Bubble Pop with Rachel Gilmore - Getting things done despite all the doom (feat. Fae Johnstone)

00:00:00.000 Hello, I'm Rachel Gilmore, your least favorite person's least favorite journalist. Welcome

00:00:10.880 to Bubble Pop. This is the weekly show where we talk about some of the biggest headlines

00:00:15.600 and juiciest news tidbits so you don't have to doomscroll. Stop doomscrolling. Let's start

00:00:21.080 hopescrolling. And for season two, as you know by now, we are doing it live, baby. So

00:00:26.860 just a reminder that if you want to support the show, you can do it on Patreon, Substack, YouTube,

00:00:32.020 Twitch, basically wherever you want to listen. You can also ask a question using the super chat

00:00:36.720 function on YouTube. And in the last 10 minutes of the show, while we're live, I'm going to do my

00:00:41.640 best to take some of those questions provided they aren't inappropriate, you little scamps.

00:00:47.440 So I have a really good show for you today. I'm very excited because it has been an extremely

00:00:53.580 busy week in Canadian politics. There was a budget, a floor crossing, a resignation, and all of the

00:01:00.500 fallout from all three. We also got an incredible injection of hope with the election of Zoran

00:01:07.600 Mamdani in New York. His election shows the importance of organizing, of refusing to give up

00:01:14.460 in the face of democratic backsliding, and that is something that today's guest knows very well.

00:01:20.600 See, the Liberal government has been talking big game about making generational investments

00:01:25.880 that are going to require sacrifices.

00:01:29.240 But when it unveiled Budget 2025 this week, we learned who's actually paying for those

00:01:35.300 generational investments and who is sacrificing.

00:01:39.520 The government decided that rather than getting the money to pay for those investments with

00:01:45.840 stuff like, I don't know, keeping the luxury tax on boats and private planes or keeping the unused

00:01:51.920 house tax, the government instead scrapped both of those taxes and chose to slash public service

00:01:59.120 jobs and slow the growth of program spending. You know who'd love that? Harper. But in the months

00:02:07.240 leading up to this budget, it became clear that some departments would be hit harder than others.

00:02:12.900 see the ministers had been asked to search for savings within their departments under what the

00:02:18.180 government called the quote comprehensive expenditure review the goal was to reduce

00:02:24.420 program spending in those departments by 15 over the next few years but factoring in the conclusion

00:02:32.020 of current funding programs the department for women and gender equality's budget was actually

00:02:37.300 set to decline if they didn't get new money by 81% over that same period. So just like they did

00:02:45.980 when Mark Carney initially got rid of and ultimately brought back the Women and Gender

00:02:50.440 Equality Minister, women and 2SLGBTQIA plus riots groups got very, very loud. Over 175 of them

00:03:00.960 called on the government to maintain this funding in the 2025 budget. And as a result of their

00:03:06.940 unrelenting advocacy, they mitigated this damage and made sure that the cuts wouldn't be so deep.

00:03:13.260 Queer Momentum's Executive Director Faye Johnstone was one of the badass women who was part of the 0.91

00:03:18.460 successful push to save some of Wage's funding. She's a relentless advocate for 2SLGBTQIA plus

00:03:24.940 rights in this country at a time when that work is more necessary than ever. And that is why

00:03:30.780 I am so stoked to welcome her on the show today. Faye, welcome to Bubble Pop. 0.95

00:03:37.900 Hey, Rachel. Thanks so much for having me back on.

00:03:40.380 Of course. Oh my God. It's my complete pleasure. I love hanging with you. So, okay. I need to ask

00:03:46.700 you, we're going to take like a few steps back because obviously a lot has been happening in

00:03:50.060 this last week. But when you first heard that wage was going to be dealing with these 81%

00:03:58.780 percent effectively cuts that that was the amount of funding they were losing um and that came after

00:04:05.180 the cardi government initially dropped but ultimately brought back the women and gender

00:04:09.340 equality minister what did you make of all of that i mean like fury was the emotion that i was

00:04:17.420 feeling strongest at that stage you know to see uh you know a liberal prime minister come in and

00:04:23.820 start by not including a wage minister you know this is after the liberals had you know done a

00:04:29.820 lot of good work under trudeau to support gender equality and then to just see our minister go away

00:04:35.420 and for the prime minister to seemingly not understand the importance of gender equality

00:04:40.140 the importance of building a country that works for girls and gays everywhere uh we were furious

00:04:45.500 we were furious because we shouldn't have had to fight for this minister to begin with

00:04:48.860 and it was taken as a sign you know if if he's not giving us a minister what does that mean

00:04:53.740 and then our concern got so much stronger and our advocacy so much louder when we saw the

00:04:59.660 departmental plan over the summer that so showed if no new money was pledged the budget at wage

00:05:05.020 would go down by 81 percent over the next three years that means that the organizations

00:05:10.860 that rely on that funding your local woman's shelter your career counseling program

00:05:15.260 your women's economic or entrepreneurship program those programs would be devastated

00:05:20.860 and it would have a ripple effect that would make canada less equal and less free for marginalized

00:05:26.460 communities yeah yeah it's it's i think all of us had this sort of oh moment when we saw that

00:05:35.340 and um obviously you guys a lot of people have that oh moment and the doom just consumes them

00:05:42.620 but you guys got busy so can you tell me a little bit about how you won that fight to make sure that

00:05:49.260 wage wasn't totally decimated absolutely and it was you know fundamentally yeah we got angry but

00:05:56.940 it was everyday canadians who were speaking up who were getting angry at their mps at cabinet

00:06:01.660 ministers they made it happen and so what i would say is we took like a multi-pronged approach

00:06:07.260 uh there were a ton of us who reached out and engaged our mps our ministers and helped them

00:06:12.060 understand how critical these investments were and how damaging for both the immediate and long term

00:06:18.940 such a reduction would be. We made our case, you know, we argued about the economic impact of these

00:06:24.220 kinds of funds. We made our case focusing on the vulnerable Canadians who would be impacted by

00:06:30.380 these cuts as well. And then we also, you know, went for the photo a little bit more and talked

00:06:34.540 about, you know, how an austerity budget would screw over girls and gays, as I like to say,

00:06:40.780 across the country and so we did the nice stuff we did the the strategic understand the investment

00:06:46.700 stuff and then we also i think flexed a little bit and showed that if they got the funding that

00:06:51.980 our organizations and the communities we serve rely on we wouldn't go down quietly and that

00:06:57.100 you know women are a big part of why prime minister carney is prime minister to begin with

00:07:02.300 and he doesn't want to betray that voter constituency and we would be very loud and 0.97

00:07:08.220 and critical if we needed to be, if those funds were gutted.

00:07:12.620 Yeah, you know, I really appreciated

00:07:14.940 that you gave some of those examples

00:07:16.660 when you were first explaining like your reaction

00:07:19.160 to hearing about these cuts,

00:07:20.260 because I think that sometimes it's easy

00:07:22.140 for people to kind of get lost in the sauce

00:07:23.860 when they see, oh, this percentage, these dollars,

00:07:27.380 this reduction, you know,

00:07:28.740 and they don't actually realize what that means for them.

00:07:31.020 I mean, even just right now with the conversation

00:07:33.100 about the public service jobs being cut, you know,

00:07:36.300 people without the unions who are coming out and speaking about what this means for Canadians,

00:07:41.340 that translation kind of has to happen. So in the context of these acronyms and numbers

00:07:48.340 that you saw with wage, can you tell me a little bit more about what that initial cut would have

00:07:54.540 meant? And even what the, there is still a reduction. So like what that could also look

00:07:59.540 like still as it stands. Absolutely. You know, I think, and you hit the nail on the head with

00:08:06.000 you know it's just a percentage it's just a number and people don't understand the material impact

00:08:11.440 and so you know local women's organizations and lgbtq organizations they have been like chronically

00:08:16.960 underfunded for decades right like they're underfunded and they're dealing with these

00:08:20.400 massive crises and they're putting it all they're leaving it all on the ice as i like to say so that

00:08:25.440 is you know shelter workers who are going above and beyond to do everything they can to help a

00:08:30.880 women fleeing violence get the care and support they need to you know stand up and live healthy

00:08:36.400 lives and get you know back to contributing to our economy and so if these cuts had come through

00:08:42.240 that lifeline funding that has been channeled by women and gender equality into our sectors

00:08:47.520 it would have disappeared overnight and we would have seen organizations suddenly with a funding

00:08:52.480 gap that no one else is stepping into address you know it's not like there's provincial governments

00:08:57.680 lining up to spend more on women's services right now and so you would have seen local organizations

00:09:03.120 struggle to do their jobs right like demand is increasing because the gender-based violence

00:09:07.440 pandemic is ongoing and we've got governments rolling back on rights and then to have these

00:09:12.320 organizations be placed in an even more financially untenable position uh would have had a devastating

00:09:18.000 impact across the country and so there's there's the services piece and that is where we've really

00:09:22.640 focused our argument because those services are what matter most in making this economy in this

00:09:26.880 country work for everybody but then there's also what happens when you gut a department and make

00:09:32.880 it a shell of itself you know we rely on wage to help inform the rest of government's work

00:09:39.280 on gender equality to make sure when they're announcing programs that they actually think

00:09:42.720 for at least a hot second about how those programs might impact women girls and queer people

00:09:48.160 if you take that away if you reduce their capacity to provide that advice and that guidance

00:09:52.880 you are risking a budget and a government that thinks about men and men only and doesn't factor

00:10:00.840 in the realities that are different for women and queer people across this country yeah and

00:10:06.000 i i think that that's something that has been a broader critique that we've heard several times

00:10:12.040 about mark carney i mean uh there i i didn't actually like prepare any quotes from this or

00:10:18.480 that i can pull up because i'm just going rogue a little here but um you know we we heard uh we saw

00:10:24.880 in practice when he was dealing with uh journalists in the election campaign and to this day that he

00:10:30.480 tends to lose his temper a little bit more quickly with female journalists and it's not just me

00:10:35.040 pointing that out chantelle a bear also said this and you know um there is the additional factor

00:10:41.440 that there were these murmurs and i heard this from my government sources too that it was a bit

00:10:46.080 bit of a boys club in the prime minister's office. And then we also saw how petty he was towards

00:10:52.620 Karina Gould, which came out of the Steve Marr article in McLean. So I guess this feels like a

00:11:01.660 prime example of the way that unconscious bias results in real proactive issues for

00:11:09.860 marginalized groups. I don't know if you can speak to that a little bit. Do you think that

00:11:14.560 that's a fair analysis or what are your thoughts? My hope is that that's not the case, right? Like

00:11:19.960 it's still early days. You're still trying to figure out like who is this PM and what is he

00:11:23.800 all about? But you know, right after the budget, I was in the lockup on Parliament Hill. And so

00:11:29.680 we got to like see the budget a little bit more, embargoed copy before it was live. And then right

00:11:34.880 after I was debriefing with a bunch of our pals in the career and feminist space. And I won't

00:11:38.760 attribute who said this because they deserve to speak for themselves. But one of the first

00:11:42.760 comments that I heard was, oh, this is a man's budget. This is a budget for the boys. It's a

00:11:49.220 budget with big military spending, with all of these cuts to help the tech bros make their next

00:11:56.220 billion. And it's not really thinking about everything else. And so I think that does

00:12:01.580 contribute to an aura of concern that maybe this PM doesn't understand the importance of gender

00:12:07.700 equity. And maybe he thinks it's a nice to have. Yes, it is nice to have a government that does

00:12:12.260 what Trudeau did, which is like trot out feminism for props and symbolism. And I care about the

00:12:18.500 moral and social right that is investing in these programs and services. But if you've got woman 0.98

00:12:24.920 shelters, the economy won't work in the way that it's meant to, because you will have less folks 1.00

00:12:29.340 able to get jobs, able to be supported. Canadians rely on those services. And so at the end of the

00:12:35.860 day, I'm hopeful that our read so far on Kearney isn't accurate. And I am like, you know, a little

00:12:43.240 bit appeased or made hopeful because we know that part of why we got these investments in the wage

00:12:49.720 budget was actually because of feminist liberal MPs and gals around the cabinet table who helped 1.00

00:12:56.000 articulate the critical investment that this needed to be. But it's still a bit of a mixed bag.

00:13:02.360 And I'm not really convinced or sure where PM Carney himself stands on these issues.

00:13:07.840 Yeah. You know, jumping off of that, I did want to ask you in a more broad sense, because, you know, I think as someone who's very involved in political organizing, you talk to a lot of unions, you talk to a lot of folks who have overlapping, but maybe their wheelhouse is on a different part of the intersections of, you know, injustice in our world.

00:13:29.600 So I did want to ask you about like, whether you have any thoughts of the direction the government seems to be heading in based on this budget. Personally, I found it to be a pretty big red flag that they're telling people we have to make sacrifices while they're also paying for all of these investments with cuts to public services, to the public service, to programs through, you know, not increasing their funding in the years to come.

00:13:59.600 which, you know, results in a slowdown.

00:14:02.780 But then also they're getting rid of, you know,

00:14:06.120 the capital gains increase that was canceled.

00:14:08.800 Looks like it's permanently gone.

00:14:10.980 The taxes on luxury planes and yachts and unused houses,

00:14:15.420 those are gone.

00:14:16.500 So it kind of feels to me like the people being asked

00:14:21.100 to make the sacrifices certainly aren't the ultra wealthy.

00:14:25.200 And all of that, you know, from an intersectional lens

00:14:27.720 has broader impacts on the work that I think all sorts of different activist groups do. So I guess

00:14:33.720 I wanted to ask you what your thoughts are on, in that broader read, the direction that the

00:14:39.140 government's heading in based on this budget. Oh, and that's like the million dollar question,

00:14:44.860 right? Like, what are the vibes and where are we headed? I think I would align with a lot of

00:14:51.300 concern around what kinds of choices are being made. This was billed as a generational budget,

00:14:56.620 but for which generations, for which segment of future generations.

00:15:01.700 And so I'm sitting here and I'm seeing, you know, I'm understanding the moment, right?

00:15:06.140 Like we are in a time where we need to unlock the potential and strength of our economy,

00:15:11.380 where we need to ensure that we are addressing inflation, tackling affordability and the cost

00:15:17.100 of living. But I think sometimes you see the ideology in Carney through where he is putting

00:15:24.060 those cuts and where he is placing those investments. The amount of money invested in

00:15:29.840 the military compared to anything social services is one great example. But also indeed, a lot

00:15:35.960 of tax cuts that seem aimed at those who already have a lot of wealth, those who are already

00:15:40.840 living quite nicely, instead of at working class Canadians, instead of at the folks who

00:15:47.220 are having a hard time paying their bills, affording their mortgage or their rent, or

00:15:51.380 or even putting groceries on the table.

00:15:53.440 And so I think time will tell, and it's a balancing act

00:15:55.980 because we do need to both strengthen our economy

00:15:58.500 and support the most vulnerable.

00:16:00.480 But I think we often rely on a false choice.

00:16:03.120 What I would say is that investing

00:16:04.680 in working class Canadians, investing in public services

00:16:09.320 and things like childcare and mental health services,

00:16:12.000 those lead to a stronger and more prosperous economy.

00:16:15.280 And in particular, an economy that works for everyone,

00:16:18.780 not just people who look like Mark Carney does.

00:16:21.380 Yeah. And I think that it feels extra egregious because of the fact that we just all jealously watched as New York elected Zoran Mamdani and saw that, like, these kinds of politics aren't just electable.

00:16:36.380 They are very popular. And the thing that I keep coming back to from that is that, you know, I think that the reason why we're seeing such a rise in this right wing populism is because those populist leaders are correctly diagnosing the issues that we're facing right now with respect to broadening income inequality.

00:16:55.000 You know, in Canada, it is the worst it has been since Stats Canada, Statistics Canada, started keeping track of income inequality in our country.

00:17:05.640 So, you know, there is an issue in our economy that maybe gets missed with these macroeconomic indicators like when you consider those big economic indicators that are always referenced by our leaders, you know,

00:17:21.460 which lead people like Christopher Freeland to call what we're experiencing a vibe session

00:17:26.100 when the reality is yes the very rich are doing very well but working class people are struggling

00:17:32.580 more than ever and I think that just to bring this full circle the conservatives are correctly

00:17:37.480 diagnosing that issue just the solutions that they're offering are kind of snake oil because

00:17:42.240 they are trickled down like policies that time and time again prove to be ineffective so I guess I

00:17:48.680 I just feel extra frustrated seeing a budget like this that offers these timid, outdated solutions to an issue when we know that there are other options.

00:17:58.700 And we just saw that through Zoran Mamdani.

00:18:02.260 And I'm just kind of rambling now, but I did want to ask you, in light of all of this, like this budget was a factor in conservatives crossing the floor to the liberals.

00:18:16.940 and they still call themselves red Tories in this floor crossing. So what do you make of

00:18:24.700 the state of our politics from that lens? And I guess in a sense, like, do you think we can

00:18:31.080 learn any lessons from the Zoran of it all? Oh, we have so many lessons that we desperately need

00:18:37.840 to learn from Zoran. And I would say like, as a progressive, you know, I think we are lacking

00:18:42.160 the strong like counter note to what is like a liberal Tory same old story kind of energy right

00:18:48.320 like so much of the conversation in Ottawa has been you know Mark Carney is a liberal but his

00:18:54.240 budget is for conservatives and his approach is conservatism and I think that that's a big

00:19:00.260 challenge because everyone is terrified of this Pierre Polyev guy right like we don't like him

00:19:05.560 We're worried about his, you know, obsession with identity politics and cultural war distractions.

00:19:13.160 And we are very worried about a PM who will joke or make comments about how, you know, political opponents need to be jailed or investigated by their RCMP.

00:19:22.120 I've seen, you know, him going off around recent Supreme Court decisions.

00:19:26.920 I grew up in a family where we thought that conservatives believed in the rule of law and respected the courts.

00:19:32.300 And so we're seeing this like scorched earth, I'm going to burn it down, get angry and channel that rage energy coming from Polyev. And then we're not really seeing that same like populist, in a good way in this context, like populist left wing response.

00:19:47.420 And I think, you know, the NDP leadership race is underway, and there are some candidates there that are bringing that energy, and I'm excited to see where that goes.

00:19:54.880 But in that gap, in that moment, there's not really a strong third option, and the first two options seem very similar.

00:20:04.160 Now, when it comes to, you know, Polyev, I think that he is starting to see more and more the price of a politic built on rage and with little substance underneath it.

00:20:13.940 And I deeply enjoy seeing some of the hypocrisies that emerged through, you know, conservatives branding themselves as the everyday man's guardian or defender.

00:20:23.940 You know, I think it was after the budget was dropped, as is done almost every year, there was like a party in downtown Ottawa where a bunch of liberals went and celebrated.

00:20:34.220 And they got criticized by, you know, Melissa Lansman for their like out of touch champagne politics, blah, blah, blah.

00:20:40.020 And I'm just sitting there being like, wait, so like a former law or a Walmart lobbyist is lecturing Canadians about affordability.

00:20:47.380 How much money does she make? How much money has she made?

00:20:50.700 When is the last time she had to worry about paying her bills or putting food on the table?

00:20:54.800 I would love for rich people to stop trying to pretend that they are anything other than rich people and to stop trying to pretend that they are the ones in touch with the working class when that is the furthest thing from the truth.

00:21:04.260 yeah well and also sorry just like as a personal aside i was in the press gallery for seven years

00:21:11.120 that party's an annual tradition and you can criticize it but i can tell you conservatives

00:21:15.880 went to it when i was on the hill so it's just i find it kind of ludicrous that because of the

00:21:22.120 populist sort of scorched earth politics that they're embracing that all of a sudden they're

00:21:27.320 pretending it's super weird to do this kind of thing when like i've had wine with michelle

00:21:32.140 Rempelgarner in the CTV offices. So, you know, it's just maybe that is a problem. But it's just

00:21:39.840 so ludicrous to see this shift where they pretend that this wasn't exactly what they did just years

00:21:45.240 ago before they decided to pretend to be something else. Yeah, I did want to ask you about that from

00:21:53.120 Polyev because that is sort of the flip side of this. I mean, there's the elements of what this

00:21:58.040 Floor Crossing tells us about the liberals and their style of governance and their policies and

00:22:02.560 why it might appeal to someone who is more of a red Tory. But there's also what it tells us about

00:22:07.460 Poliev. I mean, for years, he has been going on these like culture war issues, attacking the

00:22:13.900 vulnerable and just like, you know, talking about things that it's so funny. I actually noticed that

00:22:19.620 when Poliev went quiet for a bit after he lost his seat, some of you can correct me if I'm wrong,

00:22:26.060 because I'm saying this as a cis woman, but like I saw a bit of a die down in at least the political

00:22:33.740 conversation about trans rights. People moved on to other stuff when there wasn't Polyev directing

00:22:39.820 their rage as like clearly in that direction. It still existed. Absolutely. There's still plenty

00:22:45.440 of transphobia, but then he came back and he started sending emails and he started, you know,

00:22:51.860 getting loud again and some of the first stuff he did was attacking trans folks and it just ramped

00:22:56.820 up again and so i i guess i wanted to ask you like do you think that that's also part of why we're

00:23:02.420 seeing this floor crossing is because he's leaning into these weirdo culture war issues that normal

00:23:07.700 people don't actually care about unless they're disinformed into caring about them absolutely you

00:23:14.260 know i think i think that a lot of like more centrist conservatives are in a really tough

00:23:20.180 situation because like they they are conservatives right and like their belief in uh and their

00:23:26.340 support for the conservative party is is often something that has mattered to them throughout

00:23:30.100 their lives but i think they've also like lost the fight for the soul of the conservative party

00:23:34.500 uh and i think many are wondering is there any way to to win back momentum again uh when we look

00:23:40.900 at you know aaron o'toole the past leader of the conservatives and compare him with polyev

00:23:46.180 i see a leader there who could you know flirt with centrists and maybe even bring over some

00:23:51.220 progressives versus polyev who seems to be more focused on firing up his base than in doing

00:23:57.380 anything else and so i think for those conservatives who are more center of the road who are looking

00:24:02.420 at carney and recognizing that this guy was first appointed under harper uh that this guy

00:24:08.180 is in many ways again like aligned with their fiscal beliefs and if they're pissed that their

00:24:14.180 leaders scorched earth culture war politics it's a pretty strong case to say what if you went over

00:24:20.260 the to the other eye or like cross that aisle um and helped govern instead of just being part of

00:24:25.780 a party that wants to burn things down all around them yeah yeah totally um and and that really is

00:24:34.260 the the reality of the kinds of politics that we are seeing polyev embrace is that that burning

00:24:40.980 everything down because what are you left with when you convince people to hate each other to

00:24:46.180 this degree right and i wanted to ask you on that topic because it's something that i personally

00:24:51.220 grapple with too when i'm you know on social media and trying to i i think there's a lot of power in

00:24:58.340 the conversations that we have in the public square and those influence how people think

00:25:03.380 as i just demonstrated with the situation where polyev started sending out fundraising emails or

00:25:09.060 you know sending out tweets about trans folks and all of a sudden there were more conversations

00:25:13.860 vilifying trans folks so um sometimes like i try to provide a counter voice or hit back at some of

00:25:22.580 this but i wondered what you think about how like where the line is when it comes to further

00:25:31.300 inflaming these divisions versus helping to counter them because if i like for me i think oh

00:25:38.980 if a trans kid is seeing all of this hate hopefully they see a positive supportive post

00:25:44.580 and that kind of gives them that little boost that they need to to hang on but what if that propels

00:25:51.540 a ton of hate in response to it that then other trans kids see when they might not have seen the

00:25:56.420 hate in the first place so i guess that's sort of my question to you is where is that line

00:26:02.180 and i think i think that's a lot of where we we feel stuck and i i know i often do is like you

00:26:07.140 know when polyev or danielle smith are coming for trans people and they're using all this

00:26:11.380 misinformation like how much do we engage and directly refute and what i would say is a few

00:26:17.140 things first like social media has broken our brains already um and we need to learn to engage

00:26:22.420 in other spaces right like the the ecosystem is so polarized that it's hard to have real

00:26:27.300 conversations anymore i think the like degree of character assassination and personal attacks you

00:26:32.260 and i both receive is indicative of that and the efforts to like frame us as these like scary

00:26:38.580 radicals or conspiracy theorists and i'm just like y'all like yes the far right has done

00:26:44.580 a good case study on character assassination by coming for us

00:26:52.420 they just froze for me but oh there you go you're back okay the last thing i heard from you was that

00:27:02.980 the right did a good case study and character assassination through us which is absolutely true

00:27:07.940 so please carry on and so i guess like what i would say yeah like first again in-person

00:27:14.900 conversations and i think rejecting the frame that they're placing on the table right like

00:27:19.220 they want you to believe that it is either protect the rights of parents or the rights

00:27:25.380 of trans kids well how about if instead we built schools where every kid could be themselves and

00:27:29.860 we welcomed the involvement of parents in their child's education what if we believed in freedom

00:27:35.860 without the exceptions of freedom when it comes to trans people but when it came to all people

00:27:40.900 and so i think we need to respond when it's happening in the moment we need to be out there

00:27:44.980 and providing that counterpoint but then in our everyday work we need to be having these

00:27:50.540 conversations and doing so on our terms because when we seed space to them and they define the

00:27:56.060 conversation well they've already focus grouped the slogans they're using and they boxed us into

00:28:00.760 a corner and so let's reject that corner let's rise above and let's come back to what every

00:28:06.260 canadian believes in a country where freedom is for everyone where we believe in rights and we

00:28:11.700 want governments telling us how to live or what we can do with our bodies yeah yeah absolutely

00:28:16.500 that's i think that's a a great uh little lesson and how to handle this trash um you know and i

00:28:24.660 think one thing i always think about and uh i i've seen you make this point as well is just

00:28:30.340 the ways in which um all of our rights are intertwined and i i think that we keep getting

00:28:36.660 more and more evidence of this of how you know as we see lawmakers come for trans folks rights

00:28:44.580 there will be uh cisgendered folks who don't uh care or if anything will like actively join in on

00:28:53.460 this but then next thing you know these policies bleed into policing how those cisgendered women 1.00

00:28:59.300 present like a bathroom ban is going to uh necessitate for enforcement a enforcement 1.00

00:29:07.540 of femininity so if if you are peeing and your hair is too short even if you're a cisgendered

00:29:15.460 woman there is a very good chance that your expression of femininity and how you choose

00:29:20.660 to live as a cis woman will be it'll be policed because in order to not face harassment while

00:29:28.020 going pee, you have to present as feminine as possible. And so these are sort of the ways in

00:29:34.360 which these policies that start by absolutely abusing and vilifying trans folks, they also

00:29:40.000 bleed into other communities. So even if you don't care about other people, at least if you can care

00:29:44.940 about yourself, you know, maybe that'll give you the juice you need to, to fight these things. But

00:29:50.760 I guess I wanted to ask you like, about this interrelated nature of human rights and how you

00:29:56.820 see and experience this in the work that you're doing so I like to think about this in two angles

00:30:02.940 first is exactly what you alluded to like the social environment they target trans people and

00:30:07.980 like turn us into a boogeyman to make an example of us as like bad gender performance and what that

00:30:14.100 leads to is a world where like the butch lesbian is going to be mistreated the gender non-conforming

00:30:18.520 tomboy like this whole resurgence of a like social conservatism right like and we're seeing it when 1.00

00:30:25.860 comes to like has feminism gone too far and like trad wives and incels like all of that really is

00:30:32.500 like the resurgence of a social conservative politic that should be worrying to anybody who

00:30:36.580 wants to like look however they want to look sleep with who they want to sleep with and live

00:30:40.580 like maybe alternative lifestyles so there's there's a piece there and a piece where the like

00:30:46.100 rage and um like polarization that is fuel that is being fueled here will make it harder for folks

00:30:52.020 of all kinds right like if if you can create an environment where it's permissible to demonize

00:30:56.660 trans people who the hell do you think conservatives are going to go after next it's going to be

00:31:00.820 newcomers it's going to be a bring back of the cultural or the barbaric cultural practices tip

00:31:05.540 line kind of energy and so there's a huge component and concern in the social space

00:31:11.540 and then the second place is the erosion of checks and balances on government power

00:31:16.500 and this is where i'm really like this is where i think we see the biggest departure from what

00:31:21.380 conservatives used to be they used to be the ones that didn't want the government telling you what

00:31:26.180 you could or couldn't do with their bodies or with your bodies and now in alberta we have premier

00:31:30.980 danielle smith mandating sex checks on women and girls so they can play the right sports 0.72

00:31:35.540 we have a politician in your family doctor's office violating the sacrosanct relationship

00:31:40.580 between a patient and their physician and we have a concerted effort to weaken the notwithstanding

00:31:46.820 the charter of rights and freedoms now i understand why that clause exists that allows you to suspend

00:31:52.580 for a period of up to five years equality rights and other components like that that clause was

00:31:57.540 negotiated for a reason but it was not meant to be used flippantly or irresponsibly you know in

00:32:03.140 saskatchewan premier mo actually invoked the clause uh prior to a court ruling because he was so scared

00:32:10.180 that a that the courts would say hey you're harming vulnerable children that he didn't even

00:32:14.980 want them to be able to consider the case in alberta we're seeing the use of the notwithstanding

00:32:20.900 clause to try to force teachers back to work meanwhile parents are struggling with larger

00:32:25.860 and larger class sizes that aren't giving the kids their kids the support and services that they

00:32:31.060 deserve and so there's the social battle that we need to make sure we are fighting tooth and nail

00:32:36.980 and then there's also the erosion of rights and freedoms of checks and balances on government

00:32:42.260 power i don't want to live in a country where politicians are able to erroneously override

00:32:49.060 our court system if we have to do that i want it to be done in a manner that is cautious that is

00:32:55.460 aware of the risk and the danger and it is grounded in genuine concern but and i hate to bring in the

00:33:01.780 like supreme court ruling in terms of uh the pedophilia strike down of mandatory minimums

00:33:07.700 But it is very important. It's a great conservative opportunity to go off about Trudeau and about

00:33:13.700 Carney. But what happens when you say, actually, we are going to violate or potentially violate

00:33:21.140 the freedom and rights of some in order to serve a angry political narrative? That's a terrifying

00:33:28.020 precedence. Absolutely. Actually, I'm really glad that you brought up the notwithstanding clause,

00:33:32.980 because that was something I wanted to to talk about here because it is really for the so Faye

00:33:39.300 kind of already did a great job just quickly explaining it you can tell that like she does

00:33:43.660 this all the time hey she like drops a a big fancy word that no one understands quickly defines it

00:33:49.880 doesn't even like break a sweat while making her point but for those of you who didn't pick it up

00:33:55.960 from Fay, the notwithstanding clause is a clause in our charter that allows governments to pause

00:34:04.080 or override or violate certain charter rights. Not all of them. There's some exceptions that

00:34:11.140 this can't apply to, but there are rights that can be overridden or ignored for a period of five

00:34:16.740 years while enforcing a law. And this is what was used in, and it's being fought in the courts,

00:34:23.520 But the Saskatchewan, you know, basically forcing forcibly outing kids to their parents.

00:34:30.560 There's it's being used in Alberta. It's being used with the Quebec religious symbols law.

00:34:38.980 So what we're seeing time and time again and now, you know, in Alberta with respect to the teacher strike.

00:34:44.320 So what we're seeing is that every time this is used and the original framers, you can see this on the Library of Parliament website,

00:34:50.480 intended this to be a safety valve that is rarely used and not used for controversial issues.

00:34:59.920 But I have to say, I was a little bit optimistic because I find it hard to think of a situation in

00:35:03.980 which overriding someone's charter rights wouldn't be controversial. But it is supposed to be this

00:35:08.660 very scarcely used. But what we're seeing time and time and time again is conservative governments

00:35:14.240 use this clause to violate marginalized people and vulnerable people's rights. It's being used

00:35:21.880 to violate trans folks' rights. It's being used to violate the rights of religious minorities,

00:35:26.780 and it's being used to violate the rights of workers. So it is fundamentally being used to

00:35:31.740 regress our politics. And I guess I wanted to ask you about, as we're seeing this trend,

00:35:37.800 how concerned are you about the future of trans rights in this country, particularly as we are

00:35:42.420 seeing a shift towards you know conservative governments keep winning in these provincial

00:35:46.340 elections and they are the ones who are continually enacting and using the notwithstanding clause

00:35:52.020 that's just a fact so what what are your thoughts on that so i think you know first like one of the

00:35:58.820 the concepts that upheld or upholds the notwithstanding clause is the idea of parliamentary

00:36:04.580 supremacy right it's the idea that like the will of the people as uh conveyed or administered

00:36:09.380 through their elected representatives should be above anything and everything. And that makes a

00:36:14.920 lot of sense in a healthy liberal democracy. But the idea was that governments would have to pay

00:36:20.400 a political price if they were being irresponsible in their use of that clause. And that's why you

00:36:24.780 see a five-year limit, right? So that at some stage, that government's going to have to go

00:36:28.860 back to the electorate to get a new mandate. I think what that clause didn't factor in was a

00:36:35.000 politics of polarization, an era of misinformation, and a loss of, I think, like a loss of some of

00:36:43.640 the like foundational understandings that, you know, generations past understood to be core to

00:36:49.040 a healthy democracy. So, you know, we got a whole lot of rage. And so it makes it so much tougher

00:36:53.880 to have real conversations. Now, I think when it comes to, you know, the future of trans rights

00:37:00.040 and what happens when we have the flippant use of the notwithstanding clause it is of course like

00:37:05.240 the deepest cause for concern uh because if we don't have the one check and balance on government

00:37:10.440 power i.e the court system uh that we have relied on in the past how do we make sure that we protect

00:37:17.320 the rights of vulnerable people now my like diamond in the rough is as follows you know um

00:37:23.560 we've always had governments come in for the rights of our communities it's only in the last few

00:37:28.040 like years or decade or two where we've seen like not hostile governments and we've also had

00:37:34.360 periods of backlash time and time again in the 70s the 80s the 90s there's always these windows

00:37:40.440 uh and guess what we've done on each of those occasions we have organized we've advocated and

00:37:45.480 we've won the public over to our side and we have built progress uh in the midst of those rollbacks

00:37:51.480 and so i think my world is really scared right now and my heart is breaking for the trans kids

00:37:56.440 in Saskatchewan and in Alberta, and they deserve so much better than this. But at the same time,

00:38:02.200 I am confident that as this politics of rage continues, more and more Canadians will wake up

00:38:08.600 to the poison pill that they're being offered by Kira Polyev. More and more people will become

00:38:13.960 inoculated against this politic of anger, but it requires us offering a politic of hope instead.

00:38:20.520 A politic that believes in a Canada where freedom includes everyone, and where we actually lift our

00:38:25.560 neighbors up when they're going through tough times even if their families look different from

00:38:29.640 our own and i'm really hopeful i'm placing all of my i'm betting placing all my bets on this concept

00:38:37.720 that we can overcome anger and like we can see a shared humanity and it starts by connecting

00:38:44.280 through shared values and a vision of what we want i want a generational

00:38:48.520 change in canadian society that actually delivers for everyday canadians not just some of us

00:38:55.560 Yes. Thank you. And you know what? I think that that is what was so powerful about and why the world was watching the election in New York City, because that was what Zoran Mamdani represented.

00:39:13.400 it. He had all of these policies that, you know, also like progressive or seemingly progressive

00:39:20.220 or democratic establishment politicians have disavowed as way too radical, you won't be able

00:39:28.220 to get elected on that, yada, yada. And he just said, no, we're going to have hope. We're going

00:39:32.700 to push. We're going to do this. And he proved that hope can win. And also voters across the

00:39:39.040 United States proved that as Trump is doing these increasingly anti-democratic actions and attacking

00:39:45.800 people's neighbors, rounding them up in the streets, people are not okay with that. And they

00:39:50.840 will use the tools at their disposal to push back. I just think it's so inspiring. And you

00:39:58.800 are like Zoran in the sense that you are someone who doesn't give up, who keeps organizing in the

00:40:05.320 face of fear. So many attacks were levied at him. He was, you know, painted with every kind of

00:40:10.760 racist attack that they could pull out of their, you know, pockets. Everything was tried and

00:40:17.720 thrown at him. And he was relentless. He didn't give up. And you are the same way. You keep

00:40:22.640 organizing in the face of fear. And I wanted to ask you, you know, and you kind of already just

00:40:28.060 said it but what do you like how do you keep going and what do you say to people who look at all of

00:40:37.020 this and are struggling to find that energy to pick up and to keep going and to be relentless

00:40:43.740 in the face of these attacks and to you know hold on to hope how do you do that

00:40:51.420 well first thank you comparison to zorwan is like terrifying i'm gonna like

00:40:54.460 sorry i think i'm like i'm not complaining yeah i think you know there's there's a couple things

00:41:03.580 the foundation is i think recognizing how much progress we've made and who's benefited from it

00:41:08.780 right like i refuse to go backwards because i know what backwards looked like it looked like a world

00:41:13.980 where you know matthew shepherd was murdered in america simply for being gay it looks like a world

00:41:19.820 where trans people before me were forced out of their homes and made to live in hostile environments

00:41:26.940 and just suffer so deeply simply for being themselves i am reminded that it is we are

00:41:33.740 stronger now than we have ever been before we are movements that have changed the fabric of

00:41:40.860 civilization in such incredible ways and i am made hopeful because i see the kids that are benefiting

00:41:47.820 from that progress today and we told them that they deserve the freedom to be themselves and

00:41:53.180 now we have to fight like hell to defend that freedom and i refuse to let that be a broken

00:41:57.820 promise i refuse to let this world go back to the one that taught my generation to hate ourselves

00:42:04.780 and that we deserved and had to hide who we are i think canada is ready for all that my community

00:42:10.700 has to offer and i think canada will benefit from accepting us because our acceptance will lead to

00:42:16.300 a world where everyone is more free from the patriarchy colonialism racism classist

00:42:21.980 bullshit that we have been sold by centrists and conservatives for generations yeah well

00:42:28.620 faye that was all the questions that i had prepared i do have some more stuff i would throw

00:42:34.700 at you but i want to also give the audience a chance to get some questions in if they have any

00:42:40.540 so um if you guys have anything you want to ask faye or myself please feel free to put that in

00:42:45.740 in the chat now. And while I give you a minute to do that, Faye, can you tell people who have

00:42:50.680 listened to you for the last 45 minutes and have felt that hope and excitement where they can keep

00:42:57.120 up with both you and your work? Absolutely. So on Twitter, which we refuse to call by anything else

00:43:03.880 and that yes, I have not been chased off of yet. You can find me at Faye Johnstone. I love a good

00:43:09.680 pun. So my Instagram is at fading away because like she disappears sometimes. And if you want

00:43:15.560 support my organization's work you can go to momentumcanada.net and have no doubt we are going

00:43:21.720 to continue making noise at this current uh federal government but also we're soon going to be

00:43:27.480 tapping back in in a big way in alberta uh where the government is looking like it's going to

00:43:32.120 introduce the notwithstanding clause within the month and so stay tuned because we're going to

00:43:37.160 have to get real angry and encourage all of y'all to do the same to protect the rights and freedoms

00:43:41.960 of trans kids and their families. Yeah. Awesome. Thank you so much, Faye. And just so you know,

00:43:47.520 that is Faye F-A-E. So that in the pun fading away is F-A-E. So we do have one super chat here

00:43:54.640 that I'm going to pull up. Nicholas Chopp says, speaking of social media, have you two heard of

00:43:59.900 the North Sky Project, a Canadian LGBT branch of Blue Sky? It's still in the works, but hopefully

00:44:04.760 it can detoxify some social media. So I don't know what your reaction is to that, Faye, and what you

00:44:09.280 think of these alternative social medias that are popping up um whether you think they'll work

00:44:13.700 whether you think they are powerful or if they're gonna turn into just little community spaces that

00:44:19.820 might not move the needle the way some other social media platforms can but can at least be

00:44:23.380 a source of support what are your thoughts on them i think i'm twofold first like it's the same

00:44:28.720 reason i'm still on x is kind of the same reason that i'm like not always jumping into the new like

00:44:35.080 lefty social media place and that is i don't want to cede space i think that there is a risk we

00:44:39.800 already have an echo chamber on the left we don't like to admit it but we do and i want to make sure

00:44:44.120 that we are engaging beyond that space um but at the same time oh my god i am so excited the concept

00:44:49.400 of a social media platform where i can actually be a human being and not worry that everything

00:44:53.000 that i say or do is going to be taken out of context and turned into a like far right attack

00:44:57.640 and so i'm like stay on the platforms and fight for that space while protecting yourself as you

00:45:03.400 do it but also find those other spaces that can be more community-based and can be safer for you

00:45:10.840 because i think those help us stay present in the global arena as well yeah yeah um i i totally

00:45:18.680 agree i it's a bit of a controversial position apparently like i hear see from some of my peers

00:45:23.880 that i choose to stay on twitter but i honestly just the if the decision makers didn't stay on

00:45:30.920 there, I would leave. But the fact that so many who are making the decisions in the newsrooms of

00:45:36.580 Canada, the biggest newsrooms and the biggest halls of power in terms of politics are continuing to

00:45:42.340 scroll on that hell site means that if all of us just remove ourselves who provide a different

00:45:48.380 perspective on these issues, they might become convinced that these loudest voices that are in

00:45:55.080 fact minority voices that are in fact agitating in bad faith a lot of the time are the reality

00:46:01.500 of Canadian society. So I feel the need to counter that because of the fact that these

00:46:07.420 individuals who have so much power in our society refuse to learn that lesson. There was another

00:46:15.820 question here. Someone wanted to know, are there any strong advocates of the LGBTQIA community who

00:46:21.140 running for office that you know of um i don't know if you have any names off at the top of your

00:46:25.380 head or folks who are getting into politics that you're excited about or folks who are already in

00:46:29.780 politics that you're excited about that people can follow or look to as a north star perhaps uh

00:46:35.140 what are your thoughts on that any names oh this one is easy um so actually i mean some of it is

00:46:40.180 like there's not many i don't think there's any election currently underway on a provincial or

00:46:44.100 federal level. But Lane Treasurer was just re-elected, is a non-binary Yukon NDP MLA up in

00:46:52.520 the territories, and they are a badass and a source of hope for me. But then we also got folks

00:46:58.080 like Logan Oxenham in Manitoba, the first openly trans man in provincial elected office. We've got

00:47:06.620 folks like Janice Irwin, who is doing so much good for the gays and everybody else, making us all

00:47:13.300 fall in love um and feel like butch envy out in alberta and so i think we have these champions

00:47:20.020 i think there's a lot of them across different parties um and my invitation is i think we again

00:47:26.100 i hate social media despite being a doom stroller myself my invitation is like that's actually

00:47:32.020 organized to support their campaigns uh now more than ever it's great to share our hot takes on

00:47:36.820 socials but we need to show up and knock on doors to help get good gays that they selected into

00:47:41.220 office. Yeah. So that was the only other question that I saw. Oh, you know what? Sorry. I caught 1.00

00:47:47.680 another one here. I was going to be greedy and ask you another one of mine, but I'm going to

00:47:51.900 throw this one at you. And then if no other one comes through, I'll throw you one last one from

00:47:55.160 me. But someone says, Canadian here, how do either of you navigate social media to fight the good

00:48:00.540 fight without being exhausted by the toxicity of certain media? What do you, how do you do this,

00:48:06.380 say i think you know a lot of it i mean the shitty thing i would say is that you become

00:48:12.460 hardened to it like it rolls off of you when you've been like broken and jaded about it enough

00:48:16.660 times like there were moments when yes it broke me three years ago uh now i'm really good at

00:48:22.320 blocking people and i'm really good at ignoring what's happening on my socials and i manage it by

00:48:27.300 going back into community i joke that i have been to more drag shows and gay clubs than ever before

00:48:33.380 since I came into this role because it's powerful to realize that these are just trolls on socials

00:48:38.420 and that like community is thriving in our own spaces without them. And so like hang out in

00:48:45.380 community, ignore the haters and like have fun because fun is one of the things that will keep

00:48:51.200 our movements going. Totally. I completely agree. It's the same thing with me. Like I know it's such

00:48:56.800 a thing to say, go touch grass, et cetera. But like really each blade of grass is, I feel like

00:49:05.160 symbolically touching grass is like each blade of grass is another member of your community. And

00:49:09.680 just like reacquainting yourself with that community, reminding yourself that the internet

00:49:13.600 is not real. Like it is real in the sense that it has offline impact, but the voices that you see

00:49:19.560 on there aren't necessarily reflective of how broader society as a whole thinks. There are

00:49:25.160 going to be the loudest, awful voices on there. But you have to remember that the average person

00:49:30.100 you run into in the street, first of all, a lot of those people who will say that to you online

00:49:33.020 wouldn't even say that to your face in person. But like, the average person you run into either

00:49:37.740 doesn't care, or I like to think hopefully are kind. And so I have those moments where I surround

00:49:42.920 myself by that proverbial grass. And that reminds me that there are a lot of good people in this

00:49:47.680 world. And I think that with things like the election of Zoran, we saw that if those people

00:49:51.900 all come together and care that they can really win something because the um the politics of hate

00:49:58.460 is very mobilizing and those politics have been mobilized for years while a lot of people felt

00:50:03.820 apathetic because they weren't being offered exciting positive solutions but i think that

00:50:08.780 what we're seeing now is a lot of folks building momentum building those positive solutions and

00:50:14.300 I'm hopeful that as more people get involved and start to express the care that they do feel inside, that we'll start to see a shift in the narrative.

00:50:25.980 But that actually leads me to the thing I wanted to talk about with you, Faye, because you mentioned earlier, and I think it's so interesting, like you and I have dealt with these really intense attacks on our character.

00:50:38.120 and I wanted to ask you whether you feel as though that is something because I personally

00:50:44.500 have a lot of feelings about this but I wonder about how those character assassinations have

00:50:50.060 been effective in slowing progressive movements because you know if they make all of they being

00:50:57.100 these sort of loud haters on social media and stuff when they watch us like hawks using what's

00:51:02.920 referred to as like the gamer gate model but I won't get into all that right now

00:51:06.320 When you're watched like a hawk by someone who dislikes you for you, for your opinions, but then anytime you make a mistake or do anything that they can conceive as being problematic, they will amplify it and pretend that that's the thing they care about when it's actually you as an individual and what you represent in your politics.

00:51:24.640 But then our media isn't really taught to look for intent or to look to differentiate between good faith outrage and bad faith outrage.

00:51:36.920 And so what ends up happening is they'll both sides those issues or they'll view you as controversial as a result and say, oh, when there's smoke, there's fire, yada, yada.

00:51:45.580 So I wanted to know, like, is that something that you've encountered? And what lessons do you think our media and our society needs to learn about not participating in these character assassinations and smears as a result of, you know, these bad faith attacks?

00:52:03.940 I think it's one of the like, I think I like to read it first as like a demonstration of success. Like we're clearly doing something effectively if they're like this invested in coming after us.

00:52:13.660 like the funniest thing for me is that like my profile would be so much smaller if the far right

00:52:19.340 wasn't obsessed with me like the fact that they go out of their way to like smack around anything

00:52:24.300 that i'm involved in like babes like i don't think about y'all but they have like dozens of photos

00:52:29.260 of both of us saved on their phones and i'm just like oh it's so weird um you're so normal wow

00:52:36.460 people just do that right they just like save pictures of folks uh it's not creepy by any means

00:52:42.220 um but i i think for me i like to rest on the fact that like they've created this whole like

00:52:47.020 false persona of who i am and then people meet me and have a conversation with me and they realize

00:52:53.260 that i'm like pretty much just like another human who wants to chat and that actually works in our

00:52:58.620 favor when they frame us as unreasonable and we are as reasonable as i know us to be they look

00:53:04.700 like extremists and they look like assholes and idiots and so i think that their character

00:53:10.940 assassination strategies will eventually and are already starting to blow back on them we saw what's

00:53:15.980 wrong he just like ran into it and kept going and then those folks over there looked unhinged when

00:53:21.340 he just brushed off their criticism as the bad faith attacks that it were that they were and

00:53:27.100 so i think there's a lot there um but i also think the risk is the overton window shifting

00:53:33.180 right so i think we see if we don't you know respond with the politics of hope and goodness

00:53:39.580 i think there is a risk that those narratives coming from certain segments of the far right

00:53:43.980 filter more into mainstream media and then it gets harder for those of us who are in like

00:53:48.460 unofficial spokespeople roles uh to get booked on those shows whereas on the right wing they're not

00:53:55.020 bringing the like centrist anti-trans person who has like feelings and questions i want to chat

00:54:00.140 with that person uh they're throwing up the unhinged i want to like criminalize and loathe

00:54:05.020 of those transes. And so we need to make sure that we are wary of that and building our own

00:54:11.360 movements and the power of our own response so that they can't shut us out of the public hands

00:54:16.060 square. Totally. Yeah. I always think of that Cardi B quote where she was like, she was accepting

00:54:22.700 an award or something. And she was like, and shout out to my haters because you're commenting

00:54:27.480 on my stuff and blowing it up and you made me famous. So it is sort of a byproduct, but it is

00:54:34.080 true that um i i think that a difficulty with as i mentioned the media is that they they can't it's

00:54:40.800 difficult to differentiate intent or determine intent and differentiate between good faith and

00:54:45.520 bad faith and as a result of that we end up with situations where they'll have these sort of

00:54:50.720 radical people on air from the right um but then they'll also feel as though we are you and i are

00:54:57.360 like loco because of the bad faith attacks that we get and then they're surprised when they actually

00:55:03.760 see this in person which then kind of brings us full circle to the power of showing up in person

00:55:08.960 and having community because i think that also helps to remove the false branding that people

00:55:14.000 like you and i get because of the relentless character assassinations which are really

00:55:19.440 evidence of our strength um so faye thank you so much for coming on the show today i really

00:55:25.360 appreciate your time um is there anything that uh you didn't get the chance to touch on that you

00:55:31.680 you want to say we've got like a minute left so I figured I'd give you the floor if you have

00:55:35.280 anything else you want to mention I think just like I mean first like a thank you to you for

00:55:40.140 creating a space and a platform where we can have these conversations because I think it is like

00:55:44.660 the counter note that the world needs in an era of doom and gloom and then for everyone else

00:55:50.840 watching I would say just like remember that it is scary uh but fear is what they want you to feel

00:55:57.380 and hope is a choice. It's not always an easy choice when the world is on fire,

00:56:02.140 but progressive change has always happened when good people tap in. And when we tap in,

00:56:07.380 in unity, in a belief in a better future, nobody can stop us. We've always been outgunned. The

00:56:13.420 rich have always had more money than we do, but we have won and we will keep winning as long as

00:56:18.400 we keep hoping and showing up to make good things happen. Thank you so much, Faye. I think that's a

00:56:23.880 great note to end things on. I really appreciate your time today and hopefully I can badger you

00:56:28.100 to come back soon. Oh, absolutely. Thanks so much, Rachel.

00:56:37.800 Thank you for listening to this week's episode of Bubble Pop. I'm Rachel Gilmore,

00:56:42.220 your least favorite person's least favorite journalist. If you enjoyed this episode,

00:56:45.820 consider subscribing on YouTube, Patreon, Substack, or wherever you like to listen.

00:56:50.400 You can also find me on TikTok, Instagram, Twitch, and Blue Sky.

00:56:54.660 I'd like to give a special thank you to Hans Vivian Wenzel for making the incredibly groovy

00:56:58.780 music for Bubble Pop.

00:57:00.060 You can find more of his stuff on Spotify under the artist named Hans.

00:57:03.800 That's a lowercase h with an exclamation mark.

00:57:06.920 Thank you again for spending this time with me.

00:57:08.980 This is my dream job.

00:57:10.560 I know I say that every week, but that's because it's true every week.

00:57:13.720 And I couldn't do it for one second without your support.

00:57:16.620 So thank you.

00:57:17.960 And I'll see you next time.

00:57:20.400 I'll see you next time.

Bubble Pop with Rachel Gilmore - November 08, 2025

Getting things done despite all the doom (feat. Fae Johnstone)

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