Under the Influence (with Jo Piazza) - Facing Setbacks and Fostering Ambition

00:00:00.000 When I'm looking at the next 12 months of my life, what I do not have on the books and what is

00:00:09.040 impossible for me to have on the books is a trip to Sicily. However, the next best thing to having

00:00:15.120 my own adventure in Sicily was reading Joe Piazza's new novel, The Sicilian Inheritance.

00:00:20.640 It is a vacation in a book. If your vacations were sexy murder mysteries that also dive deep

00:00:30.240 into generational trauma, but not in too heavy of a way, it is the perfect book to take on a plane.

00:00:37.680 It is the perfect book to read next to your public pool while taking breaks to yell at your kids.

00:00:44.940 it is the perfect book to get you out of a reading slump, and it is available now wherever you get

00:00:51.320 books. Support for today's episode of Under the Influence comes from OneSkin. As many of you know,

00:01:02.640 I'm on a mission to smooth out my skin and make it look perfect and dewy and glowy and lovely

00:01:09.340 for this upcoming book tour. I've been doing a lot of the things lately, the things that 43-year-old

00:01:16.160 women do to their skin to achieve such a look. And one of those things is One Skin's two-step 1.00

00:01:23.100 approach to healthier skin. I've been trying a lot of things, and this is one that's been sticking

00:01:28.660 in my routine. The products are powered by a scientifically proven peptide, which sounds very

00:01:34.080 fancy, and I don't know exactly what it means. But it targets lines and wrinkles right where

00:01:39.180 they start in your cells. Yes, yes. And I know that we all kind of want to turn back the clock.

00:01:46.640 I don't really want to turn back the clock. I just want to like, I don't want to look like

00:01:50.740 Jack Nicholson when I get interviewed about the Sicilian inheritance. That's it. And OneSkin

00:01:55.880 helps me do that. Our listeners are getting 15% off OneSkin products using the code influence

00:02:02.460 when you check out at oneskin.co. That is 15% off OneSkin products using the code influence at

00:02:09.760 oneskin.co. Hey, y'all. Hi. So today we're going to talk about two things that we don't talk about

00:02:22.960 nearly often enough. Career setbacks and women's ambition. And these two things have way more to do 1.00

00:02:30.460 with one another than we might think. I genuinely believe that our ambition only increases or has

00:02:36.640 the potential to increase after a setback. The Sicilian inheritance was initially rejected,

00:02:43.400 that first draft that I wrote of it. And at first, it made me feel terrible and made me want to put

00:02:49.280 it in a drawer and or rip it up and throw it in a fire. And I sat with that for a while. And

00:02:56.480 eventually, it made me want to write the shit out of it and make it the biggest book I possibly 0.99

00:03:01.960 could. And that's what I did. It's been four years, four years since then. And now it comes 0.99

00:03:07.380 out in two weeks. And I love this book so much. I didn't expect that setback to set me on this path.

00:03:14.580 But it did. It did. We never know what's going to happen. We never know what's going to happen.

00:03:20.820 Many of you have messaged me when you've been laid off, or when you haven't been able to get

00:03:25.500 back into the workforce after a maternity pause. And that's one of the reasons I wanted to bring 0.99

00:03:29.860 on both of today's guests. We will be hearing from speaker, strategist, and all over hype woman,

00:03:36.060 Amanda Wagner, about why ambition should never be considered a dirty word, and why we should own

00:03:41.920 our ambition more and be allowed to be ambitious in all of the things. We can be ambitious in our

00:03:47.440 careers, in our parenting, in our relationships, in our gardening. We can have ambition in all of

00:03:54.100 the things. And all of them are equally valuable. They are. But first, I decided to call up my

00:04:00.660 friend, the author and journalist Amy Schoenthal. Amy just released her first book this week. Yay!

00:04:08.880 It's called The Setback Cycle. We've given away copies on the Substack and we'll be giving away

00:04:13.160 more. It's wonderful. And it's all about working through life's inevitable setbacks and coming

00:04:19.120 back stronger than ever. Amy is here today to talk about her own career setback after maternity

00:04:25.460 leave and how it ended up changing our life for the better. So I want to talk about setbacks.

00:04:37.700 I don't think we talk about setbacks enough. I don't think we talk about how they can be

00:04:43.260 valuable for our lives, and we have a very negative view of failure. How can setbacks

00:04:50.080 actually be good for us? Setbacks are not fun, and I'm not going to pretend that they are,

00:04:59.300 but when they happen, and setbacks are inevitable, we're all going to experience them,

00:05:04.480 but when they happen, we have to fight that instinct, that urge to ignore them. That's the

00:05:12.740 biggest thing I uncovered in my research, that everyone wants to, like you said, avoid failure,

00:05:18.880 ignore discomfort, and just barrel through any negative experience and like pretend it's not

00:05:25.980 happening. I'm guilty of this. This was totally such a part of my own setback story. And what

00:05:32.840 I've really learned and I try to do, but it's hard because it doesn't come naturally to me

00:05:37.300 because I've been conditioned like the rest of us. What I try to do now, if I'm having a negative

00:05:42.660 experience or some interaction leaves me very uncomfortable, I try to like sit with that

00:05:48.460 discomfort. And that's because that's how we learn. That's how we grow. You sit with the

00:05:52.940 discomfort. You try to understand what is this telling me? What are the clues? And why? Why is

00:05:59.720 this affecting me so much? Because that's going to give you the information you need to come out

00:06:04.560 of your setback. I've had many setbacks. I came back from maternity leave and I was so excited

00:06:13.400 to dive back in. Say what you will about that, but that was my attitude towards work. I was

00:06:19.240 excited to go back to work. I was just one of those people that said, okay, I love my kid and

00:06:25.020 I want to be the best mother ever, but I miss my career and I want to go back to it. I only had

00:06:30.700 12 weeks of maternity leave so it wasn't that long and I went back and I remember saying to

00:06:36.720 my manager okay like what's the status of these accounts let's go and he said in exact words

00:06:43.760 about this one account you don't have to worry about that anymore

00:06:47.340 I will never forget those words what happened was the people who had replaced me I had two

00:06:56.400 people replace me. They were amazing. They're friends of mine. They're wonderful. They're

00:07:00.260 talented. They're great at their jobs. They replaced me and they did a great job. And the

00:07:04.640 accounts sort of changed and evolved over a 12-week period. And they wanted to continue

00:07:08.860 running these businesses. So we had this, you know, difficult conversation and I supported it

00:07:15.720 in theory. You know, I wanted all the opportunities for these people. And I still had one account to

00:07:21.080 run not three but one and I was bummed I said okay like I want to give this to them but also

00:07:28.940 at the same time where does that leave me what am I going to work on you know and there was no

00:07:35.800 consideration given to that it was just sort of like figure it out and so I spent the next few

00:07:41.040 years basically rebuilding my entire portfolio of businesses and things that I worked on and

00:07:49.780 that didn't feel great but I did it I rebuilt everything and I you know kind of came out of

00:07:56.060 that setback but at the same time I also explored career opportunities outside of that day job

00:08:01.620 it's not a coincidence that my freelance writing career kind of took off in 2018 2019

00:08:07.860 because my daughter was born in 2018 I came back to work in 2019 and what happens when you sideline

00:08:14.840 an ambitious woman or a mom. Becoming a mom is like such a thing that like skyrockets someone's

00:08:21.640 ambition. I wasn't just going to sit there and like wait around for something to do. So I always

00:08:26.420 had this freelance writing. I'll call it a hobby. It was something I always did. I mean, I graduated

00:08:31.840 with a journalism degree. I've been writing since I graduated college in the early 2000s. So I just

00:08:37.000 kind of leaned into that more. And you know what that led to, you know, more and more visibility,

00:08:42.000 more high-profile people seeking stories that I would write more speaking engagements you and I

00:08:47.620 met at one of those speaking engagements right at mom too we were on the same panel it was so much

00:08:52.340 fun but like tell people tell people about some of the crazy people that you've gotten to interview

00:08:56.620 because of this I was asked to interview Senator Mazie Hirono that was such a big one she's like 0.98

00:09:05.380 the badass senator from hawaii like she's so freaking cool um norma kamali tracy ellis ross

00:09:12.140 all the peloton instructors like if you know joe and i like bond over our love for peloton i was

00:09:18.840 on a ride in and i feel like we should tell listeners the outfit that i'm currently in

00:09:23.440 i am in my full you're wearing a peloton sweatshirt right now i'm wearing a peloton sweatshirt but

00:09:28.960 underneath i am like head to toe what is it like cheetah animal print because you're full

00:09:35.120 mob wife right now i'm full mob wife in honor of the civilian inheritance and this outfit was sent

00:09:40.440 to me by our friend kendall tool she's a peloton instructor who has this new collaboration with

00:09:46.280 an apparel company called spiritual gangster and i'm in full mob wife attire for joe today

00:09:51.780 and kendall is one of the people in the book so yeah you interviewed so many people in the book

00:10:00.480 about their own setbacks do you have a favorite story i do not because these are like my children

00:10:07.200 i do not have a favorite i know you do i have a i have a favorite i have a i have a favorite child

00:10:11.700 i probably depending on the day have like a story that i'm more drawn to but they're all

00:10:18.360 they're very different stories you know some cover all very different stories i love robin

00:10:23.780 arzon's story robin is a peloton instructor can you tell us just like a tidbit of that story

00:10:30.480 Of course. So Robin has had many setbacks throughout her life and she talks very openly

00:10:35.500 about them. But the one I chose to focus on, I actually met Robin when I interviewed her

00:10:40.800 after she had come back from her own maternity leave. And she, I think, showed that experience

00:10:47.320 in a very different way than society had seen to date. You know, she was working out the whole

00:10:51.560 time. She was one of the first Peloton instructors to really like be visibly pregnant and continue to 0.93

00:10:57.460 lead workouts throughout her pregnancy. So that's when I met her. But the setback that I talk about 0.89

00:11:02.700 in the book is the one where she was getting her job at Peloton. And at the same time, that's when

00:11:10.880 she was diagnosed with diabetes. And all of a sudden she had this whole identity shift. She was

00:11:15.920 leaving her corporate job as a lawyer to become a full-time fitness instructor. She had become an

00:11:22.120 ultra marathon or like, like her whole identity was shifting into this fitness realm. And all of

00:11:28.000 a sudden she's diagnosed with this disease that people do not associate with fitness and health.

00:11:35.440 And yet so many very, very fit and healthy and athletic people have this. I found out even while

00:11:41.700 writing the book that I'm pre-diabetic. I eat healthy. I love exercise. Do you know what I mean?

00:11:47.660 Like people just have the wrong idea about this. And diabetes is something that so many people

00:11:51.980 deal with. And so she said, okay, if this is what I'm dealing with, let's figure out how to deal

00:11:57.680 with it. How can I continue to lean into this fitness instructor lifestyle while dealing with,

00:12:03.860 you know, this condition that I have now been diagnosed with? And she said, I think she said

00:12:10.040 to her endocrinologist when they gave her the diagnosis, okay, so how do I run this

00:12:15.200 ultra marathon in a few weeks? And she figured it out and she didn't. She talks about it. She

00:12:20.140 sports her insulin patch on like every ride and kind of shows people that like this diagnosis

00:12:25.480 does not need to define you you may have it you may deal with it but it's not your entire identity

00:12:30.220 yeah and i think that i mean i genuinely think that women women are very good at using setbacks

00:12:40.620 to say what comes next how can i how can i channel this or you know or that's what we want to do

00:12:47.680 and i mean i think that you know so many women i know have limitless ambition and we just want

00:12:55.780 want more and more places to channel it so true so well said we want more and more places to

00:13:02.540 channel it that's what happened to me more yeah yeah i know you've been there to channel it

00:13:07.720 yep totally totally i mean i want a nap right now but uh yeah nobody channels it more than you

00:13:14.160 It's a lot of channeling right now. But yes, but I do think that the world is not always kind to ambitious women. We talk a lot about that in the Sicilian Inheritance. I mean, it is a lot of food and wine and sex, but there's also women's ambition and agency, friends. 1.00

00:13:31.460 And we are going to take a quick break here. And when we get back, we're going to talk with our next guest about channeling that ambition and why ambition shouldn't be a dirty word for women.

00:13:44.160 And now on to ambition, because once you have a setback, you have to have a certain level of 0.97

00:13:59.440 ambition to get back where you want to be. To talk about that, I'm bringing on a woman 0.98

00:14:04.580 who is just an inveterate hype woman for other women. Yes, this is what I want to be. I want 0.99

00:14:10.940 to be your biggest cheerleader? My name is Amanda Wagner and I am a business strategist and speaker

00:14:18.480 and I am one of those people that is really shameless about my ambition. I am fascinated by

00:14:27.480 ambition. I was just accepted into a PhD program because I want to study ambition and how it

00:14:34.520 helps us make decisions as female entrepreneurs. And I want to be at the scale of Oprah.

00:14:41.760 I love that. Do you? I mean, I really love that. Like, yeah. Yeah. You're going to be Oprah.

00:14:47.020 Just say it to the world. Just like I'm going to say I'm going to say we're going to make the

00:14:50.580 Sicilian inheritance an instant New York Times bestseller. Right. Yeah. We hit the magic number

00:14:57.320 that you're not allowed to talk about, but kind of talk about. We just hit the magic number actually

00:15:02.280 this morning. So, yes, I am so excited. We still have a lot more books to sell. So so everyone

00:15:10.400 listening, pre-order your book. It's not even really pre-ordering the Cisleian Inheritance

00:15:14.580 anymore because it's going to be here so fast that it's like real ordering at this point.

00:15:18.880 Yeah. Buy the book now and then it's like a present when you get it because the money's

00:15:24.380 already gone. So it's the money is gone. I know. And I love pre-ordering actually because I forget.

00:15:30.040 I forget that I just ordered something and then it arrives and it's a nice surprise to me

00:15:35.980 instead of a package arriving and it's toilet paper, which is what it usually is.

00:15:41.860 Fair enough. I have been thinking a lot about how you're like, I'm a marketing monster. I'm like,

00:15:46.600 no, no, you are a sales machine. No guilt. There is no sleaze in sales. You shouldn't have to take

00:15:53.020 a shower after. I am on board to promote the shit out of the Sicilian inheritance. I was also 1.00

00:15:58.140 thinking, like, who else needs this? Oh, yeah. Who else should we give it to besides Oprah?

00:16:02.480 OK, well, Oprah, we have some Oprah we need to talk. Also, Brene Brown, we need to talk. But I'm thinking teachers. So in the States, school year wraps up in May. I'm like, no teacher needs another mug. Get him a book.

00:16:16.840 Get him a book.

00:16:17.760 Get him a book.

00:16:18.340 It's a great gift for a teacher for the end of the year.

00:16:20.520 A hundred percent.

00:16:21.300 I love this idea.

00:16:22.460 I love it. 0.59

00:16:23.960 Today's whole episode is going to be about ambition and women.

00:16:27.240 And I love what you said about don't call yourself a marketing monster.

00:16:30.800 And I think so many women, we're ashamed to talk about our ambition.

00:16:36.940 I wouldn't normally say, oh, I'm ashamed.

00:16:40.040 I'm nervous.

00:16:40.560 But then why do I cower from saying that I want this thing for my book?

00:16:45.440 Correct. You are a person who studies women and ambition. What have you seen when it comes to

00:16:52.660 women and ambition? Oh, we are cowering. There's so many things tied up in ambition that if we 1.00

00:17:01.380 are too ambitious, we are cutthroat, we are at all costs. We have to buy ourselves flowers because

00:17:07.600 we have pushed away all the people in our lives who could possibly love us. Exactly, exactly. I

00:17:14.100 think for too long and in so many movies and in pop culture we see ambitious women as bad

00:17:21.820 totally and you know i'm even i'm going to throw it out there i was watching the sag awards or 1.00

00:17:27.220 clips from the sag awards because i don't watch tv in real time last night and anne hathaway was

00:17:32.440 there with emily blunt and meryl streep and they were recreating the scene from a devil wears

00:17:37.480 Prada. And Miranda Priestly, Anna Wintour, is a bad guy in that. When she's just an ambitious

00:17:46.620 woman, okay? That's all she is. But we turn ambitious women into villains in media. 0.99

00:17:55.000 Yep. And they are. They're the villains. They're the monsters. They are cutthroat. They'll do 1.00

00:18:01.380 anything. And they're cold-hearted, and they don't take care of their children, and they don't love

00:18:05.980 their families and their husbands or meet quiet tired men no none of these things are true and

00:18:13.060 for me when I talk about ambition when I experience ambition I say it's like this pilot light inside

00:18:18.280 of me and ambition is a tool it helps me get more of what I want so when I introduce myself and as

00:18:25.760 I am a speaker I'm a business strategist what I really am is a hype woman and I am here to pour

00:18:31.160 gasoline on your pilot light. I love that. And I think that all women need to remember that we

00:18:39.300 should be hype women for other women. Yes. Regardless of where you choose to put your energy, 0.93

00:18:47.100 where you choose to spend your time, I don't care what that is. What I do care is that you

00:18:53.520 have somebody on your team to hype you the hell up. Exactly. Exactly. And we all need that. You

00:19:01.040 You know, I one of the things that I'm trying to do every single day, this is this is one of my little exercises that I do every day. 0.92

00:19:09.580 I try to text one of my girlfriends or email them or I'll send them a video just telling them they're fucking awesome. 0.96

00:19:17.080 Hell yeah. 0.86

00:19:18.280 And at different things.

00:19:20.400 Right. 0.99

00:19:20.740 So I'm like, hey, I just want you to know I saw you walking your kids to drop off this morning and you're a fucking awesome mom. 0.99

00:19:26.260 Or I just read this article you wrote in Philadelphia Magazine, Regan Stevens, and you're an amazing goddamn writer. 0.96

00:19:34.220 So just like little and it doesn't have to be long, right? 0.97

00:19:36.440 It's one sentence.

00:19:37.600 And I send one sentence out to my girlfriends and we need to hear it.

00:19:42.480 Even if you think your friends are tough as nails, everyone needs to be hyped up.

00:19:47.960 And we can't be tough as nails all the time.

00:19:50.860 And I also like taking the pressure of I'm similar to you and then I'll text my friends and I say no response needed.

00:19:55.800 I just wanted to, you know, I'm sure when you're ready. I asked today for some hype. I texted my

00:20:03.560 friend Jessica and I said, hey, Jess, I need a pep talk. And then I frantically texted, actually,

00:20:11.320 I don't need it, but I want it. I know I can do this thing and I know I'll be good, but I want

00:20:15.840 the pep talk because you know what it's like to be called too much. And I know you get me. I know

00:20:22.440 you get this enthusiasm so is somebody who has been called too much and yet has felt not enough

00:20:28.980 the people like you who are texting the friend those are the people we need in our lives

00:20:34.320 exactly exactly and i such love being too much i like you know i think i i'm really embracing

00:20:42.240 my too muchness as a grown-ass woman is what i'm doing i like to refer to my too muchness i'm like

00:20:49.260 You know when you go to McDonald's and you get the six-pack of chicken nuggets and you secretly wish there was a seventh one?

00:20:56.140 I am the seventh chicken nugget.

00:20:58.640 You didn't expect it. 0.98

00:20:59.760 You didn't know you needed it, but it was a goddamn delight when you saw it in that box. 0.99

00:21:04.200 But it was a goddamn delight. 1.00

00:21:05.600 You're a goddamn delight, that surprise chicken nugget. 0.99

00:21:08.460 I'm on this mission to be like, hell yeah, please be too much. 0.99

00:21:12.300 So talk to me a little bit about how you got involved in what you're doing now.

00:21:16.380 I'm on my seventh career at the tender age of 36. I used to be a high school teacher and I taught at a school for pregnant and parenting teens. Loved it. Went back to school, went into the world of sales in a startup company that sold an iPad app to teachers. And I was laid off totally unexpectedly.

00:21:37.880 So I took everything I loved about teaching, everything I loved about sales, and I combined it and built a business where I actually was honest about what I wanted.

00:21:51.800 So one of the things that we're going to talk about today is the word mompreneur.

00:21:56.820 And I want to talk about that after a quick break.

00:22:00.480 I want to eradicate the word.

00:22:03.480 You and me both, sister.

00:22:07.880 Chew on this bold question from Dentine Gum. Is it ever okay to compliment a millennial

00:22:14.680 on their skinny jeans in 2026? Dentine. Chew bold.

00:22:27.960 Now, Amanda, there are a lot of words that I want to get rid of in the English language because I 0.94

00:22:33.700 think that they are condescending to women. One of them is stay-at-home mom, because let's be

00:22:40.420 honest, no one is just staying in the home. No, no. It should be work-at-home mom. And that would

00:22:46.180 change the whole tenor of the conversation around mothers who work inside the home. 1.00

00:22:51.200 Who do we need to call to get that one changed? Because I'm signing that petition.

00:22:55.180 I don't know. God. God. Great. Don Draper. Another word that I hate, that I hate, hate, hate is mompreneur. So when I was living in San Francisco, I had my first baby. And I met a lot of women who had been working in big jobs at big tech companies.

00:23:15.580 I was working at a sad tech company called Yahoo at the time, but these women had jobs at Pinterest and Facebook and Meta and Lyft, all the fancy places. 0.90

00:23:26.940 When they had kids, those companies, the majority of them, not all of them, they sucked to work for. 0.98

00:23:33.080 They sucked, okay? 0.97

00:23:34.180 They did not accommodate life as a parent who needs not even a flexible schedule, not even less hours, just grace. 0.98

00:23:42.200 just grace to be a human caring for other humans in the world so they left those tech companies

00:23:50.100 a lot of them started their own businesses and they were almost universally labeled mompreneurs

00:23:57.760 i have so many crunchy feelings because what pisses me off about that is that they're being

00:24:06.280 labeled by other people as mompreneur. There are many people who self-identify as mompreneur and

00:24:13.840 I support women in business. This is not an attack on any one person and their choice to

00:24:19.340 use the word. If it works for you, great. But it's such an ugly word. It is a bastardization

00:24:26.640 and I think it devalues both roles. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. And I think that

00:24:31.880 that's the problem. It does devalue being a mother and it devalues being an entrepreneur. 0.86

00:24:36.280 And also, we never hear the word dadpreneur. We just hear really successful guy trying to launch

00:24:42.920 a startup. There were whole conferences for mompreneurs. And it is a label that a lot of

00:24:49.700 women have accepted and identified with, mostly because it's out there, right? And sometimes we

00:24:57.140 have to accept these things as part of our identity. And none of this is to say, if you

00:25:02.720 love being called a mompreneur. Cool. Good on you. Have at it. I just don't like the fact that

00:25:09.460 it seems to other you when it comes to the world of entrepreneurs at large. Absolutely. I think

00:25:17.120 it's a word that, oh, like if somebody called me this, I just have this visceral reaction to it

00:25:23.420 because it plants in this less than, I think for both roles. I also think what the word

00:25:31.100 mompreneur does is it assumes that being a mom is a credential for everything or being a business

00:25:37.460 person is a credential for everything. So it's really muddying the waters and takes away from

00:25:43.860 what I actually do. So the idea of, oh, I'm a mompreneur. No, I'm an ambitious woman who helps

00:25:51.080 other ambitious entrepreneurs and leaders get more of what they want, claim their spotlight,

00:25:55.600 and not be afraid of their ambition, you don't know if I have a kid or not. I don't have to rely

00:26:01.080 on that social capital. Well, exactly. That's the thing. No dad walks into a conference and people

00:26:10.020 automatically know how many kids he has or that he has kids at all, right? Totally. Yeah. And

00:26:17.140 here's one of like the biggest piss-offs for me. In preparation for this episode, I did some

00:26:23.400 research, I wrote out all of the caveats that I have, because I'm a big fan of the yeah, but.

00:26:29.940 Like, I've explored all of the yeah, but. One of the most frustrating things is that

00:26:35.040 on Instagram, and I am no social media star by any means, I wasn't sure if I should post about

00:26:42.440 my baby or not. I talked it through with my social media manager. Liz and I, like, deep dived into

00:26:47.720 What do we say? What does it look like? Posted one picture of my one daughter the week after

00:26:54.560 she was born, and it got the most likes and comments out of everything I have ever posted.

00:27:01.020 Well, I said this before when I was writing How to Be Married, actually, because this was before

00:27:07.420 I had kids, but the Instagram and Facebook posts that got the most attention in my entire life

00:27:13.680 were my engagement. And this is before I had kids. These platforms, the algorithms really

00:27:21.880 reward intensely traditional female milestones of having children, of getting engaged, 1.00

00:27:30.780 of getting married. All of those are wonderful things. They are things we should celebrate. 0.51

00:27:35.780 But I post a picture of my book or a book deal. I get nada. Nothing. And I don't know. I don't

00:27:42.440 think it's because my audience doesn't like it I think the people following me really really like

00:27:46.600 that stuff I don't think the Instagram and Facebook algorithms push those things to the top of

00:27:52.320 people's feet I actually don't need to share every element of my life but the algorithm is going to

00:27:58.300 support it when I share a picture on my anniversary of my wedding or a picture of my child on her

00:28:03.360 birthday so in some ways I'm like shit I'm really losing at this social media game because I'm not 0.97

00:28:07.700 willing to exploit my kid. Absolutely. And yeah, every person in my contacts, you want a picture 0.99

00:28:14.280 of my baby? Oh, I will send you far more than either of us think is appropriate. She is magical

00:28:20.700 and she is one piece of my life. She is not my identity. Right. Exactly. Exactly. And I think

00:28:29.620 being a mother is one part of our life. And for some women, it's a bigger part than other parts. 0.99

00:28:37.700 But it's not everything about us.

00:28:41.460 No, it can't be.

00:28:43.980 But the same could be said for my business.

00:28:46.480 My business is not the only part about me.

00:28:50.040 I don't think everything has to be siloed, but I also don't think every part of the Venn diagram, we have to have this big overlap between being a parent and being an entrepreneur.

00:29:00.440 No, no, I don't think we do.

00:29:02.620 I hope we don't.

00:29:03.680 I really do.

00:29:04.520 So as an entrepreneur and as a mother, what do you find the biggest challenges are?

00:29:12.420 The biggest challenge for me, sample size of one, is really reconciling how these two

00:29:20.020 things work together and to be somebody that fiercely said before I had a child, I want

00:29:28.340 it all.

00:29:29.300 So it's been redefining what it all looks like.

00:29:32.560 And it's being really thoughtful of when does my kid come into play here? When does parenting come into play? Do I have to say that I have to be there for pickup at 5 p.m.? Or can I just say I have a hard stop at 430?

00:29:47.360 Mm hmm. So it's little changes like that. And and even facing the the questioning of, oh, the daycare is closed for professional development. How's that going to work for you? And I'm like, Dottie has two parents.

00:30:03.580 two parents two parents yeah exactly it's challenging because it's it's made me confront 0.98

00:30:13.540 my identity and again as somebody i'm i'm such a chicken shit i'm like oh i'm gonna get canceled 0.96

00:30:18.600 for saying this and yet canceled from what canceled from what at this point i'm like who's 0.96

00:30:24.280 gonna cancel me what's gonna happen but i don't want my gravestone to say wife and mother

00:30:29.000 that's not the impact i want to have sure i want to raise a wonderful magical human being that

00:30:36.920 makes this world better and i love my husband to death and that's not it that's not enough

00:30:45.060 and that's not enough and that's not enough yeah yeah

00:30:49.980 so i one of the caveats i set out joe when i was prepping is that

00:30:57.700 this could be my tiny baby feelings looking for validation or proof that I'm an entrepreneur

00:31:05.900 because I'm sure there are many someones listening to this and being like whoa

00:31:10.580 this woman is uncomfortable in her role as a mom or she's in denial or wait till your kid's five 0.99

00:31:18.140 whatever bullshit is going to come up and sure maybe it's that but I don't know and it's it's 0.99

00:31:25.520 an identity wrestling conversation. Right, right. It is. It is right. And I think that 0.99

00:31:33.900 with women, I think, you know, women, maybe more than men, we're constantly wrestling with our

00:31:41.020 identity. You know, am I, am I a mother? Am I an author? Am I a business person? What am I? And

00:31:46.900 what, what should define me? And what makes me most comfortable defining me? And

00:31:52.260 They're conversations that can be tricky, to be honest. And so, yeah, I just think it's important

00:32:00.720 for us to say these things out loud, to say what we want, to say what we're scared of, to say how

00:32:05.800 we want to shape our identity. Because otherwise, other people will shape them and choose them for

00:32:14.420 us. Absolutely. It's not just saying what we want. It's also asking for more. So here's what

00:32:23.100 my gravestone will say. It will say, don't ask, don't get. I have this poster up on my wall.

00:32:30.360 Joe, if we could, let's throw some to your listeners. I have to ask for what I want. And

00:32:35.060 I firmly believe that the hardest part of asking is knowing what you want.

00:32:40.300 true so if you spend time knowing what you want joe you do a really good job of this i promise

00:32:46.480 i'm not just here to pump your tires we all know you want to be on the new york times bestseller

00:32:51.620 list i do i do i want to be on the new york times bestseller list the sicilian inheritance is the

00:32:56.700 best book i've ever written and i'm just going to keep shouting that from the rooftops yeah so

00:33:01.780 no more apologizing necessary you're not a marketing monster you're marketing we can find

00:33:07.340 another M word. I'm a guru. Sure. I'm not a marketing mama. That's not the word I want to

00:33:15.400 use. Absolutely not. No. Because you and your uterus have absolutely nothing to do with the

00:33:23.420 sale of your book. No offense to your uterus. No offense. It's done great work. None taken, 0.97

00:33:29.040 my friends. Right. So I'm like, yeah, let's ask for more. Let's figure out what the hell you want.

00:33:35.000 And we don't have to caveat it with, well, I'm a mom. 0.55

00:33:39.640 Or some people look at the word mompreneur and they go, oh, I know where her priorities are.

00:33:44.820 She's not a real business person. 0.70

00:33:47.160 And again, it's this pitting people against each other.

00:33:50.920 Like, why are we fighting over this? 0.96

00:33:53.700 Two things can be true and we don't have to make it an ugly ass word. 0.98

00:33:58.940 Exactly. 0.97

00:33:59.760 Exactly. 0.91

00:34:00.160 What is your advice for moms who want to channel their ambition more? 0.97

00:34:07.040 To me, it's really about stripping away all of the yeah buts, all of the things that come

00:34:14.900 up when you say what you actually want that you feel like you have to whisper.

00:34:19.960 So when people join me, either in like a strategy call or on stages, I will tell them, I want

00:34:26.200 to hear the thing that you're afraid to say out loud.

00:34:30.160 Because I walk into rooms and I say, I want to be at the scale of Oprah. 0.90

00:34:34.340 And it scares the shit out of people.

00:34:37.040 But what it actually does for me is it helps me find the people on my team.

00:34:44.080 Because the people who are on my team and who think big go, oh, that's juicy.

00:34:48.460 How do I help you?

00:34:50.380 And the people who don't get it are uncomfortable.

00:34:55.040 They laugh.

00:34:56.380 They roll their eyes. 1.00

00:34:57.380 they do this, like, all right, bitch, see you in 10 years, let's see if you've done it. 0.98

00:35:03.160 So saying it out loud, making space for the thing that you kind of sort of think you want to do, 0.98

00:35:09.580 strip away all of the, the, like the crutches. Yeah, yeah. Channel the ambition, say what you

00:35:17.380 want. And you're allowed to change your mind. Absolutely. Absolutely. And I think that that's

00:35:23.320 a really, really important one that you're allowed to change your mind that just because

00:35:26.520 you said something out loud doesn't mean that that's it that's the end all be all totally one

00:35:31.400 of the i forget if it's a swedish or norwegian word for re-decide which doesn't really exist

00:35:38.080 in english and i just love that concept i get to re-decide i get to re-decide this is not

00:35:45.440 that is a gift yeah i'm gonna re-decide what i want when i am speaking in front of audiences i'm

00:35:52.200 I've been called Demanda. I can get a little bossy, which, welcome. It's part of the seventh

00:35:58.200 chicken nugget experience. I will tell people, I'm like, okay, I need you to write down 10

00:36:02.800 things that you would ask for if you knew the answer was yes.

00:36:08.200 Huh. That uncovers a lot of our deepest, darkest, what do I actually want? Because again,

00:36:17.340 the hardest part of asking is knowing what you want. Well, I can ask the question,

00:36:21.440 joe how did i get on this podcast you you literally asked me you just you just said i

00:36:26.400 want to come on your podcast yeah and i would like i would also like to be on bernie brown's

00:36:32.320 show and glennon doyle's show yeah me too let's figure it out let's figure it out so if you knew 0.69

00:36:39.400 the answer was yes would you ask send the damn email with you just you just made me decide that

00:36:48.880 I should really email Glennon right now. I've interviewed her before. She was on Committed 0.98

00:36:52.960 with Abby and it was a great interview. Why haven't I emailed her and asked her if I could

00:37:00.840 send the Sicilian inheritance yet? Great question. Why not? I don't know. I don't know the answer.

00:37:07.960 Maybe I am scared. Also, maybe I'm tired. Okay. Yes, of course you're tired. But really,

00:37:12.720 this is like drive-by-fire coaching here. What's the worst case scenario?

00:37:18.880 The worst case scenario is she says that they're booked because no one's rude and says, don't 0.77

00:37:22.700 come on my show.

00:37:23.340 Everyone just says they're booked.

00:37:25.020 Okay.

00:37:25.860 And the world, the world doesn't end.

00:37:27.800 Right.

00:37:29.740 So she's booked and it doesn't work out.

00:37:32.320 Are you going to be okay?

00:37:34.020 I'm going to be totally fine.

00:37:35.360 I'm going to be fine.

00:37:36.420 Yeah.

00:37:36.940 Yeah.

00:37:37.160 I become an annoying five-year-old sometimes where people will share the big thing and

00:37:40.860 they're terrified.

00:37:41.480 I'm like, okay, it doesn't work.

00:37:42.600 Then what happens?

00:37:43.860 And we go through this path.

00:37:45.160 I'm like, okay, and then what happens?

00:37:46.600 And then what happens?

00:37:47.620 And I don't think there has been one time where someone's been like, I will be completely destitute.

00:37:54.260 My life will be over.

00:37:57.220 So, yeah, send the email.

00:38:01.220 Find the contact information.

00:38:02.680 This is a chance to put out to the network.

00:38:03.940 Hey, who is listening to this that knows Brene Brown?

00:38:06.840 Because Amanda and Joe, we need to talk to you.

00:38:10.400 We want to be on your podcast. 0.99

00:38:11.720 We have good shit to say. 0.99

00:38:13.940 I love this. 0.99

00:38:15.760 I love this.

00:38:17.220 Will you tell our listeners where they can find you?

00:38:20.740 Absolutely.

00:38:21.640 You can find me at theamandawagner.com. 0.59

00:38:24.700 That is T-H-E.

00:38:26.660 And you can find me on Instagram at theamandawagner.

00:38:29.960 I write on there periodically.

00:38:32.440 I have committed to publishing 40 things this year, short form, long form, wherever they

00:38:37.360 are.

00:38:37.620 I'm writing 40 things.

00:38:39.700 Big thank you, Jo, to your interview with Jamie Attenberg.

00:38:44.580 Oh, that was so good.

00:38:46.080 I loved that oh my god it's so good I just have this I buy pretty much every book from the authors

00:38:53.180 on your podcast oh that's great that's great you can find me at theamandawagner.com um and if you

00:39:00.160 know Oprah, Brene, Adam Grant uh let us know but go email Glennon for now all right fine I'm gonna

00:39:08.900 go I'm we're gonna end right here and I'm gonna email Glennon Doyle literally I'm gonna I'm gonna

00:39:13.060 do it right now before I do anything else. Please call me when it works. I will. I will. I will.

00:39:18.280 I'm doing it right now. Right now. All right. And that is all we have for today. I did email

00:39:24.700 Glennon Doyle. I did. I did. I haven't heard back yet. But you know what? I sent that email.

00:39:29.780 And I love what Amanda said about what would you do if you knew the answer was yes. Right?

00:39:36.360 it's very freeing. And I'm here for it. I'm here for it. And I don't mind talking about my naked

00:39:44.180 ambition to make this book a bestseller and the book of the summer. But I'm also prepared for

00:39:49.960 what happens if that doesn't happen. Because the bestseller list is hard to break into.

00:39:57.020 And that will also be okay. It will all be okay. I'm feeling very zen at the moment because I am

00:40:03.360 operating on three hours sleep. My operating on three hours sleep is essentially like me being

00:40:08.480 on weed. I'm very chill. Now go have a great day, do something nice for yourself, and hype up an

00:40:15.840 awesome woman in your life.

00:40:33.360 Thank you.

00:41:03.360 Thank you.

Under the Influence (with Jo Piazza) - March 21, 2024

Facing Setbacks and Fostering Ambition

Episode Stats

Transcript