Culture Club - Creativity In The Desert & Embracing Change & Self-Doubt With Courtney Barnett

00:00:00.000 Following creativity in the desert, harnessing change in your 30s, and the process of making

00:00:10.100 her new album Creature of Habit with the musician Courtney Barnett. I'm Jasmine and you're listening

00:00:16.000 to a special solo episode of Culture Club Chats where we sit down with a guest to chat all things

00:00:21.160 life, culture, and creativity. Today I'm recording on the lands of the Wurundjeri

00:00:31.680 Wurrung people. I would like to pay my respects to Elders past and present and extend this

00:00:36.420 to any Aboriginal or Torres Strait Islander listeners today.

00:00:43.040 Today's guest is the musician Courtney Barnett, who has just released her fourth album,

00:00:47.560 Creature of Habit. The album is all about embracing change and journeying through

00:00:51.660 self-doubt via Courtney's signature poetic lyricism and instantly recognizable indie rock

00:00:57.040 melodies. In this chat, Courtney and I spoke about her process of writing the album in Joshua Tree,

00:01:02.680 how her debut album, Sometimes I Sit and Think and Sometimes I Just Sit, feels after 10 years,

00:01:08.180 harnessing her creativity and getting rigorously curious about indecision and anxiety. I hope you

00:01:14.000 enjoy it well I'm calling from Melbourne and you are in LA at the moment and I wish I could send

00:01:21.200 you a Melbourne coffee through the screen oh I would love a Melbourne coffee how is it in LA at

00:01:28.120 the moment like it's two o'clock in the afternoon there how how are things living in LA it is good

00:01:34.980 um it's nice I um I have I just um adopted a dog last year so I've been loving um having a little

00:01:43.860 dog in my life I just fed him so that he didn't um bark while we were talking and um yeah I've

00:01:52.080 been really I've been really enjoying living here between here and Joshua Tree I was a couple of

00:01:57.680 years ago. And yeah, it's been nice. And congratulations on Creature of Habit. I loved

00:02:04.700 it. Luckily got a preview link and I think I have like five favorite songs. I just, it's so hard

00:02:09.860 to choose between them. And I promise I'm not just saying that. How are you feeling about it

00:02:14.640 nearly being out in the world? Like it's coming out in March. I feel so good about it. I just

00:02:19.520 feel really excited I think I've um I've gone through the stressful moments and the um the

00:02:27.560 all of the kind of fear that normally comes before a release and I'm sure it'll come back

00:02:33.780 you know the the week before the album comes out but um but I feel I feel really happy with it and

00:02:41.060 I feel really proud of the album and I've been working on it for so long um like I started

00:02:48.100 writing it at the start of 2023 and um so it really you know it feels like it's been with me

00:02:56.240 for a while and when I finally just the day that I was like it's done it's finished there's no

00:03:04.640 there's no part of it that I want to change or that I feel embarrassed about that's normally my

00:03:11.220 um like my marker that it's not finished and yeah I just I'm really excited yeah yeah because I think

00:03:18.980 as artists it's so easy to like just want to keep going over things and like nothing ever really

00:03:25.480 feels done when you're like pouring your heart out onto a page and obviously your style of

00:03:30.480 songwriting and lyricism is very like not diary like but it's very raw and so yeah I can imagine

00:03:37.020 that feeling of just like wanting to keep it like keep working on it and three years when did you

00:03:44.500 actually like finish finish the album like you started 2023 when did you when did you get to

00:03:50.600 that point of like no this is done now so I remember I was in it was like the middle of last

00:03:57.580 year I got the masters back so that was like the final step so maybe a month or two before then I

00:04:05.680 probably recorded the final vocal got it all mixed did all that so but yeah so at this point

00:04:13.240 I probably finished it half a year ago what was the last song you recorded if you remember I do

00:04:20.260 because we um I kind of recorded the album in portions I thought I was going to get it all

00:04:25.380 done in the first one but then I didn't um so I went away and tried to finish some of those songs

00:04:31.300 and then during that process I kind of I ended up writing some brand new songs almost I think

00:04:40.440 I think I was trying to distract myself from the work that I was trying to do but I ended up

00:04:47.400 recording new songs so I did the last songs I did were Stay In Your Lane, Sight Unseen, Sugar Plum

00:04:53.040 and Mostly Patient was maybe the very last one. I really really love Sugar Plum. Oh cool thanks.

00:04:59.680 um apparently for this album you showed up in the studio with much less of a plan and you kind of

00:05:05.580 let it rip how was that process different the fourth time around of like just going to a studio

00:05:11.160 in Joshua Tree jamming with your band what was that like I think normally I have been maybe a

00:05:18.060 little more organized or when I say that I mean songs have been a little more finished um and this

00:05:27.100 time I, when I started writing in March, 2023, I set myself a deadline of March, 2024 to get in

00:05:36.240 the studio. So I just kind of made, made up this date and, and yeah, I just felt like I kind of

00:05:44.340 needed some parameters or something to work towards. So I booked the studio, you know, I got

00:05:51.400 the band um and you know people came from all over the world the people I wanted to work with

00:05:58.480 and and um and it was great we did some really good stuff but some of the songs just weren't

00:06:03.580 I I hadn't finished them and I hadn't finished them lyrics and and then um so I feel like not

00:06:09.820 other times I've maybe been a little more prepared but I was um I was kind of just

00:06:16.060 you know trying to go with the flow trying to like let the creativity do its thing which I

00:06:24.220 think it did in some ways but but then it also stressed me out a bit and it maybe psyched me out

00:06:30.760 um so it was an interesting process I don't know if I'd do it completely the same way but I think

00:06:37.860 it was a good lesson or maybe a few good lessons um but you know some of the a lot of the stuff

00:06:45.660 that we recorded in in those sessions um I really loved and then you know we just added on it

00:06:52.320 uh and kept adding as as the months went on I think sometimes creative people having that

00:07:00.000 rough deadline or self-imposed uh limit on things can also help a lot like if you just have all the

00:07:06.860 time in the world then you'll just go on forever so yeah no that's dangerous yeah and you've said

00:07:13.440 that your new album Creature of Habit is about change which is kind of ironic to the name it's

00:07:18.860 like a juxtaposition there can you please tell us a bit more about the narrative of the album

00:07:23.220 yeah I think um well when I started I guess there wasn't a narrative or a theme I think normally

00:07:32.900 that kind of appears to me later um sometimes not until I release the album and start talking

00:07:40.380 about it on things like this. And then I realized. Yeah, it's a really strange, a strange way to kind

00:07:51.920 of dissect it. But it's, it's interesting. And then, you know, when you get other people's

00:07:57.860 point of views, it's interesting. But I remember when I wrote the song Mantis, which is where the

00:08:05.580 lion creature of habit comes from I when I finished that song I remember feeling as if

00:08:14.280 it was kind of the glue that made the album come together um and I don't really know why but that

00:08:20.120 song just kind of felt like the centerpiece and everything made sense around it all of a sudden

00:08:27.400 it actually started feeling like a proper album instead of just a collection of random songs

00:08:32.380 I was working on um and then I think you know a year after that or something you know it was a

00:08:41.020 long time when I was trying to come up with an album title um and I and and that was kind of in

00:08:49.060 my long list of album titles Creature of Habit and um and I kind of sat with that for a while

00:08:56.320 and i realized that that title also brought all the songs together um and i'm still kind of trying

00:09:04.000 to understand or like uh figure out how to um verbalize why but um it just it just kind of

00:09:14.640 it made everything make sense to me and um i do like that juxtaposition of and and just the kind

00:09:21.920 kind of multi meanings that that title can take on or that people can read it as I feel like

00:09:28.580 everyone might read that title slightly differently depending on their own life and where they're at

00:09:35.280 and their kind of projections and whatever but yeah I liked that I was kind of looking at myself

00:09:42.000 and looking at I guess at the time I wrote the line it was just my writing my writing habits and

00:09:48.200 my daily making a coffee, sitting outside and writing for a few hours. But also, you know,

00:09:57.540 craving change and craving spontaneity and wanting to, you know, break my bad habits and

00:10:06.720 make new healthy ones. And so, yeah, it kind of has so many different meanings, which I like in

00:10:15.620 a title yeah and of course the album art features said mantis said grasshopper yes hang it all

00:10:24.160 together um yeah a press release said that you decided to get rigorously curious about your own

00:10:31.020 indecision and anxiety i really love the idea of rigorously curious and i think that indecision

00:10:38.560 and anxiety is something that us creative people like we always are overthinking our i don't know

00:10:44.080 career choices or what we're doing or if we're ever going to make it, et cetera, et cetera.

00:10:49.300 And that is something that obviously you explore in Mantis. So what was that process like of

00:10:54.920 getting rigorously curious about your own indecision and anxiety and around the album?

00:11:00.820 I think that some of that is, yeah, I guess just trying to explore where those feelings

00:11:08.940 come from or where those anxieties come from or stem from and you know at what moments in my life

00:11:17.420 do they come up and and how do they kind of manifest and how do they ruin my day and whatever

00:11:24.520 it is just trying to be really observant and trying to change some of the ones that I felt

00:11:36.460 weren't really serving me or you know instead of being like oh that's just how I am um or I'm that

00:11:43.860 I'm I'm this kind of person like kind of going along with the story I just was trying my hardest

00:11:49.220 to be like no I I want to try try you know doing it a different way or um I can't think of an actual

00:11:58.820 example but um yeah just these little micro moments of just trying to kind of alter my

00:12:06.340 pathway or my thinking or um whatever it was and yeah a lot of that I guess I I tend to explore

00:12:16.080 through songwriting um so that's kind of why I write songs to you know to figure to figure that

00:12:25.800 stuff out. Um, so yeah, I find it useful, even though sometimes it takes so long to get to an

00:12:34.360 idea or to, you know, to, to, to get to the end of some theory that I have, but it's, um, it's,

00:12:44.000 it seems to be the only thing that I've found in my life that, um, that helps me do that.

00:12:51.620 and I think that is such a sign of like emotional intelligence and also a sign that like you never

00:12:59.160 really stop growing like into your late 30s like you're still having that conversation with

00:13:04.560 yourself and like trying to see how you're changing over time I think that's something

00:13:09.060 that a lot of artists with artists you're obviously marketed and you're in a category and

00:13:15.580 such. So I think that's a good sign that you're growing and changing. And I think that's a really

00:13:21.680 cool theme for an album and something that a lot of people will resonate with as well.

00:13:26.100 Yeah. I mean, I hope, you know, I think it's good to be changing and growing and evolving

00:13:32.200 constantly. And I think that's, I guess, one of the other things about

00:13:37.720 habits of, you know, people getting to a certain age and saying, well, that's just how I am. Or,

00:13:44.320 you know I can't change that because I've always been like that um but I think yeah just these

00:13:51.120 certain moments in my life along the way of meeting people you know meeting like some I

00:13:58.260 remember yeah someone in her 80s and she and and she um what was it I released this documentary

00:14:05.000 a few years back and I remember I went to the screening and I and this lady came up to me

00:14:10.220 afterwards and she said I didn't know anything about you but I just came along to watch this

00:14:15.100 movie and it really inspired me to um to take a look at my life and and you know look at um

00:14:22.140 I forgot what she said but um but but it was really beautiful and I thought wow you know um

00:14:30.120 it's it's a vulnerable and scary thing to do to look at the parts of ourselves that we don't like

00:14:38.120 or that we kind of want to change or that we want to explore.

00:14:42.580 Yeah, I remember feeling really touched in that moment,

00:14:46.520 especially just I wish I remembered what she said,

00:14:50.740 but just believe me that it was really beautiful.

00:14:54.000 It was reflective.

00:14:55.440 Yeah, I think she even said,

00:14:56.980 I want to go home and start a journal or something like that.

00:14:59.840 Like she wanted to kind of explore her creativity.

00:15:03.920 Yeah, it was just really, really beautiful.

00:15:05.920 So moments like that along the way in my life have kind of inspired me.

00:15:11.260 And on artists inspiring others, you reference the artist Georgia O'Keeffe in your artist

00:15:18.060 bio.

00:15:18.880 What is it that you resonate with her and feel that kind of connection to? 0.74

00:15:24.660 Yeah, I think I was living in Joshua Tree for a bit and I just started collecting all

00:15:31.200 these books of hers and um and just I was really interested in her as an artist and her as a person

00:15:40.660 and just the way that she kind of lived her life and moved through the world and always kind of

00:15:47.640 stayed true to her style and her art and she was constantly working creating from from what I could

00:15:55.020 see um we got to go we did a festival at Ghost Ranch in New Mexico which is where um she was

00:16:03.860 living and working for a while and we did a tour of her house and it was just it was really

00:16:09.200 inspiring and so I feel like she just was kind of omnipresent yeah in over the years of me working

00:16:17.800 on this album you know there was always a book on the coffee table another book on the side of the

00:16:23.280 bedside and, um, I had this cooking book of hers that was in the kitchen. It was like, oh,

00:16:29.880 and you know, this picture, this is a print of hers that I got because I loved it. Yeah. And

00:16:36.620 it's just, yeah, just, I don't know when something keeps popping up or keeps returning. I feel like

00:16:43.040 it's a nice little sign of just embracing it and like letting it inspire you and show you what it

00:16:49.380 needs to show you I love that like paying attention to signs and the universe like some people may say

00:16:55.040 it's woo-woo but I think as creative people there has to be something kind of cosmic about it so I

00:17:00.540 love that yeah like someone said to me the other day just a little a little woo-woo yeah just a

00:17:06.960 sprinkle that's fine whatever we're here on a floating rock it's fine who knows one of the

00:17:15.240 album's first singles sight unseen features Kate Crutchfield of Waxahachie who is also incredible

00:17:21.940 artist I saw her last year at Meredith and feel like it opened a whole up a whole new world of

00:17:26.960 music for me um how did you two end up working together what was that like and why did you choose

00:17:34.340 that like collaboration as one of the first singles for the album yeah we've we've known

00:17:40.320 each other since maybe 2018 or maybe before then but we did some touring in 2018 and we've just

00:17:48.280 kind of been on the same shows and festivals over the years and so we've you know we've known each

00:17:53.980 other for a while and when I wrote the song I heard the harmony in my head and I was always

00:17:59.160 just kind of singing it to myself and I think I was maybe just going to sing it on the record

00:18:05.280 But then I thought, God, it would be so nice if she sung it

00:18:09.340 in her beautiful, beautiful voice.

00:18:12.240 And, yeah, she's just, she's one of my favourite songwriters.

00:18:16.800 I think I've seen her play so many times as well

00:18:18.980 and she's a really inspiring artist and, yeah,

00:18:24.540 and I just, I was really grateful that she, you know,

00:18:29.820 that she sung on the song and made it something really extra special,

00:18:34.420 I think yeah agreed and it's been over a decade since your album sometimes I sit and think

00:18:41.980 sometimes I just sit was released I remember I moved to Melbourne in 2015 from New South Wales

00:18:48.160 and I've such like vivid memories of like learning about Melbourne culture and just like trying to

00:18:56.600 fit into this new city and that album was everywhere like it was huge um how has your

00:19:02.920 approach to music change since that like in that decade I guess that's a really really big question

00:19:08.300 but yeah I guess 10 years on how are you feeling about that album in the press release you

00:19:14.060 reference like no longer being like the creative ingenue you know of like your 20s so how are you

00:19:20.980 feeling about that um it's crazy that it has been 10 years um I mean I don't know it's funny that

00:19:28.760 that feels so long ago, but also so recent at the same time.

00:19:36.520 And, yeah, I don't know.

00:19:41.300 I mean, I feel like I write songs in quite a similar way,

00:19:44.280 but obviously I've just grown and changed and gotten older and, you know,

00:19:51.420 experienced more things and travelled and all of those things.

00:19:54.820 Like it just kind of adds to the richness of the songwriting experience.

00:20:01.360 It probably, maybe it means that I, you know, think about,

00:20:06.700 like maybe I overthink things more because, I mean, yeah, I don't know.

00:20:12.040 Maybe I do.

00:20:12.960 Maybe then it was all brand new and I wasn't overthinking it.

00:20:18.720 But, I mean, I remember those songs were even more kind

00:20:22.960 of anxiety-ridden.

00:20:24.880 Yeah, I was going to say, it's when you say that

00:20:26.640 because I think they're quite, like, living in your 20s,

00:20:29.120 like, what's going on?

00:20:29.840 Oh, my God.

00:20:31.420 Yeah.

00:20:32.320 Yeah, I mean, I think it's kind of similar.

00:20:34.380 I think it's just different chapters.

00:20:36.920 And I do like looking back at songs and albums kind

00:20:40.740 of document a certain period of time, you know,

00:20:44.980 this rough three-year period or so, and of the writing, recording, touring.

00:20:54.020 And, yeah, so it is, yeah, it's different but similar.

00:21:00.040 And then I love, you know, playing old songs when we perform.

00:21:05.720 It's interesting to see how old songs have kind of evolved

00:21:10.320 or how I relate to them like when I sing them these days sometimes you know they just bring up

00:21:19.320 different memories or sometimes they take on different meanings or it's very it's it can be

00:21:25.780 yeah it's quite strange but it's nice it's nice to kind of witness that yeah and to this day like

00:21:32.360 10 years on are you still having people saying like like it still feels fresh and modern in a

00:21:36.520 in a way I mean 10 years isn't that long in the scheme of things but are you still having people

00:21:40.480 like yeah say what the album meant to them yeah I think that is a nice thing about music is that

00:21:48.600 people always um discover things at different times so you know someone could be hearing one

00:21:58.080 of those songs for the first time this year and um that's gonna be happening hopefully you know

00:22:04.380 over time forever yeah and um I yeah I like that I like I like that we kind of stumble across things

00:22:11.940 and and um they pop up and if they're if they're meaningful you know like they find us at the

00:22:18.560 right point in our lives and yeah I don't know if they hit if they hit a hit the mark or like hit a

00:22:25.540 nerve an emotional nerve at the time I think that's yeah it's pretty it's a pretty um pretty

00:22:30.800 amazing thing that music does and we cannot like that we can that that exists and that we can find

00:22:38.900 things that mean something to us anytime I love it yeah and writing in general like I was feeling

00:22:45.720 like so not alone but when I listened to your album recently I just thought like not I'm the

00:22:51.380 only person who's ever felt those feelings of anxiety and overthinking of course of course of

00:22:54.720 course but just that like what am I doing I'm like 29 creative blah blah blah and hearing your

00:23:00.760 the few songs that kind of pull out those themes I was like oh my gosh like this is something that

00:23:05.780 a lot of people go through I think that is like the power of music and the power of writing so

00:23:10.700 I think that is very true I totally agree with you as we said at the top you now live in LA you

00:23:18.320 worked in Joshua Tree um you also were away from Australia during the pandemic you came back during

00:23:25.460 lockdowns what has it been like moving away from Australia you were born and grew up in Sydney

00:23:31.220 and has that changed your relationship with the Australian music industry yeah definitely I guess

00:23:38.220 it definitely changes the that relationship just because I'm yeah I'm obviously not around and not

00:23:44.280 as involved and I think when like in my 20s I had Milk Records record label in Melbourne and

00:23:52.420 and so kind of felt a lot more you know involved and a part of a part of things so it definitely

00:23:59.680 feels different in that way yeah again it's just it's it's and you know some of those things are

00:24:06.580 hard it's like like closing the label was was really sad and really hard and it was like this

00:24:12.340 grieving process um and I think it's the same with with moving away but I mean it's it's weird

00:24:21.340 because I don't really say I still don't really say like that I've moved I just kind of feel like

00:24:27.220 I'm living here for now oh okay you know I mean I don't know it depends on the day yeah yeah I mean

00:24:35.820 I love Australia and I feel like I'm always going to be I'm always going to be coming back there I

00:24:40.800 I was just there at Christmas in Sydney and I really missed it this year, this summer.

00:24:47.560 Yeah, but I feel like I'm really lucky to be able to, you know, that my work takes me around the world

00:24:55.260 and I can be here writing and performing and working on music.

00:25:01.020 And yeah, it's definitely, it's a lucky position to be in that I feel, I do feel really grateful for that.

00:25:10.020 What did you miss about it?

00:25:11.300 When I was back at Christmas, I was in Sydney

00:25:14.100 and I was just going to the beach a lot.

00:25:17.700 It's funny, like each place just holds so many different memories.

00:25:21.080 Sydney is like my zero to 16 years.

00:25:26.100 So it feels so nostalgic.

00:25:28.880 But then I was in Melbourne in November

00:25:31.320 and I just feel like Melbourne is always going to feel like home to me

00:25:36.180 because I was there for the last 15 years.

00:25:38.800 yeah I just a lot of my really good friends are there I just really feel I feel at home just

00:25:43.820 walking around um and just being there so it's yeah it's a strange feeling of having two or three

00:25:50.220 homes yeah yeah obviously a lot of like a lot of musicians go to LA to work and work with different

00:25:59.720 writers is that why you felt it had to be LA because there's just like such a music scene

00:26:05.440 there weirdly i don't really know what well here's the thing at the end of 2019 i i was touring

00:26:14.000 my album tell me how you really feel and and and um i think i was pretty burnt out and depressed

00:26:20.960 and i was basically like next year i'm i'm not doing any like i'm not i'm not doing this anymore

00:26:27.100 i don't wanted to uh i don't i don't even know if i want to make music i kind of told everyone i

00:26:33.680 worked with that I was gonna just go off and like maybe write a book of poems or something and

00:26:38.540 um and yeah I just felt pretty down about it and then um and then at the start of 2020 I did this

00:26:47.920 little solo tour and it ended in LA and I just remember being there I stayed at a friend's place

00:26:55.460 for a couple of extra days and I just thought why didn't I just stay here I didn't have a

00:27:01.020 a place in Melbourne at the time. So I was like, I've got actually nowhere to go back to. I don't

00:27:06.000 even know what I'm doing with my life. Maybe I'll just stay here and have a little adventure.

00:27:10.680 So I did. That was kind of my plan. And then COVID started. And so I was like, maybe I'll just stay.

00:27:19.040 I'll wait it out. You know, my mom was like, I think it looks pretty serious and you should

00:27:23.220 come home so I went home um Sydney did to Melbourne um I stayed at a friend's um apartment

00:27:31.660 they ended up letting me take over their lease so I was renting this apartment through all of

00:27:39.180 the Melbourne lockdowns and um of course I like started writing music because there was nothing

00:27:45.140 nothing else I had nothing else to do yeah and and it was helping me you know process all the

00:27:50.760 things and, and it was fun and, and it just helped pass the time. And so I ended up making an album

00:27:57.040 and then, um, touring that. And then after all of that, I was like, wait, wasn't I going to try

00:28:03.940 living in LA? Like time jump, like, oh yeah, I was doing something with my life before.

00:28:10.340 Yeah. And I kind of always, I always had this dream of trying to live in Joshua Tree for a

00:28:16.720 little bit because I I really love it out there and and I and I've over the last 10 years I've

00:28:22.340 been kind of spending time out there so I think yeah after all the COVID stuff and all the thoughts

00:28:28.960 of you know never being able to travel again and I thought just why don't I just go for it and give

00:28:34.460 it like give it a try and just have an adventure and there's so many parts of America that I really

00:28:41.460 love like I love um I love uh exploring the national parks and all the there's so many

00:28:48.200 beautiful places here um I think especially in California like you think LA is like Hollywood

00:28:56.600 but like yeah there's actually so much beauty and hikes and I've not been there yeah from what I've

00:29:02.160 seen no it's true yeah and I think when I was younger I thought it was like yeah the city

00:29:07.340 big scary city and it's not it's it's really it's actually quite similar it reminds me of

00:29:13.660 Australia sometimes um and maybe it's because there's like gum trees scattered around LA which

00:29:20.140 is um strange but makes me reminds me of home obviously yeah just quickly going back to Milk

00:29:28.280 Records so this was a record label that you started in Australia in Melbourne in your 20s

00:29:33.120 and has now closed how did you know when the right time to do that was because in press release I've

00:29:42.240 read it said like you felt like it was a failure on your part but also you had to figure out how

00:29:48.420 to let things go and I think that's a real juxtaposition that creative people also deal with

00:29:55.760 so yeah how did you know it was the right time to close McRecords and like what was that like

00:30:01.360 It was tricky. I feel like it was a few kind of years of trying to make the decision, maybe going back and forth a little bit. I mean, in the end, I don't know. Yeah, I think it was just so hard to keep it going.

00:30:21.020 like it was expensive and you know um it started off as such a simple innocent thing and like in

00:30:30.240 my bedroom and me going to the post office every day and and it grew into this really beautiful

00:30:35.600 bigger thing and bigger community and and really great people who um who were who were part of the

00:30:43.340 label and making it run and and um doing so many wonderful things and it and it got bigger and um

00:30:50.720 yeah I don't it's I still don't really quite know what or why or how to how to say it I think in the

00:31:00.080 end it just kind of it was causing me a lot of grief and a lot of sadness and yeah it felt like

00:31:08.140 it had kind of reached a point and and things were different and people were kind of moving in

00:31:14.780 different directions and but but I think as well like I wanted to try to focus on music I felt like

00:31:24.180 I was like splitting my focus and not really giving 100% to either world yeah and I think

00:31:33.180 that that wasn't benefiting the label or anything to do you know with that world and yeah it was

00:31:40.120 it was really it was really difficult and it did yeah it did feel like a failure on some levels

00:31:48.160 and it's still no I think now I've come to terms with it's like it just it is what it is and it

00:31:55.100 was amazing and I'm really grateful for it but I think I don't beat myself up about that anymore

00:32:01.320 because it's just like it's all good everything lasts forever and I think in our society we can

00:32:06.120 so easily be like well if it if it's not like doesn't last for 10 20 30 years and make millions

00:32:12.180 of dollars and every business venture is a failure but like i think sometimes it's like no that had

00:32:18.360 its time and you help people and yeah i really with like the focus thing like trying to focus

00:32:23.200 on so many things that you don't give things 100 so i think that's very true and i think those

00:32:29.520 you know the the albums that we released they will last forever um the label doesn't need to

00:32:36.580 last forever the label the label was beautiful and um it was a lot of fun but the music will

00:32:43.880 yeah yeah and i and that like makes me happy like all of those all the artists got their albums and

00:32:51.500 rights and all that stuff just straight back and and then you know that music will continue to exist

00:32:58.340 And I do really love that.

00:33:02.480 Well, thank you so, so much for your generous time

00:33:05.480 and words this morning.

00:33:07.380 It's been so lovely essentially having a coffee with you.

00:33:10.620 Before I go, every week on the podcast, Maggie and I ask each other

00:33:15.620 what we've loved watching, reading or listening to at the moment.

00:33:18.960 And I was wondering if you had any cultural recommendations

00:33:22.380 for podcast listeners, TV show, album, like movie.

00:33:26.640 okay well um movies I've been loving going to the cinema I think we should all go to the cinema

00:33:36.860 again all the time we have big proponents here on coach club great I just love it it makes me so

00:33:44.660 happy um and what have I seen recently I saw Marty Supreme uh Begonia and um if I had legs

00:33:55.360 i'd kick you with beautiful rose byrne so good um i feel i just feel so proud of her

00:34:02.340 in the last few weeks like watching all that stuff i'm like yes yes um that's made me really

00:34:10.640 happy yeah they're they're my movies oh and tv the pit i've been loving the pit yes i haven't

00:34:17.660 seen that yet but i've heard good recommendations it's like a medical drama yeah yeah yes i think

00:34:24.900 people say it's kind of similar to ER, which I never watched, but it's very good. Yeah. And it's

00:34:33.540 interesting because each season, every episode is one hour of the day. So essentially a season is

00:34:41.260 one day in the emergency department. And so it just, you know, gives you a lot of gratitude and

00:34:51.500 extra respect obviously for our health care workers and how incredible they are um it's

00:34:58.160 very stressful show okay but it's not like a wind down one it's a no drama I mean I think

00:35:05.900 that's the same as if I had like said kick you that is when I saw that in the cinema I was like

00:35:10.440 bit all my nails down it was so stressful but amazing yeah but there's so much good stuff out

00:35:15.920 at the moment very uh yeah very blessed yeah it's very helpful when you have a culture podcast as

00:35:22.720 well like I said thank you so much for your time today I love chatting with you and I hope you

00:35:30.580 have a great album rollout thank you so much it was really nice to chat

Culture Club - April 03, 2026

Creativity In The Desert & Embracing Change & Self-Doubt With Courtney Barnett

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