A Bit Fruity with Matt Bernstein - March 06, 2026


We All Deserve Better Than Gavin Newsom (with Emma Vigeland and Kat Blaque)

Topics
The Epidemic of Celebrity Cowardice (with Gianmarco Soresi and Caroline Kwan) What I Learned From 12 Hours of DOGE Bro Depositions (with Krystal Ball)

Episode Stats


Length

1 hour and 41 minutes

Words per minute

172.41

Word count

17,470

Sentence count

698

Harmful content

Misogyny

7

sentences flagged

Toxicity

78

sentences flagged

Hate speech

78

sentences flagged


Transcript

Transcript generated with Whisper (turbo).
Misogyny classifications generated with MilaNLProc/bert-base-uncased-ear-misogyny .
Toxicity classifications generated with s-nlp/roberta_toxicity_classifier .
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
Topics generated with Qwen2.5-3B-Instruct.
00:00:00.000 Did you guys see this morning that Gavin Newsom called Israel an apartheid state? 0.97
00:00:04.680 Oh, okay.
00:00:05.980 I guess he got some poll numbers back in.
00:00:08.180 I can appreciate when a worm wriggles towards the light.
00:00:12.120 I think you can appreciate it while also saying that that's not leadership.
00:00:21.540 Hello, hello, and welcome back to A Bit Fruity.
00:00:25.180 I'm Matt Bernstein, and I got into some trouble on Twitter last week.
00:00:30.520 And I need to tell you about it, because this was a little rough.
00:00:33.900 So this all started when Gavin Newsom, the Democratic governor of California,
00:00:38.500 who's pretty openly preparing his run to be the Democratic nominee for president in 2028,
00:00:44.400 did an interview on CNN where he said that, quote,
00:00:47.820 the Democratic Party needs to be more culturally normal.
00:00:51.260 No doubt that the Democratic Party needs to be, dare I say, more culturally normal.
00:00:57.020 And to stop spending what he thinks is a quote,
00:01:00.240 Disproportionate amount of time on pronouns.
00:01:06.200 Culturally normal.
00:01:08.200 Culturally normal.
00:01:09.960 These words have been rattling around in my brain lately.
00:01:13.240 I'm someone who is visibly outside of the cultural norm in America.
00:01:17.280 You know, right-wingers online will often just post pictures of me with no added context
00:01:22.620 because to them, my culturally abnormal appearance is an insult in and of itself.
00:01:28.180 So when I hear the potential supposedly left-wing option for president
00:01:33.240 calling for a return to cultural normalcy,
00:01:36.400 I anxiously want to know what he means by that.
00:01:40.200 Anyway, I tweeted sarcastically,
00:01:42.180 We abandoned LGBT people in the 2024 election and lost. 1.00
00:01:47.220 Here's why we need to do it again. 1.00
00:01:49.460 And then I jokingly added that this could have been an article written by Ezra Klein.
00:01:54.700 I'm a snark.
00:01:55.660 Sorry, the Ezra Klein lashings don't grow on trees.
00:01:58.220 The reaction, not from right-wingers, but from liberals, was genuinely shocking to me.
00:02:05.020 Hutch, a liberal YouTuber, accused me of being a Russian operative.
00:02:09.620 Many liberals on a popular Reddit thread that someone sent to me also called me a Russian op.
00:02:14.760 And deep in the replies of that thread on Reddit, one listener of this show stood up for me.
00:02:21.060 Sonny790 wrote,
00:02:22.960 Literally so bizarre to see people calling Matt B an effing Russian bot in this thread as a regular watcher, lol.
00:02:30.960 Sonny790, if you're listening to this, wherever you are, thank you.
00:02:36.100 Josh Sorbet, a spokesperson for Senate Judiciary Democrats, said that my tweet was, quote,
00:02:41.800 one of the dumbest things he's read this week and attached a statistic showing that LGBTQ people 0.68
00:02:47.900 did mostly vote for Kamala Harris in 2024, which is nice. But that's not really responding to what 0.94
00:02:56.260 I was saying about her campaign, abandoning trans people. We'll get to that. Many people
00:03:00.980 pointed out to me that, did I know Gavin Newsom supported gay marriage in 2004 before it was cool?
00:03:06.620 it was a long day but we are so back today i want to talk about gavin newsom clearly he's someone
00:03:14.060 we're gonna have to deal with for a little while whether we like it or not i want to do something
00:03:18.140 i probably need a xanax for which is talk about democrats and elections and assess the state of
00:03:25.420 our democracy if two and a half years before the next election it makes me a russian op to criticize
00:03:33.140 an apparently preordained establishment Democrat who isn't even running yet.
00:03:38.640 To do that with me, I am so excited to be joined by two friends of the show.
00:03:44.520 First of all, Emma Vigeland of The Majority Report. Welcome back.
00:03:48.280 Thank you so much. It's always a pleasure to be with you, my friend.
00:03:51.540 And Kat Black, veteran YouTuber. Welcome back to the show.
00:03:56.740 Thank you for having me. I'm hella happy to be here.
00:03:59.920 Kat, I'm so excited that you're here because I adore you, but also because I know, based on what happened to me on Twitter last week, that if I didn't get a Californian on this episode, people were going to be like, oh, but you're not in California. You don't know how great Gavin Newsom has actually been.
00:04:15.860 Yeah, I don't know very many people who like him personally, but maybe that's my circle, you know.
00:04:20.660 I mean, is he even really running California right now? It seems like he's mostly focused
00:04:26.640 on podcasting, which, hey, that's our bread and butter.
00:04:31.180 Yep. But we also don't have states to run, in fairness.
00:04:34.180 Right, right.
00:04:35.160 I am so excited for the three of us to be here together, because despite occupying
00:04:39.480 pretty different spaces online, kind of, I know there's going to be a specific portion
00:04:44.480 of listeners of this episode who are like, wow, I'm a mad cat. But I know one thing that
00:04:50.140 all three of us have in common is that we have been shitted on for criticizing this man. So I 0.56
00:04:57.280 want each of you to just give me your high level overview of how you're feeling on this topic.
00:05:01.280 We're kind of seeing right now this effort to manufacture consent for Gavin Newsom being the
00:05:08.100 best option possible for the Democratic Party right now. And he is engaging in much of the
00:05:15.460 same playbook that was part of what the losing kamala harris campaign engaged in which is a
00:05:22.360 move to the center to the right throwing certain marginalized people under the bus and not
00:05:29.360 addressing fundamental questions of class and incoming wealth inequality which are the very
00:05:35.500 factors that have led us to this moment of fascism yeah i mean to me gavin newsom is like
00:05:41.300 obviously not a good choice and i and i feel a little crazy honestly because i've been talking
00:05:46.360 about stuff like this for so long and to me gavin newsom like you know the glamour photo shoot that
00:05:52.760 he does like tearing down homeless encampments like the way that he's speaking about the trans
00:05:58.760 community to me personally it obviously makes him a bad choice not wanting to tax billionaires like
00:06:06.180 I don't understand why people are trying to make us choose him right now as the candidate, because I think he would be the most obviously losing candidate. But maybe that's my bubble.
00:06:19.040 I don't think it's your bubble. I think that it's one of the many tactics that we've seen as we're seeing an upswell of Democrats who vote in primaries, holding these candidates accountable for corporate money that they're taking, for Zionist money that they're taking, for crypto money that they're taking, for enabling Donald Trump.
00:06:39.740 We have seen a very well financed effort. And it's funny you mentioned Ezra Klein earlier, Matt, it's the abundance movement, which is this very top down effort to make sure that the conversation around what is possible under a Democratic administration is extremely limited in scope and is largely about cutting regulations and red tape for more private housing.
00:07:05.060 I mean, that's what they say their grand vision is. And it's funded by Reid Hoffman and other big donors in the Democratic Party. They're trying to make this a thing by advertising it as such. And I would say Gavin Newsom and the effort to elevate him preemptively and lock him in as the 2028 nominee is another example of top down efforts by Democrats to create a reality on the ground that is not actually organically occurring.
00:07:31.700 And I wish they would listen. I really do.
00:07:34.520 I want to start off that CNN clip, and I want to get into what he's trying to say there. So let's watch it.
00:07:40.860 No doubt that the Democratic Party needs to be, dare I say, more culturally normal. I believe that.
00:07:48.340 Less prone to spending a disproportionate amount of time on pronouns, identity, politics.
00:07:55.520 more focused on tabletop issues things that really matter the stacking of stress
00:08:00.140 in terms of electricity bills and child care costs and health care and obviously housing costs
00:08:04.620 there's a lot to discuss here and this is not nearly the point of anything but tabletop issues
00:08:12.360 oh my gosh tabletop issues what are we talking about their kitchen table issues it's this
00:08:20.280 tabletop issues he's thinking about my i need in my second home my marble countertop
00:08:29.220 my marble tabletop renovate tabletop tabletop tabletop oh right i'm supposed to be appealing
00:08:35.320 to people on like a broad affordability issues and i if you want me to just go off i'll just
00:08:40.980 go off here matt that is very much what the medium of podcasting is for okay so tabletop
00:08:48.880 issues aside, when he talks about being culturally normal and speaking about pronouns, he is calling
00:08:57.160 queer people, calling non-binary people, calling trans people not culturally normal. Now, he would 0.93
00:09:03.080 try to split that difference and say, look, I was an early supporter of marriage equality in
00:09:08.760 California. That's what he hangs his hat on. We know that trans people's rights and gay people's
00:09:15.580 rights are indelibly linked when they come for trans people. It's a matter of time before they 0.97
00:09:20.700 come for gay people more broadly. So that is a distinction that he should not be able to get
00:09:26.160 away with. But what is so frustrating is seeing how Zoran Mamdani's message of affordability is
00:09:35.360 being co-opted by Democrats who have no interest in addressing it outside of saying the word
00:09:41.700 affordability. Now, Bernie Sanders in 2016 was speaking about class and billionaires. And the
00:09:48.500 Democratic Party at the time called him a sexist and a misogynist and said that it was a real
00:09:54.720 problem that he went on the Joe Rogan podcast and all that came with it. Now we have to appeal to
00:10:01.520 young men. But within the context of affordability, Newsom isn't offering anything. In fact, he
00:10:07.320 opposes the billionaire tax. So there's now this like belated understanding that, yeah, it turns
00:10:13.540 out people wanted the Democrats not to just talk about certain cultural issues to avoid the issue
00:10:18.840 of class. Oh, we have to be talking about the economy or not class, but affordability as Zoran
00:10:24.200 Mamdani did. But without any proposal, without any of the policy that would address affordability
00:10:30.660 so that he thinks you can just say the word and that is sufficient while throwing trans people
00:10:37.760 under the bus. Theories about like political change involve building the broadest coalition
00:10:44.020 possible. And the easiest way to do that is to say we're the 99% versus the 1% and we're going
00:10:50.880 to tax billionaires to make your life better. But for Democrats that are involved in a very
00:10:56.600 lucrative part of the party embedded in a consultant class with a lot of big money donors,
00:11:01.880 they are tasked with avoiding that very conversation. And what that results in is saying
00:11:07.400 this marginalized group has to go, Palestinians, Arab Americans have to go, perhaps the Black Lives
00:11:13.320 Matter movement was too divisive, trans people, what have you. And we are done with that because
00:11:19.060 fundamentally, billionaires and the power that they've accrued financially have become a threat
00:11:23.700 to democracy and enablers of fascism. So it's not just fairness and equality and getting the
00:11:29.280 economy to work for people. It's also an existential threat right now to the very
00:11:33.720 nature of life in America. Yeah, it's, you know, we got to spend less time talking about trans 0.93
00:11:40.120 people. We need to sideline trans issues for tabletop issues like wealth inequality and also 0.95
00:11:47.840 not do anything about that. Like, what are you offering? Anyway, Kat, your turn. 0.97
00:11:52.440 I mean, so here's the thing. It's a distraction. And unfortunately, what they're banking on is that enough people will be ignorant about trans people that they will vote for them out of fear. Right. And frankly, this is something that I have navigated around my entire life. Right.
00:12:11.120 um this is something that is a big reason why i'm a full-time youtuber do you know why
00:12:16.580 because back before um there were legal protections for trans people against discrimination
00:12:23.660 it was one of the only things i could do right i've been a youtuber since you know 2005 trans
00:12:29.620 people are offered are being offered up right now as a scapegoat and unfortunately i think
00:12:35.080 if for some people it's going to work all they have to do is talk about um you know trans people
00:12:40.320 being in sports with, with, you know, with women and things. And it's like, that's a
00:12:45.240 incredibly small group of people, but there's a lot of people who are propagandized against
00:12:51.060 trans people. And these Democrats are really, they're banking on those people. And you see,
00:12:56.800 this is a great demonstration of like the problem with liberals. I mean, it's one of the many,
00:13:01.080 he is entertaining the right wing premise of this issue. Pronouns. Look, I'm in a lot of like
00:13:07.420 legitimate spaces where weirdos exist. Pronouns aren't even a big deal there, right?
00:13:12.900 No one is like hyper fixating on pronouns. But really what's happening is people are assessing
00:13:21.140 that the civil rights protections that have existed for trans people only very recently
00:13:26.320 may go away. And so there are some of us who are trying to fight to protect those things, right?
00:13:31.660 But people are treating that fight as like this unnecessary thing where from where I'm sitting, historically, when we've seen stuff like this happen where, you know, stigmas created against a group of people and then their rights are starting to see a way.
00:13:47.020 It's a clear path line to genocide and people need to recognize that they're not going to stop with trans people.
00:13:54.440 They're going to justify the premise of it using trans people because everyone can agree that, you know, the trannies are weird or whatever. 1.00
00:14:00.960 Right. 1.00
00:14:01.660 But they're not going to stop there. And that's kind of why I am so frustrated with people embracing Gavin Newsom and saying that we need to vote for him and then yelling at me for not wanting to.
00:14:13.480 Because when I hear Gavin Newsom say that, what I'm hearing is that when it is time for them to decide whether or not they're going to go through with their plans, there are a lot of Republicans right now talking about how they do want to genocide trans people. 0.59
00:14:30.280 how you know certain mass shootings are evidence for why trans people should be rounded up put in
00:14:36.500 asylums and roundly exterminated right it's a a real serious thing i've been trying to talk about
00:14:42.820 it for a really long time before we got on the show i was talking about how i've been disconnecting
00:14:48.000 a little bit and enjoying you know my creative side and a lot of that has to do with the fact
00:14:54.120 that I kind of feel a little bit like they may be successful. And I need to kind of enjoy what I
00:15:00.780 have and disconnect and stop fighting as much as I historically have. So I get what people say when
00:15:06.840 they say, you know, harm reduction and yada, yada, yada. But we've actually had plenty of examples of
00:15:11.960 this now. Has the harm been really reduced? I'm not entirely sure. You know, so sorry, that was
00:15:19.640 my reaction. No, it's entirely valid. And we will get into this, I'm sure. But I also am deeply,
00:15:28.740 deeply skeptical about the electoral benefits of throwing trans people under the bus, even when
00:15:34.120 the issue polls in a certain way. You can't take polling in a vacuum. Certain people vote on
00:15:40.380 certain issues and are motivated to go out to vote based on issues of whether it's the economy
00:15:45.200 or immigration, but trans issues, even if it polls negatively in terms of people's rights,
00:15:50.380 it's not really motivating independents or anybody except an anti-trans bigot to go out and vote.
00:15:57.020 This is something I've been thinking about a lot because whenever you say like,
00:16:00.680 I'm not going to vote for someone who throws trans people under the bus. And that's just 0.99
00:16:03.440 one group of people, by the way. We're going to talk about Gavin Newsom's record on LGBTQ rights.
00:16:07.300 We're also going to talk about his position on Israel, which is dizzyingly untethered,
00:16:13.040 shall we say. But people will say, oh, well, you're purity testing. Yeah, it sucks because
00:16:18.500 you can't get a politician who says everything you want, but this is what we have to do to win.
00:16:24.940 First of all, is it? These are the Democrats that the DNC has run for the presidential nominee for
00:16:30.420 the past several elections. This was Kamala, this was Biden, this was Hillary. I find it morally
00:16:36.280 unethical, but I also find it strategically stupid. Who is this voter in 2028 that you're 0.99
00:16:43.320 trying to win over who isn't already voting for Trump and whose holdout on voting Democrat is
00:16:48.620 the 10 trans athletes? Like, is that a significant voting block that like Ezra Klein would like for
00:16:55.140 us to believe that this is like who we have to cater elections to? So this is a voter that really
00:17:01.480 does not exist. But you have had, since 2016, Chuck Schumer and the Democratic Party have
00:17:08.460 reoriented their strategy to try to appeal to this voter. You can look this up. I repeat this
00:17:16.300 all the time. But Chuck Schumer was quoted in 2016 saying, for every blue collar worker that
00:17:22.840 we lose in rural XYZ area, we're going to gain two in the suburbs of Philadelphia. And this was
00:17:30.740 about pursuing affluent suburbanites who may have voted Republican in the past and are very likely
00:17:38.560 voters, but not necessarily the working class base that Democrats had traditionally kind of had the
00:17:45.120 corner on in past election cycles. And this is because they wanted to micro target specific
00:17:51.200 voters. And this is motivated by donors in swing states and not do this like broad based coalition
00:17:57.680 of people coming together, volunteers, motivated to tax billionaires, but this specific pet
00:18:04.880 constituency that has narrowed the Democratic coalition to such a degree that they keep losing
00:18:10.240 elections. This fixation on trans people is also a part of that. It's about this small sliver of
00:18:17.800 voters who they hope can turn out for Democrats, but don't really threaten the power structures
00:18:23.700 here and also keep getting consultants rich because you can micro-target them with ads as
00:18:27.860 opposed to having a volunteer base of door knockers and things like that, the more Bernie-style
00:18:33.160 grassroots politics. So this is about going for that specific voter base, but it's shown that it
00:18:40.500 has caused electoral failures for the Democrats more broadly across the country because their
00:18:46.020 message is so narrow and so muddled that it has no broad efficacy and doesn't turn out voters.
00:18:52.180 So you look at trans issues. Yes, you'll see that, say, a majority of voters in this poll don't think that trans women should participate in sports. But the question is, do people go out and vote in mass on that issue?
00:19:06.080 And the answer is no. In the same way that gun control polls extremely well for the Democrats, I mean, something like universal background checks is a 90 percent issue. Well, if polling was all that determined how Democrats should run their campaigns, then that should be the top line on every single Democratic Party platform.
00:19:25.160 Why is it not? Because it's not a motivating issue, even if it polls in their favor. The people that are motivated to vote on gun control are the crazies that want no regulations, and they're the ones that are already voting Republican. And you can see that related to the trans issue as well and how Democrats have approached it.
00:19:44.220 Now, you'll get pushback from Democratic Party consultants, because when you look at the testing for the ads in 2024, the one that was most effective in focus groups was the Kamala is for they them ad burned into the back of my brain.
00:20:01.660 A year later in Virginia, they tried this exact same playbook because they took that same data and said, well, transphobia was so electorally beneficial for us.
00:20:10.980 Why don't we run on this in Virginia? Why don't we triple, quadruple down?
00:20:14.800 And the Republican in that race lost to Abigail Spanberger when she ran just on transphobia, this Republican, by historic margins.
00:20:22.740 It is incredibly unstrategic. And like, I think this is amoral. But even if you are, you know, I see online a lot of cisgender gay people who think that the right wing attack on trans people won't reach their doorstep.
00:20:36.120 Ken Paxton is making a very threatening run right now for Texas Senate.
00:20:43.200 Ken Paxton very openly wants to bring back sodomy laws that make consensual gay sex illegal laws that were struck down in 2003.
00:20:52.680 There is, and I want everyone to Google this right now, there is an extraordinarily well-funded, up-and-coming anti-gay marriage movement called Greater Than.
00:21:04.180 I don't know if you guys have seen this.
00:21:05.640 I cannot believe that the mainstream right-wing voices, including Lila Rose, the anti-abortion activist who is good friends with Gwen Stefani, is one of the faces of this movement. 0.52
00:21:18.200 It's saying children's needs are greater than your desire to get gay married. 0.65
00:21:22.800 And their whole thing is like gay parents can't provide a stable future for children, etc., etc. 0.83
00:21:27.320 It's all of the old arguments from 10, 20, 30 years ago. 0.82
00:21:30.540 But they are absolutely coming for gay marriage. 0.98
00:21:33.000 And so I just think that when you continue to run these candidates who are willing to concede inch by inch by inch, and they don't even fucking win. 0.97
00:21:41.740 Well, now we have fascists who have made it so all of, you know, all of these other people are on the chopping block, just in case you don't even care about trans people. 0.98
00:21:48.280 And that's what drives me crazy. 0.55
00:21:51.460 Is it okay when I go on a rant?
00:21:53.980 I don't know.
00:21:54.820 You're the host.
00:21:55.780 It's your divine right.
00:21:57.440 You can do whatever you want.
00:21:58.960 I want to talk about my tweet that I made for a second, which people got very bad at me for,
00:22:04.740 where I mocked Gavin Newsom's saying we should be culturally normal. And I referenced how Kamala
00:22:10.880 Harris's campaign also abandoned trans people. And look how that turned out. Now, many people
00:22:16.760 took issue with my saying this. You listening right now might think Kamala Harris didn't abandon
00:22:23.820 trans people. And, you know, there seems to be discrepancies in our collective memory about
00:22:30.580 what Kamala Harris did and didn't say about LGBTQ rights in her 2024 campaign. Do you guys remember
00:22:38.720 specifically what Kamala said about trans rights in her campaign? That she'll go by whatever the
00:22:44.320 state says. I was going to go with nothing. So yeah, not nothing. Kat's basically dead on. She
00:22:50.660 said, with regard to trans rights, in a clip that I will play for you in a moment, I would follow
00:22:55.900 the law. But it's actually worse than that. Let me explain. So in Kamala Harris's short-lived run 0.97
00:23:01.880 for president in 2020, she did actively support trans rights. She spoke about ensuring trans
00:23:08.320 healthcare was available to incarcerated people. She talked about banning the gay and trans panic
00:23:14.140 defenses she talked about the need to tackle violence against trans women of color specifically
00:23:20.980 now during her 2024 campaign where the polling on trans issues had apparently shifted she
00:23:29.560 explicitly discussed trans people in that entire campaign one time when fox news host brett bayer
00:23:36.580 asked her if she still supported incarcerated people's access to gender affirming care to which
00:23:42.780 she said this. So are you still in support of using taxpayer dollars to help prison inmates
00:23:48.580 or detained illegal aliens to transition to another gender? I will follow the law. 0.99
00:23:54.300 And it's a law that Donald Trump actually followed. You're probably familiar with now
00:23:59.820 it's a public report that under Donald Trump's administration, these surgeries were available to
00:24:07.380 on a medical necessity basis to people in the federal prison system.
00:24:13.460 And I think, frankly, that ad from the Trump campaign
00:24:16.400 is a little bit of like throwing stones when you're living in a glass house.
00:24:20.360 The Trump aides say that he never advocated for that prison policy
00:24:23.520 and no gender transition surgeries happened during his presidency.
00:24:25.880 Well, you know what, you've got to take responsibility for what happened in your administration.
00:24:28.680 Yeah, no surgeries happened in his presidency.
00:24:30.560 It's in black and white.
00:24:31.680 Would you still advocate for using taxpayer dollars for gender reassignment surgeries?
00:24:35.760 follow the law just as i think so trump would say he did so not only taking basically no stance
00:24:43.140 i'll follow the law you would be the president but also saying she's almost being like actually
00:24:48.520 trump was the trans friendly one i'm not trans i'm not trans friendly i'm not promising gender
00:24:53.040 affirming care that was trump blame him this was also the strategy on immigration yes when they
00:24:59.120 felt that they had some sort of disadvantage when looking at the polling, as opposed to
00:25:05.860 understanding that you can affect polling by using the bully pulpit. I mean, Trump has done that with
00:25:10.260 immigration over and over again. He transformed the immigration debate almost single-handedly,
00:25:15.080 fascistically in this country, since coming down that escalator and speaking about how 0.94
00:25:19.360 Mexicans are rapists and criminals, and some are, I assume, good people. From that point on, 0.99
00:25:25.300 the Republican immigration debate was indelibly changed. The Democrats like Kamala Harris and
00:25:31.340 the consultants that ran that campaign look at issues like that and they sprint away from it
00:25:36.280 and they try to outflank the Republican from the right. But if somebody is motivated by the issue
00:25:42.100 of immigration, if somebody is purely motivated by the issue of transphobia, they are already
00:25:47.140 voting Republican. You are not gaining any votes by acting like the diet version of that. And it
00:25:55.280 also creates a credibility problem for you, because it makes it seem like you're obviously
00:25:59.920 lying when you're trying to say that Trump is the real person giving away your taxpayer dollars to
00:26:05.680 trans people. No one's believing that. That's why that question is being asked of you. It's because
00:26:10.280 they think it's a liability for you. And so what a left-wing candidate, as opposed to a liberal
00:26:16.120 candidate like Kamala Harris, would say, would be, say Zoran Mamdani was in that position. He would
00:26:22.220 say, I believe in a single payer universal healthcare system that cuts out the rapacious
00:26:27.960 middlemen of insurance companies that are constantly gouging you. And healthcare should
00:26:33.320 be a right for everybody. And that includes you and your family. Are your healthcare costs too
00:26:38.920 high? Well, I want to change that with Medicare for all. But that also is going to include people
00:26:43.640 who are in prison, because trans care is healthcare, and they have a right to healthcare
00:26:47.880 But you know what you have? You have a right to not go bankrupt for cancer treatment, or you have a right to not have to pay X, Y, and Z for your prescription drugs. And that's why I'm going to change that. Do you see how that immediately neutralizes that argument? But she's incapable of making that case because this is a consultant focused campaign focused on appealing to suburban Republicans, the most narrow, narrow part of the electorate possible. And it's damaged the Democratic Party, perhaps indelibly.
00:27:16.420 Amen to that. I think a lot of people have to understand that health care for trans people, it is our life or death. And I think a lot of times when people put trans people in these scenarios, they are kind of aware of that.
00:27:30.600 There is this thing that happens within prisons where trans women are housed with male inmates and sort of presented as like a way to calm down violent offenders. It's called V coding, right?
00:27:43.160 Trans women who are imprisoned experience a lot of abuse, a lot of assault. And people are really
00:27:51.080 just trying to have these conversations to create even more stigma against trans people who need
00:27:57.100 access to care. Trans folks from the people that I've known in my life who do medically transition
00:28:02.240 often have to undergo immense debt just to gain access to the care that they need to keep
00:28:08.260 themselves alive. That's a problem. That's a problem, not just for trans people, but for a
00:28:13.580 lot of us. I was very disappointed by what she said in that interview. And I know that, you know,
00:28:19.900 right now, Kansas just closed down one of the only places where trans people in Kansas could
00:28:26.720 get care. That may not seem like something that matters to people, but for a lot of trans people
00:28:33.860 in Kansas that on top of the shit that just happened with their ID that is going to be their 0.96
00:28:38.600 life or death and and this is a strategy that Kamala did that is being replicated by Gavin Newsom 0.98
00:28:45.900 but you know what like Emma like you gave that perfect rhetorical answer of like okay well here's
00:28:52.920 what you could say and always bring it back to affordability without selling anybody down the
00:28:56.800 river which is exactly what Zoran Mamdani did but Gavin Newsom can't do that because he's in the
00:29:01.280 pocket of billionaires anyway when i tweeted that kamala harris had had sold trans people down the
00:29:08.020 river i think just because trump during that election cycle talked endlessly as if kamala
00:29:14.800 was obsessed with trans people that that's just sort of what is in people's cultural memory it's
00:29:20.700 like oh she would never shut up about pronouns never talked about pronouns a single time someone
00:29:26.340 quote tweeted my quote to the tune of 12 000 likes kamala's entire campaign was gay this
00:29:34.680 this is a work of trumpian fiction it is it is insane to me that what gavin newsom thinks he
00:29:41.480 has to do now to win is talk about trans people even less than kamala did which is to say not at
00:29:47.360 all i would like to take a quick break from the show to give a shout out to the american humanist
00:29:55.420 Association for sponsoring this episode. I was so grateful when the AHA reached out about
00:30:02.120 sponsoring this podcast because their values organically align so well with my own, and if
00:30:08.460 you're a frequent listener of this show, they'll probably line up with yours too. Humanism is about
00:30:13.940 living ethically, fundamentally caring about people, and making decisions based on evidence
00:30:20.880 instead of dogma. On a material and legal level, it means enacting laws that center our lived
00:30:28.020 humanity, not religion. The AHA is a wonderful organization that is on the ground working to
00:30:34.540 keep separate church and state. Like recently, the American Humanist Association got involved
00:30:40.780 in a case where Virginia had allotted $5 million in taxpayer funds to go towards private religious
00:30:49.240 charter schools in Ohio. The AHA challenged that funding through a legal system and it was ruled
00:30:56.000 unconstitutional, preventing that taxpayer money from going towards religious education. I believe
00:31:01.860 strongly that the laws that govern all of us should center our humanity and our reality and
00:31:09.100 not certain people's religious practices. And the American Humanist Association does the work to
00:31:14.160 make that possible. If that resonates with you, consider checking them out at humanist.org
00:31:19.480 slash fruity. That is humanist.org slash fruity. You can learn more about what they do. You can
00:31:26.060 support them if you're able to. And just check them out. Great organization. Now, let's get back
00:31:32.460 to the show. I want to talk more about Gavin Newsom's record on LGBTQ issues and how he arrived
00:31:40.840 here. First, I want to establish a little bit of his backstory so people who don't live in
00:31:46.760 California can feel included. Because I think there are some important consistencies throughout
00:31:52.400 his life. One being access to money. So Gavin Newsom is born in 1967 in San Francisco. He has
00:32:01.400 many notable people in his family. The Newsom family has its own Wikipedia, which I'm like,
00:32:06.960 when your last name has a Wikipedia page, like that's serious. His dad was an attorney for Getty
00:32:13.500 Oil and an administrator for the Getty Family Trust, which the Gettys of Getty Oil and the
00:32:20.380 Getty Museum, et cetera, et cetera, billionaires, were close family friends with Gavin's family.
00:32:25.420 Do you know this background? A little bit. Yes, I did know that he came from money,
00:32:30.720 but that he grew up primarily with his mother who didn't come from money.
00:32:34.980 Exactly. His parents divorced early. Gavin was mostly raised by his mom, who didn't have money, who worked multiple jobs. This is from his Wikipedia page, quote, Newsome wrote in a later memoir that the family would receive luxurious gifts from the Gettys, which he and his sister pretended not to like so their mother could return them for store credit.
00:32:54.100 Period. I love a scammer.
00:32:56.060 gavin newsome struggled in school which he attributes to his dyslexia to this day he says
00:33:05.740 he prefers memorizing a speech over relying on a teleprompter which fair enough ultimately he
00:33:11.220 graduated from santa clara university in 1989 majoring in political science within a couple
00:33:16.380 years of graduating from college a then 25 year old gavin newsome launches the plump jack group
00:33:23.260 which is a really fascinating name for a business management company that launched over a dozen
00:33:29.280 businesses, including wineries, restaurants, cafes, hotels, very Californian. Now, almost all of these
00:33:36.540 businesses that Gavin Newsom now manages were funded by Gordon Getty, who says he viewed Gavin
00:33:42.520 like a son. And I just think it's notable not to be too thematic here, but you know, Gavin Newsom
00:33:47.740 didn't grow up with money, but he always grew up with access to money. And I think always had an
00:33:52.740 intuitive understanding of how to appeal to people with money to further his own ends.
00:33:57.800 Gavin Newsom became wealthy from his Getty-funded businesses pretty quickly. He is now extremely
00:34:02.700 wealthy. I think people might underestimate just how wealthy he is. In 2021, he sold his home in
00:34:08.840 Marin County for $6 million and in 2024 bought a new one for $9.1 million. He's just a relatable
00:34:16.700 guy. Have you heard from him that he's an underdog because of the dyslexia? I'm not trying
00:34:21.460 I'm not trying to be ableist in any way, but it's just amazing to me that he's clearly gotten some poll numbers back, that his like greasy used car salesman thing isn't necessarily making him the most relatable.
00:34:36.520 So we got to we got to go with that.
00:34:38.440 He's playing up the dyslexia as like his one human attribute.
00:34:41.360 I'm sorry to be so cynical, but that's kind of where I'm at.
00:34:44.900 Now, it was through his business success that Newsom got into politics.
00:34:50.440 A 29-year-old Gavin Newsom threw a fundraiser at one of his plump jack properties for Willie Brown, who would successfully become the mayor of San Francisco. Willie Brown, once a mayor of San Francisco, then installed Gavin into the board of supervisors for San Francisco. So do you think there's any meaningful conclusions to be drawn from this being his entry into politics, essentially like buying his way?
00:35:15.400 I think that it's more indicative of the San Francisco machine. Nancy Pelosi came out of the San Francisco Democratic Party machine, as did Gavin Newsom, as did Kamala Harris. There were a lot of misogynistic jokes about her relationship with Willie Brown around this period as well. So it's interesting that he comes up here.
00:35:34.560 But it's also notable that many of the billionaires that are responsible for surveillance technology and the tech broligarchy that has populated the Trump administration also comes out of this area of the country.
00:35:50.560 So Gavin was on the board of supervisors for a number of years before running for mayor himself and winning in 2003. He ran as a business friendly centrist who promised to do something about homelessness.
00:36:03.900 We have seen many iterations of that, including him doing raiding homeless encampment photo shoots, obviously to little success.
00:36:14.160 Gavin Newsom won again in 2007 for mayor, despite progressives in San Francisco trying to find an alternative.
00:36:21.160 They couldn't.
00:36:22.180 Now's our time, you guys.
00:36:23.480 We finally have to find that alternative and stop this man in his tracks, I beg. 1.00
00:36:27.960 Back to LGBTQ stuff. 1.00
00:36:29.580 This is the A Bit Fruity podcast. 1.00
00:36:30.900 In 2004, Gavin Newsom directed the San Francisco city county clerk to issue marriage licenses to same-sex couples, which Newsom supporters on Twitter in my replies will still hold up as evidence of his progressive views, especially around LGBT people.
00:36:49.780 It's interesting that Kamala Harris also sort of touted that as well, but less so because she was quite self-conscious about being seen as a California liberal because of her race and because of her gender.
00:37:04.920 And I am sympathetic to the misogyny and the racism that was definitely a big part of Kamala Harris's loss to Donald Trump, despite all of our many critiques of the campaign.
00:37:16.820 But it is notable to me that he will elevate this part of his career, but is still willing to throw trans people under the bus in the present, even without having the issues that Harris had with trying to appear like a tough person or trying to dispel the notion that she's some sort of California liberal.
00:37:36.920 because when you look at polling about her right now, she's almost up there in terms of public
00:37:43.160 perception of liberalism with Zoran Mamdani. And that's not that has nothing to do with how she
00:37:48.580 campaigned. These are all just California, black woman, liberal, boom, there are a lot of people
00:37:55.600 that just turn their brain off with that. And so it's not that it's excusable how she ran. It's
00:38:01.660 just it makes more sense when you think about the issues that this country has with blackness and
00:38:07.880 with women with gavin newsom it's even more egregious because he doesn't have any of those 0.51
00:38:14.120 issues he has the luxury of being brave with his identity and his whiteness and his cisness and all
00:38:19.260 of that and he still chooses to throw marginalized groups under the bus even back to the homeless 0.51
00:38:25.320 encampment thing. So the question here is, who does he stand up for? Because it doesn't seem
00:38:31.620 to be anybody except the billionaires. Yeah, I will say that my impression, though,
00:38:36.520 this could be wrong, is that I do, I do feel like Gavin Newsom is trying to come off as like,
00:38:41.840 not one of those Californians. I didn't really realize this until I started traveling. And
00:38:47.240 apparently I have an accent that comes obviously from California. And people were like, they had
00:38:52.300 an issue with california like people have a whole thing about california and la specifically and i
00:38:59.320 know just you know because i see it on my feed republicans do think that gavin newsom even after
00:39:05.700 all of his sniveling is like a crazy liberal a crazy leftist extreme yes they really do um so
00:39:13.200 i get the vibe that that like when he said that stuff about trans people i did kind of feel like 0.94
00:39:18.240 it was coming from a place of like yeah i'm on the left but i'm not one of those like weird leftist
00:39:23.300 to like or not leftist let's not be crazy i'm not one of those weird liberals who believe like
00:39:28.360 you know that men can be women or something like it and it gives me that vibe but it's also not
00:39:33.560 effective i mean if with when harris did that she's still the polls still show that she is
00:39:38.940 considered just as quote liberal as zora mandani yep who has the kind of political ideology that
00:39:45.480 can overcome that Zoran and that's the problem is is that Newsom is perhaps using the exact same
00:39:53.260 playbook but when there's even less of an appetite for it within the country Kat what you're saying
00:39:59.080 about people I think especially like right of center thinking that Gavin Newsom is like a crazy
00:40:06.080 leftist is so true I guess it's because he's like comes from California I really think that that's 0.86
00:40:13.220 it but he really is i was having a conversation with a gay guy at a party a few weeks ago and
00:40:21.600 neither of us really knew anyone at the party so we just started talking to each other he was like
00:40:26.320 what do you do i said i do a podcast it's mostly about politics he said oh i listen to political
00:40:30.640 podcasts all the time i said oh well what do you listen to he's like oh well you know i make sure
00:40:34.660 i listen to everyone across the spectrum you know from like ben shapiro to like gavin newsome
00:40:41.120 so silly but but and i just i i but you know this is ultimately the information ecosystem
00:40:49.880 we're up against and um and i i do genuinely wonder like where that comes from because
00:40:54.960 even in his career infancy with san francisco politics he wasn't particularly left-wing there
00:41:00.880 it's because our politics in this country are more right-wing than people really like to see it
00:41:06.020 like as they really they really don't understand that leftists have not had the power in this
00:41:12.860 country and there is a huge effort towards silencing and deplatforming leftist people
00:41:19.340 i mean and we're seeing it now in our media like like very in a very big way you know they are
00:41:24.940 trying to really suppress leftism right so like most of the time when you guys see people's very
00:41:31.220 well-produced well-funded fancy podcast a lot of times a lot of times it's because it's being
00:41:39.040 propped up by people who have moneyed interest you know and at this point thank you to the
00:41:43.860 listeners of this podcast i could afford to get new headphones but i still have the same pair of
00:41:47.900 headphones that i have when i started this show and i'm getting an uptick in comments of people
00:41:52.940 who are complaining about that that this side if you're watching the video podcast you'll see that
00:41:57.080 this side is, uh, the ear cuff is peeling. Anyway, back to Gavin Newsom.
00:42:05.460 I don't think Newsom in his podcast studio is experiencing that kind of, uh, you know,
00:42:11.760 putting stuff together with duct tape. So Gavin, as we know, eventually in 2018 is elected governor
00:42:17.520 of California back to his LGBTQ record. So he did have a while there while it was culturally popular
00:42:25.660 to support pro-LGBT legislation.
00:42:29.460 In September 2022, he signed a law making California
00:42:33.880 the first sanctuary state for transgender youth.
00:42:37.240 In 2024, he signed the Safety Act,
00:42:41.120 which prevented educators from outing queer students to their parents.
00:42:45.420 This was really in response to all of these bills that started cropping up,
00:42:49.920 I think inspired by Ron DeSantis' Don't Say Gay bill,
00:42:52.740 and then the many bills that followed that would allow
00:42:55.240 and sometimes require educators to out queer students to their family at home,
00:43:01.100 you know, supported by parents who think of their children as property.
00:43:05.940 Then, late 2024, Trump wins.
00:43:09.040 And we all know we were talking about this,
00:43:11.320 the way that people were talking about that election
00:43:13.860 and somehow blaming Kamala's loss on her support for trans people,
00:43:18.760 which I guess I just must have missed it.
00:43:20.660 It couldn't have been the genocide.
00:43:22.280 Couldn't have been that.
00:43:23.020 Joe Biden's hanging in the race for way too long, shutting out any primary challenge, despite having very historically low approval ratings.
00:43:33.440 Yeah, all that stuff. All that stuff mattered. Not at all. It was trans people who she was too vocally supportive of when none of us were listening.
00:43:44.420 then in march 2025 gavin newsom who at this point has a podcast naturally invites charlie
00:43:54.980 kirk to be on his podcast the whole vibe of gavin newsom's podcast is very like it has kind of a
00:44:00.960 bill maher syndrome to it where he's like i'm a real lefty and i'm gonna have all these
00:44:06.160 conservatives on and just kind of agree with them on everything this is a very very very lucrative
00:44:13.120 part of media by the way and you can go to Dave Rubin you can go to whatever Anna Kasparian is
00:44:19.000 doing right now you can go back and see all of these people who have so called you know have
00:44:24.140 supposedly left the left for some really well-funded media venture where you have right
00:44:29.920 wingers that want to hear why the left is so damn crazy and then suddenly you're making millions it's
00:44:36.120 nuts I remember when that shift started happening I was like wow we've we've lost the plot but then
00:44:41.700 people started making money and here we are yeah yeah 100 so gavin newsome has charlie kirk on his
00:44:48.300 podcast and says this about trans girls in sports so like you right now should come out and be like
00:44:56.620 you know what the young man who's about to win the state championship in the long jump in female
00:45:01.140 sports right that's that that shouldn't happen you as the governor should step out and say no
00:45:05.240 no and i appreciate and but like would you do something like that would you say no men in 1.00
00:45:09.060 female sports. Well, I think it's an issue of fairness. I completely agree with you on that. 0.97
00:45:12.840 So that's easy to call out, the unfairness of that. It's easy to call out the unfairness of
00:45:16.920 that. How about the unfairness of our economic system where we have income and wealth inequality
00:45:22.960 that has surpassed the Gilded Age, where people have hit a record of credit card debt month and
00:45:29.540 month over and over again, where we continuously over the past year and plus are hitting records
00:45:35.800 of subprime auto delinquencies because people can't make their car payments, where you have
00:45:41.400 the top 10% responsible for 50% of consumer spending. These are the kinds of things where
00:45:47.700 you could talk about fairness in ways that actually impact people in a broad way in their
00:45:54.560 day-to-day life, or you could zero in on a right-wing talking point about some volleyball team
00:46:02.100 in some part of california and give that idea oxygen instead of redirecting it towards the 0.74
00:46:07.880 actual nerve centers of power that need to be challenged gavin newsom's a coward in addition
00:46:12.860 to being somebody who's not right for this moment politically yeah and that podcast it's all just
00:46:17.500 about chumming up to these guys like that's what it is like yeah i'm sure that you know they go
00:46:22.420 back and forth here and there but like it's just about being like hey you know like we may have
00:46:26.780 our disagreements but like there's a lot that we agree on and like we can all do like drink beers
00:46:31.720 together and like that's all this is yes and it's that's like a terrible metric for who you should 0.97
00:46:38.640 vote for as the fucking president and i hate this whole i want to be able to get beers with 1.00
00:46:43.480 my president kind of shit you know i want a president who actually is about that crap you 1.00
00:46:48.820 know i don't want a fucking performative president who's going to change his mind 1.00
00:46:51.780 once it's politically inconvenient and i think people have really lost sight of the fact that 0.99
00:46:56.560 these motherfuckers work for us it's not the other way around i i have had so many people say 0.97
00:47:02.980 to me even today i i with regard to uh gavin's evolving shall we say stance on the israeli 0.99
00:47:09.240 genocide which we'll talk about in a second people are like well isn't it better to have
00:47:12.940 an opportunist than a staunch zionist or or a staunch transphobe and i'm like
00:47:19.280 i guess but can't we do better than an opportunist we're not even in the election season right now
00:47:28.680 that we're talking about this election is two and a half years away and i already have to go
00:47:33.780 for the opportunist because that's the best i can do if we do not have a president that comes in
00:47:39.600 and acts with the urgency that trump has to repair our institutions our systems and to actually
00:47:46.140 prosecute the criminals that are in this administration right now. We are on a complete
00:47:52.080 downward trajectory into like a failed kind of democracy territory. We need somebody who isn't
00:47:59.620 just going to put their finger to the wind and decide what polling says and then make a
00:48:04.860 determination from there. The danger that we're in right now requires actual leadership.
00:48:09.580 Yeah, it's real shit. And people think, oh, we want a perfect candidate. I don't need a perfect 0.99
00:48:13.860 candidate. I don't think that exists. I've always said that if you ever see me supporting
00:48:17.380 a presidential candidate, like really with a lot of gusto, that's not me. That's a Cylon. 0.96
00:48:22.440 I've been replaced. I want a very, I want a very short list of things right now. I feel,
00:48:29.800 I feel, I want someone who's willing to disentangle their relationship from Israel. 0.93
00:48:34.780 I want someone who's willing to tax these billionaires, someone who wants to place
00:48:40.080 restrictions on AI and someone who wants to codify our civil rights. And if I get that list,
00:48:45.620 which to me isn't a very exhaustive list, that'll be probably for the first time in my life,
00:48:51.220 a person that I'm eager to vote for. People are being sold like supremacy shit. Like if all of 0.99
00:48:56.540 these immigrants are deported where we're finally going to be able to own homes. No, you can't own 1.00
00:49:02.380 a home because private equity has bought all of them. That's the actual problem. And those people
00:49:08.460 are paying to tell you that trans people are the biggest issue it's distraction it is distraction
00:49:15.540 i don't want perfection i want someone who's actually offering something that's going to do
00:49:20.880 something and everything that you just listed like those are majority popular positions in
00:49:27.800 the democratic base the center democratic voter right now is so wildly further to the left than
00:49:35.840 like dnc strategists and consultants and their refusal to acknowledge what people want out of
00:49:44.100 our public servants is insane and then we are made to be the crazy ones when we say two and a half
00:49:50.440 years in advance that we won't vote for someone who doesn't provide those very basic necessities 1.00
00:49:55.580 because we're just supposed to settle for like another corrupt asshole in the pockets of health 1.00
00:50:01.000 insurance billionaires. I don't know. I feel like I'm going a little bit insane. And I don't mean 1.00
00:50:05.940 to yell. And I know my tone on this podcast, which is why some people listen to it, is like
00:50:10.380 like a little bit chilled out. But I get so much heat for this online. I know all three of us have.
00:50:17.100 It's just crazy to me that two and a half years out, I am told I am like browbeaten into
00:50:24.580 to accepting that the best we can do is someone who has a $9 million home and whose highest
00:50:33.540 personal ambition, his most important belief, is that he wants to be able to sit at the table
00:50:40.760 with other powerful white men and chum it up. Donald Trump's politics come largely from the
00:50:46.660 same place. We have plenty of time. We have plenty of time.
00:50:50.700 yeah should we talk about israel i always am down to talk about israel uh i know you are emma
00:50:58.340 vigeland i know you are i'm very passionate about palestinian rights and the genocide in gaza and so
00:51:04.640 that is one thing that uh obviously i'm ready to tee off against gavin newsom about tee off on him
00:51:11.700 i guess that's the right way to say who tabletop issues baby table tabletop you gotta tabletop
00:51:17.980 them so i want to begin on october 20th 2023 a couple weeks after october 7th immediately after
00:51:28.800 which the genocide on gaza is launched in its current iteration by october 20th 2023
00:51:35.320 thousands of palestinians have already been killed by israeli bombs and it is on this day
00:51:41.520 that gavin newsom travels to israel he writes on twitter i'm on my way to israel i'll be meeting
00:51:48.280 with those impacted by the horrific terrorist attacks and offering california support what
00:51:53.420 does that even mean i'll be offering california's support anyway i just added here that jorts the uh 0.97
00:52:01.020 the twitter famous cat jorts wrote in response oh for fuck's sake is there anything to say about 0.87
00:52:09.740 Gavin Newsom traveling to Israel? I'm not surprised. His record on Israel is not going 0.97
00:52:16.080 to be as direct as if he were in federal office, because obviously AIPAC is more focused and the
00:52:22.620 Israel lobby, we should say it's not just AIPAC, is more focused on retaining the endless supply
00:52:28.280 of weapons and billions of dollars of funding that they get from the federal government. So
00:52:33.560 those voting records are a little bit more clear. But we do know that Gavin Newsom is a staunch
00:52:38.620 opposer of boycott, divestment and sanctions in the state of California. And so I'm not surprised
00:52:45.380 that he went to Israel after October 7. Yeah. And in 2024, amidst Gaza encampment protests
00:52:52.860 at universities across the US, Newsom signed pro-Israel legislation that required California
00:52:59.600 college students to take like courses or training modules or whatever on protesting with civility. 0.58
00:53:08.620 whatever that means, and have anti-Semitism training, which just, you know, as a Jewish
00:53:14.700 person opposed to genocide drives me insane because all of that legislation about like,
00:53:18.780 we must do anti-Semitism training for pro-Palestine protesters. Well, a lot of those
00:53:23.980 protesters are Jewish. And so, you know, it's just tying the protest to Judaism, which they were not
00:53:29.340 about Judaism. This legislation that Newsom signed was opposed by the ACLU, which said that it served
00:53:36.400 to, quote, chill the speech of students.
00:53:39.020 So the first time I heard Gavin Newsom talk about APAC
00:53:42.280 was when he was on the Higher Learning podcast
00:53:45.480 and the host, Van Lathan, said that he would not vote
00:53:50.020 for a candidate that took APAC money.
00:53:53.240 That was one of his disqualifiers.
00:53:55.420 Gavin Newsom said this, and this video, really,
00:53:58.020 I say this sometimes about some things
00:54:00.020 that we look at on this podcast.
00:54:01.260 It was like my body was like levitating off the ground.
00:54:03.900 I was like, are we all okay? 0.99
00:54:05.080 interesting you're like the first to bring up apac in years which is interesting i will not vote for
00:54:11.820 a candidate that takes one dollar from apac it's interesting i mean it's interesting i haven't
00:54:15.940 thought about apac and it's interesting you're like the first to bring up apac in years which
00:54:21.920 is interesting why i say that not relevant to the my day-to-day life okay which is just interesting
00:54:29.160 listen it's interesting you say that jpac perhaps more but apac less and less okay better which
00:54:35.060 is just interesting what's interesting about it that it's just interesting as you bring up apac
00:54:39.620 that it hasn't been part of i'm just reflecting quite openly and honestly hasn't been part of
00:54:45.380 the day-to-day did he mention it's interesting you know what he was trying to imply there
00:54:49.300 was that van was anti-semitic for asking that question say more that's what i got that's
00:54:53.980 definitely what i got it's interesting hmm hmm how dare you it's interesting it's interesting
00:54:59.620 that you would bring up the israel lobby as opposed to these other issues i mean it's 0.61
00:55:03.040 the slimy way that every Zionist plant, a politician who's been corrupted by Zionist
00:55:10.240 money, tries to get out of answering these questions. And it's hilarious that he tries 0.92
00:55:14.520 to say that, oh, this AIPAC conversation, I haven't heard about that in years. Really?
00:55:19.140 Because it's currently probably the most toxic acronym possible within the context of Democratic
00:55:25.480 Party politics, where you have candidates all across the country distancing themselves from
00:55:30.380 past AIPAC support because it's when they're branding with it by track AIPAC or by their
00:55:35.440 opponents, they're losing their primaries across the country because of their association with this 0.66
00:55:39.860 genocidal settler colonial ethnostate. Yeah, I don't get when politicians act surprised by this 0.85
00:55:46.180 question. I don't. And this keeps happening where they're like, huh, AIPAC never thought about that.
00:55:53.680 To me, he was like, when I watched that video, I saw, you know, a politician like trying to buy
00:56:00.300 time to think about what they want to say, which like every politician does that when they start
00:56:03.860 their answers with like, let me just tell you this. You know, it's like they're thinking,
00:56:07.980 but he just never got to an answer. Interestingly, just last week, Gavin Newsom said that he would
00:56:14.160 not take a pack money that he said never have never will. However, I want to complicate that
00:56:19.400 a little bit, though, because I think sometimes what gets lost in the conversation about AIPAC,
00:56:23.960 and you guys can tell me what you think about this, is like voters demanding that politicians
00:56:27.460 stop taking money from AIPAC, it's like twofold. One is just saying no to lobbying more generally.
00:56:34.940 Stop taking corporate money. Stop letting people buy your votes, essentially. And then the other
00:56:40.360 is like stop supporting Israel. But there are politicians who support Israel without necessarily
00:56:46.240 taking money from AIPAC. Some of them do it for the love of the game.
00:56:49.560 I was thinking about Joe Biden not being in the Epstein files at all, for example. And you just
00:56:54.060 realize like, oh, he just really, really enjoyed killing Palestinians.
00:56:59.200 You know, I think it's interesting, too, because as AIPAC is becoming this politically toxic
00:57:04.220 entity, the people who fund AIPAC are realizing we have to funnel this money to politicians in
00:57:11.000 different ways. That just happened with this primary race in, I believe, North Carolina with
00:57:17.160 Valerie Voucher. Yes. So unfortunately, Nita Alam, who was the insurgent progressive candidate who
00:57:24.500 was challenging Valerie Voucher, did lose by around one percentage point as of the current count,
00:57:30.660 but was up against a ton of money from this incumbent who had previously taken APAC money.
00:57:35.780 then because it became so politically toxic, Fouché distanced herself from that.
00:57:41.120 And then there was some reporting by Sludge showing that Hakeem Jeffries had been secretly
00:57:46.160 funneling AIPAC-aligned money in a different manner to this race to support her regardless.
00:57:52.640 I just bring this up to say that AIPAC is ultimately a vessel for moneyed interests
00:57:57.860 to pay politicians to support the continuation of a genocide. But that money can move around
00:58:04.360 and call itself different things.
00:58:06.460 Yes.
00:58:06.980 You know, it's great that we've created this environment
00:58:09.180 where politicians, if they want to run for a Democratic seat,
00:58:12.320 feel forced to say, I will not take AIPAC money.
00:58:15.200 But that doesn't mean in and of itself
00:58:17.340 that they won't find another way to either accept money
00:58:19.960 to support Israel or to support Israel
00:58:22.620 just because they think they have to.
00:58:24.860 I want to be cautious about that.
00:58:26.780 And I also want to talk about Gavin Newsom
00:58:30.220 appearing about six weeks ago on Ben Shapiro.
00:58:33.300 Actually, it was Ben Shapiro appearing on Gavin Newsom's podcast because, of course, these are the people that he invites on.
00:58:39.040 Here is a clip where Ben Shapiro is sort of talking at Gavin Newsom and saying that it is not a genocide what Israel is doing.
00:58:50.020 Democrats have now been dragged into this conversation, some drag, some run with, you know, flags waving, into the conversation.
00:58:58.280 This notion of genocide.
00:58:58.960 Yes.
00:58:59.380 I mean, look.
00:59:00.500 Israel did not commit a genocide in Gaza.
00:59:02.580 There is no standard by which Israel committed to genocide in Gaza, just on a factual level.
00:59:06.480 Just on a legal and factual level.
00:59:08.300 Yes.
00:59:08.660 Yeah.
00:59:09.140 What is your opinion of this?
00:59:10.880 My opinion is I understand the tendency for people to make that, to assert that.
00:59:20.280 Why?
00:59:20.620 On the basis of the images and the proportionality. 1.00
00:59:26.260 Ugly shit doesn't mean genocide? 1.00
00:59:27.860 No, no. 1.00
00:59:28.220 And by the way, I agree with you. 0.83
00:59:29.760 And international and proportionality doesn't mean that if you kill my child and I then kill seven criminals, that I've been disproportionate.
00:59:37.080 I'm not disagreeing with you, but I think the, but I understand that tendency on the basis of trying to reconcile the proportionate nature of how the war was ultimately conducted and the devastation.
00:59:50.820 I have a question. Why do you feel the need to create a permission structure for that sort of stuff? I mean, meaning it's not true.
00:59:59.400 why not just say it's not true yeah look i don't know the definition i don't know the legal
01:00:03.940 threshold that's not my opinion so i don't i don't share that opinion as it relates to genocide
01:00:08.280 i do not agree with that notion
01:00:10.380 it gets me so mad it's unbelievable it's unbelievable i can't stand this out of this
01:00:20.460 oh my god everything ben shapiro was saying here is categorically false it is dehumanizing 0.99
01:00:28.420 anti-Palestinian racism, bullshit. Every major human rights organization in the world has ruled 0.98
01:00:35.020 this a genocide. I cannot believe we are still even talking about this. Any person with two
01:00:40.200 functioning brain cells at this point knows that it's a genocide. Nonetheless, Ben Shapiro is
01:00:45.520 absolutely steamrolling him here because Gavin believes in nothing and he can't articulate for
01:00:50.840 a belief because he doesn't have one. There's no difference between Holocaust denialists and those
01:00:56.060 two men right there. In fact, I would say that being a Holocaust denialist is potentially less
01:01:02.040 damaging in this current moment than being a denialist about the act of genocide in Gaza,
01:01:06.920 because there's still an opportunity to prevent the worst things from happening there. I'm being
01:01:12.860 a bit inflammatory with that statement, but I do think that moral courage in the face of a current
01:01:18.620 genocide is even more important because we are supposed to have learned the lessons from the 0.99
01:01:23.480 past to prevent what happened to millions and millions of Jews, as well as other Roma, gay 0.53
01:01:29.740 people, trans people, what have you, under the Nazi regime, that it compels us to stand up against
01:01:35.860 this current genocide in this moment. That display of a lack of moral courage as he gets steamrolled
01:01:41.120 by Ben Shapiro in that instance is why he has no capacity to actually deal with fascism on a really
01:01:47.600 systemic level. And when, to bolster your point, Matt, Bet Selim, the Israeli human rights group,
01:01:52.880 has called this a genocide, as has Human Rights Watch, as has Amnesty International, as has the
01:01:57.380 UN Special Rapporteur, you can go to the genocide conventions and look at what constitutes a genocide
01:02:03.400 based on Article 2, and I'll just go through it really quickly. Killing members of the group,
01:02:07.700 causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group, deliberately inflicting on the group
01:02:11.780 conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part,
01:02:15.880 imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group, and forcibly transferring
01:02:19.660 children of the group to another group. Now, you just have to meet the criteria for one of those
01:02:24.880 thresholds that I just listed to constitute a genocide and to have an active claim on that front.
01:02:31.100 Killing members of the group, clearly. Causing serious bodily or mental harm, clearly. Deliberately
01:02:36.360 inflicting the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole
01:02:40.840 or in part. They have dropped the equivalent of multiple nuclear weapons on Gaza. There are 0.64
01:02:45.780 hundreds of thousands of people stuck to death, screaming to death, suffocated to death under
01:02:49.780 rubble, who are not accounted for right now. They've destroyed the hospital system. They've
01:02:53.940 destroyed all education systems in Gaza. And then 141 square mile area, that is what they have done, 1.00
01:03:00.200 dropping bomb after bomb, imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group.
01:03:04.440 We spoke to a doctor on our program who saw babies rotting in NICUs, their corpses, because of the 0.63
01:03:10.360 Israeli genocide, because they've cut off access to health care. So that's preventing births within 0.65
01:03:14.680 the group and five forcibly transferring children of the group to another group we know how many
01:03:19.300 children in both the west bank and in gaza have been kidnapped and tortured in israeli prisons
01:03:24.260 that is literally all five planks of what constituted genocide is met by just me listing 0.79
01:03:31.740 it off right there off the top of my head the one question is is this a holocaust that's the
01:03:36.580 only question that we're talking about right now anyway yeah and i think that it's important
01:03:44.480 for us to keep pushing candidates to withdraw their support from Israel and I hate the fact
01:03:49.940 that people think that that's like purity testing like oh my god just like I know that I know that
01:03:56.400 they support it but like because it's it's actually to me this is what drives me insane
01:04:01.220 to me it's like a great metric because if you continue to believe that what's happening in 0.99
01:04:08.960 Palestine isn't genocide and that we should continue to send money to them I think that
01:04:13.500 that actually does say more than people are giving it credit for. You have to keep in mind that
01:04:19.520 Israel is so in bed with all of this surveillance bullshit that we're, that we're struggling with 0.99
01:04:26.060 right now. Like all of this stuff, all of the anxieties we have with billionaires right now, 0.99
01:04:32.520 it's connected directly to Israel and Israel, the, our engagement in it is because of capitalism,
01:04:38.280 right? That's literally the primary reason. Like I said earlier, I don't need a perfect
01:04:43.040 candidate, but for me, and it really is, in my mind, a baseline. I want to vote for a candidate
01:04:49.300 who at least believes in disentangling our relationship with Israel, because I think 0.99
01:04:53.760 that on its own even is more massive than people I think are willing to acknowledge.
01:04:59.440 Israel has so many of the things that we would like to have over here, and we give our money
01:05:05.180 so that they can have it over there. And there's so many angles to come at it from, but at the end
01:05:10.360 of the day, they are funding genocide. And that should actually put you off enough to not want to
01:05:16.300 support a candidate who even kind of sort of believes that maybe they should keep doing it.
01:05:20.960 But he also believes in the concept of an ethnostate of Israel needing to maintain its
01:05:26.400 security or its national character by having a massive demographic majority of one group. And
01:05:33.240 this is why Zionism is incompatible with democracy and incompatible with any anti-fascist movement 0.94
01:05:38.400 is because inherently it believes that there should be a nation state that is defined by 0.61
01:05:43.100 someone's religious or ethnic character, and that that needs to be maintained by force and
01:05:46.900 domination. And when you talk about what all of the surveillance technology that is oppressing 0.91
01:05:52.140 us here at home, and you have this imperial blowback that we're experiencing in the United
01:05:56.160 States, people should read The Palestine Laboratory by Antony Lowenstein, which literally
01:06:01.520 speaks about how in Gaza, and this is prior to October 7th, this book was written, they are 0.69
01:06:07.200 testing AI, weapons, surveillance technology on the Palestinians like they're lab rats.
01:06:13.100 And so it is all a part of this overarching problem with capitalism, as you say, Cad, 0.78
01:06:19.260 where the whole world could be Gaza, as far as I am concerned, because everything about the
01:06:25.720 systemic problems of capitalism, anti-democracy, kleptocracy, climate change, militarism,
01:06:31.880 American imperialism, it's all there in the heart of this 141 square mile place.
01:06:37.200 And so if you can't stand up for the Palestinians, you won't stand up for trans people, certainly.
01:06:42.120 And you're not going to stand up for people at home who are facing the brunt of this from the Trump administration.
01:06:47.580 I keep saying to people in my life, like, this is the everything issue.
01:06:50.780 And we saw this with the 2024 election.
01:06:52.640 And the fact that we're seeing it now and we're not even in the presidential election cycle drives me crazy because people say, oh, you're a single issue.
01:07:00.340 You're a single issue voter.
01:07:01.580 I'm like, this is not a single issue.
01:07:04.860 It is all of the issues that you've just listed.
01:07:07.200 is it is indicative that you can't stand on the side of justice and humanity on any of those
01:07:12.340 issues. And also a new Gallup poll just came out that said for the first time in America,
01:07:19.180 across all the political parties, this is not specific to Democrats, American sympathy lies
01:07:25.060 more with Palestinians than it does with Israelis. Now, the fact that this is the first time that
01:07:32.780 that has been true is pretty remarkable to me, but it's true. And that includes Republicans.
01:07:38.800 That was a broad swath of Americans that answered that question. And so on top of everything else,
01:07:46.300 AI surveillance technology that's being tested in Gaza so that it can be exported to America,
01:07:51.100 on top of genocide being a moral issue, on top of this being a lobbying issue with you being
01:07:56.900 in bed with big money that forces you to support Israel against the will of the people,
01:08:00.960 on top of all of that, if you run as a Democrat, as a pro-Israel candidate, when there is so
01:08:08.720 much polling, the one thing that these people care about is polling. And there's so much polling
01:08:14.860 that that is by far an unpopular position with your own base. You're showing us that you won't
01:08:20.320 even listen to us. These people, I mean, these people, oh God, like I really hope I don't come
01:08:26.660 across as like ranting and raving but someone like gavin news like they they hate us well they also 0.96
01:08:31.760 think we're stupid i think that they think that they can manipulate the public on pet issues that 0.93
01:08:37.960 don't actually address anything systemically and they can still stay in power and that's why trans 1.00
01:08:42.780 people are the first to go it's a small minority of the population and so that's the easiest thing 0.58
01:08:48.380 to do yeah and that's why it's so important to pay attention to how people challenge other groups
01:08:54.700 civil rights because it really is it's just going to keep expanding more and more and more you know
01:09:00.840 they they said oh we're just targeting trans people you know like we're targeting trans people
01:09:04.980 but actually they're they're targeting women in a lot of ways like you have to pay attention to
01:09:09.360 the things that that are actually happening when you argue that the government has the ability to
01:09:15.180 tell me what i'm doing with my body that it's totally okay for the government to say you know
01:09:20.740 what you can't transition yes that has bigger repercussions than people even recognize it does
01:09:28.220 and it genuinely frustrates me because you know i don't want to i don't know how this is going to
01:09:32.620 sound but like when i said earlier like to me gavin newsom is like the obviously bad choice 0.63
01:09:37.620 it's because to me it it's just so obvious that gavin doesn't give a fuck about us like when you
01:09:44.220 watch him tear apart homeless encampments and keeping in mind where our economy is going, 0.96
01:09:51.800 right? Keeping in mind how AI is replacing workers right now, keeping in mind that many
01:09:56.840 people are just one paycheck away from being unhoused. What the fuck do you think is going 0.99
01:10:03.000 to happen when you end up in that position? You're going to immediately become the disposable person 0.99
01:10:09.000 that you for so long thought homeless people were, you know, and that's why you should give a fuck 0.99
01:10:15.780 about it. But so many people have this illness of supremacy in this country where they think 0.99
01:10:19.820 if trans people are being beaten down, if immigrants are being beaten down, if black 0.56
01:10:25.440 people are being beaten down, then things are just going to get better for me. But in reality, 1.00
01:10:29.500 these billionaires target these groups, knowing that they can do it to you eventually,
01:10:33.480 you know so even from your own like self you know survival perspective people should should give a 0.97
01:10:40.120 little bit of a fuck about how they're treating other groups what's happening in palestine right 0.94
01:10:45.700 now is just a great example of it you they they define certain people's you know ethnic background 0.99
01:10:52.540 as inherently radical they say well you know we have to do this because that's just how they are
01:10:58.540 and dah, dah, dah, dah, dah. They spend decades dehumanizing them. And so the, the, the loss of
01:11:04.740 a life is suddenly now not that big of a deal because you know, there are, you know, they just 0.99
01:11:08.320 happen to belong to this ethnic group. People are like those Brown people over there. Yeah. You know, 1.00
01:11:12.300 they're weird and they don't live like us. So it's okay. And it's not, it's not because you are 0.87
01:11:18.400 really fooling yourself with it. If you think they don't want to do it to you, you really are.
01:11:23.020 And it aggravates me quite a bit.
01:11:27.520 I would like to take a quick break from the show to give a shout out to Factor for sponsoring this episode.
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01:13:22.920 I also want to reference that in the same Ben Shapiro podcast interview, Ben Shapiro brings up
01:13:28.800 how Gavin Newsom's office had previously called the state-sponsored ICE murder of Renee Good
01:13:35.520 state-sponsored terrorism and uh let's see how how gavin reacts when uh ben shapiro brings that up
01:13:42.540 your press office tweeted out that it was state-sponsored terrorism which i mean governor
01:13:48.140 i have to ask you about that that that sort of thing makes our politics worse yeah and it does
01:13:53.680 i mean our our ice officers obviously are not terrorists yeah a tragic situation is not state
01:13:58.460 sponsored terrorism yeah i think that's fair someone commented in the youtube comment section
01:14:06.840 of this podcast interview take a shot every time gavin challenges ben is a drinking game you can
01:14:12.580 legally play while driving literally literally you know like with with renee good renee good
01:14:19.460 was kind of a good example of some of the stuff i was talking about like what a lot of people
01:14:23.180 didn't understand like the core of the black lives matter movement was actually about was like
01:14:27.200 that you shouldn't be able to just shoot someone because you suspect them of a crime right and now
01:14:31.680 we're seeing what they've done knowing that the populace is going to say well maybe if the cops
01:14:36.920 are there you know there's probably a reason for it and like you know we should just trust the
01:14:41.920 police because when have they ever led us astray you know it's it's yeah and this is what i mean
01:14:48.260 when it's like people will say well isn't it better to have like an opportunist than an ideological
01:14:53.400 biblical Zionist, for example. And I'm like, well, the problem with an opportunist is that
01:14:59.320 Gavin Newsom can come and say some of the things that he said this week, which we're about to look
01:15:03.900 at. But then tomorrow he could sit down with Ben Shapiro again and say, yeah, it's not a genocide
01:15:08.320 because he wants to make happy whoever is sitting in front of him. And that's not what a that's not
01:15:13.740 leadership. Like definitionally, that's not leadership. So this week, obviously, we're now
01:15:19.380 war with Iran for reasons that genuinely we can only speculate about because nobody fucking knows. 0.93
01:15:26.600 And after the U.S. and Israeli bombs killed, I believe, 150 schoolgirls at a school in Iran, 0.97
01:15:36.400 Gavin Newsom said this.
01:15:39.060 We have to reconcile why our bombs were used or Israeli bombs were used to kill children,
01:15:44.820 young girls at a school and what the imminent threat was.
01:15:48.560 it hasn't been described we have to we have to reconcile process it's it's the same uh argument
01:15:55.320 you're going to hear from chuck schumer which is is that uh trump didn't come to congress and ask
01:16:00.520 us and give us sufficient explanation there's no critique of it on its merits yeah and i hate how
01:16:06.820 he's acting like he doesn't know why they they targeted a school i mean they targeted a school
01:16:11.260 of girls for a reason the israelis were involved these you think that the targeting schools isn't
01:16:16.980 in their playbook i've got news for you buddy israel has been targeting schools every week
01:16:22.040 for the last two years in gaza but you know what even just not to overanalyze but like i do think
01:16:27.980 if someone is going to run for president we can overanalyze because we we need to reconcile why
01:16:33.180 our bombs were used to kill children what do you mean we you're the leader what he's doing there
01:16:40.360 rhetorically is trying to get a lay of the land with the people he's talking to, to see what
01:16:46.920 opinion he should have about it. We need to reconcile what happened here. You need to tell
01:16:54.140 us what you think so that we can decide whether or not to support what you think. But he doesn't
01:17:00.840 believe anything. That's a really important point, Matt, because Zoran would never do something like
01:17:05.800 that just in terms of who we're looking at with like the strongest messenger right now in in
01:17:10.220 politics on our side he would never just say hey it's up for grabs and once i get the poll testing
01:17:17.300 in i'm going to determine whether or not i can ride the fence on this kind of situation polling
01:17:22.600 is not static the consultant class in the democratic party wants you to think that because
01:17:27.320 they have sold a bill of goods to a bunch of corrupt democrats that they can give you a package
01:17:31.680 of data and you can win elections that way we've seen it's fleeting we've seen it's cynical we've
01:17:36.700 seen that it's completely lost voter trust if you are a politician it is your duty to use the bully
01:17:42.180 pulpit to change public opinion on issues of human rights and of income inequality and what have you
01:17:47.900 and what the old class of liberals does is they are reactive and it's definitionally poor leadership
01:17:54.500 it's why that even like there were some good things that the biden administration did on
01:17:58.560 antitrust, right? Or on even the Inflation Reduction Act. But I still think he's one of
01:18:03.700 the worst presidents in the history of the country because he's such a horrible leader and plus the
01:18:07.780 genocide in Gaza. He didn't use the bully pulpit to sell anything to the American public. We had
01:18:13.020 an absence of leadership for around four years about what the vision for this country should
01:18:18.180 look like outside of restoring these crumbling institutions and patching them together in
01:18:23.600 between two Trump terms. That is also the responsibility of the president is to give a
01:18:28.360 vision for where the country can go. And even where like, I might prefer Biden's domestic policy to
01:18:34.180 what Obama offered, for example, I'm still going to say Obama was a better president, because he
01:18:39.300 actually took the issue of like being a leader a little bit seriously and a statesman. And that
01:18:44.920 means trying to push the conversation in a way that benefits your political movement. I disagree
01:18:50.760 with obama's political movement more broadly but you get exactly what i'm saying here being so
01:18:55.100 reactive is genuinely a threat to all of us because they're not providing an alternative
01:19:00.880 vision as the republicans are providing a very clear and scary one yeah that's the thing is that 0.96
01:19:06.100 like a lot of times these people think if we do a little bit of right-leaning shit like maybe we'll 0.95
01:19:10.760 get some people but like the people who feel like that are just going to vote for the republican 0.96
01:19:14.080 like they're just going to vote for the republican so then last night i'm so glad we're doing this
01:19:19.760 today because this morning i woke up to new gavin newsom israel statements he's on a book tour right
01:19:26.520 now which uh i think in many ways is serving as his the soft launch for his 2028 campaign yep he'll
01:19:33.760 officially launch in january 2027 right after the midterms but he wants to get into the public
01:19:39.220 consciousness right now in early 2026 every playbook ever for an establishment democratic
01:19:45.820 politician. He's doing it by the calendar. Right. And he was being interviewed about his book by,
01:19:53.780 I believe it was the Pod Save America guys. And they raised the issue of continuing to arm
01:19:59.980 Israel. And here's what Gavin Newsom says. And a lot of Democrats have looked at the Netanyahu
01:20:06.120 regime and felt like, you know what, we don't like the trajectory he's on. It's time to rethink the
01:20:12.900 U.S. relationship with Israel, especially military support. Where do you stay?
01:20:16.160 Well, Bibi's making that easy right now. Let's talk about that. But the issue of Bibi's interesting 0.96
01:20:20.280 because he's got his own domestic issues. He's trying to stay out of jail.
01:20:27.040 He's got an election coming up. He's potentially on the ropes. He's got folks, the hard line,
01:20:33.480 that want to annex the West, the West Bank. I mean, Freeman and others are talking about
01:20:37.960 it appropriately. Sort of an apartheid state. Thomas Friedman is talking about it. That's
01:20:42.420 he's taking his cues from now wait i'm not done i'm sorry do you think looking down the road that
01:20:48.100 the united states should consider maybe you know rethinking our military support for israel it
01:20:54.420 breaks my heart because the current leadership in israel um is walking us down that path where i
01:21:02.900 don't think you have a choice but that consideration no i what do you think about it we have no choice
01:21:08.580 the israelis have dragged me to my position that i didn't actually want to take he's also lying
01:21:13.820 this is going to be the shorthand for people that are listening to this pay attention to the
01:21:18.180 democrats that just blame benjamin netanyahu they are lying to you they are lying about the
01:21:23.560 polling within israel which is they have it's a population that is incredibly radicalized and
01:21:28.840 that's because it's ethnically and religiously homogeneous by design an overwhelming majority
01:21:34.480 support the genocide in Gaza. The opposition leader, the so-called center-left opposition
01:21:41.220 leader in Israel, the leader of the opposition to Netanyahu, just came out in support of the
01:21:46.920 greater Israel proposal by Mike Huckabee. The only thing that's going to change the situation
01:21:53.260 is for the United States to cut off diplomatic support, but most importantly, arms. And Netanyahu 0.63
01:21:59.520 has been the leader of that country for nearly 30 years with a small respite he is as representative
01:22:05.340 of their politics as a leader could possibly be and the the the democrats need to reckon with this
01:22:11.700 and actually deal with the problem of the apartheid and not just like signal about it
01:22:16.240 and actually talk about it outside of just netanyahu equals trump which is what they're
01:22:20.580 going to try to get away with a hundred percent and i mean obviously i think he's invoking like
01:22:27.100 oh maybe it's an apartheid state because clearly his consultants have given him like the go on okay
01:22:33.260 we poll tested apartheid and you can say apartheid now and but you know they ask him should we cut
01:22:39.320 off weapons and he says well it's heartbreaking first of all what does that even mean it's
01:22:43.620 heartbreaking it's the heartbreaking aspect of this is that maybe we should cut off arms to
01:22:49.420 Israel that's been committing a genocide but also these phrases of like that's a real conversation
01:22:54.380 that we should have it's so kamala it's corporate speech people are sick of it people are really
01:23:02.480 sick of it like people are tired of the non-answers i wish people would recognize that like
01:23:08.840 one of the reasons why people really enjoyed mom danny is because he like actually stuck to his
01:23:13.280 point and was like this is what i'm gonna do this is why i feel and it's not wishy-washy here and
01:23:18.540 there like when i listen to him answer that i don't hear anything it's why trump has his appeal
01:23:23.400 Let's be real. He's lying, but he speaks off the cuff. It's it's an authenticity or a performance
01:23:28.780 of authenticity that people are craving. Mom Donnie authentically has it. Trump is just a liar,
01:23:34.540 but he's also impulsive. And so it looks like authenticity. And you know what? I just want to 1.00
01:23:40.300 return to this question of like, well, isn't an opportunist better than a Zionist ideologue?
01:23:46.380 Because people were like celebrating this. And the element of this that I think is worth celebrating
01:23:51.600 is the fact that he's using the word apartheid.
01:23:54.740 The fact that he's entertaining the conversation.
01:23:58.620 And I can't believe we're still in the stage
01:23:59.900 of entertaining a conversation
01:24:01.260 about cutting off arms to Israel.
01:24:02.500 But the fact that he's doing it,
01:24:04.160 this extraordinarily buttoned up man
01:24:06.660 who the only things he says
01:24:08.800 are what have been battle tested
01:24:11.100 and approved by his pollsters.
01:24:13.140 So the fact that he's saying it indicates
01:24:14.800 that it is, and we already knew this,
01:24:17.680 broadly popular.
01:24:19.140 Things like cutting off weapons, 0.94
01:24:20.520 things like highlighting the reality that this is an apartheid state that's nice to know but i'm not
01:24:26.800 celebrating and people can disagree with this but i'm not celebrating gavin newsom's answer here
01:24:32.900 beyond that it reflects what we already know which is that is popular because like i said this man
01:24:39.020 has proven again and again that he believes in nothing he could sit down with mike huckabee
01:24:42.580 and and say well yeah you make some points about the greater israel project am i crazy absolutely
01:24:49.040 not hey y'all it's matt from the future editing this episode and how grateful am i to be able to
01:24:56.540 let you know that by the end of the day that we recorded this episode on gavin newsom's spokesman
01:25:02.100 had already walked back his recognition of israeli apartheid from the new york times quote
01:25:07.440 asked to clarify the comments izzy garden a spokesman for mr newsom said that the governor
01:25:13.580 believes in Israel's right to exist and its right to defend itself, period. And that's showbiz,
01:25:21.320 baby. So I want to round out this episode, Act Three, if you will, by talking about what it
01:25:28.800 means to live in a supposed democracy where like, apparently we already have to commit to voting for
01:25:36.800 this person who's not even running yet. And I want to explain that through a controversy that
01:25:40.980 recently took place online with a one hassan piker who listen i try not to center you know
01:25:54.020 straight men on this podcast but you know he's at the heart of this one and no he's an exception
01:25:59.840 i joke hassan's a friend and i love whenever i see him trending because i'm like oh someone else
01:26:05.220 is taking the heat who has a little bit more clout than me that can just buttress these insane
01:26:13.040 Democrats. We've given you a lot of context so far for Gavin Newsom's politics or lack thereof.
01:26:20.940 Another important element of his current political career as governor of California is that he
01:26:26.640 opposes California's billionaire tax. There is a fight right now within the state of California
01:26:31.960 over this ballot measure, which would be a 5% tax on the residents of California who have over
01:26:39.800 a billion dollars. This would be a big part of trying to cover the gap in funding for healthcare
01:26:47.340 programs like Medicaid that the Trump one big ugly ass bill pushed and was responsible for 0.98
01:26:54.880 some of the largest healthcare cuts in the country. This billionaire tax would fill those 0.95
01:27:00.160 gaps. But Gavin Newsom has been vociferous in his opposition to this proposal, even as there is
01:27:07.360 like significant grassroots support for it in California. And this is not the first time that
01:27:12.240 he has acted on behalf of billionaires. There was a measure that he ended up killing as governor
01:27:19.260 that would have much more intensely regulated private equity and hedge funds as they price
01:27:24.960 gouge on healthcare. He was somebody who ran on single payer healthcare, but then worked behind
01:27:31.880 the scenes after getting elected to kill it. So the only time really that Gavin Newsom engages
01:27:37.800 in progressive rhetoric is when he's going to backtrack on it later and stab the left in the
01:27:43.300 back. That's pretty much his track record. Yeah, we need to focus on tabletop issues,
01:27:48.140 like health care and also do nothing about that yep it's really important that we focus on nothing
01:27:55.780 except making sure that uh nothing threatens the wealth of billionaires i digress by the way i will
01:28:02.020 say you know one of the uh arguments that gavin newsom makes in opposition to the billionaire
01:28:08.020 tax is like well if we tax the billionaires five percent they're all gonna leave california
01:28:12.520 and i just want to say that that's not true that doesn't happen this whole thing just played out
01:28:18.060 in New York City, all of the richest people in New York City saying if Zoran wins, we're going
01:28:22.200 to leave. Guess how many of them have left? Even in California, they did this. They raised taxes
01:28:26.380 on millionaires 15 years ago, and the number of millionaires increased in the state. This is a
01:28:31.640 capital flight myth that academics have studied, and it's there to stave off the calls to tax the
01:28:36.620 rich. It's not actually something that happens, especially in large states like California and
01:28:41.940 New York, where they are centers of culture and finance. And these corporations and billionaires
01:28:47.200 need to be there. They're just trying to shake down the state for more tax cuts to pretend that
01:28:51.820 they're going to leave. The real reason Gavin Newsom opposes this stuff is because his career
01:28:56.080 is in the pockets of these billionaires. And so Hassan Piker, popular leftist Twitch streamer,
01:29:02.240 if you in fact don't engage with any straight men on the internet and don't know who he is,
01:29:06.540 he was talking with our girl Jennifer Welch of I've Had It, who's been on this podcast before
01:29:13.020 as well. And she asked who he would vote for in a hypothetical election between J.D. Vance and
01:29:20.580 Gavin Newsom. And this is what he said. Who do you vote for, J.D. Vance or Gavin Newsom?
01:29:25.740 Well, I'd have to vote for Gavin Newsom. Me too. I wouldn't blink. What about you, Hassan?
01:29:28.960 I'd probably vote third party. You would? Oh, yeah. I mean, at that point, it doesn't even
01:29:34.640 matter. Like, because my policy on this is is the same as like my refusal to endorse Kamala Harris.
01:29:41.460 the reason why I did not endorse Kamala Harris was because she did things that were not only
01:29:48.760 unproductive but also unconscionable but and I still stand on that I still talk about it all
01:29:54.520 the time because people constantly bring it up they're like you didn't sufficiently like promote
01:29:58.060 Kamala Harris you're the reason why she lost I'm like I am incapable there is no singular force in
01:30:04.820 this country that is capable of making or breaking an election and if that was real then it is the 0.97
01:30:10.880 most idiotic thing not to listen to my demands but everybody knows that that's not real right 0.91
01:30:15.200 if i had this singular force to be able to make kamala harris the president then kamala harris 1.00
01:30:20.460 should be coming to me every day and being like let me do a collab with you please right that's
01:30:25.480 not the case of course and they know it that's why they didn't do it and for me the way i see it is
01:30:31.180 if the democratic establishment makes this decision one more time just as they did with
01:30:35.640 Hillary Clinton, just as they did with Kamala Harris, and in some ways, just as they did with
01:30:40.460 Joe Biden as well, which led to Trump too, then they just don't care. People lost their minds
01:30:48.400 over Hassan Piker saying that he would not vote for this candidate. In an election that is two
01:30:53.880 and a half years away, for a candidate who is not running yet, they blamed Hassan for the state of
01:30:58.540 the country, saying he's no different than MAGA Republicans, that Hassan handed Trump the
01:31:03.640 presidency on a silver platter. They also called him a Russian asset. Hey, Hassan Piker, we have
01:31:08.840 something in common. There was one popular tweet that said, Hassan is functionally no different
01:31:14.660 than a fascist. Here's what I'll say. You can argue that there are some Democrats who are 0.52
01:31:22.880 functionally no different than fascists. And I would argue that perhaps Chuck Schumer, who is
01:31:30.100 refusing to rule out voting against supplemental funding for this horrific war that we are waging
01:31:36.620 in iran is an example of at the very least a fascist enabler that he is repeatedly caving
01:31:44.180 to the republicans on issues as it relates to government spending like that is much closer to
01:31:49.480 a fascist because he's literally enabling their actions than someone like hassan who's demanding
01:31:54.940 better of the opposition party that's supposed to be keeping us from a moment of fascism that
01:31:59.020 we've already reached. And the problem here is that this level of entitlement, this however the
01:32:08.020 Democratic Party kind of fans are reacting here, is what has repulsed so many voters and has made
01:32:15.060 it so that the Democrats are actually more unpopular than Trump right now. And when you
01:32:20.580 look at polling and that is because of the entitlement here, they keep trying to preach
01:32:26.400 democracy as an ethic. And I agree. I want to protect democracy. But the big problem is that
01:32:32.080 they don't practice it internally, whether it's forcing Joe Biden to run when you had actually
01:32:38.760 Democratic Party voters saying we want somebody different. They said, no, no, no, we're going to
01:32:42.980 actually make South Carolina the first primary. We're going to try to box out anybody who might
01:32:47.200 challenge this very geriatric kind of ailing old man who's deeply unpopular. And we don't really
01:32:51.900 care what you have to say. You oppose the genocide in Gaza? Only, like, single-digit percentages of
01:32:56.920 Democratic voters, let alone only 25% of independents per Gallup poll last August. Those
01:33:02.400 numbers have gotten worse since then. But it's something like 9% of Democrats support Israel's
01:33:06.540 military action in Gaza. Well, hey, Chuck Schumer, the Democratic leader, he's all for Israel. It
01:33:12.140 doesn't matter what the voters think. My base I don't even care about. I care about the Zionist
01:33:17.840 lobby. These are fundamental undemocratic actions that have enabled the fascism of Donald Trump. 0.81
01:33:24.860 So when then Kamala Harris goes out there with Liz Cheney with a big democracies on the line
01:33:29.520 ballot, what do voters think? Do they think of democracy as something that they need to protect
01:33:34.700 inherently? Or do they see a group of cynical politicians who are not acting democratically
01:33:42.120 in and of themselves which means democratic responsiveness which means changing your
01:33:47.660 positions to reflect that of your constituents to reflect that of the voter base and that you
01:33:53.360 have they have no legitimacy on the issue of democracy because they don't practice it themselves 1.00
01:33:57.640 they don't listen and they pretend like they can just force things through by throwing trans people 0.52
01:34:02.320 under the bus by some focus testing here what have you no no no there's no shortcut you have
01:34:07.160 to respond to voters period i wish people would understand that leftists did not actually lose
01:34:13.040 this election that non-voting leftists are a minority within a minority um that many of us
01:34:20.140 actually did go out and vote for kamala harris i did i voted for her i did with all of my criticisms
01:34:27.280 and that's another thing i wish people would understand that a lot of times we're making
01:34:31.540 these criticisms with the idea that we would like to vote for them to me telling me as a 0.96
01:34:36.720 trans person to listen to gavin newsom essentially say he doesn't give a fuck about my civil rights 0.91
01:34:42.820 and then say if i don't vote for him i'm ushering in donald trump or you know the the jd vance 0.99
01:34:50.960 presidency that that's gonna you know ruin everything it's like it's so ridiculous and 0.95
01:34:57.520 it's frustrating that people don't see that it's ridiculous because it should actually be seen as a 0.58
01:35:03.300 very reasonable thing for me to not want to vote for a candidate who would be working against my
01:35:09.160 interest and would also be funding genocide or would be defending the idea that billionaires 0.86
01:35:14.120 don't deserve to be fucking taxed it's like none of this makes sense so why are you yelling at me
01:35:20.560 yeah i mean look the discourse around the 2024 election was in my you know seven years like 0.99
01:35:28.680 being online and talking about politics, some of the most miserable months of like my waking up
01:35:34.580 and doing work every morning. And I know that like all three of us feel that because if you
01:35:39.200 were vocally against so many of the things, notably the genocide that Kamala, maybe in
01:35:46.200 different language than Trump, but functionally promised to continue in the exact way that Trump
01:35:50.800 has, then it's like, well, how do we vote for this person? How do we advocate for this person?
01:35:55.260 and the election came upon us i i went in the week leading up to the election i took a bus 0.91
01:36:02.180 to pennsylvania and i fucking door knocked i was coconut posting i'm a dsa member
01:36:09.220 i was on tiktok getting yelled at for being like i think maybe kamala might be the better of the 1.00
01:36:17.380 two choices like yeah i'm like making stupid cases like look how hot she is that's got to 1.00
01:36:22.760 count for something right i didn't even like her policies like that and i mean this is the thing 0.96
01:36:29.540 for me it's like when i talked online about how i had like gone to pennsylvania and door knocked
01:36:34.960 there were palestinian people who were very disappointed in me and what could i say to them
01:36:43.500 what did i have to say to them nothing because i am not going to look you straight in the face
01:36:50.260 As so many people are asking trans people to do, are asking Arab Americans to do, and say, vote for this candidate who doesn't care about you, who has presided over the mass death of your family members, of people in your community, and suck it up and vote for them because that's what it means to protect a democracy. 0.70
01:37:09.080 What kind of democracy is that? And so that was the conversation, the very tense and uncomfortable and miserable conversation that was happening then in the days before the 2024 election. Guess what? We lost that election. And we've seen what having a candidate who failed all of these litmus tests has paved the way for.
01:37:32.120 And I mean, years and years and years and decades of this sort of neoliberalism has paved the way for. Now we're not in an election cycle. So now we're having this conversation. So just don't tell me that I am a fascist, that I'm no different than a MAGA Republican, because in March 2026, I'm saying I don't want to vote for Gavin Newsom.
01:37:53.900 Like, what is the point of representative democracy if we can't even air our desires because it's like we must accept this preordained prince from his nine million dollar mansion?
01:38:06.340 You know, to wrap it up, that's kind of where I am just screaming from the rooftops is that we have to perform representative democracy by actually representing people and representing their views and not just trying to work around it.
01:38:22.600 Represent them, uplift them, and it's not that hard.
01:38:25.640 You can do it. You just have to have a universal message, which a lot of Democrats are afraid to do because universal programs mean taxation, challenging power, all of that stuff that needs to happen if we're going to make sure that fascism is destroyed.
01:38:39.740 and uh and i'll just say on twitter as people were you know going at hassan for saying he
01:38:46.540 wouldn't vote for newsom hassan defended himself by highlighting gavin newsom's waffling on trans
01:38:52.580 issues in particular to which some people said no he supports us look what he did in 2004 and
01:38:58.880 one week later after this whole fiasco gavin says on cnn just to bring it home that democrats should
01:39:05.300 be more culturally normal hassan piker vindicated i guess i don't know you know being a leftist
01:39:17.020 it's it's often a game of just being right too soon oh yes it's absolutely agonizing and it ruins
01:39:23.940 uh your psyche and your mental well-being but we don't have a choice but to be leftist because
01:39:29.300 this is how progress is made i guess there's some comfort in knowing that uh the people before us
01:39:35.780 people who have sacrificed way more than i have also experienced this incredible frustration we're
01:39:40.740 just in a really really difficult time right now and we keep fighting we've got no other choice
01:39:45.280 emma and kat thank you so much for like dragging me through the mud i promise if you're listening
01:39:52.760 to this i promise this is the last time for at least a few episodes that i'll talk about electoral
01:39:57.480 politics it'll be back to celebrity analysis soon i just had to get it off my chest thank you both
01:40:03.180 so much for being here today where can people find more of you the majority report uh with sam
01:40:09.020 cedar but also myself emma vigeland is live every uh weekday noon eastern we're live for around two
01:40:16.060 and a half hours you can become a member at join the majority report.com we are a daily left-wing
01:40:21.060 news show that covers all of these issues and more. I'm primarily found on YouTube, where I go
01:40:27.980 by my stage name, Kat Black. And you can also find my writings on blackinthecity.com. I am
01:40:33.560 definitely trying to celebrate my creative ability right now. So I'm going to be trying to speak less
01:40:39.960 about politics. But knowing me, I'm still I'm still going to do it. I'm still going to do it.
01:40:43.660 I can't stop doing it. It's important to me. But I'm trying to embrace my creative side. So
01:40:48.340 look forward to seeing that and if you have made it this far in the episode thank you so much I
01:40:54.000 hope this is the last time for a while that we have to talk about Gavin Newsom it's one thing
01:40:59.300 to talk about like you know pop cultural stuff that I have a problem with it's another thing 0.96
01:41:04.060 to just talk about this dog shit cynical rich guy politician that I don't it's just like genuinely
01:41:09.620 not fun but I hope we made it fun I love you so much thank you for listening to this episode I 0.95
01:41:16.160 We'll see you next time, and until then, stay fruity.