Under the Influence (with Jo Piazza) - November 26, 2024


The Ozempic of it All

Topics
Sunday Nice Things: The Family That Travels Together Prime Domination: Amazon's Holiday Shopping Conquest with Dana Mattioli

Episode Stats


Length

58 minutes

Words per minute

180.15

Word count

10,549

Sentence count

352

Harmful content

Misogyny

18

sentences flagged

Toxicity

18

sentences flagged

Hate speech

5

sentences flagged


Transcript

Transcript generated with Whisper (turbo).
Misogyny classifications generated with MilaNLProc/bert-base-uncased-ear-misogyny .
Toxicity classifications generated with s-nlp/roberta_toxicity_classifier .
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
Topics generated with Qwen2.5-3B-Instruct.
00:00:00.000 Hello, hello, hello, hello, hello. Jo here and you are listening to Under the Influence.
00:00:13.660 Today I'm talking about something that's pretty personal. And I wasn't even sure if I was going
00:00:19.820 to share it at all. But then I decided, screw it. Why not? Why not? Because as women, if we don't
00:00:27.860 talk about all of the things that are happening in our lives, then we just perpetuate all of the 0.94
00:00:32.720 shame and the guilt and the crap and really all of the fake stuff that we see on social media. 0.72
00:00:38.700 All of the filtered fake reality. And frankly, I just think that's dumb. It's dumb. Can we just 1.00
00:00:44.900 be real with each other? I think it's a lot easier and it's a lot healthier. So for the past three
00:00:51.580 months, I've been taking a semi-glutide. It's like the Ozempics, but it's the generic version,
00:00:57.500 a compounded version. And I want to talk about it because people are constantly asking me
00:01:01.380 questions about it. So I know that there's a lot of questions out there. And I also know that there
00:01:05.980 are a lot of people taking it, namely celebrities, who are completely lying about it. And that's just
00:01:12.240 crap. When we look at pictures and videos of celebrities and they look the way they look, 0.99
00:01:17.060 and they tell us that they look the way they look because of hard work and willpower,
00:01:20.080 we just feel bad about ourselves. I'd like everyone to be honest. I would like the
00:01:24.200 celebrities to be like, I look this way because I'm rich. And if I'm being honest, I lost a bunch
00:01:29.840 of weight in the past three months because I'm taking a semiglutide. So today I'm bringing
00:01:33.960 Glenis on with me. We're going to talk through it. We're talking through my whole semiglutide
00:01:37.540 journey. I hate the word journey. I don't know why I just use the word journey. I hate myself
00:01:41.820 a little bit now. I do. And I'm going to get into all of it. I'm getting into all of the things.
00:01:47.300 And one last thing. I shouldn't have to remind anyone of this, but I will. I'm not a doctor.
00:01:51.860 I'm not a doctor, and I'm definitely not an expert in anything.
00:01:55.540 So this is my story.
00:01:57.280 This is what happened to me.
00:01:58.780 Just me talking to Glynis about it.
00:02:03.400 Hey, Glynis.
00:02:04.660 I just love seeing your face first thing in the morning.
00:02:07.500 The listeners can't see my face, which is puffy from bad sleep and salt.
00:02:11.740 But this is, I think, the best week of the year.
00:02:15.080 Thanksgiving week.
00:02:16.280 Oh, it's so good.
00:02:17.900 Especially as a, I mean, I've been in New York for such a long time now,
00:02:21.160 but there's still that Canadian in me that loves American Thanksgiving. It's my favorite holiday.
00:02:25.800 And when I was a waitress in the village, it was like, this was the best week of the year because
00:02:30.300 everybody was in a good mood and you'd be like three drink buybacking the entire restaurant
00:02:35.280 made so much money. Oh, yeah. I mean, it's not even really a work week at all, right?
00:02:41.340 Yeah. I was trying to explain this to friends in Paris who are not American. I was like,
00:02:46.540 oh, it's Thanksgiving week. Like starting today, people start to travel and drink.
00:02:51.620 And this Thanksgiving, I think post-election is going to be
00:02:54.420 somewhat intense for many people. Yeah. One thing that I'm talking to people about is,
00:03:01.920 and I actually think a lot of people are doing this. I'm like, if you typically have a family
00:03:05.960 Thanksgiving that's very fraught because maybe you have a mixed political bag, I'm like,
00:03:11.900 how about you don't go i i feel like this is a thanksgiving where people i feel like the 2016
00:03:18.060 thanksgiving was shocked everyone's talked but i feel like this might be the thanksgiving where
00:03:22.920 everyone's like you know what you know what maybe i'm gonna sit this one out do something i'm gonna
00:03:27.780 skip the airport and do something i also think i love thanksgiving so much because i don't
00:03:32.860 i have a long established new york city thanksgiving so i either ride my bike to it
00:03:38.180 or just take one subway ride and i think that also contributes to oh yeah there's no travel
00:03:43.140 yeah and also when i was a kid in canada it was always so confusing to me because you'd come home
00:03:49.840 on a random thursday because canadians have thanksgiving but it's a monday in october it's
00:03:54.020 tacked on it's a long weekend it doesn't even make any sense to me well it's the canadian
00:03:59.160 thanksgiving predates american thanksgiving it's uh it derives from like a celebration of the
00:04:04.060 harvest, which is earlier in Canada because it's colder there anyway. Right. But then people saw
00:04:10.060 whatever. But in America, I would come home from school as a kid and be like, why isn't Little
00:04:14.880 House on the Prairie on TV? There's a football game. And it was so confusing to me until I moved
00:04:21.020 here. And now, of course, it's my favorite holiday, which also for me, it's there's no family
00:04:26.720 tradition except the one I've created, which is also makes it delightful. But anyway, look, I think
00:04:31.440 that created traditions and chosen family at this point it's just just the direction that a lot of
00:04:39.500 us are going in okay i mean i joke that i'm on thanksgiving number i want to say like 26 or
00:04:46.740 something with the same people in new york which then takes on its own you know rituals and you
00:04:53.800 know family baggage and baggage and also it it's just funny to be there because now the kids are
00:05:00.020 all like kids that weren't born or near like 15 but it's beautiful and it's like you're still
00:05:04.400 choosing it anyway you're choosing it yes yes well we're we are we're going to talk about something
00:05:10.800 thanksgiving adjacent today this week because i i okay go ahead i want to talk about this so much
00:05:16.520 yeah i uh well so my my favorite part about thanksgiving i don't like turkey i'm not a turkey
00:05:22.780 person know that about you yeah i just i don't get it is right thing i just it's so boring to me
00:05:30.340 it's like the hard seltzer of meat is what it is uh because i'm just like if you're gonna eat 0.97
00:05:39.780 meat eat a freaking steak like if you're good and if you're gonna drink have a goddamn old-fashioned 0.84
00:05:46.380 okay or maybe it's the vape pen maybe it's the vape pen of me it's because i'm also just like 0.99
00:05:51.440 smoke a parliament light my friend vaping's for losers uh i love turkey i don't like turkey
00:06:00.240 it's just so bland to me but i love sides i just love them i love i love all sides i love
00:06:09.260 stuffing i love mashed potatoes i need a macaroni and cheese at thanksgiving and can i ask you have
00:06:17.360 you ever had a deep fried turkey i have not had a deep fried fried turkey i have had a turducken
00:06:23.440 i've had at the thanksgiving a couple times to be clear i don't do anything chefs show up with
00:06:29.280 some cake i bought uh from two little red or from ladybird bakery and like champagne or whatever
00:06:35.120 but i've had deep fried turkey a couple times and it is so good but you have to have people who know
00:06:41.600 what they're doing there's all those youtube videos people setting their homes on fire but
00:06:44.640 it's incredible um which maybe will if you ever had it would shift your turkey maybe it would
00:06:49.660 shift my turkey turkey views okay but right now i don't i don't love a turkey but i do but i do
00:06:54.400 love sides yes yes which means and and i love a steak so i like i like a nice steak at thanksgiving
00:06:59.960 uh and i'm bringing this up because i am i'm currently into month four of my my semi-glutide
00:07:09.000 semi-glutide journey is it really month four it's well it started in september so september
00:07:15.820 october november we're about it so i've been i've been on it for three months right and
00:07:21.360 i'm getting so many questions about it and i'm also not a person who hides anything i talk about
00:07:28.760 all of the things and as women especially when it comes to women and our health and how we feel
00:07:35.040 about our bodies we have to talk about it so much more uh just to normalize it i feel like
00:07:41.420 i shift into a paramedic cause conversation with strangers in like 90 seconds in 90 seconds i
00:07:49.440 refuse to feel any shame or sort of um hesitation because and part of it is the absence of
00:07:59.320 information and part of it is like i'm just it's like why wouldn't we be talking about what's going
00:08:04.880 on with our bodies but totally to your point so I'm okay let's maybe just explain to the audience
00:08:10.380 because I think at this point we're on year two of sort of the ozempic era yeah but people
00:08:16.720 don't always unless they're using it directly don't always understand how it goes because
00:08:22.820 certainly when you first started telling me about this and I want to get to this in a minute
00:08:26.180 I had so many questions but I just maybe like lay out for the audience exactly what this entails
00:08:31.720 for you. Totally. Okay. So this is a journey, my friends, and I keep calling it my Ozempic journey,
00:08:38.600 even though, just because that's what everyone knows, right? And Ozempic is, and I did a huge
00:08:42.680 story that never ran for the Times a little over a year ago. So Ozempic is like the brand name,
00:08:48.100 like almost like Kleenex, like it's the larger name for all of these semi-glutides that,
00:08:54.280 and it was the original one that was created for diabetics. And then they discovered weight loss
00:09:01.360 was one side effect. And then, of course, capitalism kicked in and it became not just
00:09:07.380 capitalism. I'm sure we can just say just capitalism, but then it became, oh, we've
00:09:11.160 started making all of these different versions that deal specifically with weight loss.
00:09:16.280 Well, Govi's one, Unjaro's one, now Zapbound is one. And then there's, you know, side,
00:09:21.520 there's just semi-glutides that are being created by other businesses or professionals.
00:09:27.180 Totally. Totally. Yeah, exactly.
00:09:28.860 No, thank you. Thank you for the information. I love a good info dump.
00:09:36.920 So I had been thinking about this for a while now, a couple of reasons. One, as a lot of our
00:09:47.060 audience knows, I have this very rare form of muscular dystrophy, which I have the gene for.
00:09:54.060 I have very, very, very early symptoms of it that may or may not get worse.
00:09:59.400 We have no idea how it will progress.
00:10:01.680 You wrote about this in the opening of How to Be Married, just for listeners who don't know that.
00:10:05.680 For listeners who don't know that.
00:10:07.480 And one of the things that I want to focus on, because my dad passed away from complications.
00:10:15.880 He was intensely overweight.
00:10:18.460 He was clinically obese by the end of his life.
00:10:21.800 He had diabetes.
00:10:23.020 because he could not move from complications, from muscular dystrophy, and also had a terrible diet,
00:10:30.260 let's be honest. And so one of my goals is to keep my body as healthy and as strong as possible.
00:10:38.420 And so that means maintaining a certain weight level and a lot of lean muscle. Now, as women
00:10:45.500 of a certain age, maintaining lean muscle is our part-time job at this point. We all eat all of
00:10:51.020 the protein. People have been wearing weighted vests, apparently, now. And so this was one of
00:10:57.360 my goals. I gained a lot of pounds during the pregnancy, as women do. But not just during the 0.98
00:11:05.000 pregnancy, because I think, too, one of the bigger conversations that I haven't seen attached to this
00:11:09.700 yet, and I'm sure we will because this is like a rolling conversation, is having children later
00:11:16.420 in life or what we consider later, bookends up to the beginnings of perimenopause, which we don't
00:11:25.760 fully understand yet as any woman over 40 who's been to the doctor knows. So, so many of my
00:11:30.220 friends, and tell me if this was true for you, are recovering from postpartum in their bodies,
00:11:35.280 and it's overlapping with the early signs of perimenopause. And that, I think, is an intensity
00:11:40.420 of symptoms and challenges that haven't been fully addressed in either of these conversations.
00:11:48.180 A hundred percent. A hundred percent. Because I had my babies at 37, 39, and 42. Right? And so,
00:11:55.320 yes, immediately after the last one, ejected herself from my body. I flew out, as I recall
00:12:01.880 from the text message chain. Just fell out. She did. Immediately after that happened, I,
00:12:08.480 you know, started experiencing perimenopause symptoms. And I had a GP who was not helpful
00:12:17.180 with this at all, who as an older woman, and this is the case with, I think, some older doctors,
00:12:25.800 she'd been through menopause and was like, this is just what we go through.
00:12:30.280 This is just how it goes, which is the least useful. Every time I hear myself take that tone
00:12:36.880 in any on any subject including media i try and stop myself because i'm like that's not helpful
00:12:41.980 doesn't have to be this how it goes anymore it's like a weird like um badge we wear being like oh
00:12:49.560 it was hard for me it'll be hard for you and it's like actually you know what progress is supposed
00:12:52.760 to be like it's not hard for the next generation or as hard it's not hard as hard for the next
00:12:57.140 generation and so now now that i'm i'm out of the breeding phase i'm i'm working very diligently on
00:13:05.040 the you know improve my lean muscle get my get my body in a place where i am healthy where i feel
00:13:11.600 good and i work out every day i changed my diet to do you know the things uh and not and i was
00:13:20.560 gaining weight i was continuing to gain weight i said this to my doctor and she's like oh yeah
00:13:24.460 that's just you know just age just age i mean this is with a exercise regular exercise you start
00:13:30.980 regular exercise routine weight lifting as we're all doing now thanks to the reminder that we
00:13:36.140 should muscle mass and women in age and bone density exactly exactly and i was like you know
00:13:41.300 what screw it that was one that was one impetus and then the second impetus is that i have so
00:13:49.240 many great freaking clothes and i want to fit into my thing i would say either yeah i agree no it is 0.71
00:13:56.400 not a small thing it is not a small thing there there should be a german word for what it feels
00:14:01.040 like to fit back and i'm not talking my like size freaking twos okay from my 20s conversation that
00:14:07.040 used to be like no no no commercials of like i can fit into jeans i wore when i was 25 no it's
00:14:12.740 having an entire closet that fit six years ago and you're like i don't want to reinvest in all
00:14:18.020 of these clothes no i don't i don't i love my clothes i have a great collection of vintage of
00:14:24.520 just fabulous pieces and jeans. I have a lot of jeans that I really like. So no, this is not about
00:14:29.820 fitting to my damn wedding dress. This is about I want to wear those clothes that I bought when I 0.99
00:14:34.040 was a grown ass woman for the rest of my life. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Those commercials from the 0.96
00:14:39.040 eight. I mean, I even stuck in the city when Miranda fits under. It's just like those commercials
00:14:44.300 date back to a time where women were having their kids in their mid to late 20s. And then in their
00:14:50.720 40s they were like why can't I fit into things I wore when I was 22 and I think right now style
00:14:55.080 wise particularly as a person who just turned 50 I'm like my style has been set the last 15 years
00:15:00.560 and it's good for me and I look in my closet and I'm like there's I want this closet I want this
00:15:08.040 closet I want this closet totally totally and so with those two things in mind and that's what that's
00:15:13.240 why I want to have this as a conversation because I do still think there's a lot of stigma and
00:15:19.660 judgment out there. There is a reason that the majority of celebrities who who do use
00:15:25.840 semiglutides will never freaking admit it. Yeah, I think, too, we're still we're still
00:15:31.740 in early days a little bit. And so much of that early conversation got attached to that
00:15:36.500 old like before and after and and was attached by the media. I mean, I really I veer away
00:15:44.020 from all this. Like, let's just only blame the media. But when you look at all of the
00:15:47.200 coverage I think we can blame the media for for sure it really it was like an excuse to go back 0.69
00:15:53.080 and we are in a moment that's prioritizing thin white women as anyone was you wrote about this 1.00
00:15:57.480 in your newsletter about the incoming Trump administration sort of appearance of women 1.00
00:16:03.280 um but but I I think that erased a lot of more complicated conversations around this which are 1.00
00:16:11.420 only percolating up right now because it became attached to a I am a celebrity who wants to be
00:16:18.200 like Kate Mawson and I fast tracked it and it was in a moment where Ozempic was being
00:16:23.540 people on who were diabetic and very much needed it couldn't access it couldn't get it all of that
00:16:29.820 early chaos around it which I suppose is inevitable and we're also in a country where insulin is so
00:16:35.160 expensive it's prohibitive for people with diabetes like this is all part of a larger conversation
00:16:39.680 around hating most women who don't adhere to a particular idea but what i'm finding so keep
00:16:47.400 going because i'm finding i my conversations with you about this have there's parts of it that have
00:16:51.580 stuck in my head that have nothing to do yes with what we associate with the shame of taking
00:16:57.620 which if you read tressie mcmillan cotton uh who's a times writer she's written so interestingly on
00:17:04.500 all of this um so i haven't read i haven't read that yeah she's incredible oh okay i'll read that
00:17:09.840 hold on let's take a quick break and when we get back we're we're gonna we're gonna dive in all of
00:17:13.780 that hungry now now what about now whenever it hits you wherever you are grab an oh henry bar
00:17:31.620 to satisfy your hunger with its delicious combination of big crunchy salty peanuts
00:17:37.440 covered in creamy caramel and chewy fudge with a chocolatey coating swing by a gas station and
00:17:43.780 get an oh henry today oh hungry oh henry okay okay we're back so i've been telling you about
00:17:55.500 this this journey the semi the semi-glutide journey uh since i since i started it in in
00:18:02.400 september and in fact we had a lot of conversations about it because i didn't start it until i got
00:18:07.320 back from paris right it's funny because i remember you saying that when we were in paris
00:18:11.460 and i hadn't thought about it and then i saw you i got back in october and saw you
00:18:15.440 and do you want me to tell my version okay yeah tell your version of it yeah i came down for
00:18:22.340 Halloween. And I just, you were just like, like a little kid, like pulling their shirt up being
00:18:28.480 like, look, this is amazing. I feel my body feels less in pain and more mobile. And I feel so much
00:18:38.900 more comfortable, but that's not the, I mean, that's, that's great. We're all like, we all
00:18:43.400 have that thrill of fitting into clothes again. But here's the things that have interested me so
00:18:47.900 much joe about what you've spoken about or what you've told me about it which is that it has it
00:18:54.460 has dulled some compulsive natures in your behavior that have nothing to do with food
00:19:00.240 yes you you do not um want to pick up your phone as much that you are not compelled um to like
00:19:11.560 dive onto the internet as much that you're more that the food noise and i really want to talk
00:19:17.220 about food noise, that the food noise in your head has been dulled to an extent that like it's
00:19:23.200 freed up other brain space. And that is those are the things that fascinate like that. I have
00:19:29.460 repeated the fact that you have had such a joyful experience on this is something I have been
00:19:36.180 telling other people in these conversations because of these aspects to it that I don't think
00:19:40.920 we fully understand yet. I think we're discovering a lot of different side effects to this
00:19:49.060 that a year ago when I did research on this was absolutely not in the conversation or in
00:19:54.020 the general conversation. And so that's so interesting to me because I was like, oh,
00:19:58.020 especially post-election, the idea of not having the urge to pick up your phone and the idea of
00:20:03.840 not having food noise in your head. Because I think for the early part of this conversation,
00:20:09.020 that food noise was being attached to obesity and i think i i think there are very few women i think
00:20:20.840 probably there are some women but very few women whose head is not occupied by food noise 0.99
00:20:24.860 24 hours a day for reasons i mean that are so expansive of the way women are punished for 1.00
00:20:32.000 appearance of the way we walk into a room and have to present ourselves of all of the culture that is 0.96
00:20:36.340 inundated towards us that we are inundated with about weight, etc., etc. So much of it unhealthy
00:20:43.300 and so much of it love not to participate in. But understanding the degree of our brains that
00:20:49.020 are consumed by this noise and what we're not thinking about or we're not like that men don't
00:20:56.920 necessarily walk around with half their brains consumed by this. The absence of food noise is so
00:21:01.280 fascinating to me. Totally. Totally. And, you know, it's interesting because I don't think
00:21:06.120 I understood what food noise was going into this. Yes. Until it was gone. Until it was gone. Until
00:21:14.660 it wasn't. And I do think that so much of this has been ignored because there was a lot of shame
00:21:22.540 and stigma around it. And there just haven't been open conversations about it. When one of my first
00:21:29.220 experiences talking about this is I showed up at a very fancy dinner in Virginia that was being
00:21:37.160 thrown by Middleburg Books. I love them. They're amazing. And they were throwing me a dinner
00:21:43.500 of just delicious Sicilian food for the Sicilian inheritance, for readers. And I said to people,
00:21:51.600 I just want everyone to know I'm so excited about eating everything. I may eat a little bit less
00:21:57.640 because because I'm on I'm on I'm on the you know I do still say Ozempic because it's like the brand
00:22:02.680 name um and I I've recently found out that it is a compounded semiglutide uh that I've been taking
00:22:08.880 but I'm like I'm on the thing four women at that dinner said oh my god me too but no one's ever
00:22:15.620 said it out loud to me so I haven't felt like I could talk about it and and that's yet another
00:22:21.180 reason that I want to talk about this. So I hadn't realized how much food noise and compulsion was in
00:22:28.220 my head of like, what are you going to, what are you going to eat for lunch? Or even just the
00:22:32.160 compulsion to pick things up off my kids' plates or pick up any food. Nick, Nick will eat any
00:22:37.700 leftover food. He's so, I mean, this is, this is why Nick gained so much baby weight when we had
00:22:43.620 the babies uh because he will eat he like has food food scarcity um like i think he really
00:22:50.420 internalized a lot of the the 90s save the children campaign ads uh sally struthers because
00:22:56.640 he did not grow up with his own food scarcity but somehow right and any leftover piece of food
00:23:01.600 cannot be thrown out uh and yeah i think that but all of that is gone like i don't i don't think
00:23:08.600 about food in the way that I used to but here's the caveat for that a lot of people ask me oh so 0.54
00:23:16.760 but why would you give up the joy of food oh no I still fucking enjoy food like I enjoy food so 0.88
00:23:22.060 much it's I it's just I'm not maybe I maybe I can put it like I don't think about the crappy food 0.95
00:23:26.860 and I don't mindlessly eat and so I can kind of focus on what do I really want what will I really
00:23:34.040 enjoy uh i just went i was up in vermont for a reading retreat and vermont they have very good
00:23:41.540 cheddar cheese up there it's a you know excellent excellent uh place to purchase very good cheddar
00:23:47.640 and i love cheese so i bought i brought back pretty much like half a suitcase of cheese
00:23:52.640 from vermont and i've been enjoying it and devouring it and planning my holiday cheese
00:23:58.380 plates which you'll have on sunday and i still love eating i just i do eat a lot less and we
00:24:06.400 can get into the nitty-gritty of how this is working in terms of food noise uh what's interesting
00:24:13.000 too is the idea of food as a reward right like when you're so worn out and stressed out and just
00:24:20.480 going and when you have small kids that is on another level but even in the aftermath of the
00:24:24.840 election was like oh god and for me it's always chocolate i'm like i really deserve this milkshake
00:24:29.160 because of this new site or i really deserve so i wonder if it takes away food as if it is reward
00:24:36.320 if it returns food to um a sustenance uh and takes away that like i deserve something right now
00:24:46.300 i'm gonna eat the thing that bumps up my dopamine so one of the things that we that we know these
00:24:52.140 drugs do is that they they do kind of decrease the reward mechanism right of yeah food you don't
00:25:00.620 get you don't even want to say it's like as high off of eating because again still still have joy
00:25:06.800 still have joy here uh but i think that is one of the reasons that it tamps down on me not checking
00:25:13.940 my phone compulsively and i i said this to the doctor that i'm working with and they're like
00:25:19.640 Yeah, they're like, we hear that from everyone, that they're not scrolling social media as much.
00:25:23.860 And I think that that is proof that these social media companies have programmed these apps to be compulsive, to be rewarding.
00:25:33.480 The Times did a big piece on Ozempic impacting the junk food market.
00:25:38.780 And it's that same thing of, of so much of this part of the business plan or the recipe, the literal recipe in cases is addictive quantities. Like how do we tap into the addictive side of your brain, whether it's social media, which we know taps into our addictive receptors or junk food, which we know is full of chemicals.
00:26:00.180 And when you think about how little of this was available 40 years ago and the way it's gone into.
00:26:06.880 So it's interesting to turn off that receptor and then realize that you don't want all of these.
00:26:11.340 What is linking all of these things is their addictive nature.
00:26:14.560 I also just want to emphasize that you have a healthy exercise schedule and that there's a foundation here of activity and healthy food choices underlying all of the rest that it's possible to return to.
00:26:38.900 because I think a little bit of that, and this is, we're only speaking of your experience and
00:26:42.940 our experiences. Totally. And I can only speak about my experience. Yes. Yeah. Part of what I
00:26:47.160 think, and maybe the conversation has changed in the year because I haven't been paying as close
00:26:50.880 attention to it, but part of what I think gets missed in this a little bit is if you are a
00:26:57.800 person with sort of healthy habits to begin with that maybe you veered off of a little bit or
00:27:02.960 getting overlaid with bad habits, that it's not learning an entire new lifestyle. It's the ability
00:27:08.620 to return to a lifestyle that's long been there and maybe gotten lost along the way from time to
00:27:16.200 time does that was that what it feels like totally absolutely absolutely it's just it's just a little
00:27:21.800 bit easier as a reset and again i'm not thinking about any of this as necessarily as i'm losing
00:27:31.380 weight like it was more I want to be comfortable in my body again yeah and because this is the age
00:27:40.060 where things start to hurt too I'm very sensitive to that like knees hurt and my hip hurt and when
00:27:45.860 I go running my foot hurt like and a lot of that is not overused like a lot of that is related to
00:27:52.440 weight that we have long been told we inevitably gain yes yes and every friend I have a lot of
00:27:58.960 friends that are that are taking semiglutides now i have a lot of the way that's i have a lot of
00:28:03.200 friends i have a lot of i also have a lot of friends yeah um but and they all say the same
00:28:08.360 thing oh my god my body feels so much better now my joints don't hurt as much i can go running again
00:28:16.920 uh which is very very much the case for me and in fact i'm working out more and i think more
00:28:24.520 efficiently than ever especially when it comes to the weights because i don't hurt yeah and i you
00:28:30.640 know again going back to food noise i think i was talking with a friend or somebody about losing
00:28:39.400 weight and like losing more than five pounds if you have to lose more than five pounds for
00:28:44.240 health-related reasons which any doctor will say when you go there like certain pains it's like
00:28:50.480 well, if you lost 10 pounds, it would help. Anything more than five pounds, you have to devote,
00:28:54.600 particularly I think at this age with hectic schedules and habits and the whole other,
00:29:00.000 everything else. You have to devote so much of your brain to weight loss for a six-month period.
00:29:06.720 Do you know what I mean? It has to become almost a full-time job, I think, of focus because it does
00:29:12.640 take focus. It's not impossible. It's certainly not impossible. And that's where this all gets
00:29:16.160 tied up into who's earned it and is this cheating and all this nonsense because we so attach
00:29:21.920 obesity or fatness really to shameful behavior which is a hundred percent as we know from
00:29:28.960 science not true not true not true and also we love that puritan idea of well i've suffered
00:29:34.040 for you know these results and this is like lifting and revealing at the same time both
00:29:43.120 lifting but this idea of uh i weighed 125 pounds in my 20s um i'm just gonna throw that out there
00:29:51.160 and i did not suffer for it i just smoked a lot of cigarettes and went to a lot of parties where
00:29:58.220 i wore high heels so i you know i was clearly exercising by wearing these high heels and not
00:30:04.260 eating because i was smoking but i was not suffering for it not suffering so i when i look
00:30:09.240 at my schedule you know 15 years ago versus my schedule now and also the world limit like it's
00:30:14.720 just these are all complicated conversations but i just think like part of what the shame is
00:30:19.520 attached to is that you haven't earned it but part of the appeal is this can happen without it being
00:30:24.860 my number one focus day in and day out for the next six months and oh yeah i don't think i don't
00:30:31.320 think about it now yeah no think about it no uh all right let's take one more quick break and when
00:30:36.500 I get back, I want to talk a little bit about my new relationship with alcohol and the side
00:30:42.420 effects. Because there are some. There are. Okay, we're back. Now, you have experienced this
00:30:57.060 directly with me. I can't really drink that much anymore. I'm a very social drinker. I'm not a
00:31:05.780 i'm not a drink alone person but if we if i'm if i'm like out with a group i'm like let's tie it on
00:31:12.120 and i have found my body actually whereas before i would have one drink and i would get the fizzy
00:31:20.760 buzzy excited feeling and be like when's the next drink i don't get that anymore
00:31:24.720 interesting which is interesting it's just interesting to look at how my body
00:31:32.280 responds to these are really discussions around addiction which neither of us are doctors and
00:31:37.080 this is yeah i think the thing about this is reminds me of birth control right the early
00:31:44.620 birth control when birth control was introduced on the market it was life-changing in controversial
00:31:50.020 ways of i mean god need me to say that it was life-changing and also it was it still is a
00:31:57.440 complicated medication with side effects that we don't fully know the outcome because it's only
00:32:01.580 been around you know since i was born so i think we are it's necessary to position this conversation
00:32:10.780 in part of the same sphere of this is brand new and life-changing and also we still a lot of us
00:32:19.360 we don't know a lot of people are like taking the risk on the outcome is worth the possible
00:32:25.960 side effects we don't know where this is headed although rfk jr apparently doesn't like ozempic
00:32:31.080 And I just think it's going to be interesting to see if he tries to take it off the market.
00:32:36.540 Oh, yeah.
00:32:36.960 That will be a death sentence for the GOP.
00:32:39.060 But anyway, let's go ahead and talk about your side effects, because I think it's important to say like every same with the birth control.
00:32:45.580 Like this was getting compared to Ozempic was getting compared to Fen-Fen.
00:32:49.300 But I actually think the most useful comparison is birth control, because as you and I both as every woman knows, everyone's body responds differently to birth control, that there's different levels.
00:33:01.080 of hormones in it. There's different estrogen, all these different things that might work better
00:33:06.080 or worse for all of us. But I think, again, you know, like the perimetopause conversation,
00:33:11.700 it only helps to talk about your experience to add to the larger conversation of experiences.
00:33:19.180 Yeah. Yeah. No, absolutely. Absolutely. And I am a person who, and I didn't realize this till much,
00:33:24.240 much later in life birth control did not agree with my body okay i genuinely think that birth
00:33:32.660 control contributed and again this is just my experience but it contributed to my anxiety um
00:33:38.960 a lot of like mood imbalances in in my 20s and i'm not on anything anymore because nick got snipped
00:33:49.280 And I will say that my my brain and body do feel better not being on birth control.
00:33:56.920 Which I just say I had the just as for a counterbalance, I loved being on birth control.
00:34:01.760 I know you did.
00:34:02.520 My body loved it because I had such periods.
00:34:05.560 My periods were out of control with cramping.
00:34:07.380 And I loved it so much that when I went off of it, I was so sad to go off of it.
00:34:12.920 But again, like these are two, you know, two different female bodies with two wildly different experiences.
00:34:19.580 So how is the semiglutide impacting you?
00:34:23.600 So it's fine now, but I will say that for the first about six weeks, and I've heard this is very common, I got very, I got nauseous, very nauseous, mostly because.
00:34:38.360 When you ate or just generally?
00:34:39.820 It was generally. And it felt like very similar to how I experienced morning sickness, which was like a low level nausea kind of kind of all of the time. Or if I ate too much or too much of something that because your stomach empties a little bit slower. So I had a ton of French fries at the Weezer concert and also some beer.
00:35:06.720 beer is not agreeing with me right now um which is probably good because when i drink beer i'm not
00:35:12.980 drinking a nice michelobe ultra i'm drinking three ipas you know i have to say michelobe just when
00:35:23.300 you said michelobe ultra i was like nick could have been in a michelobe ultra commercial he has
00:35:27.360 that look where he could have just like sailed by on a horse or something with his like flowing hair
00:35:32.860 With this flowing hair. Exactly. But I mean, much like I think that turkey is just the weak link of meat. I'm like, when it comes to beers, I'm like, I'm not drinking a water beer. Give me give me this full bodied Westkill Brewery IPA and I'll have like three and a half or four of them.
00:35:50.820 So, I mean, that's, that's my own journey. But so I realized early on, kind of just like, how, how every how different things made me feel fried food didn't make me feel good. French fries were fine, but I wasn't going to devour a whole thing of French fries all at once.
00:36:13.000 I think, you know, anything fried in like oils and stuff wasn't agreeing with me. And also because I wasn't paying as much attention to eating generally. Sometimes I would forget to eat, which is a thing that never happened before. And that would make me nauseous. And so that was rough for the for the first six weeks. And also, I mean, I can't overdrink. That's the thing.
00:36:37.340 uh i i would immediately be sick uh if i had more than more than two drinks which is not a lot of
00:36:45.780 drinks for me so i remember on halloween yeah the next day was uh rough going for you in a different
00:36:53.040 in a different kind of rough going different kind of rough going exactly exactly i don't get the
00:36:58.480 nausea as much anymore um and yeah i mean now i don't actually feel any side effects at all but
00:37:07.100 those were those were very very apparent early on and to the extent that i was like oh do i want to
00:37:13.100 stop this and what level of because as i understand it you start at like 2.5 and after four weeks you
00:37:18.900 level up to a higher dose yes yes exactly exactly so now i've leveled up um i think it's 0.25 i think
00:37:26.700 it's 0.25 and then 0.5 uh and then i lingered at 0.5 for a while i'm now at 0.8 i think uh and and
00:37:36.200 Honestly, my goal with this is to pretty soon just kind of taper down, to taper down and to not be on it forever, of which the doctors that I'm working with say they think that's totally possible.
00:37:53.860 yeah yeah that we haven't touched on yet one is that you are doing this in consultation with your
00:37:59.460 physician and a program that injects it for you because there's two ways to get it right now which
00:38:07.500 is through a pen which is really just like a syringe being shielded so you don't know that
00:38:12.320 you're giving yourself an injection and then there's also you get syringes and a vial and
00:38:18.660 you inject it yourself or you have someone else inject it but you've been doing this in consultation
00:38:23.120 with physicians. Totally. I did. I did. And one of the reasons that I did that is because
00:38:29.220 of the muscular dystrophy aspect of this, right? I wanted to make sure that I wasn't losing
00:38:36.840 muscle mass as we went through this. And if I was, I was going to stop immediately.
00:38:42.260 So I did a full body scan of measuring the lean muscle to make sure that we're staying at good
00:38:52.420 levels. And now I actually have more lean muscle now than I did before. Again, I work out, I do a
00:38:59.040 lot of weightlifting almost every, not every day, but I do some form of exercise every day. And I
00:39:08.280 also take creatine supplements to maintain the muscle. So I mean, again, those are things that
00:39:14.280 just work for me. And so that's one of the reasons that I decided to work with a doctor to do this.
00:39:20.820 Because everybody, I mean, I think too, I'm part of the research I did on this last year. So again,
00:39:26.000 this is not as up to date and I'm far from being a physician, but the necessity of getting the same
00:39:32.380 way before you go on birth control pill, you'd have to see a doctor and get blood tests is
00:39:37.800 necessary for this too. I think for what you say, like, do you have, is there thyroid issues? I
00:39:42.980 have a friend who was thinking about this, but was, you know, has a number of complicated,
00:39:48.900 like not complicated but it's like we're also in our early i'm in my i'm 50 now this idea of like
00:39:54.780 your body's experiencing all these changes the physical beforehand is to determine whether some
00:39:59.780 of these changes are as far as we know to connect to paramenopause or is it thyroid issues or the
00:40:05.740 heart like it's it's not a thing that you just are like oh i'm gonna do this it sounds great
00:40:10.560 it's not like a caffeine pill somebody took in the 80s which was complicated in and of itself
00:40:14.680 this is i so jesse jesse spano i'm so excited i'm so excited like to really think through this is
00:40:24.620 like you wouldn't just go on a birth control pill without talking to a doctor you wouldn't go on
00:40:28.860 this and that brings us to the very american conversation of this is for most people not
00:40:36.200 covered by health insurance which is in and of itself very expensive um and so these there are
00:40:43.020 financial realities to this is expensive and i think there's one conversation to be had around
00:40:49.940 like um again like health is wealth and wealth is health and who gets access to these and who
00:40:59.600 does it benefit and who is again continues to be shamed for um obesity and also is this just
00:41:08.800 to, you know, when you spend money on this, because the prices are dropping. I remember
00:41:12.720 having a conversation about this recently with my doctor who was like, so many more
00:41:17.140 things are coming on the market. And this again is like the birth control pill, that
00:41:20.300 it's driving down the initial crazy cost of it to more accessible as we learn more and
00:41:26.460 more people are bringing it onto the market and weighing it against like, what am I spending
00:41:31.240 on food? What am I spending on alcohol? What am I spending on clothes? Like, do I want
00:41:35.940 So I think all of these are complicated conversations, but the cost is a real consideration because for most people, remember, you know, Samita at the Cut wrote about this a year ago of like getting the coupon and that drops the cost to $700 a month, which for a lot of people, I mean, we live in New York, $700 a month is not like a third of everyone's normal rent.
00:41:59.660 but for most people that is like it's rent it's rent or a mortgage payment and then you know once
00:42:07.280 that 12 months runs out if you're a person who needs this because again ozempic is i you know
00:42:13.020 was was created for diabetics and thinking about that in insulin or again thinking about it in
00:42:18.140 birth control you can't take birth control for six months and get off it it stops you know like
00:42:21.960 for a person who needs this as a maintenance thing for real health issues the cost of it is
00:42:28.060 is astronomical astronomical and then there's a conversation as you say of going off of it after
00:42:33.660 six months which i think is the new era we're moving into because initially the conversation
00:42:38.040 around it was like you have to take this forever and i actually think for a lot of people
00:42:42.760 you're you're hearing and this is anecdotal this idea of i need it as a reset
00:42:47.660 but then you want it as a like a one-time reset not as a i'm going to use it every two years when
00:42:56.000 things get out of control reset because i think that probably has physical implications that we
00:43:00.700 don't are not yet aware of either but like we're in such a flux moment of not knowing
00:43:05.580 this so if it's like can you do it for six months suck up the cost get yourself back on track and
00:43:11.320 stick with it is going to become a conversation for a lot of people i think yeah and we're gonna
00:43:16.340 see we're gonna see we're gonna see like we don't know this is you were very much at the
00:43:20.660 crest of this sort of um i am a guinea pig my friend like the way where it's like is if you
00:43:27.720 have healthy habits that you can stick with and if this is a reset headed into second half of life
00:43:35.840 and you understand it is that and that the cost of it really drives that home then is that how
00:43:41.180 this becomes useful i don't think anybody knows i don't think anybody knows i don't i don't think
00:43:46.180 anyone knows all right let's take one more quick break and then we're going to come back and we're
00:43:48.860 going to tie it all together and wrap it up okay we are back i do want to tell you one more
00:44:01.700 compulsive behavior that i don't do yeah i don't pick my face anymore really really i don't know
00:44:09.420 that i knew that you picked your face to begin with but it's interesting yeah yeah yeah yeah i
00:44:13.040 am a zip picker okay and like i mean the tiniest little blackhead i will go to town on it and i
00:44:20.720 don't do it anymore and i only just realized that recently that's amazing i know again i mean like
00:44:26.380 we don't know what's happening in our lives right now it's so crazy no i also it's coming at a crest
00:44:31.120 too where we've only recently in the last five years it feels like really started taking mental
00:44:36.560 health seriously to a degree that it like moved into the culture, into mainstream culture. And
00:44:43.120 that we've only in the last five years started taking paramenopause seriously, whereas moved
00:44:48.380 into the mainstream culture and that all of these things are happening simultaneously. So it's like
00:44:53.660 this, this, all of these things that so many people have been struggling with for so long
00:44:59.620 are just beginning to be taken seriously. And you're seeing a lot of the conversations around
00:45:03.800 semi-glutides being like, oh, maybe it impacts depression. Maybe it impacts anxiety. And I think
00:45:09.480 we're like still new on so much of this. We don't even know how these things overlap or hormonally
00:45:14.740 or how our brains work. And so it's like, wow, this thing is making me do three things at once.
00:45:21.100 And then that contributes to the idea it's a miracle drug when maybe it is, you know,
00:45:25.280 there have been miracle drugs this century. Birth control pill is one insulin, all of the
00:45:30.460 antibiotics you know vaccine i love yeah i love my zoloft okay there we are you know where we're
00:45:38.600 headed is another discussion but so it's all these overlapping things where it's like oh my god and
00:45:44.160 it's like well there hasn't been enough research to determine how all this functions prior to the
00:45:49.220 area um or also just research on women generally okay generally just generally generally and you
00:45:57.820 One of the things that I was sick of being told when I talked to some of my more traditional
00:46:05.360 doctors was, this is just your life now. 1.00
00:46:08.500 This is how women age.
00:46:10.960 And that's what all of my friends have been told. 1.00
00:46:13.440 No, your joints are going to hurt.
00:46:15.780 Your bones are going to get brittle.
00:46:17.660 You're going to have a lot more belly fat.
00:46:22.080 such that i wrote about how my when i when i said to my doctor i was like oh i'm like
00:46:26.260 you know i have a lot of a lot of a lot of belly fat uh and she's like well can you pick it up and
00:46:31.140 then she picked it up and then dropped it she's like no that's the safe kind of belly fat i was
00:46:34.740 like i don't i don't want you to be able to pick it up and drop it i really think you're totally
00:46:40.320 like it's totally true i'm really fortunate i i haven't been to a male doctor first of all since
00:46:44.660 i was eight i realized oh god no i would never go to a male doctor oh gross i was watching the
00:46:48.940 handmaid's tale. And I was like, Oh my God, I can't imagine like a man, a man examining my body
00:46:54.400 is not my experience for so long, but I'm really fortunate to have not just a woman doctor, but
00:47:01.000 one who's a few years younger than me. And she is very, she will say things like, I don't know if I
00:47:07.400 have the solution, but you shouldn't have to be dealing with this. Like you shouldn't. Yes. This
00:47:11.940 might be a symptom of perimenopause that sleep or whatever it is, or like hairs going out of
00:47:16.620 different parts of your body she's like you shouldn't have to be dealing with this so let's
00:47:19.800 see let's try out different versions and i think it both highlights that we don't have answers to
00:47:25.440 things but also that that should be the show needs a new doctor right exactly but i think that that
00:47:31.200 should be the mentality in uh the medical world because the one you encounter is the common one
00:47:37.540 like that should my experience should be common not yours totally totally and one of one of my
00:47:44.360 friends says says this to me all the time when we have this discussion around every every change to
00:47:50.500 a woman's body she's like look when men experience symptoms of aging the medical community you know
00:47:58.080 just like jumps to attention right i mean viagra their espn is on when i'm at the gym all the time 0.57
00:48:05.760 that stupid pat show or whatever and the ads on there are like 75 cents per for viagra it's just 0.99
00:48:14.140 like, oh, if a man's getting old and his penis doesn't work, don't worry. We're going to find 1.00
00:48:19.040 a drug for that. It's going to be covered by insurance because we don't want, we don't want
00:48:22.420 you to have to go through that. Oh my gosh, wait, men lose their hair when they get older. We're
00:48:26.000 going to fix that for you. There's going to be, there's going to be so many surgeries you can
00:48:29.340 have for that and Rogaine and pills. And we're just going to make it so easy for you to get it.
00:48:33.720 And also it's not shameful. It's not shameful. No, no, you take it. And I'm sorry. The same
00:48:38.040 treatment is not given to women god no i'm so far from it that it's but i think what's new right now 0.99
00:48:46.580 is our rage over it versus this being new right like it's always been the case that women have
00:48:52.740 not been treated with the same amount of respect or um seriousness but now we're all really angry
00:48:59.160 about it i think that is you know my as my wonderful doctor said to me at one point she
00:49:03.760 said you're from a generation that has grown up used to answers to so many things and you all of
00:49:10.340 you are now moving into an age where there are no answers and you're going to flip out and that's
00:49:14.260 how it's going to change and that's what we're seeing but it is enraging it's enraging and we're
00:49:20.060 not going to take it that's the thing we're just not going to take it so i have discussions about
00:49:24.760 paramenopause with literally everyone literally everyone out at fairway or wherever i am i was
00:49:30.600 Trader Joe's. Sometimes I have it at Trader Joe's. Yeah. Perimenopause, I mean, all the time,
00:49:35.720 it just, it just keeps coming up. Right. And, and for me recently, this semi-glutide conversation
00:49:40.440 has come up and, and you know, you know that I was very nervous about talking about this because
00:49:43.880 there'll inevitably be someone that will tell me that I did something wrong in this conversation.
00:49:47.440 And you know what? I don't care anymore. I don't care. This is the thing. I think that no matter
00:49:51.060 when we talk about the, I think we're moving out of it being only shameful and into it being a more
00:49:58.280 complicated conversation which is only helpful for everyone i think and the same way of like
00:50:03.780 when we were kids our parents our mothers would never have conceived of telling anyone they had
00:50:08.680 their period right like they would never have conceived of like not hiding their maxi pad or
00:50:14.680 their their tampons or whatever and we've moved into nowhere my niece who's 13 is like as there's
00:50:22.180 no she doesn't even cross her mind that she shouldn't be ashamed of like pulling a tampon
00:50:26.180 out of her bank and going to the bathroom. Like these things are shifting and the conversation
00:50:30.500 hopefully is shifting to useful ways. I mean, who's to say in this new America we're headed
00:50:35.000 into? Who's to say? Who's to say? But I mean, what I hope is that this just means we get to
00:50:39.900 start a conversation, right? I mean, if anyone wants to ask me about this, one of the things
00:50:43.840 I just keep thinking about is I've written, I wrote a lot about getting on anti-anxiety meds
00:50:50.620 Uh, and then also about having really bad, uh, post breastfeeding anxiety.
00:50:56.480 And those are two of the only stories that some people find.
00:51:00.180 I get DMS every week from women being like, can I talk to you about this? 1.00
00:51:03.580 Because they can't find any other information. 0.95
00:51:05.700 So I'm like, all right, I'm going to talk about this too.
00:51:08.420 And maybe I didn't get everything right.
00:51:10.320 And I also want to say, this is what I wanted to do to be comfortable in my body right now
00:51:18.140 and to feel good.
00:51:19.280 Okay.
00:51:19.600 i don't care what anyone else does with their body i could like literally i'm like everyone
00:51:23.800 should just do what makes them happy at this point i think it gets complicated with like the
00:51:28.060 culture of of what women's bodies should look like and but also the feeling of feeling healthy
00:51:36.820 and strong i think adding i want to feel strong conversation of it not being about i mean it is
00:51:43.720 always everything about women is about thinness but like the goal being like I want to feel not 0.95
00:51:49.680 in pain and also in a more powerful body versus I want to be which is when we were kids it was like 0.98
00:51:56.880 not kids high school like oh I want to be Kate Moss or whatever you know like there's these are
00:52:01.900 two different conversations and no I don't want to be Kate Moss there are people who are driven
00:52:06.060 I don't want it certainly not at this age that thinness at this age is not oh god it's awful 0.71
00:52:11.280 on everyone including k moss who you know i've loved her for years she looks terrible um she
00:52:17.700 does not look good right now but i just think like complicating these conversations is only ever
00:52:21.420 useful and i'm sure people will have feedback that is you know critical in ways it'll complicate it
00:52:29.760 again that i'll hope that'll be useful so totally totally i mean what well also i i want us to be
00:52:36.300 able to keep having these conversations yes with great with grace right yeah because if you can't 0.92
00:52:40.560 then you know what women talking which uh women not to tie everything into the election but it's 1.00
00:52:46.440 hard not to particularly as a woman like women talking is the only i think useful only even if 1.00
00:52:53.320 you don't always like what they're saying yeah and we're gonna leave on that we're gonna leave 0.99
00:52:58.320 on that no women talking is useful it is it is and you know what i would like to actually i'd like
00:53:05.340 to leave on the note of i have to say i think that your book is an excellent holiday present
00:53:11.060 for people oh thank you i hope so yeah and you you and i shall be shall be doing a small business
00:53:18.280 saturday event this saturday at thunder road books uh which i'm very excited about i'm excited to
00:53:25.140 have bruce springsteen in my head for full 72 hours totally will you will you just tell everyone
00:53:30.040 about your book really really quick i'm mostly here to enjoy myself one woman's pursuit of
00:53:35.000 Pleasure in Paris is a memoir of the six weeks I spent in Paris post-COVID, where I, speaking of
00:53:41.600 cheese, ate a ton of it, drank a lot of wine, took my clothes off a lot, had a lot of sex,
00:53:47.180 rode my bike around, and just generally tried to capture in the book all the ways women enjoy
00:53:52.580 themselves, including in solitude and in quiet and in sitting in a park and reading a book,
00:53:57.720 because I don't necessarily think we get that version of enjoyment. So if you want a signed
00:54:03.860 copy, The Strand, put it on their holiday list. You can order it from The Strand. There's a bunch
00:54:07.340 of signed copies. But otherwise, you know, independent bookstores are very important
00:54:12.560 and will be increasingly so in the coming years. So I would encourage anyone purchasing any books
00:54:17.980 for the holidays to do so via bookshop.org or an independent bookstore. Totally, totally. And
00:54:24.880 Sicilian Inheritance also makes a great holiday gift. Just want to remind everyone, it's filled
00:54:29.080 with joyful food as is my life joyful right now and also speaking of how to be married you know
00:54:33.960 you were early on and charlotte walsh likes to win and also all of these conversations about
00:54:38.740 trad wives i just think you're very early on literally everything you do and that's something
00:54:43.320 to keep in mind when listening to you talk is that you're a is it canary i'm a sicilian witch
00:54:50.220 is what i am sicilian witch like it's a good barometer for where certain conversations are
00:54:55.080 headed this is true this is i mean i scared the hell out of myself with everyone is lying to you
00:55:00.060 because again i started the trad wife thriller because i started writing it kind of as a as a
00:55:05.620 satire and social commentary and things keep coming true i know well you started writing it
00:55:10.560 um in a dickensian way in the newsletter as a weekly episode which i think is i'm a modern
00:55:16.780 i'm the modern day charles dickens yes this is totally true and now it keeps coming i mean
00:55:21.460 it is it has been intense to rewatch to watch the handmaid's tale right now it's such a trope
00:55:26.920 to say that but um it is really you know we just sent the we just sent the book to margaret atwood
00:55:34.220 let's see what happens i can't wait i mean i'm excited to see it um see the galleys the cover
00:55:40.080 is so good the cover is so good this cover is so good and it's also available for pre-order guys
00:55:44.760 you can get it now order now order often because and i say this all the time in the sub stack even 0.78
00:55:50.480 pre-ordering feels like feels dumb okay it's not pre-ordering it's not as dumb as turkey
00:55:54.300 but i get i get that it feels dumb but the fact is my sales and marketing team constantly looks 0.89
00:56:01.380 at those pre-orders and they're like oh my gosh it's selling we should just we should print more
00:56:05.340 now and then sell more i mean it is just i mean i was gonna both know this is a whole other podcast
00:56:09.500 but if you like books or if you want to see certain books what the pre-order does is it it is a flag
00:56:16.040 to the marketing department in a publishing house to take this book seriously and invest in putting
00:56:21.220 dollars behind marketing so you know about it so that there's you know when you see authors
00:56:26.180 begging for pre-orders that is really they're just begging you to help them get their publishers to
00:56:31.400 take them seriously um which is exhausting for it's so tiring it's so tiring but also speaking
00:56:39.040 to what you want to see on bookshelves and the stories you want to see in the stories we're not
00:56:42.240 seeing and women talking in general in this moment you know your dollars speak louder than anything
00:56:47.900 else and if you see something and they're like oh i want this to be more part of a conversation
00:56:52.660 that is i think why pre-orders matter and i think it's important to articulate that because i feel
00:56:58.140 like at this point people just see that think that the author wants more money but actually
00:57:03.260 You are impacting the decision-making in offices that are much culturally much more powerful and impactful.
00:57:13.200 It actually typically has nothing to do with more money because we've already been paid.
00:57:16.340 Yes.
00:57:17.300 Yeah.
00:57:17.760 We've already been paid to make.
00:57:18.800 I don't make any money off sales of Sicilian right now.
00:57:22.560 No.
00:57:23.020 No.
00:57:23.600 Yeah.
00:57:24.200 It's really, it is, we want to see the conversation head this way.
00:57:31.020 Yes.
00:57:31.280 Yes.
00:57:31.340 And yes, you. So it's like it's handing the control over to the readers at the earliest stage possible.
00:57:38.900 That's what a pre-order is. Oh, I love that. Yeah. That's good. You're good at that.
00:57:43.700 Baby, women talking. We've got lots of women talking. Women talking. Women talking. Women 1.00
00:57:47.480 talking. A new a new a new podcast by Joe Piazza and Gwyneth McNichol. Yeah. All right. We have
00:57:52.800 to go before we launch a new podcast. Yes. OK. All right. Go have a great day, everyone. You deserve it.
00:58:01.340 Transcription by CastingWords
00:58:31.340 You