Under the Influence (with Jo Piazza) - Newborn Advice No One With Tell You With Modern Mom Probs (Tara Clark)

00:00:00.000 Hello. Hi. So I am celebrating my third baby, my bonus baby's first birthday today. Never

00:00:17.380 again will I have a newborn human. I mean, until I'm a grandma, which is going to be

00:00:22.880 in like a thousand years and I'll probably be dead. But yes, I mean, we have a one-year-old.

00:00:28.900 It's amazing, right? And I wrote about this on my substack over the influence that I want to get all of my newborn parenting advice out there because I know that I'm immediately going to forget it.

00:00:42.520 Because the brain blacks out this crazy dumpster fire of a time for us because it has to. Otherwise, we would not make more babies.

00:00:52.200 I personally probably cannot make more babies because I am a shriveled up old hag, but my brain will still black it out anyway. So I want to talk a little bit. This episode is for moms of newborns and pregnant ladies. And when I was in the muck of it, I just wanted to listen to people talk about it. So if that's not you, okay, cool. You don't have to listen. I still love you anyway. 0.98

00:01:18.340 but pass this on to a newborn mom in your life because they need it. They need to listen to

00:01:23.800 things like this. Here is my very best advice. Number one, you don't need most of the stuff.

00:01:31.000 You really don't. A baby would happily sleep in a box if you only had a box. And in olden times,

00:01:37.680 a lot of people only had a box and the baby slept in it. When we had our first baby,

00:01:44.040 we bought so much crap that we didn't need and I found some of it like deep in a closet the other

00:01:50.520 day we bought this thing called a munch mitt that that our baby just chewed on when he was teething 0.77

00:01:56.680 and it was so gross and he also kind of hated it and he kept trying to rip it off with his mouth

00:02:02.640 and he looked sad but I was like oh no you need this munch mitt they don't need things they don't

00:02:07.740 babies want to play with a box they want to chew on your finger they love chewing on spoon

00:02:12.460 You don't need most of the stuff.

00:02:14.120 And if you're having a baby shower, ask people to get you things.

00:02:17.480 Ask them to get you cozy, comfy pajamas, nice candles that you like.

00:02:22.440 Ask them to take care of you because you need help and you need stuff more than the baby

00:02:26.920 needs stuff.

00:02:27.980 You also need adult diapers.

00:02:30.420 I know that that's gross, but a lot of things come out of your body when you get home from

00:02:35.560 the hospital and the hospital will give you maxi pads, which are probably the worst invention

00:02:40.040 ever invented.

00:02:40.860 buy some adult diapers, your pants, your sheets, everything. Everything will thank me later.

00:02:47.920 Also, get yourself some cute postpartum sweatpants. Splurge on these because you're

00:02:52.700 going to be wearing these sweatpants or pajamas for a very long time and you deserve it. You

00:02:57.540 deserve to be very comfortable. You do. Because being happy in the first few months after a baby

00:03:03.960 comes is hard. The postpartum period is, I'm just going to say it, it is a clusterfuck dumpster fire 0.99

00:03:09.780 of hell and do not let anyone tell you different. The human body and brain is not equipped for the 0.97

00:03:16.740 lack of sleep that comes with having a newborn and you will feel completely crazy. Ask for all

00:03:24.360 of the help. Tell your husband or your partner exactly what they need to do and be very specific.

00:03:31.900 Be very specific because a lot of people are going to offer to help, but they don't know what you

00:03:36.120 need. So say, hey, I want you to hold this baby so I can take a shower. I want you to do my

00:03:41.260 grocery shopping. I want you to do my laundry. I want you to put away my laundry. I want you to

00:03:46.240 help my toddler make Rice Krispie treats for their stupid treat day that they have at their preschool 1.00

00:03:52.520 because I just can't do it. Also, I want you to hug my toddler so that they feel loved because 0.99

00:03:56.880 I'm holding this screaming baby and I just need that very specific, very specific piece of help.

00:04:05.060 People are dying to help you. They want to. Let them do it over and over again.

00:04:11.100 Here's one more. This might be controversial. Babies are weird. Like they're everyone. You

00:04:17.220 were inundated with this thing in our culture that says that the second you give birth,

00:04:22.380 you fall madly in love with that baby. And they're they're kind of these strange looking aliens when

00:04:28.660 they come out. And you probably love that baby, but it is hard to like them right away. And that

00:04:34.260 is okay. That is okay. It is also okay if you want to work while you have your baby. I had my best

00:04:44.420 creative bursts of energy at the end of both my pregnancies with my daughters and my postpartum

00:04:50.360 period. And this is not true for everyone, but for me, I actually wrote my new novel, The Sicilian

00:04:55.220 Inheritance, while I was pregnant and in the postpartum with both daughters. One is four now

00:05:03.840 and the other one is one. I've been writing The Sicilian Inheritance for that long. I really have

00:05:08.560 a quick commercial for that. Quick commercial. Guys, if you could pre-order that novel right now,

00:05:13.880 because it matters so much. The publishers weirdly, weirdly care about the pre-orders.

00:05:19.820 It matters. And if we can convince every podcast listener to pre-order a copy of The Sicilian

00:05:25.460 Inheritance from anywhere you buy books right this second, then we'll be able to get this amazing

00:05:30.600 novel, this amazing, fun novel that is the best thing I've ever written in so many people's

00:05:36.220 hands. So that was just a stupid quick commercial for that book. I love all of you. Thank you for 0.98

00:05:43.240 listening to me. I hate myself for doing it. Anyway, I wrote that book during my postpartum

00:05:48.700 period because babies do sleep a lot. And I just felt this creative burst of energy and I had to

00:05:55.120 do something with it. That said, if you don't want to do it, you do you. I also watched a lot

00:06:01.660 of TV. I watched the West Wing. I watched that Harry and Meghan doc series. That was a really

00:06:07.280 good one. Zone out. Lay on the couch when you have time to lay on the couch and you pick a show that

00:06:14.400 is going to be comforting, that is just going to make you feel good. For some reason, the West Wing

00:06:18.600 does make me feel good because all of this is hard. And you know what else is hard? Breastfeeding.

00:06:25.900 Breastfeeding will sometimes suck. 1.00

00:06:28.180 A lot of people won't tell you that. 0.70

00:06:29.900 You go into this and you think, this is the most natural thing in the world.

00:06:33.340 It hurt worse than anything has ever hurt in my entire life, including giving birth to

00:06:39.080 my three children.

00:06:40.260 Okay?

00:06:41.020 And so knowing that I think makes it easier.

00:06:43.560 You do not have to torture yourself.

00:06:46.120 There are options.

00:06:47.480 Get the baby fed.

00:06:48.680 Do not feel bad about that.

00:06:50.040 I supplemented all three of my children with formula from the very start.

00:06:54.460 I cried the first time that I did it with my first baby like I was poisoning him or something. I was

00:06:59.500 not. I was not. And you know what? My kids still seem like very smart, lovely, well-adjusted human

00:07:06.500 beings in the world. They do. They're great. They're great. You know who wasn't great when I

00:07:12.500 had my first baby? My husband. He was actually great. But the thing is, you just don't like them

00:07:17.800 as much as you used to like them. And that's okay. It is okay to not be obsessed with your partner,

00:07:24.560 to not like them very much when the baby first comes out. But I'm going to tell you that it

00:07:28.300 gets better. And the two of you are going to figure it out. I hated Nick when I gave birth.

00:07:32.960 I was like, why did we do this together? But clearly I ended up liking him again because we

00:07:38.520 made two more kids after that. Two more pieces of advice. Strange things in your body are going to

00:07:46.520 hurt. They're going to hurt. And it's not just your lady parts, your back, your hip, your arms,

00:07:52.500 your shoulder. Strange things are going to hurt and the doctors won't believe you and they will

00:07:56.340 dismiss you. But it is okay to push them and be like, no, this hurts and I want help. Give me all

00:08:01.540 the help. Give me all of the drugs that you have, the physical therapy that you have. I want your

00:08:06.020 help because it is not normal for me to continue to pee every time I sneeze and for me to be in

00:08:11.120 pain when I laugh. So yeah, hey doctors, fix this for me and believe me. Last thing, stay away from

00:08:18.500 social media. Get off of it. It's not helpful. It is not helpful right after you have a baby and

00:08:24.500 neither is Google because you will Google every single symptom that they have. And most of the

00:08:30.700 time, the majority of the time, the baby is fine. And Google is going to tell you the worst possible

00:08:36.240 scenario and it will make you feel terrible most of the time. It will. I promise. And so will the

00:08:44.360 Instagrams in the very early days. It is not helpful to scroll. It is not. Today, I am going

00:08:49.780 to talk about all of this with an awesome, awesome lady who I love so much. Her name is Tara Clark

00:08:58.060 and she has been an Instagram creator for a pretty long time. Her stuff always makes me laugh

00:09:05.020 And sometimes it makes me cry, but it just makes me feel like I've been seen, which there are not a lot of things on social media that make you feel seen. So when you're ready to come back up for air, please follow Tara at Modern Mom Probs. She's great.

00:09:22.080 And today we are just going to talk about, we're going to talk some shit, actually, we're going to talk some shit about what it is like to be a woman who turns into a mother. Because you are totally different on the other end of this. You are a different person. And society needs to recognize that. You need to recognize that. I see it. I know it. And I know that you're going to be okay. I promise you're going to be okay. 0.99

00:09:46.680 you're wonderful you're wonderful and you're loved and you're gonna get through this i promise

00:09:53.120 now here is my conversation with tara clark of modern mom probs

00:09:58.000 hi hey thanks for having me i'm so excited to be here oh my god thanks for coming on i love 0.74

00:10:10.120 chatting with you and today you and i are are just gonna we're just gonna shit talk we're just

00:10:16.080 gonna just gonna get into it what do you think we should talk about today i do have a good topic 0.54

00:10:21.900 that i want to bring up so earlier this week i posted a post i did not write it was not an

00:10:28.920 original post it was a post complaining more or less about all of the expectations that are put

00:10:36.280 on us as mothers can i read a little bit of it just for context and then we could kind of go in

00:10:43.680 OK, let's let's see if I pull it up quickly.

00:10:46.940 I know. Here we go. This is the post.

00:10:49.580 So you're telling me I'm supposed to keep my child alive, educate and play with them,

00:10:55.300 keep them off their tablets and TV, keep the house clean, keep my relationship alive,

00:11:01.300 cook meals and keep my bills on track, have my own career and aspirations and goals

00:11:07.980 and manifest my dream life, meditate, go out with my friends and keep my relationships alive

00:11:14.260 because it's not all about being a mother, be a size eight, walk 10,000 steps a day and work out

00:11:21.980 five times a week and eat healthy and do all of this on four hours of sleep. Cool, cool, cool.

00:11:29.160 And it's doing incredibly well because so many people are feeling seen. It's really resonating

00:11:37.180 with them. I want to repost it and tag you because I feel that so hard. The expectations

00:11:46.240 on mothers today are so insane. And I genuinely believe that social media and Instagram only

00:11:55.980 makes them worse because we're seeing people like, you know, and I don't like to shit on any 0.96

00:12:01.040 one account so i'm not going to name this person but it is a human being with four boys who 0.94

00:12:08.060 constantly posts their like i have four as a mom of four boys this is how i get this done

00:12:14.280 i wake up at 5 30 in the morning and i take a cold shower and i whip myself in the back

00:12:21.040 to feel the pain before getting up and homeschooling them all day and that's an

00:12:26.120 exaggeration and I'm being sarcastic but I'm just saying accounts like that make us feel like we are

00:12:34.380 not doing enough and she's just trying to sell us stuff she's just trying to sell us her her classes

00:12:40.520 and her programs I don't know if she really does any of that but they're designed they're designed

00:12:47.320 to make us feel terrible and feel like none of us are doing enough right that's exactly what it is

00:12:53.380 And I think that's why this post is resonating with so many people.

00:12:56.460 I mean, there's a lot of different parts about it that people were latching on to.

00:13:01.160 Right. One was that people were like, oh, we're allowed to be a size eight.

00:13:05.300 But I think that post was from someone from the UK and the UK size eight is a US size four.

00:13:13.100 Oh, interesting. Because that's funny, because I was about to say, oh, my gosh, I'm a size eight right now.

00:13:19.260 So we're like, that's awesome. I feel good about myself.

00:13:21.720 So a lot of people sort of like latched on that as like, oh, is that cool?

00:13:26.260 But I think it's a size difference based upon UK, US thing.

00:13:31.700 But another thing that was really interesting is then people started going in on feminism. 1.00

00:13:39.900 Like, that's what you bitches get for wanting feminism. 1.00

00:13:46.180 And I was like, what? 1.00

00:13:48.100 Okay.

00:13:49.180 Okay.

00:13:49.560 This is something that I'm hearing a lot lately because I've done so many episodes on Trad Wives and a lot of the attacks that I'm getting or the attacks that I get when I say things like, I'm exhausted, I can't do it all, are from people saying, well, this is what you wanted.

00:14:09.740 You wanted to work outside the home.

00:14:11.700 You wanted to be a feminist. 1.00

00:14:13.400 You wanted all of the things. 1.00

00:14:15.040 And look, you cannot have all of the things, can you?

00:14:17.480 mm-hmm that's exactly what it is I was so floored when I saw those comments and in the frequency of

00:14:26.880 them it wasn't like just one person it was like a decent amount that they were really going in on

00:14:32.840 that and and I've always said this from the beginning of starting my account is that you

00:14:39.060 know the world has shifted we used to have an in-person village with your aunts and your

00:14:46.620 cousins and more sisters and your mother who lives nearby and all of those things. And people

00:14:53.000 were willing to help out. And now, obviously, I don't have to tell you this because you know this,

00:14:59.420 but we are so much more segmented than we used to. Families may be smaller. Our moms are either

00:15:06.840 still working or they're doing their own thing. You know, we may not have as many sisters to come 0.93

00:15:12.300 help us out right so like we are lacking that in-person village and that's how we struggle

00:15:19.860 the way that we do in addition to the systemic things obviously that we've talked about so many

00:15:25.420 times you know like not having paid maternity leave all of that but those are how we get to

00:15:31.520 where we are right now exactly exactly you know i just did a post on the on the substack uh over

00:15:39.140 the influence for all of my advice for a brand new mom I just read it about five minutes ago

00:15:45.360 no joke because yeah my bonus baby she's gonna turn one very soon and I'll forget I will forget

00:15:53.040 everything because we are programmed to erase it from our hard drives immediately after their

00:15:59.640 first birthday but I have to say that I think that the modern postpartum newborn period we are

00:16:08.560 more alone than we've ever been before. Women since the beginning of human beings raised these

00:16:18.460 children in a village. I do not think that the lack of sleep was nearly as acute ever in the 0.99

00:16:26.960 history of time because other people were taking that baby away from mothers. Other people were

00:16:32.560 helping to feed that baby. Other people were letting mothers rest when they needed to rest.

00:16:38.560 And it is the lack of sleep that drives us insane.

00:16:41.460 It is.

00:16:42.180 There's a reason that prisoners are tortured by keeping them from falling asleep.

00:16:49.020 And that is why so many of us suffer so badly in the postpartum period, because it was never

00:16:54.820 like this.

00:16:55.700 There was always a village to take that baby.

00:16:57.560 I do believe that we have it harder as mothers now than mothers have ever had it in the history

00:17:02.540 of mothers.

00:17:04.560 Yeah, because we just simply aren't there in person.

00:17:08.120 It's wonderful that we're friends online, that we have friends that live all over the country and all over the world. And we can, you know, have that camaraderie. But guess what? At three o'clock in the morning, no one's coming into my house and taking care of this baby.

00:17:21.040 You know, when when my son was born, we were living in New York City. And what you just described was exactly my postpartum experience in as much as we had my son. I didn't have any help. And my brain was absolutely on fire. I remember that's how I always described it. My brain was on fire to the point where I couldn't even think straight. You could like hardly see straight. I didn't have anyone come and help me.

00:17:46.360 my husband was home for two weeks which was amazing but he like pulled together like all

00:17:52.620 of his like vacation time he didn't he got one day of maternity leave which was like the day my son

00:17:56.820 was born and and he works in the hospital so you'd think that they would care but they don't um no

00:18:01.720 they don't so he was able to like pool all of his vacation time to stay home with me for a few weeks

00:18:06.420 which thank goodness he was but my I gotta tell you a funny story my mother and my in-law that my

00:18:11.680 mother-in-law. They came in to help me, and I'm using this in quotes, for one day. And this was

00:18:18.400 how they came to help. They drove in together. They live about 15 minutes apart. They live in

00:18:23.660 New Jersey. They drove in together. I think my father-in-law dropped them off. And they were

00:18:29.040 like, okay, Tara, we're going to help you. And I was like, oh, this is great. Thanks, guys. And so

00:18:33.660 they're like, you go take a shower. And let me tell you, it was a wonderful, hot, skin-burning

00:18:39.660 shower I took my time I washed my hair I think I shaved my legs like I really took my time on that

00:18:44.080 shower yeah that's the best shower you're ever gonna take is that like first shower when you're

00:18:51.320 out of the hospital and someone else is holding the baby but you smell weird like you smell like

00:18:56.520 someone who just had a baby and you I also I turn that shower up the hottest it'll go and they just

00:19:01.940 burn me it was scalding my skin and I was loving every second of it and so then I get out of the

00:19:08.740 shower I put on clothes I can even remember I think I was wearing a green sweater you know it's

00:19:12.360 weird that things that you remember so then they go and they say oh we're gonna go get our eyebrows

00:19:17.440 done and I was like oh okay they're like yeah you know we saw a threading place downstairs because

00:19:24.340 like I said I lived in New York City there's a threading place downstairs we're gonna go get

00:19:27.600 our eyebrows done I was like oh okay guys and so I'm thinking that they're gonna be gone for like

00:19:34.400 you know what 10 minutes tops they go for like freaking two hours they get lost at this point

00:19:41.660 i don't even know where they are and i mean i care but i don't care right and then after a while i'm

00:19:47.320 like like should i call somebody they're like not answering their phones maybe they left their phone

00:19:51.280 in my apartment i don't even remember long story short they came back two hours later and i was

00:19:54.500 like where the freak were you and they're like oh well you know we got our eyebrows done and then

00:19:59.280 we like wanted to go shopping a little bit and then so we went around and i think we went to

00:20:02.860 Starbucks and I was like you guys came to help me with the baby and so then I think they left like

00:20:10.400 an hour or two later and then that was it and that was the only postpartum help I received yeah

00:20:15.780 yeah and that story I think is true for a lot for a lot of women I was with my first baby I was

00:20:22.860 totally totally on my own because we lived in San Francisco and couldn't afford child care there

00:20:28.040 and I had just saved up and saved up and saved up to be able to not work because I also you know

00:20:34.720 was freelancing and so you don't get maternity leave when you work for yourself and my husband

00:20:40.280 had to work all the time and I was just when I was in it I didn't even think it was postpartum 0.96

00:20:46.400 depression I think is such a shit word because it's not even depression it's like you feel like 0.97

00:20:51.960 a crazy person you feel like you're failing like you're you're not just exhausted you're 0.99

00:21:03.160 i i your brain becomes a hot mash of meatloaf that is incapable of doing anything else 0.99

00:21:13.100 it's a dumpster fire of a lump of meat is what it is yeah it's just a big like brain mound 1.00

00:21:21.580 like a big lump and then someone shits on it is what happens that's that's what it was been and 0.99

00:21:27.600 on fire too like a big dumpster fire that's it and then and then your boobs are hurting and then 0.98

00:21:33.180 you got to go change a diaper you have to do all the things i know it's just well i want to talk

00:21:37.860 more about how social media contributes to this and how you've carved out a niche on social to 0.99

00:21:44.980 make moms not feel like a dumpster fire of shit first we're gonna take a quick break and we will 0.97

00:21:49.860 be right back more with Tara Clark of Modern Mom Problems. We are back and we were just talking 0.99

00:22:07.680 about how the postpartum brain is a steaming mash of meatloaf that's in a dumpster on fire.

00:22:15.300 the things that I think that you do on Instagram you are one of the only mom influencers or you're

00:22:23.440 you're now you're one of the only influencers that I regularly not only scroll but I go to I go to

00:22:30.940 find you and that's a big deal because you could anyone can come up on your scroll but if I want

00:22:36.640 a dose of happiness I go to your account because I think that you are giving moms a dose of reality 0.97

00:22:45.000 a dose of humor and a dose of what we fucking need. Oh, Joe, first of all, I'm going to cry 0.97

00:22:50.560 because that was like the nicest compliment that I've ever been paid. So thank you. I thank you.

00:22:55.620 God, thank you. I appreciate that so much. So the thing about modern mom probs is that

00:22:59.700 motherhood is not just one thing. It's just not right. As we as women are not just one thing. 0.67

00:23:06.840 You know, we're not just moms. We're not just partners. We're not just, you know, I don't know,

00:23:09.760 writers. We're a lot of things. We're a mosaic, right? And I think that motherhood is the same

00:23:15.120 thing. And so what I tried to do with Modern Mom Probs is show all of that. Sometimes it's funny.

00:23:21.760 Sometimes it's inspiring. Sometimes it's really real and raw and it's all of those things. It's

00:23:26.660 not just all of one thing. And in my mind, I always like to say that if it fits underneath

00:23:31.400 the umbrella of a modern mom problem, I'm going to talk about it. So whether it's postpartum

00:23:36.460 depression, postpartum anxiety, miscarriage, your three-year-old shitting in the corner,

00:23:42.160 you know, whatever it is, I'm going to talk about any and all of those things.

00:23:47.080 Mine pooped at the brewery once, the brewery that we go to up in the Catskills. You know,

00:23:53.320 they cried wolf and said they'd go to the bathroom. We went to the bathroom nine times,

00:23:57.380 nothing happened. And then four minutes later, just pooped, pooped right on the ground in front

00:24:02.640 of a lot of people at a beautiful brewery in the Catskill Mountain.

00:24:05.300 um did you get kicked out no the owner has children our children's age and was also was

00:24:11.840 standing right there and was just like i get it and i'm like yeah well you know what there's dogs

00:24:16.120 here and dogs poop too and my kid just did what a dog does so yeah yeah we cleaned it up see i think

00:24:22.660 well of course right you disinfect all that but you know what's interesting you just said something

00:24:26.900 that i think sums up everything she said i get it he said wait wait wait you you assumed it was a 0.99

00:24:34.600 mother you assumed it was mother he said i get it oh he said excuse me oh i assumed see i'm a jerk 0.98

00:24:41.300 uh he yeah i get it and that's what you need to surround yourself with you need to surround 0.95

00:24:47.600 yourself with people who say i get it i wrote a meme like years ago that said you know if i'm not

00:24:53.260 going to paraphrase it correctly but it's something along the lines of like all you ever need is one

00:24:57.540 friend to say i get it and and that's the thing and that's the whole thing about modern mom props

00:25:02.340 right is like i said sometimes it's funny sometimes it's inspirational but i want people to say yes

00:25:08.540 tara i get it i feel seen i know what you're going through and and that's my whole point in doing what

00:25:14.460 i do how did you start this account like when when did you get on the whole the whole gram

00:25:19.940 um 2016 it was early i'll tell you the full story that's early that's early days yeah tell me the

00:25:25.660 story yeah yeah yeah i'll tell you a full story but i'll but i'll condense it in february of 2016

00:25:31.800 I said to my friends and family, I'm going to start an Instagram account about parenting.

00:25:36.020 And my friends and family were like, what?

00:25:37.700 Like, that doesn't even that's not even a thing.

00:25:39.160 At that point, people were like, you know, taking pictures of their lattes and their

00:25:42.500 sandwiches with a filter on Instagram.

00:25:44.980 So I was like, no, no, no, it's going to be a thing.

00:25:46.680 I'm going to I'm going to make it a thing.

00:25:47.740 And they're like, OK, good luck.

00:25:48.980 And so it was called NYC Mom Probs because I don't know if you're familiar with the Upper

00:25:56.440 East Side Moms Instagram page. 0.75

00:25:58.820 It's ludicrous.

00:26:00.580 And so actually, that is what inspired me to start my account.

00:26:05.580 Oh, wait, well, tell me, for people that are not familiar with the operates Eastside

00:26:10.600 Moms Instagram account, tell people what that was like.

00:26:13.780 It is, it almost seems fictitious, but these posts are real.

00:26:18.940 I'll give you an example of one that just happened this past week, and I actually shared

00:26:22.680 it on my Instagram account.

00:26:24.960 One mom was saying, you know, my first baby was very svelte.

00:26:29.680 And now my second baby is very, is a little bit chubbier, but we still love him.

00:26:36.560 No, no.

00:26:38.140 At least they love him.

00:26:39.400 At least they love him.

00:26:40.800 But we're looking for diapers that fit his chunkier body. 1.00

00:26:45.000 So then there was a woman.

00:26:46.760 So that post came out in July.

00:26:48.180 Then there was a woman just about a week ago was like, whenever I'm having a bad day,

00:26:52.200 I think about the post where the woman called her child heavy and said, but we still love him.

00:26:58.180 And so I posted that on Instagram and it just like went bananas because people were like, oh, well, at least they still love him. At least they still love him. So those are the types of things, right? People are talking about their, you know, $20 million mansions out in Montauk, all of that kind of stuff. The stuff that you would see on Gossip Girl, but it's real. And so you funnel that down into a mom's group and you put it up on the Upper East Side. So that's the context there.

00:27:24.320 So just laughing about all of that kind of stuff. And, you know, the women like it, they always have, they're beautiful. They have like their blowouts and their manicures and all of that kind of stuff. 1.00

00:27:31.740 They're really pretty. Yeah. Yeah. They look nice. 0.76

00:27:34.420 And, you know, I was living in the Upper East Side and I was lucky if like my socks matched or, you know, my hair was washed or any of those kinds of things.

00:27:43.320 And so I started my Instagram account, NYC Mom Probs, talking about the things that New York City moms may have to deal with that other moms in other parts of the country wouldn't.

00:27:53.780 you know, $40,000 a year, private kindergarten, all of that kind of stuff. Like the process even

00:28:00.300 getting into kindergarten, all of that kind of stuff. Which is now happening in so many other

00:28:05.700 cities in America. It is. It is. It is. Yeah, it is. It's not just a new New York problem anymore.

00:28:14.820 It's not. I mean, it's where now it's like $80,000 kindergarten in New York. I'm sure. Yeah.

00:28:19.400 it's it's bananas yeah because now my son is 11 right so it would have been you know a long time

00:28:24.740 ago right yeah yeah yeah yeah but like now i moved to philly to try to avoid that and it's we

00:28:31.320 look we send our kids to a great public school but it was still like fierce we we couldn't there's a

00:28:37.100 preschool right across the street from our house and i want life to be so easy that i was like i

00:28:43.840 will do anything like i'll pay anything if the preschool is across the street from our house we

00:28:48.220 Couldn't get in. Couldn't get in. Yeah, the wait list was too long.

00:28:51.140 Wow. I believe that. When my son was in nursery school or heading into nursery school,

00:28:58.680 we went through, because for some reason we thought this was the right thing that you were

00:29:02.180 supposed to be doing, we went through all of the processes and the interviews and all of that kind

00:29:08.080 of stuff for these preschools. It was ridiculous. But we did it, and it was ridiculous. And so then 0.82

00:29:13.840 we decided to move out of the city. We moved to the suburbs. And when we moved to the suburbs,

00:29:17.660 I had an existential crisis of like, I don't have New York City problems anymore.

00:29:22.900 What do I have?

00:29:23.780 And so I was like, I have modern mom problems.

00:29:27.360 And then the account just took off from there because it is much more relatable.

00:29:31.860 And so that was it.

00:29:32.380 So that was in 2017.

00:29:33.760 So, yeah, I've been doing this for a hot minute.

00:29:35.320 And even before that, I used to work at Nickelodeon and I worked in social media at Nickelodeon.

00:29:41.000 I was Dora the Explorer on Facebook. 0.99

00:29:43.580 Shut up. 0.98

00:29:45.460 Yeah, it was weird. 0.99

00:29:46.620 No, I was like a social media coordinator there for a year.

00:29:51.000 And before that, I worked underneath the head of digital at Nickelodeon.

00:29:55.520 And now he runs Sesame Street.

00:29:57.920 So, yeah.

00:29:59.160 Yeah.

00:30:00.000 It's amazing the trajectory of our careers.

00:30:02.400 I think about this so much because I have no idea what my career is going to look like in five years.

00:30:08.880 And if you'd told me five years ago about I started the Committed podcast about six years ago, six or seven. 0.83

00:30:15.480 if you had told me then that i would be a nearly full-time podcaster i would have laughed my ass

00:30:22.380 off i was like this is just a fun little thing that i'm doing but i write big important magazine

00:30:30.320 articles no one's gonna listen to these podcasts um yeah but yeah i think you've done such a good

00:30:37.580 job of turning out content that is relatable because there's so much content on Instagram

00:30:48.020 that is not relatable. And this is one of the things that I wrote about in the sub-staff today

00:30:53.060 where I said, I desperately want new moms to just get off social media because I didn't for my first

00:31:00.800 two kids and I did for the third with bonus baby I I did get off the social media and I watched so

00:31:08.700 much good TV like so much good TV instead of scrolling and so whereas with my first two I

00:31:15.020 would scroll social media while I was like feeding them at night or like you know trying to get them

00:31:20.000 to go to sleep this time I watched the West Wing and that was so much better because nothing is

00:31:26.800 more soothing than a bunch of people in the 90s with really nice hair solving the world's problems

00:31:32.440 in 45 minutes yeah and then was the 90s and like everything was kind of going well at that point

00:31:38.800 more or less i watched a shit ton of television when jack was a baby um i watched orange is the

00:31:46.400 new black and downton abbey and those like in my mind i will forever associate those shows with him

00:31:53.240 being a newborn because we watched a lot of that yeah yeah totally totally i mean i hear i actually

00:32:00.540 hear the west wing theme song now if i were to hear it out in public and i think despite the

00:32:06.000 fact that my boobs are dried up shriveled sun-dried tomatoes uh i would i think i would let

00:32:11.560 down i think milk would just start flowing if i if i heard it that's what would happen if i heard

00:32:17.480 the beginning of downton abbey you know like the like the first couple chords of that song

00:32:21.620 whoosh. You wish it would come right down. That's absolutely true. But you know, it's funny that

00:32:27.580 you were saying about staying off social media. I agree. You know, I started social media because

00:32:32.200 I wanted to start a page. I was in the biggest city in America, lonely. I had, you know, no

00:32:38.940 friends who had children my age. My friends were working and like working in as much as like they

00:32:44.920 were like single, you know, childless at that point. And I was looking to connect with people

00:32:50.980 And I didn't know how else to connect with people.

00:32:53.120 So I started my own village and it really just, you know, took off from there.

00:32:58.120 But, you know, what's interesting in since the, I don't know, five, six, seven years,

00:33:02.060 I'm bad at math, you know, I've seen so much change.

00:33:04.980 But the one thing that I really have been sort of like leaning into a lot lately is

00:33:09.320 like the social commentary of all of this, which obviously you talk about, you know,

00:33:14.420 just this week I had Stephanie McNeil on my podcast and I told her she's great.

00:33:19.680 She's great.

00:33:20.060 And I told her that she was like my last infinity stone on my Thanos gauntlet.

00:33:26.860 And I'll explain what I mean by that of of mommy influencer social critics.

00:33:33.420 So I had you on my podcast. I had Sarah Peterson, who I love, Catherine Jezer Morton.

00:33:39.060 Who else did I have? Jessica Elefante, Stephanie, you know, like all of those people,

00:33:45.260 I feel are like my different infinity stones for my Thanos gauntlet of talking about the

00:33:50.880 influencer industry. Because now in, you know, 2023, 2024, it's almost impossible to be on social

00:34:00.800 and not be looking at it through a certain social lens, social commentary lens. Totally. Yeah. Well,

00:34:07.920 and I think it helps. I think it helps because it makes the scroll less mindless.

00:34:15.260 Right. If you think about the commentary around it, if you think about how all of this was created, you're less likely to feel crappy about it.

00:34:25.300 I think my kids are going to come in. I hear them. I hear them rumbling. They're rumbling.

00:34:29.360 I have one sick kid home today, but she was sick yesterday.

00:34:34.660 But now I think she's fine, which means she's just like running around the house.

00:34:40.980 But, you know, you're like, oh, I want you to rest. Please go watch Dora the Explorer.

00:34:45.260 No, I just totally lost my train of thought. Oh, but I think that it helps because, you know, you're less likely to feel crappy. You're less likely to compare yourself to people when you know that they're that this is a business. And if you can think about like, what are what is someone trying to sell me?

00:35:02.180 So you're telling me that you're so amazing at raising five children and homeschooling, but all you want to do is sell me your course.

00:35:12.360 And if I buy this course, you know what it's probably going to be?

00:35:15.300 A PDF.

00:35:16.380 Here's $500 for the PDF.

00:35:19.460 Yes.

00:35:19.760 Can I have $500?

00:35:21.160 Okay.

00:35:21.380 Can I just give you $500 for a PDF of your daily routine?

00:35:27.080 Which that's what some of these are.

00:35:29.180 They really are.

00:35:30.060 um or i someone sent me an account yesterday i get sent so many so many different accounts that

00:35:35.880 i should probably uh just start sending them out in the newsletter because i think people will get

00:35:40.660 a kick out of them and it's this woman who she's older it was interesting she was probably in her

00:35:47.140 she looked like she was in her 60s and talks about how she's raised five kids and has 30 years

00:35:52.320 experience mothering and has a lot of posts about how to honor your husband and take care of your

00:35:58.180 house. And then she's just trying to sell me some goddamn energy drink powder. But there are still 1.00

00:36:03.960 some bright spots on the Instagrams, much like your account. What is the most popular thing

00:36:09.700 you've ever posted? Gosh, I can think of two things off the top of my head. One, I posted a

00:36:16.640 reel about regulating yourself before dealing with your children so that you could calm yourself

00:36:23.980 down, walk away, count to 10. It was sort of just like a tip and trick about parenting and

00:36:30.120 maintaining your own regulation. And that did wildly well. And then recently, yeah. And then

00:36:35.260 recently, I made a reel where it's Mr. Rogers saying, I'm really proud of you. And my caption

00:36:44.360 on the top, it was like me to me when I put my phone down and start like when I stopped scrolling

00:36:50.260 my phone and start doing chores. And people really appreciated that one. People love anything that

00:36:55.800 has to do with social media and Instagram. And again, I think that's the meta part of that. And

00:37:02.780 I don't mean meta in as, you know, the company that owns Facebook. I mean, like, it is very meta

00:37:07.120 to be talking about social media on social media, right? And people love that. And so I think that's

00:37:13.800 really a big one. I have a quote that I wrote years ago that was something along the lines of

00:37:19.740 um be the friend you wish you had when you had newborns and that goes back to our um original

00:37:28.040 conversation about the postpartum uh friendship and village and all of that kind of stuff another

00:37:33.040 one which i think is really funny and people don't know this so much is that i wrote a meme again

00:37:38.200 several years ago and it said no one prepares you of the transition of going from mama to mommy to

00:37:45.880 mom and then another woman who has an account called um i think it's mom truth bomb she added

00:37:52.140 the bra so now you see that all the time it's like you know mama mommy mom bro um and that's

00:38:00.540 just really funny but yeah so i wrote like the original original one like you know years and

00:38:04.980 years ago which age do you think is the hardest i have a three-year-old that just turned four

00:38:09.120 and I'm hoping it gets better, but it's, it's escalating. And I have a six-year-old,

00:38:15.280 he's amazing right now, but it was hard, was hard for a long time. Um, but now he's so rational and

00:38:22.140 lovely. It's funny that you say that. Okay. So I have an 11 year old. He just turned 11 last week

00:38:28.700 and between 18 months and three years old, he tantrumed so hard. We chose not to have more

00:38:37.240 children it was a lot it was a ticking time bomb just about anywhere you went it was all hands on

00:38:46.680 deck I mean when I say all hands I mean just mean my husband but um it was a lot um and then when

00:38:53.660 he turned three it definitely lessened and then by three and a half and then four it was good

00:38:58.560 I remember when this was all going on my son my husband used to jokingly say to me about my son

00:39:05.040 like, oh, just be six. Just be six. Just be six already because six year olds are so rational.

00:39:11.480 And now he's 11. And I think back at that. I was like, God, that was five years ago when he was

00:39:15.480 saying just be six. So it really does, you know, go by quickly. But we had a lot of issues with

00:39:23.160 the tantrum. And again, this was pre Instagram parenting expert stuff, if that makes sense.

00:39:29.480 And so we were like really out there in an island alone trying to handle all of this kind of stuff. I wish I would have had all the stuff that we have now. I mean, the problem is this. There's a lot of information overload. Everyone and their mother is giving you advice about this kind of stuff. Literally everyone.

00:39:46.760 And I get sent a lot of parenting books. I get sent all of the parenting books. And I actually do read through most of them. And I have to say, they really have helped me become a better parent in figuring out my own way to parent.

00:40:05.600 You know, I consider myself like a conscious parent because, like, I'm in tune with myself to be in tune with him.

00:40:11.480 It's, you know, it's like a whole thing.

00:40:12.900 But like I said, I've read so many parenting books.

00:40:15.580 My closet is like over or my bookshelves are like overflowing with parenting books because there's a lot of people out there that have a lot of really good advice.

00:40:23.500 There are a lot of people out there that don't have a lot of good advice, too.

00:40:27.440 A hundred percent.

00:40:28.320 Yeah, absolutely.

00:40:29.040 And I actually, I think that there's some good to be gleaned from a lot of different kinds of advice.

00:40:37.420 And when you can cherry pick and just listen to what resonates with you, I like that.

00:40:42.860 I don't like, I do think that a lot of the parenting advice influencers have leaned into mom shaming too hard.

00:40:52.040 And I don't like that because, again, they're shaming you to sell something.

00:40:56.140 there's some that I just adore that I'm so happy that they are on Instagram so that they're easily

00:41:03.600 available to people I'm obsessed with Emily Oster yeah she's great she's so she's coming on the show

00:41:10.000 she's coming on the show in a couple weeks and I just think she's so smart and you know I was an

00:41:16.540 economics major undergrad and just taking economic data and translating it to parenthood that's the

00:41:25.180 kind of parenting advice that i want but and from actual real experts i love pediatricians

00:41:31.440 on instagram actually people who are real live doctors in the world uh i'm just so skeptical

00:41:37.460 of people that create these parenting coaching accounts right it's like the parenting coach is

00:41:43.020 the new life coach and i'm like what did you have a kid is that why you're qualified to coach me

00:41:48.020 because i've got three and i shouldn't be telling anyone what the fuck to do that is definitely 0.92

00:41:53.800 indicative of what's going on on social right now, without a doubt. Yes, without a doubt. 0.95

00:42:00.220 It's a lot. It's a lot to weed through. I can't imagine being a brand new parent having to have

00:42:08.600 this influx. Like I said, for me, people at that point on social were just like posting pictures

00:42:12.980 of like sandwiches and stuff, right? It was not anywhere near to the level it is now. Yes,

00:42:17.740 we had Facebook and yes, we had Twitter. Instagram wasn't really so much a thing,

00:42:22.020 you know 11 years ago um it was but like they weren't doing you know selling courses and stuff

00:42:29.160 like that but I have to say and I really I meant this and this this is true I think that I am a

00:42:34.500 better parent because of the different things that I've gleamed from Instagram and the conversations

00:42:42.680 that I've had with people over the years the overwhelming amount of parenting books that

00:42:46.940 I've been sent and that I've read throughout the years and so I've done my own research you know 0.82

00:42:51.660 i've done my own work god i that sounds terrible i hate when people say shit like that i've done 0.94

00:42:55.720 my work i've worked on myself done my work oh god tara stop it but you stop it right now tara 0.67

00:43:03.640 but i i think it's sort of like part of my job is like you know if i'm going to um you know talk to

00:43:10.640 somebody about their their book or or sort of um you know endorse something i obviously need to know

00:43:16.320 about it in order to do it you know i'm not gonna just like shill for stuff just for the sake of

00:43:20.640 shilling i have to say that doing all the research for both this show and then also all the research

00:43:24.840 i used to do for committed which was my show about marriage uh which i love so much and but i no

00:43:31.300 longer own it so i don't promote it as much it yeah i heart refuses to give it back to me uh

00:43:38.000 i learned i think how to be a better partner because i was talking about marriage so often

00:43:43.660 when that's just the value of conversation of of constantly talking about these things

00:43:49.640 that matter so much and again that just brings us back to the village like who is in our village

00:43:55.380 and how can we have these open and honest conversations not just about being a mother

00:43:59.980 but being a woman in the world which is not easy it's not easy and that's that's also why these 0.91

00:44:05.920 attacks saying well you wanted feminism are not helpful because frankly it's not easy for a lot 0.99

00:44:13.160 of women that have also chosen to stay home even the more extreme versions the trad wives 0.91

00:44:20.900 being a woman moving around in the world is difficult and just creating divisions is incredibly 0.97

00:44:27.480 unhelpful the echo chamber of social media is such bullshit it really is i you know i'm working

00:44:32.720 on a piece that might end up being controversial i'm writing it for bustle about what i've learned 0.98

00:44:37.540 talking to so many trad wives and reporting on trad wives that has improved my own marriage and

00:44:44.900 i'm gonna i'm gonna bounce this off everyone right now because i want to see what see what happens

00:44:49.120 it's what i think is very useful in the world of hashtag trad wives is the delineation of of tasks

00:45:01.780 and roles and what is so much harder in a partnership where you say but we're equal we

00:45:09.320 both do it all is that there's no definition of doing it all there's no there's no guidelines for

00:45:18.720 how to make that work and I do think that we have to do more work then to assign the roles right to

00:45:27.540 say okay you are the person that is fully in charge of all of our children's doctor's appointments

00:45:33.180 you are the person who is fully in charge of all of home repair um those have to be assigned because

00:45:39.760 i think knowing your role knowing knowing what you're supposed to be doing is comforting it is

00:45:45.600 comforting and it does and then there then there is less friction but if you are in a partnership

00:45:51.200 where you're like oh but we we're equal we both do things that's not enough and eve rodsky says

00:45:57.940 this all the time i love eve she's amazing she just made my day because she told me that she

00:46:01.620 was reading the sicilian inheritance in the series she was reading the sicilian inheritance

00:46:04.960 while while in tokyo and i'm just like i love you so much so much it's such a good book you've read

00:46:12.060 you've oh you've read it oh my god i've read it it's one of my favorite books that i've ever read

00:46:17.380 because as a Sicilian American, it really like resonated with me.

00:46:22.440 And my family's from the Palermo area and it's set in Palermo, whereas my husband's

00:46:27.980 family is from the Siracusa side, which is the eastern side of the island.

00:46:32.640 Which is different.

00:46:33.720 It's a different part.

00:46:34.440 Yeah, it's totally different.

00:46:36.020 Totally different vibe.

00:46:37.060 Yeah.

00:46:37.660 Yeah, you were one of my earliest readers and I was so nervous when you were reading

00:46:41.960 it, but I'm so glad, so glad that you loved it.

00:46:44.820 It's incredible.

00:46:45.460 I could literally sit and talk about that for the next 30 minutes because it is one of my favorite books of all time.

00:46:51.260 I may read it a second time and I don't read it a second time.

00:46:54.360 You should read it a second time.

00:46:55.480 I'll come.

00:46:55.880 Well, I'll come on Modern Mom Probs closer to pub and I will talk about it for 30 minutes.

00:47:00.300 And also you and I are going to do a party together.

00:47:02.340 We're going to do a cannoli and cheese and wine party when Sicilian Inheritance comes out in April.

00:47:09.740 I will be there.

00:47:10.320 I will drive down to Philly.

00:47:11.580 It's an hour and 45 minutes away from home.

00:47:13.520 We're going to do it. 0.97

00:47:14.400 but we're going to eat and drink and just have a fucking blast because that's the point of the 0.96

00:47:19.820 Sicilian inheritance and I do feel like a broken record because I'm asking people to pre-order 0.96

00:47:23.560 it's so annoying that I have to do that but the publisher like when they see the pre-orders go up 0.80

00:47:28.820 then they print more books so it's just I have to ask even though I feel like an asshole asking

00:47:35.400 people to order a book that isn't coming out till April but it helps so much that you can't even 0.88

00:47:39.660 underestimate it. So I'm just a broken record over here. No, but the thing is this, the book is

00:47:44.400 really good. And I could see if you said that like in your book sucked, then I'd be like, yeah,

00:47:48.900 I get that. I see it. But like your book's extraordinary. The story is extraordinary. 0.97

00:47:53.160 I couldn't put it down. I was mad anytime that I got interrupted that I would like have to put

00:47:58.840 it down to go do something because I was I was in it. I was I was there with my people. I was in it.

00:48:05.820 Oh, I love hearing that. That warms my cold dead heart because I love this book more than anything I've ever written. And I just want all the people to read it. I want to get it to all of the humans. If I could give it away for free to everyone, I would. But the publisher really wouldn't like that. They would be unhappy about that.

00:48:21.960 I want to leave our listeners with with some happiness and some joy. You're a person who is

00:48:28.680 extremely online because it is your job. What do you derive joy from on Instagram? Who do you like

00:48:34.000 to follow and who because I am all about our listeners curating their feeds so that it only

00:48:40.780 brings them joy. So who is in your feed that brings you genuine joy? Oh, gosh, that is there's

00:48:46.760 just so many people, but I'll just throw out some of my names of my good friends. Libby Ward

00:48:52.220 from Diary of an Honest Mom. Nikki Marie, she lives just outside of Boston. She's freaking

00:48:58.680 hilarious. You would get along with Nikki very well. She is a riot. Caitlin Murray from Big Time 0.60

00:49:05.660 Adulting. There's so many. I mean, I can't even, it's one of those things like, you know, when

00:49:11.000 there's like the Oscar acceptance speech and you have to like thank all of your people. It's like

00:49:15.940 Everyone, I love you. You know who you are, all of that kind of stuff. But I do think it is so important to curate your feed like that. And even when I post things and I write things, I think the same way. You know, like, that's why I said, like, my page is not all of one thing. It's sort of messy and like a mosaic. And as much as like one day I'm feeling upbeat and uplifting and I want people to feel like that. Another day, maybe I'm a little bit more down, you know, and post about that. And like, that's okay, because that's what motherhood is. And that's what being a human is.

00:49:45.480 And I think my page reflects that.

00:49:47.420 Yeah, it really does.

00:49:48.960 It really does.

00:49:49.520 And if you scroll through, you'll be like, oh, my gosh, I'm feeling this right now.

00:49:52.620 This is me. 0.99

00:49:53.220 This is fucking me right now. 0.99

00:49:55.000 And so I really I want everyone to follow Modern Momprobs and you. 0.97

00:50:00.840 And I hope you'll come back.

00:50:02.120 Will you come back on the show?

00:50:03.960 A thousand percent, yes.

00:50:06.580 Can I actually tell you a funny story?

00:50:08.160 You're going to laugh at this.

00:50:09.160 OK, like two years ago, you spoke at Mom 2.0.

00:50:13.860 And you were on a panel.

00:50:15.000 And I said to myself, right then and then, I didn't know you.

00:50:17.980 I didn't know you from, I mean, I was familiar with your work, but we didn't know each other

00:50:22.020 personally.

00:50:22.600 And I said to myself, someday, Tara, you're going to get on Under the Influence.

00:50:27.380 And so I checked off my bucket list.

00:50:29.520 Oh my God.

00:50:30.440 I was like, check it off your bucket list.

00:50:32.300 That's why we have to say out loud the things that we want.

00:50:34.160 I want to become an instant New York Times bestseller. 0.99

00:50:35.900 I'm just going to fucking say it out loud. 0.99

00:50:37.280 Say it. 0.99

00:50:37.720 It's going to happen.

00:50:38.500 I'm manifesting it for you.

00:50:40.900 It's going to happen.

00:50:41.920 We're manifesting it. 0.99

00:50:42.680 I'm going to burn some goddamn sage right now. 0.98

00:50:45.480 I loved having you on. 0.96

00:50:46.580 Thank you.

00:50:46.980 Thank you.

00:50:47.320 Thank you.

00:50:48.280 Thank you, Jo.

Under the Influence (with Jo Piazza) - December 01, 2023

Newborn Advice No One With Tell You With Modern Mom Probs (Tara Clark)

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