Unlearn16: Class is in Session - The One Where You Make A Choice...Are You Ready to Be Strong？ Buffy Season 7 Finale

00:00:00.000 class is in session how is everybody doing welcome to unlearn 16 classes in session guys

00:00:09.360 guys this is it season seven part two of the buffy the vampire slayer investigative journalism

00:00:22.840 pop culture analysis led with two amazing guys we've got stew we've got stefan hi boys hello

00:00:31.820 hello guys are you ready for it to be over no what are we gonna do on sunday

00:00:38.320 oh have a life oh right i'll do laundry laundry

00:00:44.280 Laundry

00:00:45.800 Poor Stefan reads me the filth

00:00:48.940 Every time I don't

00:00:49.800 I wear like a shirt

00:00:51.300 Same two shirts

00:00:51.940 Same two shirts

00:00:53.980 I put mine in

00:00:56.600 And didn't press go

00:00:57.760 So here we go

00:00:58.860 It's just the way the Sunday works

00:01:01.400 I'm wearing the best shirt

00:01:02.580 I did find out

00:01:03.120 What's that?

00:01:04.760 Oh you are too

00:01:05.460 I can't believe it

00:01:06.100 Very nice

00:01:07.500 It was given to me

00:01:08.460 It's amazing

00:01:08.940 I did find out today

00:01:11.260 And for everybody who's listening

00:01:13.160 if cranberries bounce

00:01:15.480 you're going to have to go see that on my

00:01:17.300 TikTok. That will be up

00:01:19.260 tomorrow. Today I'm going to put up

00:01:21.180 Stu and I go to see

00:01:23.300 Halloween ends.

00:01:25.720 Oh, I cannot wait to see that.

00:01:28.420 I took Joanna

00:01:29.140 to

00:01:29.560 the front street

00:01:32.780 with the seats in the basement.

00:01:35.680 Oh, with the basement.

00:01:37.460 Because there's no reception down there.

00:01:39.680 Get the reception.

00:01:41.820 Nobody was there.

00:01:43.160 we're in toronto it was vacant number two why down so many stairs and number three nobody took our

00:01:49.880 tickets stefan nobody but in retrospect i'm wondering if nobody took them because they knew

00:01:57.960 they memorized there were two seats sold exactly for me it used to be my favorite theater i'm

00:02:05.160 gonna say because the seats alone are worth it yeah yeah but see i live in the suburbs so all

00:02:11.080 All the seats out here are like that.

00:02:12.640 And I don't feel like I'm going to die going to the theater.

00:02:16.020 I live under a bridge.

00:02:17.560 So that's like, that's a treat for me.

00:02:20.360 All right.

00:02:21.040 Speaking of, speaking of the end, this is it guys.

00:02:25.860 So we are in the home stretch of season seven.

00:02:29.820 Where do you guys want to start?

00:02:31.260 Where do we leave off last time?

00:02:33.660 So I just want to say that this is so,

00:02:37.200 um this show is so so old that stop like after lies my parents told me well like willow gets a

00:02:46.940 call from fred and she goes over it is one of my favorite episodes of angel orpheus yes but

00:02:52.040 orpheus the episode of orpheus was delayed because of the start of the iraq war which

00:02:57.760 what wait wait the second iraqi war not not desert store not the persian gulf war

00:03:09.420 we're talking the second okay but it's post 9-11 right that's the time we're in there's

00:03:15.980 the protracted armed conflict in iraq from 2003 it's like i think it was 2011 or 12

00:03:21.900 yeah yeah long time just a page eight-year war i don't know i don't want to hear that i don't

00:03:28.740 want to hear it no but like it's so funny that like it's not funny the war but it's funny how

00:03:33.420 in my head it's not that long ago when it actually is a long long long time ago well it's 20 years

00:03:42.320 if you told me these episodes aired yesterday i believe you you know what i mean like it just

00:03:47.000 feels so new well that's but that's kind of the beauty of the show because i'm telling you right

00:03:52.700 now there's episodes of lots of shows that okay outside of some cgi issues there's episodes of

00:03:58.400 lots of shows that don't hold up like that when i watch it and i go who dated who dated like i don't

00:04:04.920 feel that way often about buffy do you know what i mean like i've been forced to watch teen wolf

00:04:09.700 why can't they get their cgi game together what what's going on guys yeah i will say i will say

00:04:16.020 long time after fluffy why do your wolves look like that stop it i you know what and i'll say

00:04:21.340 that like i still listen to the the soundtrack of season seven episode 22 of um uh the final

00:04:30.480 fight and the slayers it's it's two of the most powerful like cinematic style soundtracks of a

00:04:37.940 series of that time and to me it is still such an epic episode when it comes to like the special

00:04:44.300 effects even like compared to now cannon fodder but like then just everything was happening it

00:04:50.280 was amazing i just think also i a i agree i challenge anybody there's lots of stuff that

00:04:58.080 we can complain about at buffy but i challenge anybody to come up the series finale the two

00:05:05.240 episodes are i don't know a better series finale i just don't hard to find you know what you're

00:05:12.260 jaded stop it no there is not you're you just like the fact that you're they're supposed to 0.97

00:05:16.760 be adults and everything's dark and gloomy no screw you that's not why i'm watching tv 0.99

00:05:20.240 there is nothing more powerful in fact i think you know the buffy speech that we're going to

00:05:25.920 talk about the are you ready to be strong is perhaps that speech with the the flashes to the

00:05:36.460 women oh iconic he's the baseball girl come on now exactly the little girl with her head down 0.82

00:05:44.780 shaking she stands up there she barely can hold her bat she puts her head down buffy gives 0.99

00:05:51.980 everybody the power she tilts it up with that smile yeah there's no better scene i challenge 0.65

00:05:58.100 everybody it's amazing it's so powerful it was so powerful stewart's like swallowing hard because

00:06:05.240 he wants to destroy the scene no i think it's a i think that scene out of the entire episode is

00:06:09.860 perhaps the most powerful one in a what would be classified as a subpar episode i think that

00:06:15.500 i think the last 15 minutes of that episode were iconic i think the lead-up to that episode

00:06:23.220 felt rushed well yeah i guess yes i'll say that like the speech is the speech is everything as

00:06:34.200 soon as they enter the catacombs

00:06:35.760 amazing episode when she

00:06:37.940 gets up and she's like i want you 1.00

00:06:40.260 to get out of my face 1.00

00:06:42.520 i love it

00:06:43.940 like every double entendre

00:06:45.240 when that song starts

00:06:48.800 when that like soundtrack starts

00:06:50.120 it's incredible but everything

00:06:52.100 up until that soundtrack it just

00:06:54.220 feels like they are throwing things like fish

00:06:56.300 to the fans being like look they're having

00:06:58.180 a funny conversation at the end of the world

00:06:59.900 it just felt like a rushed season

00:07:02.300 but you're just talking about faith right now and okay come on like and um robin oh right i forgot

00:07:10.420 about him although another amazing amazing moment in the episode is actually not this episode is

00:07:15.200 end of days where buffy is sitting with faith and faith says i see you i've seen what you have and

00:07:20.920 i don't know jealous finally they finally have that moment where the two of them connect beyond

00:07:25.400 just being slayers and being like people and it's more about just like her accepting that i will

00:07:30.980 always be your second fiddle i will always be the other slayer you know but anything that's yours

00:07:36.460 anything that's supposed to be mine is yours including the friends and the family and the

00:07:40.060 heart also acknowledging she always thought she was lonely i was always alone i was always whatever

00:07:47.000 and i was looking to you thinking that's the life i want thus all of the back and forth the back and

00:07:52.420 forth even the body swap which was by the way did we talk about that episode yes it was amazing

00:07:57.300 enough detail it was one of my favorites we're all the clips sorry uh but but the idea that

00:08:04.260 when she when she's finally there she now feels what solidarity like like that kind of alone

00:08:12.420 feels like when you're the leader when you're making those choices when you're surrounded by

00:08:18.900 all these people that love you and and admire you and elevate you and you've never felt so alone i

00:08:25.460 think if people could understand that about everybody in this world forget the supernatural

00:08:30.260 for a second like holy crap what an amazing tie we could possibly have with humanity right and for

00:08:37.620 and for buffy to then to have this moment with her after everything she's still they're still 0.96

00:08:42.260 like walking on eggshells during dirty girls they have that confrontation in um empty places uh 1.00

00:08:48.900 willow our face excuse me faith has to take charge of the slayers and then they finally in the hell 1.00

00:08:54.100 mouth the two of them buffy stab looks at faith hands her the scythe no one else and says hold

00:08:59.620 the line and then faith knows it's my responsibility now and it does dive a lot more into that in season 0.93

00:09:05.300 eight faith has her own arc um they use her essentially as like a suicide squad for a little

00:09:10.220 while and then she ends up going with angel um but like just that moment with her and buffy

00:09:15.580 even at the end just standing side by side it was just it's it's to me it was almost a

00:09:22.480 a near perfect conclusion to the that that storyline between those two characters a hundred

00:09:26.640 percent and if anyone's yeah go ahead i was gonna say if anyone's looking um it's robert duncan is

00:09:33.840 the one who created the soundtrack for season seven um it's called the last battle and the

00:09:38.160 war against evil those are the two part the two main parts but there's also a beautiful

00:09:42.560 scene with um that they stole from um the killer in me uh and they used it with the faith and i'm

00:09:49.040 i'm sorry i keep saying faith right the willow and kennedy scene in the same episode where she's

00:09:53.120 like no you're my way beautiful beautiful music to these scenes like it absolutely transports you

00:09:58.800 and we're not going to put down the like here's the here's the deal too i think

00:10:04.000 there are people in this world that want some semblance of realism or some some level of

00:10:13.360 like such meaningful depth all the time and i'm just not one of those girls i'm just not one of

00:10:20.800 those people that needs it what i do need what i do need is the you know boring from another genre

00:10:29.380 the iron man sorry the the captain america picking up thor's hammer i need that scene yeah and that

00:10:36.740 scene to me happened different times in Buffy where you um well you you cheer where it's that

00:10:43.660 scene where you know I think it happened when Angel showed up as trivia as should he have

00:10:49.120 shown up should he not it was brilliant and then for Angel to then stand back and go oh you're so

00:10:54.860 gonna lose but he no longer has to help her he no longer has to protect her he's like I'm just

00:11:00.740 going to stand back and watch her decimate this guy. I miss watching this. Yep. Right? I miss

00:11:05.760 watching this. You know, and then the conversation about the cookie dough, which I never can get out

00:11:10.860 of my head. It's so asinine, but so enjoyable. I tell kids all the time, you're not done baking 0.98

00:11:16.340 yet. They don't get the reference, but it's funny. And it makes sense. And I, those kind of

00:11:21.960 ties and I, and I know Stu, maybe it's just like, oh my God, it was just so many, but those kinds

00:11:26.760 of ties when i first watch it but even when i watch it today i get there's not many shows i get

00:11:34.560 chills you know captain america that scene captain america picking up that hammer the hammer going

00:11:39.840 into his hand yeah every day i can watch that scene 300 times the same with buffy probably

00:11:47.680 i would say in those last two episodes there's probably at least five solid scenes where you

00:11:54.040 kind of want to go yes you know like that kind of feeling and that's what a series finale is supposed

00:12:00.740 to do there's there's a handful yeah there's a handful of scenes in in any like for this for me

00:12:06.820 it's it's obviously the chosen final battle um like uh when snow and charming find each other

00:12:12.720 season one of once when um the sept is destroyed and game of thrones like there are these like

00:12:18.380 epic moments in tv shows that exactly that you want to get up and like cry or scream or cheer

00:12:23.940 and they're just so embedded in your memory but i will say to stewart's point there are some things

00:12:31.600 in the episode that were too rushed like as an example when angel shows up and he sees buffy

00:12:36.400 and they have that passionate kiss just and it's a hello the first shows up as buffy to taunt spike

00:12:42.060 because the way to get to spike the closest is either be drusilla or be buffy and i feel like

00:12:47.300 if they had like even an extra episode there could have been more of a of a disconnect between

00:12:53.800 them a fear and envy a jealousy and then it would have led up to that whole I holding hands I love

00:12:59.380 you to be a little more powerful just for him to be like can we skip it can you slide bed

00:13:03.920 but I think that part was done that part of Spike and that's his growth and that's his story and

00:13:12.400 that's his arc right i think when and it was it was also powerful spike speech to buffy you know

00:13:19.160 you're the one you're this you're that you know like oh god such a good scene i don't love you

00:13:25.500 because what i'm gonna get from you i love you because of who you are it's nothing about me

00:13:30.940 yeah that gives me chills right now yeah that is what love is supposed to be right love isn't

00:13:36.860 supposed to be uh only given until it's reciprocated love is supposed to be selfish love is

00:13:43.760 supposed to be everything they are that's what you're supposed to so spikes already feels that

00:13:49.320 he's already dis i think he's already separated his ego from from that reality and so when he

00:13:56.880 sees angel kissing buffy i think it's perfect that he doesn't because he we're expecting him

00:14:02.120 to go off the rails right what does he do nothing he goes oh i saw you saying hi to him with your

00:14:07.300 tongue and she's like it wasn't like that but he's already separated he's like i'm already done with

00:14:12.400 it don't worry about it yep drink it for me give it over yeah it's true to me that's because it's

00:14:18.220 his hero's arc right like he's about to do something did you guys like that part the

00:14:25.100 spike part that spike got to do the cleanup what do you guys think about that i loved it for what

00:14:31.260 it ended up becoming an angel an angel i did love before it became an angel um i was hoping that

00:14:38.660 there would be more of a connection between buffy and angel after season seven um and not just like

00:14:43.260 a cameo from andrew um right but uh yeah i mean did the ending happen the way i was hoping yes

00:14:55.220 a no like i'm glad that i'm willow gets goes beyond her fears and becomes a goddess everyone

00:15:03.000 becomes a slayer that is intended on becoming space get spike gets his but like in the best way

00:15:09.220 i i do also like it because if it wasn't for him it would have been angel and that would have been

00:15:13.960 a problem like that would have been like but then what a really interesting start to season five of

00:15:18.360 angel him being trapped in the amulet and essentially lindsey's puppet would have been

00:15:23.220 fascinating but um no i liked it i except for obviously except for anya i would have swapped

00:15:28.500 sandra for anya and called it a day who would yeah stew what do you think um

00:15:37.940 i mean like i i like for i like it for what it was i i really have a heart i struggle with the

00:15:43.700 buffy spike dynamic um and like this is coming from someone who used to love spike spike season

00:15:50.500 two um was obsessed right i think somewhere along the way and there was character development 100

00:15:56.940 but i think in season seven they were really looking for something to redeem him after season

00:16:01.600 six yeah and um i think they i have no idea what's happening um they tried to redeem him after season

00:16:10.260 six and i think this storyline at least to me felt a little bit like patchwork um especially

00:16:19.000 in some of the back the back scenes of how he came to be a vampire um i really enjoyed those

00:16:26.160 those episode that the episode and kind of really enjoyed um delving into his his backstory and how

00:16:33.440 he killed two slayers um oh i i thought you're talking about lies my parents told me you're

00:16:39.400 talking about season five i'm talking about season seven um i'm gonna go back for a second to talk

00:16:45.960 about um nikki wood yeah oh yeah yeah yeah i enjoy really interesting kind of like yeah

00:16:52.920 background and like the background i just feel like they did the character a bit of a disservice

00:16:59.800 in season six and then we're doing a lot of they're trying to clean it up in season seven

00:17:03.960 and it felt very much like they were like the pendulum swung way over here

00:17:07.740 and then suddenly let me pick up in season seven the pendulum is on the completely opposite side

00:17:13.520 of the spectrum so when he gets the amulet i thought it was a convenient plot device one because

00:17:19.080 the actor wanted to go on and play on angel they already had those negotiations and conversations

00:17:23.460 and now buffy was ending um and second of all um i think it was a really great way for him to end

00:17:32.280 out the arc on buffy i just again and it's like the common thing for this season i feel like it

00:17:37.540 was a very rushed character arc i wish it had been a little bit more where he wasn't so crazy

00:17:44.860 for so long it was a little bit more um because in lives my parents told me they learn about how

00:17:52.260 the first is the trigger for the song and where the song comes from um and that like lives my

00:17:58.160 parents told me is episode 17 and that it's resolved in by episode 22 of the actual hero

00:18:04.300 storyline i wish we had gone maybe like in episode 10 and had 12 episodes of like really making it

00:18:11.420 like a long because angel got three seasons angel got three seasons and buffy to kind of like

00:18:18.720 do this and they gave spike 17 episodes yeah you're 100 right because there it literally it

00:18:25.460 just goes from him being crazy in the basement to crazy at xander's to normal to killing to all

00:18:30.280 of a sudden there's a trigger it literally you're right it should have been just like in the basement

00:18:34.420 he should have been humming that tune to himself yeah exactly and then rather than that yeah a lot

00:18:40.340 easier they could have simplified that so much more and then stretched out the first taunting

00:18:45.420 him as buffy like in the house like maybe confusing him to be like are you buffy or are you the first

00:18:50.520 because how would he know unless he touched her um i have a big question yeah oh sorry go ahead

00:18:56.180 no finish your thought because this is going to go off in another direction oh i just it was just

00:18:59.940 thought it was just like they could have i i really did like the torture scenes but

00:19:03.920 sound as horrible as it sounds but like the the manipulation scenes between spike and the first

00:19:09.380 and spike or the first being buffy really interesting stuff and they could have they

00:19:15.200 could have utilized the first so much in this season but in previous seasons like they should

00:19:21.540 have he should have been a or they should have been a taunting background character throughout

00:19:26.040 the series it should have been more than just one episode in season two or season three excuse me

00:19:31.700 yeah yeah like supernatural sorry here's my question do you think and this is could be applied

00:19:44.360 to the real world do you think in order to have the only the only characters that can have

00:19:53.440 extremities of greatness and i will save the world and i have the leadership and the talent

00:20:00.960 and the bravery and the kurt all of those things do you think that same person has to have

00:20:06.240 extremities to the opposite think about it think about all the characters in buffy how bad angel

00:20:14.340 was and how good he could be how bad spike was and how good he could even out even willow yeah

00:20:21.900 how powerful she can white hair goddess willow and how bad she can be the only character that

00:20:30.760 doesn't do this is buffy really unless you're going to count like season six kind of but i 0.98

00:20:37.040 don't even really count that because she doesn't have a knife but right but she's not as much of

00:20:43.160 a swing but i'm wondering because then i start thinking about predominantly men because that's

00:20:48.200 who we write about, their ability for good and nobility and greatness. Yet, this is why we

00:20:56.900 shouldn't build statues, their ability and their pull to do some horrible, horrible things,

00:21:07.060 right? And that's true. If you look at big figures in history that changed the world,

00:21:13.320 they're not they're not all good and i'm not saying a little bit bad i'm not saying a little

00:21:19.580 bit bad like they just did a couple i mean lots of skeletons lots of greatness lots of skeletons

00:21:26.260 and when i look at buffy i wonder if that's maybe not a purposeful theme but what do you guys think

00:21:34.320 about that i think it's been the show's the show does a really good job of pairing um that notion

00:21:42.220 of great power with great power comes great responsibility and i think that you see a lot

00:21:46.920 of the characters especially the ones who started off as mortal um and like rooted in mortality and

00:21:52.580 rooted in in human humanity really struggle with that when they're given a power like willow um

00:21:59.560 i really appreciate some of those lines between or those dialogue between her and giles in season

00:22:04.960 six and season seven or season six mostly when he when he really kind of holds her to task about

00:22:11.380 how she's um still an amateur as powerful as she is she's she's really just lucky and tara saying

00:22:19.860 that she's using too much magic and it kind of going into this uh this kind of parallel to a

00:22:26.740 drug addict i also think too when you have angel and and his struggles as well as a supernatural

00:22:34.100 being rooted in humanity that's amazing the one thing i will say about buffy is i think

00:22:41.380 they did the character a disservice because instead of feeling her own darkness it's often

00:22:47.040 a reflection of the darkness of people around her um so oftentimes uh her reaction to willow or

00:22:56.260 or anya or um angel or spike comes off as kind of holier than thou and like yeah

00:23:03.920 I think it's something that they could have definitely maybe like sanded the hard edges on because even someone as powerful as her who came to this power at 16 years old or 15 years old rather, I think she would have had more of a struggle or more of acting out.

00:23:29.840 other than like season episodes one of season two and then like a hand a handful of episodes 1.00

00:23:36.220 in season three where she like wore like darker colors no lower cut top and like stole something 1.00

00:23:44.280 from a store like it's on the same level as like her stealing from macy's and ended up like

00:23:49.700 at 15 years old so it's like i wish there had been a little bit darker in like season six like yes

00:23:55.580 that spoke to more of depression rather than acting out because she was more powerful around

00:24:00.320 her i would have preferred to see like a dark buffy like you saw a dark willow like you saw 0.97

00:24:05.340 all these people so i think it would have been a lot of a really interesting story to pull her

00:24:10.640 back from that edge i i have i have some thoughts on that but i i've been my mind's kind of going

00:24:16.960 all in like seven different tangents so bear with me but i feel like i feel like josh josh my god

00:24:22.860 I feel like Joss wouldn't allow himself to have Buffy be a bad girl or have those bad extremes compared to Spike and Angel and Willow or Anya because she had to be the white knight.

00:24:35.980 And it seemed like a lot of her darkness was internal, whereas she was fighting so many external darkness and evil and aggression and anger from people she cares about and also the people that she's sworn to protect and also the people that are attacking her.

00:24:50.940 It seemed like it was one of those sort of a hero's journey of, I'm not what matters here. The mission's what matters, similar to what Robin Wood's mother said. It's like, it doesn't matter what I feel. I have to do the right thing. I cannot be the bad guy here.

00:25:05.700 And I feel like eventually over time, that just becomes more internalized, which is why you saw when she came back and she said, I did the right thing. I saved the world. Why am I here? And she started hurting herself in a way, you know, with the depression, with acting out, with Spike, with all the other things, because she wouldn't allow herself to be bad.

00:25:26.300 and and josh josh we didn't use um faith as a catalyst to sort of fill up all the here's what

00:25:34.160 buffy could do but she won't because she's the good girl so let's make faith the bad one and

00:25:39.240 then we'll put her through the arc of finding retornment and and salvation and and righteousness

00:25:44.340 and then you have sort of another spectrum of if they don't have those extremes they're just a

00:25:51.020 boring character like Xander never had the extreme of being amazingly good or amazingly bad and he

00:25:57.600 just came off as sort of like a lump that floated through the series and made terrible choices but

00:26:03.860 it seemed normal when he made those terrible choices because he wasn't the good one fighting 0.85

00:26:08.620 the good fight he wasn't Buffy like when Buffy made the extreme choice of of having sex with 0.98

00:26:13.980 with Spike you're like holy shit that's strange when Xander leaves Anya at the altar because he's 0.87

00:26:19.120 afraid because he's a coward that seems like his character's arc like he's like yeah it makes sense

00:26:23.480 he would do that so i feel like i feel like i wish there could be sort of um similar to what

00:26:30.800 stewart said it would be interesting to see like a dark buffy but we have a dark buffy we have it

00:26:35.220 in faith and i feel like in order for joss to get his point across he couldn't allow her to make

00:26:40.600 those extremes the way he did his other characters i get it like i'm just wondering you know i'm

00:26:47.140 thinking a little bit about captain america because he's the one character that didn't

00:26:51.940 really have sure he grew a beard and told the government to piss off but he really the dark

00:26:58.440 side he did not traverse you know what i mean not like iron man not like the hulk by his own

00:27:04.700 not by his own control i just i wonder if it would have been i wonder if it would have been

00:27:10.940 better i wonder if it would have been you know after her mom dying was probably the time where

00:27:17.520 that should have happened if it was going to happen yeah there should have been an outbreak

00:27:20.680 a little bit more of a yeah or or but then you have dawn but then you're like no we can't let

00:27:26.960 her go bad she can't go reckless she can't feel her emotions or pain she has to take care of dawn

00:27:31.680 that's the what's that's what matters right now glory's on her way stop your feelings stop your

00:27:36.780 hurt none of this matters you have to be the good guy you have to be the hero there's dawn

00:27:40.820 protect her that's the bigger message i feel like the bigger message of buffy if we're talking on a

00:27:47.080 on a feminist level if we're talking on like a like an academic kind of diatribe this notion of 1.00

00:27:53.580 what women are expected to take how they're supposed to internalize how they're never 1.00

00:27:58.140 supposed to allow themselves to feel and allow themselves they're just supposed to get the job 1.00

00:28:03.080 done your job is you know yeah it wasn't until willow literally has to go in her mind and say

00:28:10.060 snap out of it we need you not even allowing herself to feel those feelings because again

00:28:14.860 it's one of those like everything around me is is crumbling i'm going catatonic but instead of

00:28:21.020 saying we need to help her it's like get over yourself we have a fight we have a mission

00:28:27.260 that's the only time she's allowed to cry is when she wakes up and she just cries

00:28:32.220 and it's like is that really what we should be teaching her is this the message like i don't

00:28:39.180 don't know i just i don't know sometimes i don't know if buffy's teaching or reflecting what do

00:28:43.200 you think stew you had a i did i i think i've talked about that episode uh before at length

00:28:52.100 there is something about the resolution of that episode that i absolutely just hate

00:28:55.280 i hate the fact that she has snapped out of it because willow is like yo it's enough yeah like

00:29:03.420 mop it up sweep it up build a bridge and get over it because we need you out here and like i

00:29:08.720 i understand why she did it because dawn's not dead and she can still save her so like

00:29:13.700 this self um fulfilling prophecy that she is that dawn is this is over dawn is dead is something

00:29:21.220 that will become true if she doesn't step out of it and yeah tarot will die but it's one of those

00:29:28.360 things um that i again i i wish there was a little bit more of a nuanced conversation in that episode

00:29:35.740 mental health yeah like but again like in the time period it didn't happen and i think that

00:29:41.360 for what it was at the time it was it was a pretty profound episode looking back in 2022 eyes we're

00:29:47.420 like oh wow because at that time i mean mental health was pretty much looked at like get over it

00:29:55.900 yeah if you're tired if you're depressed like take something it's around that time like in the

00:30:02.380 like hey play kelly clarkson's get us stronger yeah but in the mid to late 90s you had prozac

00:30:08.460 it was like prozac nation everyone was on prozac everyone was on lithium because it was like the

00:30:12.540 drug of choice if you want to be happy if you want to be less anxious if you want to succeed

00:30:16.620 in your life because you feel overwhelmed take some prozac also yeah don't go to therapy that

00:30:20.780 means you're crazy and therapy is a terrible thing why would you go there for prozac that's it yeah

00:30:25.100 only crazy people go to therapy like yeah i don't know i'll tell you right now i mean in that era 0.98

00:30:30.300 so high school university era for me i don't know a single person not one in my family out of my

00:30:40.060 peer group not a single one that went to therapy and if they did go to therapy not one who spoke

00:30:47.820 about it i'll tell you right now i'm on i'm on session five and it is life-changing after when

00:30:53.860 we're done recording i'll tell you i'll tell you something you said to me when we're done recording

00:30:57.080 And I'm like, oh, it's unreal.

00:31:00.120 It is insane.

00:31:01.120 Everyone should go to therapy.

00:31:01.880 I mean, Tervis, people ask a lot of the times, like, what would the advice you give to your

00:31:06.640 former self or what would you advice you give to teens and yada, yada, yada.

00:31:10.020 And I always say therapy and people are struck by it.

00:31:12.860 They're like, why?

00:31:13.800 And I'm like, well, it's not for the reasons you think.

00:31:15.820 I honestly believe that therapy is a very structured way of figuring out who you are.

00:31:24.620 It's wild.

00:31:25.160 who you are not to fix whatever sure we all need stuff to fix it's not the point it's really not

00:31:31.640 the biggest point for me if you can at a younger age if you have to deal with trauma you deal with

00:31:37.400 trauma but but if you can just figure out chunks of you we never figure it all out but chunks of

00:31:44.500 you and you take the time to figure that out and i don't mean six months backpacking in europe

00:31:50.860 I mean, the time to figure that out, right? Life changing, life changing, because then

00:31:59.920 all of the relationships and the job choices and the parents and the, you know, friends and the

00:32:07.180 stress of it all hits differently. And the only reason you can say that, or I can say that now

00:32:12.440 is I'm 47 and instead of doing that then you have life experiences doing it for you and you wait

00:32:21.800 until the trauma hits to then go to the therapist and get back to the beginning speaking of the

00:32:28.340 beginning where you understand some of the roots of who you are but if I would have known it or if

00:32:33.780 I was conscious of it it would have been so much more powerful it's not to say you're going to

00:32:39.560 avoid all the crappiness of life. Of course you're not. But it is to say, you're going to face it

00:32:44.720 with some sort of solidity of who you are. And I don't think we give kids any of it.

00:32:51.340 No. None of it. Everybody talks about financial literacy as though this is going to cure the

00:32:57.340 world in high school. Screw it. What about a grade 10 course on mental health?

00:33:03.780 when they really need it what about a great and hire somebody with that specialty

00:33:10.680 yeah what about that imagine i understand everybody needs to learn to balance checkbook

00:33:16.700 for the love of god if i've heard that but but let's focus on the person because if the person

00:33:22.400 is that think about how much stronger they will be when they don't know the answer and they can

00:33:27.180 just reach out well imagine being 16 and like because they're like oh we have a guidance

00:33:33.040 counselor like that's not nobody goes to the guidance counselor for these kind of things

00:33:36.480 like imagine being 16 years old with all these changes with social media with with teen life

00:33:41.920 just rumors and nonsense and and body changing and stress and having someone for an hour a day just

00:33:49.280 talk to you about it it would be life-changing like literally it's wild what comes out when

00:33:54.240 someone just lets you talk for an hour and the right like the resolutions revelations you receive

00:34:00.640 just just by speaking and just having that chance it's wild but then shows like this with like 0.98

00:34:06.700 normal again where it's like no you're crazy like don't do that this is 2002 what are you nuts and 0.88

00:34:11.140 you're crazy like absolutely yeah it's also super important for people to realize that 0.93

00:34:16.900 the thoughts in their heads and where those thoughts take them maybe isn't 0.94

00:34:23.280 um maybe isn't as normal as they would have thought if they had kept to themselves like

00:34:31.800 not everybody's having these thoughts um and it's really really great to have that space to talk to

00:34:37.280 someone who can catch you in those patterns and be like hey let's stop here for a second and reflect

00:34:43.800 on what we're saying and i think if we're kind of like reflecting onto buffy i think a lot of

00:34:49.780 those conversations don't happen enough a lot of external things happen to all these characters

00:34:55.960 that cause them to do what they do but there's really not and i'm guessing if you're if you're

00:35:02.100 using this universe as a universe that continues to be between episodes you're have they're having

00:35:07.180 these conversations in those spaces that we don't see um because i can't imagine any of them would

00:35:13.280 be standing um with all the death and destruction that they have encountered and seen and and been

00:35:19.600 a part of and witnessed, but I think you see these conversations happen in shows nowadays

00:35:26.980 where it is a part of an episode or a part of a season where the character is so worn down,

00:35:33.760 so traumatized, so hollowed out from all of the experiences they encounter that they have

00:35:41.520 this conversation with a parent or a friend or something. And there really is more of that

00:35:48.300 inserted into our media and what we consume and I would very I would be interested I don't want

00:35:55.460 this I'm not saying please do this so please anyone listening to this who has this power

00:35:58.880 please do not take this as like me being like you should go ahead and reboot like reboot the show

00:36:03.920 don't do that the show is perfect as it is it's perfect for the moment in time that it came out

00:36:09.040 for and it is something that doesn't need to be touched rebooted redone but it would be interesting

00:36:15.720 if it was rebooted

00:36:18.240 if those conversations would be something

00:36:20.260 that were threaded through the show

00:36:21.560 so I would love to see

00:36:23.520 those conversations happen

00:36:25.160 well especially since if you think about it

00:36:27.640 at the end of season 7

00:36:29.080 Buffy is 22 years old

00:36:30.840 imagine at 22

00:36:33.660 having the weight of the world

00:36:35.500 like the show puts on her

00:36:37.500 on any of those characters

00:36:38.960 at 22

00:36:40.120 at 37 I'm only now going to therapy

00:36:43.280 how the hell

00:36:44.880 I can't imagine what I would have done at 22. You know what I mean? Like it's wild.

00:36:49.620 I think also that's kind of the underpinning of the show, right? Is this notion of the egocentrism

00:36:55.060 of, of teenagers and not in a bad way, just in a way where you're the center of the world and

00:37:02.060 what you're going through and all of your trauma and your trials and your heartbreak and your

00:37:07.020 fights and the weight that you feel, even though it's not significant weight, because we look back

00:37:13.200 and it's not significant, but I assure you, sitting in a room with a 16-year-old who's having

00:37:18.700 quite a visionary panic attack, because if they don't get 90 on the next exam, they don't get

00:37:26.000 into McGill. If they don't get into McGill, then their world is, they're going to die alone and

00:37:30.460 poor. It's not rational necessarily, but from where they stand, it is, because it's the only

00:37:38.720 weight they've ever carried. And having said that, there are a lot of very young kids who carry way

00:37:46.460 more, well, than I ever did, and way more than a lot of people did. And I think the brilliance of

00:37:55.960 the show is the sort of metaphoric comparison, all these external demons, all this external

00:38:03.600 fighting. All this, just like you said, is very much internal. The weight of the world. I'm the

00:38:09.180 center. I have to do this. If I don't do this, everything falls apart. Well, and I'll mention

00:38:15.780 something. I won't get too deep into it because it's a very personal conversation, but I was in

00:38:22.540 a session and my therapist was talking and he triggered a memory in my head, but it was about

00:38:28.800 faith and the the memory is of faith saying you can't take me no one can take me and you know

00:38:34.400 how when you're thinking of a certain scene in a movie or a show that's sort of how it reflects how

00:38:39.200 you're feeling in that moment yeah and he's like explain that to me and i i went down this wild

00:38:44.960 rabbit hole where i realized that i was using scenes from buffy very specific scenes to sort of

00:38:51.200 track um a trauma in my life and i was using faith as the like the catalyst to explain myself

00:38:58.620 and to hide behind and then it sort of the conclusion was that she wanted she wanted just

00:39:05.880 to be done and over and she was looking for excuses but because she didn't want to go through

00:39:09.940 the the trauma of dealing with her consequences and then rather than fighting alone you see her

00:39:16.400 standing up in chosen with buffy with the slayers with that music she's right behind her she's

00:39:21.740 she's made it and she's won and there was such a getting chills thinking about but

00:39:26.080 i didn't realize how much of buffy i was using as as a way to to kind of figure out my own trauma

00:39:34.220 until i went and and had those conversations um to the point where i actually found it yesterday

00:39:39.680 I found the, the, the signature where Alicia Dushku wrote, 0.99

00:39:44.580 you're a fucking warrior faith. 0.98

00:39:46.080 I found the picture yesterday and I'm like, 1.00

00:39:48.060 I got to get that tattooed at some point one of these days. But yeah,

00:39:52.440 it's just seriously, if anything, if you take anything from this series,

00:39:57.560 Buffy's amazing, go to therapy.

00:39:59.880 Buffy's amazing, go to therapy.

00:40:02.040 Stu, what were you going to say?

00:40:04.720 No, I wasn't going to say it. I was just, yeah.

00:40:07.460 I thought you had. What's interesting, and this is just more of a general reference, I think, on pop culture and a general reference on the things in which when we are going through those times, and a lot of that is teenagers to young adulthood, right?

00:40:26.080 When we go through those times, we are bound to the things that we connect to then. And the things we connect to then have this resonance, have this, you know, the touch, the smell, the music, like just exactly the same reason.

00:40:44.080 you can put a song on that you haven't heard and you can be there wherever there was grade eight

00:40:50.720 dance 1989 this is what happened this is how i felt in my gut i can feel that and for people to

00:40:57.760 disclude pop culture as like incredibly vital and incredibly important they're just discluding

00:41:05.920 the historical application and it and it can of a person's story right of a person's history of

00:41:12.320 of a person's biography, I think nothing will tap into that clearer, which is why as adults,

00:41:19.760 full-grown adults, why do you think Comic-Con is packed, filled with people paying hundreds

00:41:28.520 upon hundreds upon hundreds of dollars to do what? Reclaim a feeling they had with a show

00:41:36.700 at that time it has nothing to do with that show it has to do with that show was on at a certain

00:41:42.580 place in a certain time and connected to a certain emotion but i want that back yeah so what do we

00:41:48.960 do we listen to the music we go back you know stranger things we're doing a haunted house at

00:41:55.340 my school with based on stranger things and the kids love it because it's their jam right it's

00:42:00.000 their it's their age group but the reason why it became what it is is because every adult sat down

00:42:07.620 with their kids from the 1980s and went oh there's a cassette player oh look at that car my dad had

00:42:14.060 that car oh my god look at that carpet my in my house that was the car and we don't even consciously

00:42:19.640 say that it none of that is conscious maybe the cassette player it's all subliminal all of it's

00:42:25.640 subliminal and it ties us back and sometimes to good. And just like Stefan was saying,

00:42:30.920 sometimes it's not so good, but both, whether it's amazing or whether it's horrific,

00:42:38.740 that is the imprint. Small things don't imprint, big things imprint, right? For good or for bad.

00:42:47.780 And, and then the, the, I think the way to get in and the way they stay is through the things we

00:42:54.100 connect to you know and i think that's super important i think that's i think it's why so

00:42:59.080 i think it's why so many people are connected to disney films from the 90s and 80s and i feel

00:43:04.220 cartoons like my obsession with sailor moon is 100 that 100 that you know and say with buffy like

00:43:10.800 some things just resonate longer and and stronger you know because of where you were and and how you

00:43:17.420 felt and and having the chance to meet the people behind those characters even for a moment the

00:43:23.960 voice actor of the your favorite anime or the the villain of this tv show you loved like feeling

00:43:29.520 that connection with them because they were there with them in that moment there's nothing like it

00:43:33.640 there's nothing like it stew what do you think i agree i honestly think too that especially for

00:43:43.040 the the time period that came out and kind of the age of feminism this show was written in

00:43:48.320 I honestly believe that it's become a comfort, um, show and, and something that a lot of people use to, um, as a form of escapism from harshness, harsh reality of everyday life and allows them to truly kind of work through their own emotions and own traumas through the characters on the show.

00:44:12.540 there's always someone who's going to relate to a character more than another um but i think that

00:44:18.960 that's something that a lot of people discount as not a good form of therapy but i do think

00:44:29.720 that i do think that escapism within reason is is a healthy way of taking a step back from

00:44:40.360 the harshness of your life and kind of protecting you until a time that you can step back into it

00:44:48.160 everyone needs a brief reprieve and i think these shows i think buffy's a lot of for millennials

00:44:55.020 and like and younger uh gen x's but i think you can see a lot of um different television shows

00:45:04.040 and genres and fandoms that that people still to this day are as passionate about as a day when

00:45:12.440 it aired and i think that's something that that speaks to the the lasting power of a show like

00:45:18.040 this and the the kind of humanity and um and impact these characters had on people's lives

00:45:23.700 so i think that well while there are issues looking back on it where you can hope for more

00:45:32.480 or wish that things were different.

00:45:34.920 I think the show as it stands

00:45:36.440 and as passionate as the fans are even now

00:45:40.020 and how it continues to attract new viewers

00:45:42.100 is a true testament to the work of these writers,

00:45:48.140 directors, actors.

00:45:51.240 I have a question.

00:45:53.480 So shows like Star Trek in the 70s and 80s

00:45:57.760 and Buffy in the 90s,

00:45:59.600 there are certain shows that stand the test of time because they have such a devoted fan base

00:46:05.360 um when it comes to like the new generation who what what tv show do you think in 20 years is

00:46:11.880 going to be the show that's so funny i wanted to end all this by asking well two things that's a

00:46:17.500 great question so we can do that and then i also want to go to i want you guys to think about the

00:46:22.420 top three shows, not Buffy, the top three shows you would say are a must watch. But let's take

00:46:30.880 a guess at today. Right now, it has to be in current production right now. What do you think,

00:46:38.440 oh, this is going to be hard for me. What do you think right now is going to be, you know,

00:46:44.860 the Comic-Con in 20 years where people will line up around the block and pay thousands of dollars

00:46:50.740 to stand beside what do you it has to be in production right now so it couldn't have just

00:46:55.760 ended ended like last year okay um like right like current i think you can like there's short

00:47:08.040 like the problem is is that we tend to push toward miniseries um or like limited series these days

00:47:14.400 um i think you're gonna find a younger generation really getting behind lock and key and you can

00:47:21.280 kind of have that um you can see it in the lovers of the comic books and the lovers of the the

00:47:27.940 netflix series and kind of the ones that are caught between i think you can see it in um

00:47:34.200 the handmaid's tale which is a little bit more i think you can also yeah you can see it in like

00:47:40.620 i mean i can see the handmaid's tale only unfortunately the handmaid's tale is so

00:47:46.620 you think i gotta hope i can see the handmaid's tale but for a different reason i mean the

00:47:54.480 handmaid's tale has this very weird uh and coincidence horrific coincidence of producing

00:48:05.580 and existing at the same time as the political system started reflecting it, which is just

00:48:12.320 insane, predictive. The book was written in like 84. So all of a sudden, this is when we're going

00:48:20.700 to make it and all of it. I guess it's not all of a sudden, but you're right. I could see that

00:48:26.300 being powerful. What else, Steph? Do you think anything? I'm trying to think of one. I mean,

00:48:30.560 that's a good one. I think, I hope and I think Stranger Things will have that staying power

00:48:35.120 for sure especially since they were all so young when it started um i would hope this i i just

00:48:42.640 finished sandman and i thought it was so interesting and i really hope that that does

00:48:47.480 but again it's just one of those kind of new shows um right supernatural ended recently but

00:48:53.400 yeah i don't know um your top you can't you gotta that's one of your shows

00:48:59.340 those um julia's julia is like the fandom um they're wild yeah they're wild but julia's part

00:49:08.560 of that fandom and i think one of our rebel commentators um they're wild and i hear some

00:49:17.040 of the stories and some of the discourse online and kind of the the dusty old fan fiction that

00:49:21.560 goes out there and i just i'm absolutely floored by the lasting power but also that show is still

00:49:27.100 sort of on. They're producing the Winchesters

00:49:29.180 now, which is a prequel series.

00:49:32.260 It's still going

00:49:33.180 on.

00:49:33.940 What about The Walking Dead?

00:49:38.180 That

00:49:38.620 fandom is crazy. 0.99

00:49:40.620 They're insane. So is Game of Thrones.

00:49:43.140 Look, no one is saying a word

00:49:45.060 about Game of Thrones until the news thing came out

00:49:46.860 and it's not even comparable

00:49:48.480 to what Game of Thrones was at the time.

00:49:50.960 The second Game of Thrones ended, it's like it never

00:49:53.020 happened. And now this new one

00:49:54.960 is just like, it came out at the

00:49:56.920 exact same time as sandman at ring of power and just it is not having the impact that anyone

00:50:01.600 thought it would because it's coming out at the same two other huge powerhouses i'm gonna say it

00:50:06.900 because it's still in production and because i love it gray's anatomy oh my gosh yes i'm part

00:50:13.980 of the anatomy oh my god even though i'm gonna i have to pump the brakes in some of these seasons

00:50:22.520 but i i'm sorry i'm gonna imagine in 10 years you're gonna have meredith gray who's not lining

00:50:29.980 up for meredith gray yeah i'm i'm gonna argue at one point because i think this is something that

00:50:34.760 we all um we all say but like for a show to be on for 19 years and like and like i will say

00:50:43.000 that around season 12 i was getting very bored of the show but then they ended up reinventing

00:50:51.500 themselves once again and i think that you saw them reinvent themselves again this year

00:50:55.380 and the fact that ellen pompeo is only in eight episodes of a 22 episode season really because

00:51:02.720 she's going to do she's doing a limited tv series on hulu i'm really interested to see if this is a

00:51:09.800 test to see if the if the fandom can exist outside of meredith gray right um i think this is her

00:51:17.160 testing to see like if they have to a end the show or she could just leave the show because

00:51:23.860 shonda rhimes has always said the show will end when meredith leaves but it is a cash cow it is a

00:51:29.460 major force on abc so do i think that it should perhaps end i think that there there should be

00:51:39.820 an exit strategy if they want to do a um they want to do a spin-off like they do for station 19 and

00:51:46.440 for private practice 100% do it but I agree with you I think that fandom that encapsulating fandom

00:51:53.120 of private practice station 19 um I think Grey's Anatomy I think will live on for for quite a bit

00:51:59.920 in the pandemic we're crazy for it what about law and order I just had I'm gonna I'm gonna say this

00:52:06.000 right now and so in like five to ten years when when Shonda Rhimes wants to negotiate all this and

00:52:11.540 all of those actresses are a few years older uh can you imagine who would pay what kind of

00:52:19.120 dollar amount would you pay for like visiting could you imagine a a plane if like it like a

00:52:30.380 physical set of a plane that has crashed and you get to meet them all what would you pay for that

00:52:36.420 that would be pretty intense what would you pick if i could like go to storybrook and have like

00:52:42.480 snow white and charming standing there and be like take my first board i will have a child

00:52:46.440 just to give them to you in 10 years yeah all right i need your three shows i'm gonna go last

00:52:54.060 because i can i think i can pivot on this one because i have some solid random choices outside

00:52:59.760 of buffy and obviously we can't say anything that's currently on no like these are three

00:53:05.080 shows that are said and done what are your three shows you're like go watch it immediately buy the

00:53:13.220 dvds even if you don't buy them what are your three shows who wants to go first first oh yeah

00:53:19.280 i think go out and watch damages damage is one of my favorite shows glenn close nice glenn close

00:53:27.980 rose burn one of my favorite shows so fucking good um i would say graze anatomy i like listen 0.76

00:53:34.880 i'm a grace fan i'm not going to apologize for it i've apologized my entire life 0.91

00:53:38.360 literally literally this show is the last show in that was airing when i was in high school

00:53:48.140 i started watching the show when i was years old yeah um or just after i graduated high school

00:53:54.680 but um and i would say like buffy i'm not going to mention it because we're doing this episode

00:54:00.560 this this podcast i think everyone knows i love this fandom i think the show veronica mars oh you

00:54:07.200 stole one of mine all right except for the except for the hulu revival i haven't haven't figured

00:54:12.500 don't do it okay um she should have gone the fbi what a waste okay that should be season four go

00:54:19.340 ahead stuff okay uh i'm gonna completely see it i'm gonna completely see out of the whedonverse

00:54:23.940 so i'm not gonna include like dollhouse or or serenity or anything like that um will and grace

00:54:29.080 everyone needs to watch

00:54:30.540 I still quote that show to this day

00:54:33.560 it's my funny

00:54:34.460 it's the funniest show ever made

00:54:35.380 Golden Girls

00:54:39.100 nice

00:54:40.280 no that's a solid call

00:54:41.980 yeah like those two shows are my life

00:54:44.200 and it's a tie between

00:54:47.160 either Once Upon a Time

00:54:48.600 or Vampire Diaries

00:54:49.620 so I think

00:54:50.680 I can't believe you didn't lead

00:54:52.260 the amount you talk about

00:54:53.500 Once Upon a Time

00:54:54.320 how do you not lead to that

00:54:58.800 will and grace is literally my life but once upon a time is probably my favorite like what again a

00:55:04.880 show that gave me such like emotions like buffy yeah i'm gonna go with once upon a time yeah

00:55:11.300 listen i'm gonna give everybody a retro show so so because because you went back to golden girls

00:55:16.800 i think we should all have a retro i'm gonna go these are my okay i'll come to your retro show

00:55:21.700 hold on i already got my retro in my head and it's controversial but here we go here are my three

00:55:26.140 house yeah battlestar galactica yeah the new one just insane just amazing and i'm gonna go with

00:55:34.140 the gilmore girls nice i could never get into it i tried i really tried i love the gilmore girls

00:55:41.260 my retro stew what's your retro what murder oh yeah i loved murder she wrote murder she wrote

00:55:51.840 Can I just say out loud, and I want to say this, I ever told Stefan this, like, I have a bone to pick with Angela Lansbury, even though, like, God rest her soul, I love her to death, but, like, literally the reason I became a writer was because of Jessica Fletcher, I used to watch that show with my grandmother, I literally assumed that writing a book required sitting at your kitchen table and writing an entire book in a week.

00:56:13.360 It does.

00:56:14.300 I was a prolific writer, what a lie.

00:56:17.100 That's how I do it, Stu, and you've seen how good that turns out.

00:56:20.120 what like what a lie i learned when i became a writer and realized that writing anything required

00:56:26.440 having an emotional breakdown and being taken to the brink of insanity and have everything felt

00:56:32.600 like written by rum like there you go i like that's it well if never once you crack the drink

00:56:39.080 if golden girls in my retro then i'm gonna say uh vampire diaries is my third then then you

00:56:44.120 And you got Vampire Diaries.

00:56:45.440 I'm going to go retro.

00:56:46.540 I'm going to go Roseanne.

00:56:48.520 Oh, fun.

00:56:49.780 That was a fun show. 0.99

00:56:50.600 I love Roseanne.

00:56:51.720 I love John Goodman.

00:56:53.240 Nobody wants that.

00:56:54.680 Did you watch the Conners?

00:56:55.600 I'm going to go Roseanne for the fact that it was A, so funny, but B, so reflective of a culture and a time and a group of people that nobody ever spoke about.

00:57:10.880 I'm going to give you an honorable mentoring

00:57:13.020 because I have one more in my head.

00:57:14.180 Stu, honorable mention.

00:57:16.820 Honorable mention.

00:57:18.780 Honorable mention.

00:57:21.360 West Wing.

00:57:22.600 Nice.

00:57:23.540 Steph?

00:57:24.200 I used to watch it with my dad.

00:57:25.640 It's amazing.

00:57:27.160 Frasier.

00:57:29.000 Nice.

00:57:29.620 I'm going to go United States of Tara. 1.00

00:57:32.300 Oh, shit. 0.99

00:57:33.300 I love that one. 0.99

00:57:34.540 Awesome.

00:57:35.040 I never thought I should have.

00:57:37.720 And I have one more.

00:57:39.080 It's like I have too much of a list.

00:57:40.880 I do have one more.

00:57:41.900 I have to mention while we're all sitting here,

00:57:43.940 it has to be Saving Grace.

00:57:47.520 I've heard of Saving Grace.

00:57:49.720 You've never seen it? 1.00

00:57:51.000 Holly Hunter in that show. 0.70

00:57:52.200 And again, United States of Tar only went three seasons.

00:57:55.520 Saving Grace only went three seasons.

00:57:57.140 Veronica Mars, three seasons.

00:57:58.700 In my opinion, these are shows that were ahead of the curve.

00:58:03.380 Had they come out five or six years later,

00:58:06.060 can you imagine United States of Tar now?

00:58:07.880 Had they come out five or six years later,

00:58:10.020 they would have had a run

00:58:11.800 but people I don't think got

00:58:14.420 the genius

00:58:15.380 and the reflection of it

00:58:18.380 it was just like it was a little too

00:58:20.260 a little too far ahead

00:58:22.340 do you have one more?

00:58:23.960 see my attention span only goes so far

00:58:26.380 so I just want something funny and walk away 0.99

00:58:28.160 so the nanny 0.99

00:58:29.720 the nanny was amazing

00:58:31.060 oh yeah shout out to Fran

00:58:34.100 what's your last

00:58:34.700 you get the last say Stu

00:58:37.240 this is it right here

00:58:40.020 as he sits pensively

00:58:42.260 I think I really really enjoyed

00:58:44.600 um

00:58:46.000 I really enjoyed

00:58:50.640 ER I just finished it again

00:58:52.680 you've just been watching it again

00:58:53.860 I really did and I think it handled a lot of

00:58:56.580 really good topics

00:58:57.580 oh no wait

00:59:00.220 it's a tie

00:59:01.540 ER Law and Order

00:59:03.880 like original Law and Order 1992

00:59:06.000 Law and Order was amazing

00:59:07.420 everyone knows me love that show

00:59:09.760 They could have a Law & Order Comic Con

00:59:11.640 Just a con for Law & Order

00:59:13.680 You could do Comic Cons for each one of these shows

00:59:16.480 And do great

00:59:17.120 I will follow Chris Maloney into the ocean

00:59:20.460 If he gave me a reason 1.00

00:59:22.720 I will just use his ass as an inflatable device 1.00

00:59:24.900 So lovely 1.00

00:59:26.820 Alright guys

00:59:28.800 Thank you guys so much

00:59:30.780 For going on this epic

00:59:32.100 And I do mean epic

00:59:33.760 Let's say Quest

00:59:35.940 Of Buffy the Vampire Slayer

00:59:37.840 I would love for you guys to say

00:59:40.700 one last time where can

00:59:42.480 everybody find you

00:59:44.120 after this 14 episode arc

00:59:46.720 Stefan

00:59:48.620 sure you can find me at

00:59:50.260 SJ Maroney on Instagram and to

00:59:52.460 follow me and our rebel crew

00:59:54.360 it's rebelwithoutacloset at

00:59:56.300 RWACPOD

00:59:57.700 we review queer and queer adjacent media 1.00

01:00:00.340 Joanna's out there all the time she's phenomenal 1.00

01:00:02.700 we just did our best friend's exorcism

01:00:04.760 and it was so fun

01:00:05.680 that's where you can find me

01:00:07.840 fantastic stew what about you you can find me on tiktok and instagram at jennican j-n-i-k-o-n

01:00:15.600 underscore um and go and like my latest picture of joe in her radiance such a good picture

01:00:22.160 listen radiance i'm telling you guys right now i i number one stew is an amazing writer

01:00:30.740 number two how you can take guys it's like he takes pictures what what's that famous lady that

01:00:39.840 takes pictures of everybody you know everybody's like if you're famous you go get her picture taken

01:00:45.060 oh annie lebowitz thank you much he is annie lebowitz with the oh my god

01:00:51.340 iPhone. I'm telling you right now. I'm telling you right now, go follow him on Instagram.

01:00:59.980 Thank you guys so much. And thank all of my listeners and viewers for spending the last 14

01:01:05.760 episodes with us reviewing Buffy the Vampire Slayer. Next week, we'll jump into something new,

01:01:11.260 political, censorship, getting canceled, a little economics, who the heck knows,

01:01:15.940 but we will see you next Tuesday. Same bat time, same bat station.

01:01:21.340 Dismissed. 1.00

Unlearn16: Class is in Session - October 25, 2022

The One Where You Make A Choice...Are You Ready to Be Strong？ Buffy Season 7 Finale

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