00:39:17.960 they think that they can get away with it if they're wearing a hat they're like oh like see

00:39:24.200 it's like that high like i that's the extra extra inch there he shows up in platform boots and a

00:39:31.600 and a and a stow top hat what is it what are the abraham lincoln hats um yeah like a like a top hat

00:39:37.800 yeah and then he just has to wear that for the rest of the relationship like he wears it to bed

00:39:42.720 he wears it to work honestly at least he'd have a sense of humor you'd be like wow

00:39:47.620 bringing something to the table live snl you know yeah as a tall woman i so i'm five eleven and a

00:39:55.980 half in in any kind of shoe i'm six feet when i that the short period that i was on dating apps

00:40:02.780 I did put my height in my profile because I, I mean, I, I, I mean, maybe I'm biased. I feel like

00:40:09.140 the sort of, you know, height wars stuff is like a little overblown. And I never found anybody who

00:40:15.240 had an issue with my height, but Mike, similar to you, I didn't want to be on a date with somebody

00:40:19.820 who would like not want to be with someone who was six feet tall. But again, I do think it like,

00:40:25.200 it just suggests to me that dating, the people who make dating apps are just not really thinking

00:40:30.520 too hard or thoughtfully about the kinds of experiences they're trying to curate for people

00:40:35.320 and i think that that is the root of the problem as to why they're in trouble these little gimmicks

00:40:40.760 about height or whatever not only sammy as you said are they like out of night out of 2015 or

00:40:46.120 something they're very late but i just don't think they're what is going to save this these

00:40:50.320 platforms i think they need to really be thinking about like how to improve experiences in a more

00:40:54.040 meaningful way totally and i think there's this idea out there i don't know if this is

00:40:58.540 technologically accurate or not. But people feel like they're being served matches that aren't

00:41:04.340 accurate to them, or just absolutely trash. So and then if they pay for the better, you know,

00:41:11.500 the upgraded premium version, whatever it's called, but then they're going to be provided

00:41:16.420 better matches. And so that paywall to better matches is also making people being like this

00:41:23.620 isn't worth it because then if you do pay it isn't necessarily better and it's a whole nother like

00:41:29.440 level of gatekeeping like no one's getting anything more necessarily from it we're just

00:41:34.380 creating more barriers when i think people in the dating sphere already feel like there's tons of

00:41:38.900 barriers uh to meeting anyone so i think there's that element and i also think even too i mean like

00:41:45.500 to your point about these people that are making these apps like maybe they should look at the

00:41:49.760 prompts available some of them are like if you were doing orientation freshman year at college

00:41:56.940 and you're all looking around the room like this cannot be real this is so cringe that's what these

00:42:02.920 are so I just I think per usual the people in charge of the tech are not asking the right

00:42:11.780 questions and they don't know their audience they think they know their audience they think that a

00:42:15.340 subset of data has told them oh this is who our audience is but they clearly haven't spoken with

00:42:21.820 those people because i think and that seems to be a missing link across the whole space whether it's

00:42:27.620 tech whether it's the consumer space whether it's politics i feel as though people just aren't

00:42:32.340 having conversations with their actual target market yeah because if they did the feedback

00:42:36.640 would be so much different because i'm having those conversations and i could give you like

00:42:40.340 15 different, you know, points that are so different from what they are sharing in their

00:42:46.060 big reports. Yeah. And I think you really nailed it. Like we are so much more complex than like

00:42:52.160 a set of data that a tech company has on us. And I think that they are trying to make decisions

00:42:57.380 about platform experiences based on narrowing us down into a very specific set of data that

00:43:04.300 they have on us. Like, I think that's exactly right. Totally. Because like, even think about

00:43:07.600 someone's past like dating experience that wouldn't be a part of that data necessarily

00:43:13.200 say they had their they were dating their high school sweetheart for 10 years and they were a

00:43:20.600 short king and then they had a terrible breakup right and then this was their first entree onto

00:43:25.940 the dating apps and so they don't want to do anything with any short kings they're over it

00:43:30.220 so therefore it's going to inform their height preferences which obviously the dating app wouldn't

00:43:35.000 know because this is their first time on the app and swiping and they're only going to think of it

00:43:38.940 as oh this person's a snob about tall versus short not understanding their past personal

00:43:43.740 interpersonal relationships right so like there's so many of those things that aren't captured

00:43:48.260 um that again we're just they're just missing it they're just missing it they're just missing it

00:43:54.900 that's a good way to put it okay so i have to ask you about this nancy mace report from wired

00:44:00.760 it is a lot uh i mean south carolina republican representative nancy mace is a lot herself like

00:44:09.120 there's all i mean she's just a lot there's a lot going on with her so according to wired who spoke

00:44:14.620 to a bunch of her former staffers nancy mace would frequently monitor her image on social media

00:44:20.420 even going so far as to create spots to comment across social media in support of her and in this

00:44:28.620 attempt to like boost her image. And she allegedly also asked her staff to create fake profiles on 0.73

00:44:34.640 social media in order to keep an eye on the discourse about her and generally boost her

00:44:39.440 image online. According to one of her former staffers, they told Wired, we had to make multiple

00:44:44.140 accounts, burner accounts, and go and reply to comments saying things that were not true,

00:44:48.320 even on Reddit forums. We were congressional staff and there were actual things we could

00:44:52.060 have been doing to help our constituents. I would say that it was at least a weekly comment,

00:44:55.960 if not daily people magazine called her staff or her office today for comment and they kind of like

00:45:02.720 made a little joke they were like oh well apparently we're too busy creating bots and

00:45:07.980 making comments to answer your query but this is just my opinion i absolutely could see her doing

00:45:13.440 this like i absolutely see it i have no trouble believing this about her none oh none and also

00:45:18.920 her past staff clearly hates her oh my god yeah within an inch of her life like absolutely hates

00:45:26.860 her guts because obviously it's a hell of a story but it doesn't it just doesn't help anyone so you

00:45:34.440 really have to be quite bitter to get yourself in a mess like this talking about your old boss

00:45:38.920 so that's the first thing that pops up second to that i really doubt that she is the only

00:45:44.840 member of Congress doing this? Like, I don't know anyone personally doing this. Let me just go on

00:45:49.960 record saying that. But it's, and also second to that, I do wonder if it comes into violation of

00:45:57.080 campaign finance laws. That's a really good question. Very good question. Yeah, I bet she's

00:46:03.960 not the only person doing this, but something tells me, like, I feel like if you're going to

00:46:08.660 do this and get your staff mixed up to them, you better be treating that staff pretty good. And the

00:46:12.780 fact that your staff is this leaky and that they're like running to wire to be like, she makes us do

00:46:17.820 this. I think you're right. It really says something about the dynamic on her staff. And the report

00:46:22.300 actually quoted a deposition from Wesley Donahue, a South Carolina-based campaign consultant who

00:46:27.640 previously worked closely with Macy's campaigns. Donahue told a court, quote, she programs her own

00:46:33.300 bots, sets up Twitter burner accounts. This is the kind of thing she does. She sits all night on the 0.99

00:46:37.940 couch and programs bots because she's very, very computer savvy. She controls her own voter database. 1.00

00:46:42.780 she programs a lot of her own website. She programs Facebook bots and Instagram bots and 0.89

00:46:46.680 Twitter bots. It's what she does for fun. And let me tell you what a like grim projection of what 0.99

00:46:53.660 an evening at Nancy Mace's house must look like. Like her just on the couch having a great time

00:46:59.400 controlling her bot army. Like pretty grim. No, for sure. I mean, holy narcissism. And it's so

00:47:05.900 wild to think that when Nancy Mace first came on the scene many, many, many years ago was because

00:47:11.080 she was the first woman trying to get into the citadel like she has had a very long kind of life

00:47:18.080 in public and yeah it just seems like something's going on and subsequently I have no trouble

00:47:24.360 believing this report from Wired I guess I'll just put it that way totally and again I would

00:47:28.720 a thousand percent guarantee she's not the only one doing it maybe at the obsessive capacity

00:47:32.900 in which she is clearly doing it aka the night at Nancy Mesa's right but I mean if you spend

00:47:41.080 as we both do you know being chronically online people you start to understand what is a bot what

00:47:48.020 isn't a bot what their sort of characteristics are and how they pop up uh occasionally I bully

00:47:54.320 one to be honest a nice little bot and bully um just to see them prove themselves as a bot

00:48:00.180 can be a little fun um asking them insane questions and sort of seeing what they spin out

00:48:05.460 it is satisfying but I think just seeing sort of you know knowing that that is the way of the world

00:48:13.280 that there's so many bots I mean there are also so many people paying for these bots and creating

00:48:17.360 them on both sides of the aisle so and beyond that beyond our borders so yeah uh we're in a

00:48:24.220 war of clips and we're in a war of bots but i think the more that people know the media landscape

00:48:30.960 like that is the reality that we are in to be aware when you go to a comment section that what

00:48:36.640 you are seeing might not be reality right that that comment on tiktok that has 50 000 likes from

00:48:44.180 user one two three four five six seven like that that particular comment is trying to curate a

00:48:51.040 reaction and supposed to it's also being utilized to curate more you know not just reactions in

00:48:56.980 terms of the likes to it but the comments and then the videos off of can you believe this comment

00:49:01.420 section so I think at least if we're in a position where people understand what they're actually

00:49:07.200 intaking and what risks there are to seeing a comment section um I think we're at least a little

00:49:15.180 bit better of a spot but hey that's another area where I say hey where's the regulation

00:49:21.580 on this bot situation because it's crazy and people really believe what they read no matter

00:49:27.400 what so and even it doesn't matter how smart the person is like I think we're all guilty of it too

00:49:32.080 being like wait oh my god oh the vibe check on this comment section people are really feeling

00:49:37.260 xyz way and right it's just how you feel about something and we as people I think oftentimes

00:49:44.160 want to see the best in what we're taking in and the best of intentions, but oftentimes that's not

00:49:49.180 the case. So Sammy, you are somebody who has a ton of experience with this. This is very much

00:49:53.920 in your wheelhouse. You've had 10 years in media, PR, comms, politics. And we were talking earlier

00:50:00.320 about how people are always just sort of wanting to pick your brain and get advice about how these

00:50:03.880 things shape so much of our discourse. So you were telling me about this new thing that you're

00:50:07.680 doing called office hours. Yeah. So office hours really born out of getting loads and loads of

00:50:14.400 questions as to how on earth to deal with this new media sphere, right? From podcasting, which

00:50:20.460 we're doing right now, to social, to newsletters, to everything else in between, how to actually

00:50:25.660 activate in this space. And basically office hours, you can book it for an hour, you can book

00:50:31.920 it for a half hour. You get to pick my brain on strategy development across the board. It can

00:50:36.540 really be anything across that larger comm space, again, whether it's marketing, PR strategies,

00:50:42.700 social, understanding what you're seeing online, how to actually develop a strategy, how to react,

00:50:48.320 what works, what doesn't, everything in that bucket and more. You're able to book an office

00:50:54.800 hour and chat with me about it, and we can figure out the best path forward for what you're working

00:50:59.640 on. And I do this on the political end of things, but I also do it in the consumer space too. So

00:51:04.940 everybody's welcome at office hours and you can book a time with the old link in bio situation.

00:51:13.040 It's always a classic. So we'll put the link for folks to join in the bio, but it is really

00:51:17.140 important. Like I used to do like disinfo trainings and media trainings. And I think

00:51:21.500 especially right now, when, as you said, the media landscape is shifting so quickly that it can be

00:51:26.440 really hard for folks to get a handle on it. Like it's hard for me sometimes. And so I think that's

00:51:31.620 valuable service that you're offering. And I actually know somebody who I think could probably

00:51:36.980 be like, take good use of this. And that is the last story that I want to talk about, which is

00:51:42.020 that readers who read fantasy author Lena McDonald's book called Dark Hollow Academy Year

00:51:48.400 Two noticed an interesting editing note embedded into chapter three that suggested that she might

00:51:54.280 have used AI to write this book. The note said, like sandwiched in between the regular dialogue

00:52:00.380 of the book, there was a note that said, I've rewritten the passage to align more with Jay

00:52:05.140 Bree's style, which features more tension, gritty undertones, and raw emotional subtext

00:52:10.260 beneath the supernatural elements. So not only was this author using AI, allegedly,

00:52:17.460 she did not delete the AI note that made it into her published book, and she was using AI to make

00:52:24.120 her writing sound more like another person's writing. When I told you I would simply have to

00:52:28.960 die like like i don't know if there would be any coming back from this like i would be so embarrassed

00:52:34.220 i would pack it up no literally like you'd never see me again i'd be off on some island with no

00:52:39.640 wi-fi and just maybe a nice little canoe like that would be truly all and it reminds me of i'm

00:52:47.000 blanking on her name but she's a cookbook author and this wasn't her fault at all the editor

00:52:51.540 unfortunately missed it but there i guess for an image of her was a note left in the book to like

00:52:56.520 tone her arms more and all the copies went out like just horrendous I think it was I don't think

00:53:08.540 it was her first book but and again it wasn't her it was you know sort of the editor which I still

00:53:13.040 feel badly for because obviously that was not their intent um but yikes yikes and it makes me

00:53:20.060 just think about how one of the areas of expertise that we really have let lead out are editors,

00:53:30.500 right? People that catch these things, that do the due diligence, that go back through things.

00:53:35.660 We look at technology and we go, oh, it's gonna, it's got us. It's fine. I can't tell you how many

00:53:41.740 times I've controlled F on a spreadsheet and it's missed something. Okay. So I just think that the

00:53:48.460 the personal touch the human to human uh does get some of the things that are missed and that is

00:53:54.580 just so wild and uncomfortable and i just um yeah i don't know what one does i mean i could probably

00:54:02.660 think of a pr way out of that one i can't i admit um but yikes that's that's a long road that's

00:54:09.820 definitely not a quick fix i'll tell you that much yeah lena reach out to sammy for some we'll figure

00:54:14.960 it out for some for some crisis comms but it also is just a good reminder that like there are so many

00:54:21.260 reasons why people should be careful about the way they use ai particularly in their creative work

00:54:26.440 you know so many reasons why you should be if you're gonna use ai you need to like really be

00:54:31.160 careful uh but the biggest one now is like you could be horribly embarrassed all across the 0.94

00:54:38.720 internet when your ai note is published in your freaking book my god so bad so bad i just hope

00:54:46.280 that if she does decide to write another book that ai as just in its existence right is integrated

00:54:54.620 into the storyline oh that'd be good yeah that would be like a way to partially solve it be like

00:55:02.920 actually it was an easter egg you guys caught it again i'd have to read the book to really think

00:55:08.520 if that was a good strategy or not.

00:55:10.580 But, you know, there's something.

00:55:12.840 This is why you're the PR master, Sammy.

00:55:14.860 People, that was actually quite masterful.

00:55:18.120 Yeah, thank you.

00:55:19.820 Sammy, thank you so much for being here

00:55:21.820 and helping us break down

00:55:22.860 all of these stories across the internet.

00:55:24.720 Where can folks keep up with all the things

00:55:26.520 that you are doing across the internet?

00:55:28.180 Well, thank you so much for having me.

00:55:29.640 This has been so much fun.

00:55:31.880 You can all tap in at girlonlygov.com.

00:55:35.080 You can find the newsletters there.

00:55:37.460 And then for social,

00:55:39.080 Girl on the Gov and Girl on the Gov, the podcast.

00:55:41.160 Check it out.

00:55:41.920 It is a very useful newsletter.

00:55:43.980 The podcast is great.

00:55:45.000 You all talk to like legitimately important people,

00:55:47.700 like elected officials and like have genuinely important

00:55:50.600 conversations that are impactful for our everyday lives.

00:55:52.820 So I really, really respect what y'all are doing.

00:55:54.620 Thank you.

00:55:55.480 Yeah, it's been crazy.

00:55:56.700 Sometimes I forget that we've interviewed some of these

00:56:01.200 movers and shakers myself in this, you know,

00:56:03.580 just that way that your career sometimes moves.

00:56:05.480 were like, oh yeah, I can't believe I did X, Y, Z thing, but we've done it. And there's definitely

00:56:11.220 some interesting conversations on the podcast feed. And then also on the social, we've been

00:56:15.500 mini-miking it up. Okay. Those mini mics are living 10 lives. I'll tell you that much.

00:56:21.400 Giving them a workout. Well, thank you so much for being here. And if folks want to follow me,

00:56:25.460 you can follow me on Instagram at BridgetMarieNDC, on TikTok at BridgetMarieNDC, and on YouTube at 0.95

00:56:30.900 there are no girls on the internet. Thank you so much for listening. We will see you on the internet. 0.76

00:56:35.480 Transcription by CastingWords

00:57:05.480 our executive producer. Tari Harrison is our producer and sound engineer. Michael Amato is

00:57:10.120 our contributing producer. I'm your host, Bridget Todd. If you want to help us grow,

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00:57:18.140 check out the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

00:57:27.280 If your bookshelf and your For You page are equally important to your personality,

00:57:31.320 welcome home pro society is a weekly podcast that's part book club part group chat for anyone

00:57:37.540 who thinks pride and prejudice and love island to serve the same level of discourse each week

00:57:42.060 we're connecting the dots between books the internet and pop culture with your favorite

00:57:46.100 writers book talk creators and plenty of overthought opinions yeah i'm obsessed i'm

00:57:51.100 obsessed listen to pro society on the iheart radio app apple podcasts or wherever you get your

00:57:56.480 podcasts. I survived nine months in captivity, and I've spent my life exploring how other people

00:58:03.820 survive what should have destroyed them. I'm Elizabeth Smart, and these are The Survivor

00:58:09.120 Files. Every week, I'm with survivors who live through the unthinkable, abducted, stalked,

00:58:15.140 controlled, and nearly silenced. These are stories about what it takes to make it out alive.

00:58:20.940 Listen to The Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

00:58:29.440 I'm Hoda Kotb, host of the podcast Joy 101 with Hoda Kotb.

00:58:33.860 You know, I'm always searching for inspiration and useful tools to maximize joy.

00:58:39.200 Like when my friend Henry Winkler offered advice to aspiring actors and really anybody hoping to stand out.

00:58:45.840 You're not hired just to fill time and space.

00:58:48.860 You're hired to fill the space with you.

00:58:52.220 Listen to Joy 101 with Hoda Kotb on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

00:59:00.320 Our hometown is not a test tube.

00:59:02.980 90 miles northeast of Nashville, a battle for the future of America, plays out in one small town.

00:59:09.000 Developers with right-wing ties have purchased hundreds of acres of land.

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00:59:14.660 This is Our Town, a podcast about what happens when a small town becomes the site of a social experiment and fights back. 0.97

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There Are No Girls on the Internet - May 30, 2025

Nancy Mace's Bot Army; Abortion Surveillance Tech; New Tinder Feature; Scumbag Landlord Tech in the Budget Bill – NEWS ROUNDUP w⧸ Sammy Kanter

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