Under the Influence (with Jo Piazza) - December 18, 2025


We've Reached Peak Tradwife

Topics
peak trad wife episode
Holiday Rage, Hormones, and the Power of No Sunday Nice Things： Dissecting Tradwives and Feminism

Episode Stats


Length

33 minutes

Words per minute

164.01

Word count

5,505

Sentence count

297

Harmful content

Misogyny

29

sentences flagged

Toxicity

22

sentences flagged

Hate speech

17

sentences flagged


Transcript

Transcript generated with Whisper (turbo).
Misogyny classifications generated with MilaNLProc/bert-base-uncased-ear-misogyny .
Toxicity classifications generated with s-nlp/roberta_toxicity_classifier .
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
Topics generated with Qwen2.5-3B-Instruct.
00:00:00.000 You want to impress them on a first date, but also play it cool.
00:00:04.400 So what do you do?
00:00:06.720 I'm Rufy Thorpe, and I wrote and read a real love story about a hinged couple that navigated exactly that.
00:00:12.820 Listen to the free audiobook now.
00:00:15.060 Chew on this bold question from Dentine Gum.
00:00:18.320 Is it ever okay to compliment a millennial on their skinny jeans?
00:00:24.360 In 2026?
00:00:27.620 Dentine. Chew bold.
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00:00:34.900 That instinct to trade didn't disappear.
00:00:37.340 It just grew up.
00:00:38.160 With no minimums, no monthly fees, and 100 free trades,
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00:00:56.040 Hey, y'all.
00:00:57.160 Joe here, and you are listening to Under the Influence.
00:01:00.000 I'm going to say something pretty bold today, and I'm not saying it lightly.
00:01:05.180 I truly think that we've finally reached peak trad wife.
00:01:10.380 And over the past year, in nearly every interview I've done for Everyone is Lying To, I've
00:01:14.220 said that this trend is going to get a lot worse before it gets better.
00:01:17.980 I truly believed that we were still on the upward slope of the hazily lit and heavily
00:01:22.940 filtered mountain.
00:01:24.640 But I've recently seen some cracks in the movement.
00:01:27.060 something in the culture is shifting and it's shifting for the better we all know that the
00:01:34.260 entire trad wife movement has been built on a performance of nostalgia to drive profit but now
00:01:40.520 that a lot of these brands are large enough the ambition underneath is starting to show
00:01:44.380 i think that is a really good thing i think it's a really good thing for society for culture and
00:01:50.280 for feminism i really wanted to talk about it today and i kept racking my brain for the best
00:01:55.220 guest, the best expert to have on to talk about it. And then I realized that that expert might be
00:02:01.440 me. So to interview America's leading trad wife expert, I'm bringing on the journalist, Nick
00:02:07.740 Astor. All right. So you've been talking about this trad wife thing for a while. And recently
00:02:13.580 you suggested it's it's evolved. It's almost jumped the shark, if you will. Yeah, I mean,
00:02:20.440 And I think I like to call it peak trad wife, to be honest, you know, like peak oil.
00:02:26.140 Remember peak oil from the 80s and 90s?
00:02:28.160 I've been asked in a lot of interviews when I've been talking about everyone is lying to you if I thought the trad wife phenomenon was already over or near to ending.
00:02:38.840 And this summer when the book came out, I honestly thought that it wasn't and that it was completely on the upswing.
00:02:46.000 And I thought that leading up to the election because there was just so much more of it on Instagram and more of it being generated by, I mean, I guess what you could call so-called normies, just like regular people and not brands like Ballerina Farm and Nara Smith.
00:03:01.200 And then we had the rise of Erica Kirk shortly after Charlie Kirk's death, and that made it feel like Trad Wife was cemented in the canon somehow, even though, I mean, you and I have talked about this before. 1.00
00:03:17.140 Erica Kirk likes to tell women to submit to their husbands, but in practice, she's actually a highly educated, successful entrepreneurial woman. 0.80
00:03:27.240 I've always told you that I thought this whole thing was a big piss take from the beginning. 0.98
00:03:33.580 Yeah, well, and I think that depends on how you're defining Trad Wife.
00:03:38.720 And I've always defined it as someone performing domestic labors on social media in order to capitalize on a false nostalgia, in order to make you uncomfortable so that they can sell you things.
00:03:53.500 For me, Tradwife has always been a performance. There is a strong group on the right, mostly men, that believes this, that has funded this, that has boosted this. But I think the main players in the Tradwife game, the ones who are performing it on Instagram, have always been doing it to capture an audience, capture attention, and to make money off of it.
00:04:17.280 And now we're seeing those brands evolve in a very interesting way where they're outwardly saying, oh no, I'm a mogul. I'm a CEO. I'm a boss babe.
00:04:29.300 Yeah. Well, that begs the question. Now, if you're going to use the term trad wife to describe specifically those who perform on social media, I guess the question is, has any damage, if you will, been done to the larger population?
00:04:44.520 Are there, in fact, women sitting at home calling themselves trad wives who are not on social media?
00:04:51.440 I think a lot. I think a lot of damage has been done to young women, honestly.
00:04:56.220 I think a lot of damage has been done in the messaging of wouldn't you be happier if you just checked out?
00:05:04.540 If you checked out of the workforce, motherhood and wifedom should be your highest and possibly only ambitions. 0.82
00:05:12.920 and also your failing as a woman, as a quote-unquote feminine woman, if you're not practicing those 0.87
00:05:21.120 things to the utmost degree. I think that that messaging was so pervasive over the past couple
00:05:26.640 of years that we saw a lot of young women falling for it. I've talked to young women who say things
00:05:32.540 to me like, why would I go to college? I just need to find a husband. And so I do think that a lot of 1.00
00:05:37.540 this messaging permeated the culture, even though the Tradwives themselves were truly 0.89
00:05:44.320 just trying to build an audience and the Instagram algorithm rewarded the kind of content they 0.99
00:05:49.620 were promoting. 1.00
00:05:51.780 So would you argue that since we're talking about two different groups of women, right,
00:05:56.120 there's the one who has sort of taken the bait and then there are the ones who are describing
00:05:59.720 themselves or even becoming media moguls in their own right, is the latter group just
00:06:05.040 a bunch of drifters like any other?
00:06:07.540 I do truly believe that a lot of the influencers who took on the mantle of Tradwife, who used it to build their audience, we could call them grifters, we could call them social media geniuses, to be honest.
00:06:20.640 I mean, look, everyone is trying to build a brand online these days.
00:06:24.600 I mean, not everyone, but 95% of us, it is, even I do it, right?
00:06:29.280 So, yes, I would say that they were very much performing for the algorithm in order to build those brands.
00:06:40.960 All right. So what made you think about this summit peak, if you will?
00:06:45.700 This so-called Chadwife peak, or maybe it's a false summit.
00:06:48.940 You and I encounter false summits when we're hiking all the time.
00:06:52.460 At which point I'm usually like, can't we just stop?
00:06:56.200 Aren't we done? Are we done yet? I don't want to hike anymore.
00:06:59.000 you reach the true summit oh god i never want to reach the true summit is the thing like i like i
00:07:03.820 like a nice false summit with a good view oh no false summits are so unsatisfying not not for me
00:07:10.100 not for not for your lazy wife view i guess it's okay if it has a i mean look i just i i hike for
00:07:15.000 the views i do i don't understand how you how you hike just to get to the top of something when you
00:07:19.720 can't see anything from the top it's a fundamental human compulsion but i digress it's a fundamental
00:07:26.340 male compulsion is what i would tell you could be anywho we do digress so i've been thinking
00:07:34.880 about this a lot lately mostly due to a couple of things one we saw the ballerina farm brand which
00:07:42.020 is helmed by hannah nailman we saw it start to pivot into some really strange things uh including
00:07:49.320 a hydration powder. I mean, essentially, it's liquid. It's fancy ass liquid IV. And they were
00:07:57.960 just shameless, shameless about promoting this. They've also been truly growing that Ballerina
00:08:04.960 Farm brand and empire. And Hannah has come out a lot more than she did before as the brains and
00:08:12.820 the power behind this brand. Whereas in the beginning, she really posited, oh, I'm just a
00:08:19.060 wife. I'm just a mother. And that just was always there as an amplifier. But now she does seem to
00:08:27.060 truly be stepping into the spotlight as the leader of this brand and this family, which is not,
00:08:33.840 it's not the messaging that we saw before. And then last week, there was a massive New York
00:08:39.660 times profile on nara smith she's a model and a mother of four she's the influencer who's best 1.00
00:08:46.380 known for making a lot of everyday things from scratch like cinnamon toast crunch and bagels
00:08:53.580 and ketchup remember i tried to make her cinnamon toast crunch from scratch not easy we could try 0.93
00:08:58.880 it again i think we'd do better nothing wrong that's it was complete crap okay it it tasted 0.94
00:09:05.160 lit crap charlie spit that cinnamon toast crunch out on the floor and it was burnt if i recall 0.96
00:09:10.540 i burnt the cinnamon toast crunch that was made from scratch i did it was okay whatever i'm i'm 0.99
00:09:16.980 a shitty trad wife as you as you well as you well know i'm a what i am thank you i like hearing that
00:09:23.400 because i think that i am a wonderful wife and you're you're a wonderful husband you really are 0.98
00:09:28.260 you are you're taking you're you're with all the kids right now while i'm up in new york
00:09:32.600 on this work trip uh you took charlie to go see a christmas story last night hey carry on you don't
00:09:38.400 take praise that well anywho this is a massive new york times profile of nara smith talking about
00:09:46.120 her the expansion of her business empire and they truly they call her a mogul in this she admits 0.75
00:09:53.680 that she left her baby with a nanny during all of these meetings which to me is actually wildly
00:10:00.200 refreshing because I hate profiles of anyone, not just influencers and not just 0.63
00:10:08.480 traddy adjacent influencers, but any woman that doesn't say how they are dealing with child care. 0.79
00:10:16.160 I think it is a massive erasure of the labor of child care. I mean, like I just said, 0.98
00:10:21.640 I'm taking meetings in New York. You're with our kids right now. In addition to a babysitter last
00:10:26.500 night, in addition to them being in school all day long. We have to talk about those things.
00:10:31.680 And so the fact that the New York Times got her to say that her baby was with a nanny
00:10:37.480 was really big because a lot of these women in the past when they've been interviewed
00:10:42.480 claim to do it all themselves. And I find that a very toxic message. 0.66
00:10:47.820 Yeah, it's unlikely to be true.
00:10:49.300 And not only is it not true, but it makes the woman who is paying out the nose for child care or who may feel like they're flailing because they don't have child care, it makes them feel really insecure about not being able to do it all without child care.
00:11:09.240 Well, yeah, it's just one of these acts.
00:11:11.060 This is you could do this with any topic and somebody claims that they lose weight, but
00:11:16.460 never diet or they are in terrific shape, but they never go to the gym or they, you
00:11:21.960 know, are rich.
00:11:23.140 And it was just because they're a genius, you know, um, this happens all the time with
00:11:28.760 this self-promotional stuff online, uh, and, you know, celebrities and, and, and so on.
00:11:36.600 Yeah, no, absolutely.
00:11:37.360 My favorite one from back when I was in magazines was that literally every female celebrity profile had that female celebrity just, like, gobbling down a burger and fries.
00:11:48.460 And the journalist is inevitably like, how do you stay so fit and thin?
00:11:52.860 And they're like, I'm just this way.
00:11:55.000 It's just genetics.
00:11:56.140 And I walk a lot, but I just eat whatever I want. 0.99
00:12:00.560 Meanwhile, especially in this day and age, I'm like, girl, bitch, you want Ozempic. 0.97
00:12:04.880 You want Ozempic just like I am, okay? 1.00
00:12:07.360 shut your mouth shut your mouth eight hours of sleep every night every night every night and
00:12:13.500 i'm just bringing you know it's just so easy because i meditate seven times a day it's just 0.52
00:12:18.120 so easy because i bring my kids on set with me and they just love it so much i don't have seven
00:12:22.300 nannies behave very well they don't need any supervision they sit and read their books and
00:12:28.280 do their homework and only only books and only only only poetry only poetry written by emily
00:12:33.840 Dickinson. We digress. We digress a little too much. Let's take a quick break. And when we get
00:12:39.040 back, we'll talk a little bit more about Nerith Smith's brand expansion. You want to impress them
00:12:49.440 on a first date, but also play it cool. So what do you do? I'm Rufy Thorpe, and I wrote and read
00:12:56.540 a real love story about a hinge couple that navigated exactly that. Listen to the free
00:13:01.440 audiobook now. Before you knew what a stock was, you traded snacks, cards, turns. You knew what
00:13:09.160 something was worth because you felt it. That instinct to trade didn't disappear. It just grew
00:13:15.120 up. TD Easy Trade taps into that instinct so you can build something real for the future with no
00:13:21.540 minimums, no monthly fees, and 100 free trades. You already got this because you are made to trade
00:13:28.640 And TD Easy Trade is made to help.
00:13:31.540 Download it now.
00:13:33.000 Chew on this bold question from Dentine Gum.
00:13:36.320 Is it ever okay to compliment a millennial on their skinny jeans in 2026?
00:13:45.500 Dentine, chew bold.
00:13:51.120 Okay, we are back.
00:13:53.400 so like i said nara smith she did this big reveal of of her brand expansion and it is it's a good
00:14:02.440 one i'm curious about where the money is coming from for it uh but she has products now which is
00:14:08.740 the next move you move from being an influencer who makes money from affiliate links we talk about
00:14:14.480 this all the time every time you click on something on an influencer page they're making
00:14:19.140 money from it um but then you move to making your own products ballerina farm had already done this
00:14:25.320 now nara smith has this whole line of stuff including this roasted garlic oil which the
00:14:30.760 more i read the new york times story about it i'm like you know what maybe we need this roasted
00:14:34.880 garlic oil let's make some roast some garlic put some oil in how hard can it be oh you know what
00:14:41.240 you're right we could we could maybe make our own roasted garlic oil from from scratch easy
00:14:48.280 It's so easy.
00:14:49.220 We could be billionaires.
00:14:50.200 I mean, I have made my own product.
00:14:52.460 I did make the Trad Wife Tears candle, you know?
00:14:55.200 Yeah.
00:14:55.720 I'm going to have to buy some of those for Christmas presents.
00:14:58.600 The candle, I think we have some in the house, honey.
00:15:01.580 The candle that smells exactly like burning down the patriarchy, if you want a Christmas
00:15:06.040 present for your friend who wants to burn down the patriarchy, it actually smells like
00:15:10.600 apple pie, honey, and bergamot and sage.
00:15:13.080 It's delightful.
00:15:14.020 OK, but yes, I mean, I'm taking this influencer playbook, and I'll fully admit it, where you create products and sell products to the massive audience that you've built by hoodwinking them into believing that they're doing womanhood and motherhood wrong.
00:15:31.860 This is just product marketing.
00:15:34.600 Insert whatever you want to make people feel guilty and insecure.
00:15:38.800 Yes, it is product marketing 101.
00:15:41.780 One, I think back all the time to an anecdote that Glynis once told me.
00:15:46.720 And this isn't fact-checked, but I love it anyway.
00:15:50.040 Oh, by the way, I saw Glynis yesterday, and I'm seeing her again tonight.
00:15:53.320 Hurrah.
00:15:54.320 I know. Makes me happy. She makes me happy.
00:15:57.180 Anyway, it's about why women began shaving their legs. 0.99
00:16:01.620 And it had something to do with a surplus of razors after one of the world wars. 0.51
00:16:08.080 And so the marketing geniuses there were like, well, how about we just make women feel bad about their hairy bodies? 0.89
00:16:16.020 And then that turned into women's bodies should be hairless and slippery like seals. 0.99
00:16:21.440 Yeah, I believe it. 1.00
00:16:22.640 I believe it.
00:16:23.380 Again, unfact checked, but it is something that I think about all the time.
00:16:26.480 And it just makes so much sense for marketing.
00:16:29.500 I mean, we're constantly being told that we should feel guilty and ashamed and we're doing something wrong.
00:16:34.640 But if we just buy this thing, we're going to be better.
00:16:37.060 We're going to be better moms, better parents.
00:16:39.820 And I think what you and I have realized in nine years of parenting is that nothing makes you a better parent except for time and experience.
00:16:48.060 Yeah, that's about right.
00:16:50.820 Like, I feel like we're pretty good now, but only because we've done the work.
00:16:55.340 Yeah, and you make a lot of mistakes.
00:16:57.520 You know, talking about it helps too.
00:16:59.200 I mean, you learn from people, you observe other people, so on.
00:17:02.860 But at the end of the day, you know, you're absolutely right.
00:17:04.740 you have to uh you know time and experience and so time time and experience time experience so
00:17:11.140 the new york times is a little tongue-in-cheek with the nara smith profile they do say more 0.98
00:17:17.900 performance art than how-to guides many videos feature miss smith dressed in elaborate couture
00:17:23.900 as she narrates her processes for making items both quotidian and outlandish i gotta say i 0.97
00:17:30.520 fucking hate i fucking hate the new york times i'm so over the new york times well the writing 0.96
00:17:34.900 about her is if she's martha stewart i mean at this point what's the difference other than 0.99
00:17:39.000 rooted in less honesty well that's literally in the next sentence they say she closes the videos
00:17:48.540 with the sign off from scratch a catchphrase that brings to mind those used by others who have built
00:17:54.500 empires on their culinary prowess like martha stewart who did it's yeah who did it's a good
00:18:01.380 thing and julia child who said bon appetit what i do think that the new york times ignores a lot
00:18:08.060 of the context ignores a lot of the messaging that she used to build up her brand i think
00:18:16.280 that the New York Times was similarly just, I don't think they had a sharp enough eye when they
00:18:27.160 profiled Hannah Nealman from Ballerina Farm, to be honest. It just feels like they're promoting
00:18:36.200 the things that these women did in order to gain this audience without being critical
00:18:43.220 of what I think was a lot of toxic messaging. 1.00
00:18:46.700 Right. Yeah. I think you're probably right.
00:18:49.800 It is fun. I'm scrolling through this article.
00:18:51.900 And guess what stroller she has? 1.00
00:18:54.100 Duna.
00:18:54.820 She has the Duna, which is our favorite store.
00:18:57.280 Objectively, it's the best stroller you can buy.
00:19:00.280 The Duna is objectively the best stroller you can buy.
00:19:03.540 It is not a sponsor of ours,
00:19:05.280 but it is the one thing that we tell new parents to get all the time.
00:19:09.880 We finally just got rid of ours after three babies.
00:19:13.220 We gave it to Ted and Evan for Baby June.
00:19:19.040 Yeah.
00:19:20.140 There are products that are worth buying, and then most of them are just stuff.
00:19:25.480 Most of them.
00:19:27.360 That's how we've built our economy.
00:19:29.520 There's a great George Carlin piece on it, but I digress.
00:19:33.380 What is the George Carlin piece?
00:19:35.540 Oh, it has to do with dildos.
00:19:37.760 And it's it's well, he does it frequently, but his piece on the Ten Commandments mentions that coveting their neighbor's goods is a silly commandment because fundamentally that is what keeps the economy moving.
00:19:56.920 I believe that I'm here. I'm here for that.
00:19:58.920 Well, you know, that is a central tenet of Instagram marketing.
00:20:03.600 We talk about this in the original series of Under the Influence, that it's aspirational
00:20:10.900 marketing to the core that you believe the person you're looking at on the screen is
00:20:16.060 perhaps a class higher than you are, and you should aspire to what they are doing and being.
00:20:22.740 The whole thing is very tenuous, if you ask me.
00:20:25.220 It's a hustle.
00:20:26.180 you're selling stuff that for the most part people don't really need there's nothing to do
00:20:31.520 with the trad wife stuff i mean this is the entire influencer economy and it is what it is and you
00:20:39.420 know i could go way down a rabbit hole on why it's probably unsustainable in the long run but
00:20:46.600 here we are and the whole trad wife uh ballerina nara smith component of it is just one component
00:20:54.120 enough. At the end of the day, you have these pictures people want to look at and somebody
00:20:58.900 tells you to buy something and makes it look pretty. Yeah, exactly. And this is capitalism
00:21:05.400 at its finest. It is capitalism to the end. But I will say I am happy that it seems like
00:21:14.000 we're moving beyond the toxic messaging of erasing a woman's labor, erasing anyone's labor.
00:21:21.920 I do not want any work to be erased.
00:21:26.040 And at least in this New York Times profile, and at least in the recent coverage of Ballerina Farm, what we are seeing is them saying, I'm putting in this work.
00:21:37.260 This is the studio I go to.
00:21:39.120 These are the meetings that I'm taking.
00:21:41.080 Instead of just seeing someone in a kitchen saying, just baked this gorgeous meatloaf.
00:21:47.360 And my kitchen's not messy.
00:21:48.800 My kids are so happy.
00:21:50.360 Now, that's great.
00:21:51.920 That to me is an optimistic, you know, look at this.
00:21:57.040 Are you saying that as we, you know, where do we go from here, right?
00:22:00.920 We talked about the hypothetical peak.
00:22:04.940 Where do we go from here?
00:22:05.820 Are you saying that this matures beyond the superficiality of it?
00:22:09.980 That this matures beyond the pretending I don't do anything all day?
00:22:15.120 Well, let's take a quick break and I'll tell you where I think it's going to go.
00:22:21.920 I didn't like what you said, Odin pauses, about the future.
00:22:28.220 This is the love story of real hinge couple Odin and Edward, written and read by me, Curtis Garner.
00:22:35.220 Listen to the free audiobook now.
00:22:51.920 Trade taps into that instinct. Because you are made to trade. And TD Easy Trade is made to help.
00:23:02.360 Okay, we are back. What I am hoping. Here's my hope and my dream. And I'm saying this very
00:23:09.440 carefully and a little nervously. Because anytime I talk about feminism, and I just wrote about it
00:23:14.100 on my sub stack, I get attacked by all of these people out there who are like, you don't understand
00:23:19.060 feminism. And that is the problem with feminism, okay? One of the problems. One of the problems 1.00
00:23:24.400 is that there are so many people who believe they have the answer or who believe they know more
00:23:29.960 that you can't have an open discussion about what you want feminism to look like in 2025
00:23:35.040 or the future. And so what I'm hoping is that we can reach a new place for feminism where we're 0.54
00:23:44.280 broadening the tent, where it is not just applied to women who are hustling in the corporate world 1.00
00:23:49.820 outside the home. And I know that technically, academically, feminism wasn't supposed to be that, 1.00
00:23:55.500 but that's what a lot of people felt it was, okay? And there are a lot of stay-at-home moms 1.00
00:23:59.900 who are working their butts off in their houses, running their families, who felt excluded from 1.00
00:24:06.020 feminism. And I'm hoping that one, we could acknowledge the labor, and two, we can try to 0.98
00:24:11.460 fight for more systemic change to make all of this, to make pursuing your purpose and your
00:24:17.160 ambitions easier for everyone. And I think step one of that is showing the work that goes into
00:24:25.080 building a brand and also showing the work that goes into caring for children and caring for a
00:24:30.740 family, whether that's a mother doing it, a father doing it, or a caregiver doing it.
00:24:36.180 Nice. So given that we've had this conversation within the context of this social media phenomenon, is anybody doing what you're describing on social media today? And if not, what's stopping them?
00:24:50.020 There's so many people doing it on social media. I don't think the algorithm rewards them as much as it does these slow living videos of picking heirloom tomatoes. I do think that the algorithm rewards classically beautiful domestic bliss in the same way that that is what was featured in glossy magazines for a long time, right?
00:25:18.440 Do you think that that's a problem with the algorithm or a problem with human nature?
00:25:23.740 I think it's both.
00:25:25.200 I think that it is also human nature as well as a social media algorithm designed primarily by men to continue capturing attention for people who feel like their life isn't enough.
00:25:38.200 Again, capitalism to the end.
00:25:39.980 And I love capitalism.
00:25:40.880 I love making money, which you hate.
00:25:42.640 But, like, making money is one of my favorite things.
00:25:45.420 That's not entirely true.
00:25:46.880 But, you know, go back and I mean, why would the algorithm favor this?
00:25:52.580 Is it because it's a lowest common denominator thing?
00:25:54.860 I mean, it's simple and easy and that's just how things default to sugar candy versus healthy food.
00:26:00.740 You know, is that what we're talking about?
00:26:03.080 Well, yeah.
00:26:03.740 I mean, it's simple.
00:26:05.160 It's easy.
00:26:05.820 It's easy on the eyes.
00:26:07.140 It's a nice escape.
00:26:08.620 Right.
00:26:08.960 I mean, all media has been created on escapism.
00:26:11.700 It would be funny with the realities of child-rearing, the realities of taking care of your home, male, female, whatever.
00:26:18.540 There's a lot of people that do it, and sometimes they do go viral.
00:26:21.740 I think they go viral less than the pretty imagery, than the pretty pictures, than well-manicured hands kneading dough. 0.99
00:26:29.520 That's the one that gets me all the time when these women are like, I homestead. 0.93
00:26:32.720 I live out in the middle of nowhere. 1.00
00:26:33.900 And I'm like, bitch, you didn't do that manicure on your own. 1.00
00:26:37.120 Come on. 1.00
00:26:38.020 Like those cuticles, you didn't do that.
00:26:39.740 you drove to the nearest city and you got those nails done for 80 bucks what do you think i mean
00:26:45.500 can social media be harnessed in a way to sort of i don't know if correct it is the right word
00:26:52.540 but to be nudged in a more um you know real direction i want i want to nudge i try to nudge
00:27:00.400 on a daily basis and my goal with all of my books as you know is to try to nudge us forward to a new
00:27:07.340 kind of more inclusive feminism that embraces all kinds of ambitions, no matter how you want
00:27:13.360 to be ambitious. You can be ambitious about your career. You could be ambitious about raising 1.00
00:27:18.540 children, ambitious about being a wife, ambitious about not being a wife, ambitious about fucking 1.00
00:27:23.860 birdwatching. Okay. By the way, I just sent Jackie how many birds we saw in London. I sent her our 1.00
00:27:29.740 Merlin list and she is so impressed. Oh yeah. It was great. That was a good, what a lot of people
00:27:36.320 don't know is that in order to please the king and queen foreign dignitaries for hundreds of years 0.97
00:27:42.260 have brought their exotic waterfowl to hyde park and so many of them are still there morons pelicans 0.87
00:27:49.460 wood ducks egyptian geese yeah all kinds of cool birds yeah the moorhen yeah jackie jackie was
00:27:56.740 blown up she's like you didn't see all these in hyde park in london i'm like yeah i did look at
00:28:00.880 our lifeless it's hyde park is practically a zoo i think fans have they don't they don't fly off 0.62
00:28:06.520 no they're definitely i mean every every dumb tourist was feeding those birds our kids tried 0.62
00:28:10.740 to feed those birds combos yeah yeah and we're like don't feed the birds combos seagulls tend 0.97
00:28:16.460 to steal it but yeah yeah yeah um i think our kids favorite thing was paddle boating in hyde
00:28:21.800 park but talking about all the all the things that our kids loved in london is a whole other episode
00:28:27.040 One that I'm looking forward to.
00:28:28.820 Yeah, well, we can do it.
00:28:29.620 We can do it later in this week.
00:28:30.800 It was good.
00:28:31.460 I think the London trip was awesome.
00:28:33.200 I think it's like four episodes.
00:28:34.900 It could be a four-episode arc.
00:28:37.380 So, I mean, what I do want to say is that I think that by showing more reality on social media, less fantasy,
00:28:44.540 by being honest about how we all do this, how do we take care of ourselves, our families, our businesses,
00:28:51.440 I try to be really honest that we've worked with an au pair for a very long time.
00:28:55.540 this is the first time that we're a perilous I call it raw dogging parenting which sounds filthy
00:29:00.520 it's like we are raw dogging now it's just it's you and I and sometimes my mom coming over but I
00:29:05.780 think we're doing okay but we have to say that it's like how do you do it how do you get it done
00:29:09.700 how do you make things work and I think that honesty is really important it's fine it's fine
00:29:15.760 to want to look at pretty videos but to see behind the curtain and to see how these things are
00:29:20.620 actually made is really important. It's a level of media literacy. That is the reason that I said
00:29:26.060 we're reaching peak trad wave. I think we're reaching a better level of media literacy where
00:29:30.500 we're like, this isn't your real life. And I do think that Everyone is Lying to You did help that
00:29:35.320 along a little bit because people read this and they're like, oh, that's how the sausage is made?
00:29:40.300 These people are renting fake houses. These people have a staff of nannies. A lot of readers are
00:29:45.180 saying, I didn't know that. And I think that's been helpful. And I think a lot more people are
00:29:48.360 calling bullshit on this and it's fine if you like nara it's fine if you like ballerina farm 0.69
00:29:52.880 it's fine if you like those brands but we should know how they're getting this done and why it
00:29:59.720 works and what we're actually buying i think that's very important 100 i think it's that's
00:30:05.580 great i think you're absolutely right this is when we you know it's easy to doom yourself about
00:30:10.440 anything um particularly social media in general i mean i'm speaking beyond just the trad wife stuff
00:30:16.060 um but you're right people will evolve somehow you know i don't know where things are going to
00:30:21.160 be in 10 years or 50 years uh you know as we know it instagram and tiktok probably won't exist i'm
00:30:28.440 sure there'll be something else and i'm sure people will be upset about whatever replaces it
00:30:33.080 one way or another but at the end of the day we we evolve at the end of the day we evolve and
00:30:38.160 hopefully we evolve in in a good way i for the first time i'm a little optimistic and that's
00:30:45.000 wild for me because i'm never optimistic i'm also happy i love this i know i know i'm also happy
00:30:50.900 that everyone is lying to you came out last summer because i think that the trad wife trend would be
00:30:55.320 a little tired to have a book come out about it now so yay timing for me i do hope someone else
00:31:01.560 robs the louvre soon though for when the parrot parisian heist comes out but oh my gosh i would
00:31:08.620 love it if those if those if those louvre heist guys decide to rob the musedes you can't steal
00:31:14.560 the clock it's embedded in the window you can with the right um you know forklift and welding
00:31:20.820 tools uh you know reflective vests and a sign that says clock repair fair fair enough okay i think
00:31:28.060 that we've now we've now reached we've reached peak episode right now with us peak trad wife
00:31:33.060 peak episode thank you so much for being here nick astor i love you very much i love you too bye
00:31:40.180 Bye.
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