Under the Influence (with Jo Piazza) - Sad Beige Babies With Sad Beige Parents

00:00:00.000 Hey y'all, Jo here, and you are listening to Under the Influence.

00:00:09.500 Now, I've been thinking about sad beige babies and sad beige houses for an embarrassingly

00:00:17.920 long time. Like, truly. Years. I mean, I honestly think that the rise of sad beige motherhood

00:00:25.540 was one of the things that broke my brain enough to create this podcast in the first 0.98

00:00:29.460 place. Because when I had my first kid, I swear to God, every single woman on Instagram, and most 0.63

00:00:35.840 of the ones in San Francisco, too, were living inside what looked like a Scandinavian hostage 0.96

00:00:41.440 situation. Everything was beige. Beige toys, beige nurseries, beige stacking cups. Even the babies 0.83

00:00:50.300 looked whiter than usual. And my life was not that. My life was a chaotic, technicolor maelstrom

00:00:58.420 of shit is what it was. Truly, truly. And the message underneath all of these Instagram 1.00

00:01:04.920 accounts, and honestly, across media generally, was that if your home was colorful or chaotic 0.85

00:01:10.340 or filled with hand-me-down plastic crap from another family, that you were doing motherhood 0.95

00:01:16.220 wrong. Now, I think that this is changing. I truly, truly do. And yet I do want to look back 0.97

00:01:24.320 a little bit to figure out exactly how this happened. And my guest today is the perfect

00:01:29.440 person to do that because she was the first person to start publicly mocking this on the

00:01:33.940 internet, which is why I knew, I knew instantly that we were going to be best friends. Our guest

00:01:40.260 today is Haley DeRoche, aka the official Sad Beige. And her recent book, Dress Your Baby in

00:01:47.840 Sage and Taupe, made me laugh so hard that I peed three times. She's basically the internet's

00:01:52.420 foremost scholar on sad beige motherhood. And today we're going to talk about how influencer

00:01:56.620 culture convinced women to turn motherhood into something that looks like a luxury brand,

00:02:01.920 where every stroller suddenly costs the same as a used Honda Civic, or maybe even a new Honda 1.00

00:02:06.520 Civic. I don't know what Honda Civics cost these days. And how we can be so much better,

00:02:12.040 so much better and happier than the sad beige mom with the sad beige baby.

00:02:19.700 here's my conversation with Haley okay Haley I have to tell you that I laughed out loud

00:02:36.080 thank you so many times so many times girl because the sad beige baby is something I talk

00:02:47.460 about all the time. I think I reference it in every, I definitely reference it in everyone

00:02:52.500 is lying to you. I definitely do. I need to, I need to go back to look, but the like dress your

00:02:57.680 baby in sage and taupe, this whole cultural shift. And it happened like right around when I had my

00:03:05.020 first baby is amazing to me. I was in San Francisco and all of those bitches were dressing 1.00

00:03:11.140 their babies in just the saddest neutral linens that they were gonna puke on and shit through 1.00

00:03:17.720 and like get food on and they were all like $200 and in fact that is one of the like influences

00:03:24.740 one of the reasons that I started under the influence yes place so thank you thank you for

00:03:30.480 talking about this very important subject it is so dear to me I'm always happy to just yap about

00:03:37.380 it because I can't let it go. Clearly. No, you clearly actually can't let it go. If anyone

00:03:42.740 is obsessed with the sad beige baby more than I am, it is me. It's you. It's you. Yay. And I love

00:03:52.500 that you wrote, you know, this satiric, but also kind of not satirical handbook for the sad parent,

00:03:59.440 dress your baby in sage and taupe. And I will tell you that I have like left this laying around

00:04:05.260 and some women have come up to me and be like, oh, this is perfect. I love this aesthetic. And 1.00

00:04:10.080 I'm like, oh my God, then we're not going to be friends. I obviously hate you already.

00:04:14.740 Well, hopefully, hopefully they read it and they, they see the light, right?

00:04:20.180 Well, I mean, maybe, but we don't, I mean, you just, what I've realized is there's just no

00:04:23.940 fixing people at this point. So, so talk to me a little bit about where this obsession came from.

00:04:32.640 And the first time that you started seeing the sad beige trend.

00:04:38.540 Yes, it's it's almost apocryphal for me at this point.

00:04:42.820 I was shopping for a baby shower gift and I came across these like stacking cups and

00:04:48.320 stacking rings like the rainbow ones, like the classic Fisher Price, right, that I'm

00:04:52.320 looking for.

00:04:53.040 But instead, what I find are these like beige, sullen, sad little stacking cups and stacking

00:05:00.520 rings that are just like these different shades of brown and like one dark blue thrown in there

00:05:06.380 for I guess like spice and I just looked at them and I was just like well this is this is depressing

00:05:11.420 and then I looked the marketing images that are with them and these children are just like staring

00:05:15.700 at them somberly and I think I think the idea was like they will be sagely and wise beyond their

00:05:21.720 years if they play with these stacking cups um but the way it kind of translated on screen like

00:05:27.460 sometimes things just don't translate the way that they're intended and they just looked like

00:05:31.000 they were miserable and sad looking at these sad little toys um and so from there I just started

00:05:37.100 seeing it everywhere but that's also where I made the initial like first sad beige toys for sad

00:05:42.440 beige children joke because after that I was like well who would be the worst best spokesperson for

00:05:49.000 a fake children's brand and I was like well obviously Werner Herzog of grizzly man fame

00:05:53.560 et cetera. Yes, absolutely. Right, right. Like, perfect. Like, you think of cuddly,

00:05:58.600 you think of warm, you think of childhood, you think of Werner Herzog. I do, actually. I have

00:06:03.200 let my kids watch Werner Herzog videos before, by the way. So, I mean, but I'm a terrible parent.

00:06:07.780 I dress my kids in all sorts of colors. Oh, same, same, same. It's like a circus

00:06:12.440 throw up. It's how one person, a sad beige person, tried to make me feel bad one time, 0.72

00:06:16.720 and I was like, no, that's great. That's what I want. Yeah, no, seriously. Well, what I think 0.95

00:06:20.720 is interesting I think so many things are interesting about the sad beige aesthetic and

00:06:26.520 sad beige can incorporate a lot of different shades there's a lot as you said in the New York

00:06:32.460 Times a lot of eggshell a lot of cream a lot of oatmeal cardboard biscotti sand exactly so many

00:06:40.980 different so many on we yeah right it does it it is the shade of on we is what it is it truly is

00:06:47.740 So one of the things that I think that it did is it also pushed commercialism and capitalism.

00:06:56.040 It was really embraced by a lot of influencers who wanted to sell you things.

00:07:01.980 Yes.

00:07:02.620 And really discouraged the idea of hand-me-downs, many of which are very brightly colored, right?

00:07:10.240 Like, you know, when I get a sack of clothes from my friends or when I did nine years ago, you know, they're all just like they're all colors of the rainbow.

00:07:17.740 And so if you want to get someone to buy something new, you embrace this cultural aesthetic that hasn't been there before. So you're really pushing them to buy new, instead of, you know, embracing the circular economy that women have embraced with babies forever, since they were babies.

00:07:34.320 Yes, absolutely. And like, talking about the influencer aspect, too, is that like, if your home is your studio from an influencer perspective, then you want stuff to pop on the screen. So having your entire aesthetic be very beige, very neutral, also just helps you sell products, honestly.

00:07:51.820 Exactly, exactly. It's like what I what I used to hear when I would cover fashion week, it was that, you know, in person, the models are supposed to be and this was back in the 90s. So people talk like this, the 90s and 2000s, you know, tall and thin, and almost blank slates, like a canvas and a wire hanger, so that the clothes popped on them.

00:08:16.940 yes exactly it's it's the same thing same song different chorus exactly exactly but what drove

00:08:24.300 me insane and I mean I'm just going back to the early days of under the influence now because

00:08:29.460 I'm revisiting some of the old episodes uh to see what we can update and put back in the feed for

00:08:35.620 people who haven't gone back through 396 episodes uh which is insane that I've made that crazy what's

00:08:42.580 wrong with me something is wrong with me no yeah flip it what's right with you clearly something

00:08:48.200 oh I love that I love that perspective uh so you know in the beginning of that I was talking a lot

00:08:56.080 about these white and beige houses and how they genuinely made me feel bad about my own home

00:09:04.120 because they were just so spartan right and mine is mine was filled with clutter and just oh so 0.97

00:09:10.820 much crap oh so much crap and it was again that shame and guilt that was used to try to get me 0.93

00:09:18.860 to purchase things to make my life look like that yes and I think like there's so much pressure for 0.99

00:09:26.240 looking like you are like the perfect parent online and like the pressure to perform that role

00:09:32.060 is incredibly high and just I think it gets higher every day and like in order to perform that role

00:09:40.180 You really do have to embrace that specific aesthetic. And like part of it is like they you do feel bad when you don't because it's it makes you stand out and not in a good way sometimes.

00:09:51.600 absolutely absolutely so we we've set this up the the sad beige aesthetic and it truly was

00:10:01.580 a way for influencers and companies to sell sell sell to new mothers to make us to put us in a

00:10:09.300 place of guilt and of shame what was what was your reaction to it how old are your kids now

00:10:15.620 My kids are nine and almost 12.

00:10:18.640 Okay.

00:10:18.940 So we had a baby around the same time because my eight-year-old's about to turn nine.

00:10:24.200 Yeah.

00:10:24.720 It was a different time, but like some things say the same.

00:10:27.400 This is when it started, though, with the nine-year-old.

00:10:30.500 With the 12-year-old, you didn't see this, though, right?

00:10:32.680 No, I really didn't.

00:10:33.860 It was still very much like people were still using Blogspot at that point.

00:10:38.600 Yes, they were.

00:10:39.180 The transition from Blogspot over to visual social media was very abrupt.

00:10:44.920 Yes, it felt like just like a switch happened. And suddenly blogspot was dead. I don't remember if that was before or after Google reader died. But I know that was also a big impetus for that. But yeah, the switch felt very, very fast.

00:10:57.880 yeah no it truly it truly did I mean because my and it was very different then because then I

00:11:03.880 went on to have more many more children uh and I say I say that in the context of like I do so 0.98

00:11:09.180 many episodes with Mormon women and I'm like I have no kids compared to them right but yeah with 1.00

00:11:15.440 my six-year-old it was then in full swing I mean like this was this was insane and it actually made 1.00

00:11:20.500 me sad because for a very long time I was unable to buy baby things for showers and things like

00:11:26.600 that in colors other than these sad colors which just broke my heart it's a bummer and like kind

00:11:36.560 of like what you mentioned before like it really does cut into people just sharing their stuff and

00:11:42.220 like you do see more and more people being like well I I like this aesthetic so I only want this

00:11:46.040 stuff given to me and it's just like I I don't know it kind of defeats the purpose I know I know

00:11:51.680 I mean, it truly does. I also think that for a long time, it was kind of a signal. And I think

00:11:58.300 actually, I think it's a signal of stealth wealth. Yes, yes, yes, absolutely. I love talking about

00:12:06.020 this aspect because I do think that the beige neutral aesthetic is absolutely a class signifier

00:12:11.720 and like quiet luxury, all of that. And like, I do think that it has specifically trickled down

00:12:17.660 to us peasants now from like the Roe and the Kardashians and like now it's come to us like

00:12:22.960 the cerulean sweater I was literally just going to say the cerulean sweater it's the cerulean

00:12:28.140 sweater all the way down it's beige all the way down and I mean whatever comes next it's going to

00:12:33.760 be the same thing the next thing is going to be the next class signifier it'll just it'll just

00:12:38.340 be different and again the idea that baby clothes should be signaling status it's crazy I'm sorry

00:12:46.660 like that is just it's too much i hate everything about it i truly hate everything about it i also

00:12:53.840 hate the idea and i've been working on a new podcast with baby list about children and families

00:13:01.400 and finance and producing it with lindsey stanbury from the purse who's amazing i know she's the best 0.95

00:13:08.420 nice uh and we talk so much about how babies don't need shit babies no won't need they actually don't 0.96

00:13:16.220 need like pretty much anything, but they definitely don't need fancy things. And I want to take a 0.98

00:13:21.180 quick break and then dig into that. Yes. Okay, we are back. You were quoted in a wonderful

00:13:36.320 Atlantic article about how babies don't need fancy things. And it's so true. They just need 1.00

00:13:43.940 less and less stuff, right? But the rise of Instagram culture and our culture generally

00:13:50.300 has sent parents the message that if we just buy the right products, we're ensuring the kid's

00:13:55.520 success and also maybe our and signaling our success as a parent, like we're good at this.

00:14:02.000 Yes. And I think like, first of all, yes, there's that aspect that like, if like you can,

00:14:06.300 you can purchase the right things and ensure your baby's like magical future, you can just you can

00:14:12.060 do that and obviously that's absurd you really can't buy your way out of the difficulties of

00:14:19.360 parenting and you can't buy your way out of the mistakes that you will inevitably make and because

00:14:23.260 you don't know what they're going to be yet um and then there's also this aspect of like

00:14:29.060 how do I put this it's really really hard to lose so much control when you become a new parent and

00:14:39.620 And so I think there's this push to solve your problems, even if it's not all of them, by buying stuff that will somehow alleviate that loss of control.

00:14:50.100 And like if you just buy the right stroller or buy the right baby carrier or something like that, that like you can kind of wrestle back, even if it's just this one thing that like now you have there was a problem and you solved it.

00:15:01.000 And like that's a great feeling when suddenly everything else feels very uncontrollable and unpredictable.

00:15:06.860 So I do see that as also kind of an angle. And like, as we lose our community connections more, solving our problems through consumption just seems to be what people turn to.

00:15:20.040 Oh, yeah. Always, always. I mean, that was how I felt when I was first scrolling Instagram and seeing all of these women with these picture perfect lives. I'm like, if I have this thing, if I have this $60 swaddle, you know what works really well? The blanket that you steal from the hospital.

00:15:36.860 Okay, but I was also I was a victim of I just there was this one baby wearing wrap that I just I really, really, really wanted it. And that became like my white whale. I was like, this is the one thing that I can control and I'm going to get it. And it did not solve my problems.

00:15:53.680 Of course it didn't solve your problems.

00:15:55.720 Shocking.

00:15:56.500 Yeah.

00:15:56.780 Well, I looked back at like the numerous things that I bought for my first child that did not work.

00:16:02.140 One of them included that weighted sleep suit where they looked like a Michelin man that essentially pinned this poor baby to their crib so that they would sleep better.

00:16:14.380 Look, I want one of those for me.

00:16:16.000 If they made like a me-sized one, oh my God, I'd never get out of bed again.

00:16:19.940 No, same.

00:16:20.480 I would love to sleep on my back more.

00:16:23.680 you know, so my face doesn't fall to gravity. Right. Yeah. For a baby. I mean, if it works,

00:16:30.040 that's great. But like, it's not a necessity. It is not. I don't really not. I also do not

00:16:35.000 think that it worked. And I was almost I was almost hoodwinked by the snoo. Oh, I escaped

00:16:41.460 the snoo. Yeah. I oh, no, I did not. I did not snoo it. But like, I was almost I was almost

00:16:46.480 sucked in by the almost snooed. Well, it's just it's just so interesting. I think I really love

00:16:51.080 what you said about as we lose community because as we lose community we lose the women who came

00:16:58.000 slightly before us yes yes and I am a different I'm a different mother now than I was with baby

00:17:06.720 one where I'm just like oh I know these months are gonna be shitty I can't buy my way out of this

00:17:14.100 like every baby is different and this too shall end yes truly it does end and like I think that's

00:17:20.500 really also the importance of like finding parents who are in kind of your same boat who you can

00:17:25.380 genuinely talk to totally because otherwise you do kind of feel adrift and you don't know what's

00:17:32.360 happening and what's happening next and why it's happening and when will it end oh yeah no exactly

00:17:38.000 and then you're googling constantly and you're scrolling instagram and tiktok and then you're

00:17:42.820 taking the advice of these influencers who are just trying to sell you something they're selling

00:17:47.880 you something instead of taking the advice of your peers I mean your peer but you're like

00:17:53.620 direct peers they're so important for some things but also they're still like going through it so

00:17:58.580 they're like ah and just as panicked as you are I'm like get yourself a mama three okay because

00:18:04.480 they're gonna be like you know what's fine a baby could sleep in a laundry basket yeah if it works 0.99

00:18:09.740 it works it works you're fine you're fine I actually I sometimes I get very nervous around 0.99

00:18:15.880 new parents because I think they end up hating me by the end because they're like, no, I can buy my

00:18:19.780 way out of this. And I'm like, no, you can't. You can't. You can't. You can try. Good luck.

00:18:24.120 You're going to be poor. You're going to be poor. No wiser. None at all. None at all. And I think

00:18:29.100 they're also like nervous sometimes when they come to my house because my kids are so freaking

00:18:32.800 feral at this point and they're just following them around everywhere. And I'm like, it's all

00:18:36.920 okay. My house is like my kids who are feral and then like random neighborhood kids just cycling

00:18:42.740 in and out and I'm like who are you hello these these neighborhood kids just live at my house

00:18:47.980 oh yeah home from a work trip like six months ago and one of the one of the neighborhood kids was

00:18:53.380 like I'll bet you're surprised to see me here and I'm like no Sam not really live here like

00:18:57.080 like last night I was feeding you know they're if we're having dinner they're welcome to have food

00:19:03.280 and everyone was just like what is that and I'm like it's gnocchi it's potatoes and they're like

00:19:08.020 I don't know about that. They're like, do you have anything else? Like, I guess. Sure. What

00:19:12.840 else can I, what else can I make you? What else can I do for you? I mean, last night I was so

00:19:17.920 behind because my podcasting platform was, was acting up and I had a deadline and I just cooked,

00:19:25.420 I think 30 chicken nuggets and put them in one platter and put out a bowl of ketchup. And I'm

00:19:29.800 like, you got it. Hero. Hero. Go. Yeah. I'm going to do that this summer. That's smart. I'm putting,

00:19:34.720 i'm filing that away right exactly i'm like we sit down for dinner together 90 of the time yeah

00:19:41.400 and the other time i'm like just get calories in your body please god please god yeah please god

00:19:48.280 yeah exactly exactly so yeah i mean i just i really do think that all of this this rise of

00:19:55.640 sad beige and the the signals of stealth wealth and and also i mean the signal of the stuff of

00:20:02.640 the strollers that you're only going to use for a year, all of that, it is crippling to new

00:20:08.720 parents. And I think it's also sending a message to younger folks who are then scared to have kids

00:20:13.920 because they're like, it's too expensive. I can't afford it. Yeah. And I mean, I think the biggest

00:20:18.980 financial hurdle is child care. I mean, yes. That's literally the only thing we should all

00:20:26.000 be talking about. I would love to figure out a way to be a child care influencer.

00:20:29.440 we'll fix it from the inside yeah well like like how do we how do we fix that because that is

00:20:37.160 and has always been my biggest expense oh yeah children um it's insane it's insane i mean what

00:20:44.500 if when you go to a baby shower instead of giving sad beige toys and presents you contributed to a

00:20:52.060 child care fund but what if we had in a high interest savings account yeah or we could have

00:20:58.400 a government that cares about its people and could maybe wishing wishing wishing on no we have to

00:21:08.080 think about we have to think about things we can actually do right right but yeah like

00:21:13.080 yes really leaning on each other is is so important like there's the drama of the day on

00:21:18.500 threads is like someone who apparently asked their sister to watch their kids for two days

00:21:22.380 while she has a new baby and like people are so up in arms as though this is like right it's like

00:21:27.580 That's a very reasonable ask.

00:21:30.000 Like you're asking your family, you're asking your community.

00:21:32.580 And like, you would think that they ask them to like, I don't know, like commit a murder.

00:21:38.540 Like to commit a murder and raise that child until college.

00:21:42.120 Right. 0.64

00:21:42.420 Raise the children, not just keep them there for two days.

00:21:45.560 What are people saying about this?

00:21:47.180 Because I leave my kids with my mom and one of our former au pairs all the time.

00:21:53.640 My husband and I are going to Croatia next week.

00:21:55.960 Oh, that's so exciting.

00:21:57.580 i know but yeah you would think that like asking your community for help and like your family

00:22:03.320 your family family is somehow like some big inconvenience and it's just like that is

00:22:08.960 that is part of being in community is being inconvenienced sometimes like you know the

00:22:16.580 inconvenience i'll add another kid to this house whatever yeah my i mean my friend has a nine-month

00:22:23.200 old baby and she hasn't been on like a solo night with her husband yet and i'm like just give me the

00:22:28.000 baby give me the baby i would love i'd love a baby i don't want my own baby i'll take a baby

00:22:33.640 overnight and you know what i've got this down to a science i know exactly what to do you know

00:22:38.840 what you're doing now right this is like the perfect situation you get them you know what

00:22:43.280 to do and then you give them back and then i give them back i'm like i still have like some baby

00:22:47.840 stuff here i'll just put it next to my bed i'll put it down we're good good it's like not

00:22:53.180 it's like nothing. And those are the kinds of things that we should be doing for each other

00:22:57.800 more. I mean, I'm constantly offering and then also asking, I offer and ask a lot. Yeah. Can

00:23:03.540 you walk the kids to school? When we go to Croatia, like my mom, it's a hodgepodge, right? 0.99

00:23:09.020 Yeah. My mom. Yeah. Mine is a hodgepodge as well. She's sleeping at the house. Our au pair who

00:23:14.980 lived with us for four years, she's essentially family. Amazing. I know. But now she's finishing

00:23:19.720 nursing school which is so awesome i know i'm so happy uh but she she'll also sleep over uh but

00:23:28.040 she has another gig during the day so she's really just here for backup and then other families are

00:23:32.300 going to walk the kids to school and it works because i ask and then also because i offer and

00:23:37.300 then you give right it truly is just give and take with people and like i i feel like we're losing

00:23:44.700 that so often and instead we're just relying on consumption to assuage that I don't know that

00:23:52.240 lack that lack that lack that lack that we I mean that we had truly truly lost and that we need to

00:23:59.340 get back to and I do blame social media for that because it has created this you know version of

00:24:07.200 motherhood where you quote unquote do it freaking all yes let's let's take another quickie break

00:24:16.780 and then I want to talk about the idea of forming a commune because you talked about this

00:24:21.800 on on your Instagram in your in your something called the mom group chat and saying let's form

00:24:27.820 a commune I'm so for communes right now I just want to talk about the idea of it like how can

00:24:33.460 me form more communes okay we are back uh i loved this on your instagram you are an addicting

00:24:48.560 addicting instagram follow if anyone is not following official sad beige yet i don't know

00:24:54.920 what you're doing with your life okay i don't know what i'm doing with my life right now honestly

00:25:00.860 we can all be in the same boat we're all in the same boat i'm gonna read a little bit of this too

00:25:05.980 uh and sometimes that's weird like sometimes people read aloud from my books to me and i'm

00:25:09.780 like i didn't i did write that i did write that um so you wrote we should form a commune a coven

00:25:16.640 commune can you imagine all of us being able to hang out at the same time and like watch each

00:25:23.100 other's kids whenever we could share everything summer child care solved and if someone's sick

00:25:30.120 You can just be sick.

00:25:31.900 I would bring you soup. 0.93

00:25:33.660 No weaponized incompetence.

00:25:35.480 No men.

00:25:36.280 LOL. 1.00

00:25:36.940 They can have their own coven.

00:25:38.140 Like the camp across the lake or something, and we'll have a weekly dance.

00:25:41.860 They can babysit.

00:25:43.220 LOL.

00:25:44.140 LOL.

00:25:44.980 You know, they actually sell whole villas in France.

00:25:47.220 We could get one of those.

00:25:48.360 Only a billion dollars, right?

00:25:49.940 Or those towns in Ireland, I think.

00:25:52.780 Every time.

00:25:53.460 Girlfriend, every time I see an ad for one of those whole towns in Ireland, my mom group

00:25:58.300 chat.

00:25:59.020 Mom, too.

00:26:00.120 and they're like is this the plan is this the plan right I mean I actually I feel like I have

00:26:08.440 kind of a commune in my Philly neighborhood now I did I had no friends in San Francisco

00:26:13.160 I was desperate and I eventually did get some friends but they all moved away because it's

00:26:18.620 expensive normal people have to leave right right it happens every time every time it's like anyone

00:26:24.520 that I was like oh my gosh you're so normal and lovely and they're like yeah I can't afford to 1.00

00:26:28.180 stay here okay okay so i was like left with these rich bitches who i could not stand who i still 1.00

00:26:33.940 like peep their instagram accounts sometimes yeah sure your kids are still wearing sad beige 1.00

00:26:38.760 decade later and you're still in that floppy hat that kind of sucked

00:26:43.740 forgot about the floppy hats the floppy hats oh yeah yeah the floppy hats and then you know they

00:26:49.920 were all also developing all because they all worked in tech and then quit oh yeah oh yeah um

00:26:54.900 So they were all developing and then selling either their own baby food companies.

00:27:01.360 Yes.

00:27:02.300 Oh, my gosh.

00:27:03.440 Which I worked for a bunch of them.

00:27:04.480 Like I consulted for a bunch of them or their own very expensive baby carriers.

00:27:10.120 Oh, my gosh.

00:27:10.600 It was the baby carriers all the way down.

00:27:13.020 All the way down. 0.60

00:27:13.880 Right.

00:27:14.200 And like I just I mean, I remember that none of those expensive baby carriers were as easy to put on as, you know, the hand-me-down Bjorn that I got.

00:27:24.120 that had been like discontinued right yeah it's just oh amazing amazing i mean so many i'm getting

00:27:30.880 so many just like ptsd flashbacks buy my book it'll give you ptsd if you were in the blogosphere

00:27:37.440 yeah buy you know what people should buy dress your baby in sage and taupe and everyone is lying

00:27:42.980 to you together together like as a package what oh let's i have an idea i have an influencing idea

00:27:49.220 why don't we do a collab giveaway i love this books yes together the perfect pairing

00:27:57.440 like a wine and a cheese it's exactly exactly um so yeah we're gonna do that i mean yes like

00:28:03.600 always we're always thinking it's true it's true um because no i like i think that your book is the

00:28:10.860 perfect perfect perfect baby shower like kid first birthday present yes birthday present

00:28:18.960 because you know that first birthday is all about you.

00:28:24.500 Yeah.

00:28:24.620 This has nothing to do with that show.

00:28:25.500 The baby doesn't know what's going on.

00:28:27.020 The baby doesn't know anything.

00:28:29.000 No.

00:28:29.340 This is a party for you and you should enjoy it.

00:28:32.720 And you should enjoy it.

00:28:33.520 You should get hilarious books. 0.99

00:28:35.200 You should get books about trad wives murdering their husbands. 1.00

00:28:38.340 Yes. 1.00

00:28:38.480 Like you deserve all the things.

00:28:39.940 So let's, yeah, let's make it like a baby shower.

00:28:41.700 Yes.

00:28:42.340 I love this.

00:28:43.260 Yes, yes, yes.

00:28:44.200 I love this for us.

00:28:45.200 Yeah.

00:28:45.580 It's amazing.

00:28:46.120 Uh, so what do you think the next trend in, in digital, in influencing motherhood is going to be that we should look out for and then, you know, fight against and ride at dawn?

00:29:02.500 Ah, such a good question because it, everything changes so fast now.

00:29:06.300 I mean, I see a lot of, um, influencers kind of, you know, not showing their kids, which I think is fantastic.

00:29:14.280 um totally yeah and obviously analog is kind of having its little moment but I'm always kind of

00:29:20.960 chuckling at that because it's like okay but you're you know writing your sub stack about

00:29:25.220 going analog so like how much did you really how analog are you how are you really yeah right

00:29:31.060 exactly exactly I do wonder if we're going to see kind of a flip to maximalism I think we're

00:29:38.760 already seeing that to be honest in so many ways yeah and i think the um actually i called this

00:29:44.080 several years ago is seeing a lot of the kind of primary colors from the 90s come back which

00:29:49.540 happened so i'm very proud of myself for that one i obviously made that happen um but like the stuff

00:29:55.160 that you see in like the old jc penny catalogs of like the red and the blue and everything

00:29:58.920 i see it more in like gen z attire but i think that that just like side beige is going to trickle

00:30:04.400 down from the adults to the kids. And so I do think that we're going to see a lot more embracing

00:30:09.540 of that kind of old school style, not necessarily like vintage, but just that like more classic

00:30:16.000 look. And oh, I'm already seeing so many influencer accounts where people are dressing

00:30:21.160 up like they're in a Ralph Lauren catalog. Yes. From 1992. Yes. Yeah. The 90s is definitely

00:30:28.300 going to be that. Well, I wish if we're doing that, then bring back the 90s parenting where

00:30:33.280 you just let them run outside and drink from a garden hose that would be fantastic i do that

00:30:37.700 personally but i mean me too same they're like they're like where's my water and i'm like

00:30:42.340 here's the hose just drink out of it it's we're fine we're in fact the best generation

00:30:48.580 okay we're we're the last best generation friends

00:30:51.880 that's gonna get canceled uh whatever i don't care i don't again like i say this oh my gosh

00:31:00.520 last night we were watching uh the manosphere documentary oh yeah yeah yeah it's the most

00:31:06.600 terrifying thing you've ever seen i watched it with my husband and we're gonna do a podcast

00:31:11.320 episode on it yes but it is horrifying it's horrifying i've decided i want to start a

00:31:17.420 movement called the perimenosphere it's just a bunch of women like screaming into these videos 1.00

00:31:24.760 being like i have no more estrogen i don't give any fucks and then another one being like no 1.00

00:31:30.380 I give less fucks. And while we're like lifting weights and eating cottage cheese, right? Like 0.98

00:31:36.520 this is a thing that needs to happen. The perimenosphere. I love this. This is amazing.

00:31:42.120 I know. I know. It was like, it was, it was an idea I had at three in the morning when I woke

00:31:46.580 up sweaty. This is the best times for ideas. The best. I have a, I have a notebook. I have a 3am

00:31:52.280 sweaty notebook. It is when I changed my pajamas. I've actually, today I looked up moisture wicking

00:31:57.320 pajamas. Oh, fancy. I think that there is a real market for women in their late 30s, 40s, early

00:32:06.820 50s for cute pajamas that wick moisture. And I'm going to look into this as yet another business 0.77

00:32:12.660 plan. Yes. I love that. Yeah, I love that. No, I mean, it just it is the like the online momming

00:32:20.600 world is crazy. I tell so many people to check out of it. How do you you have a really big

00:32:27.280 Instagram following you're like in the best way but how do you manage your media time I'm so

00:32:34.740 curious well I'm not good at it first of all I'm terrible no one's good at this no one's good at

00:32:40.840 it and I am definitely not um I try not to rely on my social media or like scrolling for actual

00:32:48.860 like problem solving honestly um I do turn to my mom group for that um because they're real people

00:32:56.060 who I trust and like we've been a mom group for like 12 years now so it's like right it's like

00:33:01.640 we're we're very stable we all love each other we all have different experiences and we've been

00:33:06.160 through a lot together so it's like if I need advice I'm gonna I'm gonna turn there before I

00:33:11.020 turn to the internet at large so it kind of creates this at least idea of barrier for me

00:33:18.620 between like the personal and the private I guess the personal the private are the same thing aren't

00:33:23.480 they uh the public and the private yeah yeah exactly totally like it absolutely does right

00:33:28.720 so it's like I have a lot of these followers but I'm not necessarily like leaning on them

00:33:32.360 for anything like I don't I don't want their advice honestly because it's just it's so many

00:33:37.900 people that I think I would go crazy and so having that kind of boundary has been really helpful

00:33:42.840 um I haven't really figured out how to stop doom scrolling but I think everyone has that problem

00:33:47.080 um but for me just having that kind of boundary between what I expect of my followers which

00:33:53.960 hopefully is just them laughing and enjoying my content um and what I really need as a person I

00:33:59.760 turn to my real life friends for yeah no same same and I I've got to say I mean I was thinking

00:34:05.320 about this today that I I now use the brick yes and I love it so much because I brick my phone

00:34:14.860 when i like finish my work day and then i just can't scroll and i'm not gonna go back upstairs

00:34:20.540 to like go unbrick it because i'm very lazy and it's i think my mental health is genuinely better

00:34:27.500 because i'm stopped from doing that instant scroll thing i truly do i truly do it's great

00:34:34.780 i have adhd so my main problem with my brick is remembering that i have it

00:34:39.580 because if it's out of sight out of mind yeah yeah yeah because i packed it for a trip recently so

00:34:45.040 it was in the bag for like two weeks i didn't use it for two weeks oh yeah no something in the back

00:34:49.140 the bag oh my god you'll never see it again never gonna live there it's a second home i know

00:34:54.500 forwarding the mail at this point with my good red lipstick i know i know just oh very traumatic

00:35:02.940 very traumatic uh but when i when i pulled it out this was like five days ago and i haven't been

00:35:09.960 i've been scrolling and i just like it's the tool that it's supposed to be and that makes me so

00:35:17.160 happy just yes retooling as it were retooling retooling exactly exactly well the other thing

00:35:25.780 i've started doing oh sorry go ahead no tell me tell me is i have started writing a poem every

00:35:29.960 night before I go to bed and it doesn't have to be good. And it doesn't have to be something that

00:35:34.680 I share. Um, I do share some of them once I've kind of like tidied them up a little bit, but

00:35:39.560 just leaning into that one small creative practice without any expectations from it,

00:35:45.900 other than I have written a poem. It didn't have to be good. It didn't have to be something I post

00:35:49.800 like I'm not creating content. I'm really just writing something to kind of sharpen my sword

00:35:56.280 as it were and that has been very grounding for me like even if I do my doom scrolling I know that

00:36:02.200 like the last thing I'm probably going to do is write a poem and I might be on my phone in my

00:36:07.620 notes app but it's still leaning into something that's very like personal and not focused on a

00:36:16.060 scroll and that has been really good for my creative practice and just like my creative

00:36:20.380 practice is my life. So it's really just improved my life, honestly. I love the idea of sharpening

00:36:26.660 your sword. That's such a great way to think about, because I talk about, you know, building

00:36:31.760 up the writing muscle all the time, but I prefer it to be a sword that is sharpened. As someone

00:36:37.440 who writes a lot of murder of bad men. Yes, you got to sharpen it. You got to sharpen that sword

00:36:42.580 every once in a while. I loved everything about this conversation. I have to go pick up my kids

00:36:47.540 from school shortly, or I would continue it forever. Will you tell everyone where they can

00:36:52.560 find you on the social medias? So where they can go when you and I collab and give people our

00:36:57.660 wonderful books as a package together? Yes, I am on Instagram at official sad beige. And I am on

00:37:05.420 TikTok at sad beige. And I am on sub stack at weird but okay. Okay. I did not know that. But

00:37:15.560 And now I'm going to go subscribe to that sub stack, A-S-A-P.

00:37:18.900 Thank you.

00:37:20.080 And then I have my website, which is just hayleyderoche.com, but nobody can spell it.

00:37:24.380 So official sad beige.

00:37:26.260 Official sad beige is just so much easier to tell people, to be honest.

00:37:31.000 So yes, yeah.

00:37:31.980 And like I said, this book is wonderful.

00:37:33.500 And we're going to link to it in the show notes.

00:37:35.020 And I just think it is the perfect gift for a new mom who is going to want to laugh.

00:37:40.520 Thank you so much.

00:37:41.480 This was so fun.

00:37:42.620 This was the best.

00:37:43.500 Thanks for being here.

00:37:45.560 Thank you.

00:38:15.560 Thank you.

Under the Influence (with Jo Piazza) - June 11, 2026

Sad Beige Babies With Sad Beige Parents

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