For The Wild - November 15, 2015


BUFFY SAINTE-MARIE on Creative Decolonization in a Global Village ⧸29

Topics
ELIZABETH KOLBERT on the Coming Age of Loneliness ⧸28 ANDREW HARVEY on Confronting Crisis with Divine Dignity ⧸30

Episode Stats


Length

58 minutes

Words per minute

128.49

Word count

7,465

Sentence count

366

Harmful content

Misogyny

8

sentences flagged

Toxicity

15

sentences flagged

Hate speech

44

sentences flagged


Transcript

Transcript generated with Whisper (turbo).
Misogyny classifications generated with MilaNLProc/bert-base-uncased-ear-misogyny .
Toxicity classifications generated with s-nlp/roberta_toxicity_classifier .
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
Topics generated with Qwen2.5-3B-Instruct.
00:00:00.000 Who's got a head, a head, a match-up with a raven? Who's got the prairie sun in every smile? Who's got good credit yet with all Mother Nature?
00:00:17.300 Ooh, native North American child
00:00:21.300 Who's got the rhythm of the universe inside 1.00
00:00:24.960 Who taught the pilgrims how to make it in the wild
00:00:29.060 Who sings her 49er rock and roll changes
00:00:32.540 Ooh, native North American child 1.00
00:00:36.540 Sing about your ebony African queen 0.99
00:00:40.120 Sing about your lily white lily Marlene 0.97
00:00:44.220 Beauty by the bushel, but the girl of the hour 0.97
00:00:47.820 Is a Native North American 1.00
00:00:50.140 Hairy flag 1.00
00:00:51.820 Sailin' on the manchee 0.76
00:00:53.800 Upa, Upa, Shoshone 0.97
00:00:55.580 Navajo, Comanche, Hopi, Eskimo, Free 0.93
00:00:59.320 Tuscarora, Yaki, Pima, Polka, O-Night
00:01:03.200 And Native North American me 1.00
00:01:07.260 Sing about your ever near African
00:01:10.220 Hello, my name is Ayanna Young 0.98
00:01:12.420 and I welcome you to Unlearn and Rewild. Today we are speaking with the legendary artist,
00:01:18.440 educator, and political activist, Buffy St. Marie. Buffy was born to Cree parents on the
00:01:24.360 Pia Pot Reservation in Saskatchewan, Canada. She was orphaned as an infant and moved to Massachusetts,
00:01:30.540 where she would later get her degree in Eastern philosophy from the University of Massachusetts.
00:01:35.640 In the early 60s, Buffy played the coffee houses of Greenwich Village, where her music was so well
00:01:41.180 received that her career skyrocketed to international fame soon thereafter. Almost 50 years after the
00:01:48.220 release of her first album, It's My Way, Buffy's new album, Power in the Blood, is filled with the
00:01:55.040 same fierce messages, eclecticism, and compassion unique to this unstoppable woman. Hello, Buffy.
00:02:02.880 We are beyond blessed to have you on the show. Welcome. Good, good, good. I love your title.
00:02:08.200 It's so good. I'm learning. Rewild. Perfect. You are an extremely creative person. Not only
00:02:14.660 are you a musician and a poet in many different genres, from rock and roll to protest music
00:02:20.360 to love songs, but you're a painter as well. I've heard you talk about how everyone has
00:02:25.720 their own creative talent to share, but often as children, we're put into schools that squelch
00:02:31.220 that creativity. So in these times of judgmental influence and distraction, how can we foster
00:02:37.520 creativity at every age? And secondly, for the artist in the audience, how can we authentically
00:02:43.940 share our art without falling into the trap of capitalist commodification and fetishism found in
00:02:50.240 the art world, which you've been able to do so beautifully? I don't know how well I've been able
00:02:55.340 to do it, but I hear you. It's definitely out there. And you're right. I think just about
00:03:00.600 everybody is born talented. And I don't think it's just the schools that discourage talent.
00:03:07.520 I think it's parents and advertising and cartoons and just about everything, you know.
00:03:15.640 And I think all of this comes back to, I mean, my belief is the best things in life are free, like breastfeeding, you know.
00:03:24.180 There's nobody making any money off it, therefore it's not in your face all the time in the media and in schools and in parental concerns.
00:03:33.480 and we're just living in a time where merchants are the kings.
00:03:39.040 That's what we're experiencing in our contemporary life
00:03:41.780 is that money rules and coins and it's a big monopoly game
00:03:46.240 and we kind of know it but we look the other way
00:03:48.900 because we say, oh no, it's probably just my own paranoia.
00:03:51.840 No, it's really out there.
00:03:53.220 It seems in history it's cyclical
00:03:55.080 and sometimes it was the church that were running things
00:03:59.540 and other times it was the Inquisition or in India, sometimes it would be the merchant class.
00:04:07.120 And I have a degree in oriental philosophy, so I always come back to that when I'm thinking about our contemporary times,
00:04:13.640 how just merchants, coins, merchandising, more, more, more money, exponential growth.
00:04:19.520 It's a crock, but it's a meme of our lives.
00:04:23.000 And yet on the other hand, if you take any group of kids to the beach when they're four or five,
00:04:28.200 They all make art, even though their parents probably don't even recognize it as art because the parents are up there sitting on the blanket, you know, talking to each other and eating chips and thinking about their own daily struggles.
00:04:40.980 But here are all these kids, and they're using their imaginations, and they're making pictures, and they're dancing, and nobody told them how.
00:04:47.620 They're hearing songs in their head.
00:04:49.620 They're making sculpture.
00:04:51.000 We don't call it sculpture.
00:04:52.220 We call it sandcastles.
00:04:53.480 but they're thinking about architecture, and they're using their imaginations,
00:04:57.700 and they're making up characters, you know, every day.
00:05:01.120 They're making up dramas and stories.
00:05:03.640 They're so creative.
00:05:05.360 And I guess, you know, you want to know how to foster creativity at every age?
00:05:10.320 What I tell people is, number one, don't discourage your kids by distracting them to anything
00:05:16.640 that's going to take them, you know, to make them think that their creativity isn't of equal value.
00:05:22.640 I think is the most valuable thing we have is our originality and our creativity.
00:05:27.280 But, you know, kids get distracted because of what their parents like to do, you know, sports or, you know, money or, I don't know, a social life.
00:05:36.740 Yet this creativity, I don't think we lose it.
00:05:39.620 I think we retain it even as adults.
00:05:42.360 Just go into a room, go to the store and buy four or five small canvases and some acrylic paint and put the different colors of paint, you know, onto a plate or something.
00:05:52.640 And then go into a room and turn the lights almost all the way down so you can't really see what you're painting.
00:05:58.140 And just throw the paint up there.
00:05:59.940 That's true creativity.
00:06:01.800 That's fun.
00:06:02.700 That's discovery.
00:06:03.460 That's being a bored child who's going to find something to do with these paints or crayons or whatever you've got.
00:06:11.440 And I think that that spark of creativity, once an adult remembers it, can really fill your life with a creative joy that you thought was impossible.
00:06:21.620 I resonate with that a lot, you know, reawakening that creative spark
00:06:25.860 that might be lying dormant but isn't gone.
00:06:28.480 Yeah, I don't think it's ever gone.
00:06:30.640 You know, I suppose, you know, like puppies and kittens,
00:06:33.180 there's a certain learning period where we're,
00:06:35.700 when it's easiest for us to come up with that kind of stuff.
00:06:39.860 But I don't know, try it.
00:06:41.700 But, you know, you also asked about, you know,
00:06:43.560 how do you share your art without being totally commodified and, you know, selling out?
00:06:49.540 I think in my own case, I just do what I want to do.
00:06:52.240 I never expected to be a success at anything.
00:06:54.980 I got out of college, and I thought I was going to India to continue my studies.
00:06:58.940 I had a degree in oriental philosophy.
00:07:00.940 But I stopped in Greenwich Village just to, you know,
00:07:04.300 see if anybody wanted to hear these songs I was writing all my life
00:07:08.660 and that I'd sung to my college dorm mates in college and little coffee houses.
00:07:14.440 And all of a sudden, I had a career, so I was quite surprised by it.
00:07:17.800 So it's not as though I looked forward all my life to becoming a professional artist.
00:07:24.160 I mean, that's really how to get commodified.
00:07:27.100 And I just kind of lucked into it.
00:07:29.220 I just got lucky with things that came very natural to me.
00:07:32.560 So if you are an original, I think the thing to do is to treasure that.
00:07:37.240 And I think I've always thought very differently from my peers and from managers and agents and record companies.
00:07:44.580 they were all chasing whatever last month's hit was oh sing like madonna sing like you know
00:07:51.680 britney sing like somebody else but to me the only reason for getting on a stage in the first place
00:07:58.120 in my own personal life was that i needed i wanted to demo the songs i would have loved it if somebody
00:08:03.100 else could have done that and i could have gone to india but i was the only one who had the songs
00:08:07.300 and i thought the songs were valuable so that's where i was coming from i was coming from not i
00:08:12.520 want to be a singer because i like pretty dresses and makeup and want to be on tv it was i'm a
00:08:17.800 songwriter how can i get these messages out and so i was a little more like a journalist than
00:08:23.200 than a pop star and i'm very surprised that i've had as much success as i've had
00:08:28.340 i think you just do it you know you just do it whatever it is that is original to you
00:08:34.440 don't that's why you're there is your originality not how well you can sing you know
00:08:41.500 the latest top 20. Yeah, it's that leap of faith, allowing that pure passion to bubble to the
00:08:49.820 surface. I feel that a lot in my life. Yeah, do you? Yeah, I do. I, you know, I just leap not
00:08:56.320 knowing what the outcome will be. Yeah, like a child, like a kid who's, you know how sometimes
00:09:01.600 a child will really need to be heard, and they'll have an idea, and they just talk over you, and
00:09:06.740 and they really need to be heard, or they're coloring their pictures
00:09:10.840 and they don't want to be interrupted, or they're making their music
00:09:13.960 and they're really, really happy.
00:09:15.680 Nobody has to tell them how because they're playing.
00:09:19.880 So I'm a big believer that creativity in the first place, it begins with play.
00:09:26.380 So if you're attracted to do something, you know, you want to be a writer,
00:09:29.700 a journalist, a blogger, a painter, a dancer, whatever it is,
00:09:32.960 if you're attracted to it that's your fuel that's your that's your real fuel is your own attraction
00:09:39.220 to it if you don't want to do it don't go become a bean counter it's okay there's a lot of beans
00:09:43.860 out there that need counting but if you have something original that you love to do oh give
00:09:49.080 other people a chance to um to see that and uh um not so that you'll have a career but because
00:09:56.760 That's the only contribution we have is our originality, I think.
00:10:26.760 Well, little wheel, spin and spin, big wheel, turn around, round.
00:10:31.700 Little wheel, spin and spin, big wheel, turn around and around.
00:10:35.740 All the sins of Caesar's men cry the pious citizens.
00:10:40.300 Petty thieve the five and tens and the big wheel, turn around, round.
00:10:44.880 Little wheel, spin and spin, big wheel, turn around and around.
00:10:49.160 Little wheel, spin and spin, big wheel, turn around and around.
00:10:52.960 Blame the angels, blame the fates, blame the Jews or your sister Kate
00:10:57.080 Teach your children who to hate, and the big wheel turn around, round
00:11:01.460 Little wheels spin and spin, big wheel turn around, round
00:11:05.960 Little wheels spin and spin, big wheel turn around and around 0.95
00:11:09.960 Turn your back on weeds you've hoed, silly sinful sins you've sowed 0.99
00:11:14.160 Add your straw to the camel's load, pray like hell when the world explode 0.99
00:11:18.460 Little wheel, spin and spin, big wheel, turn around and around. 0.99
00:11:27.320 Swing your girl, fiddly say, later on the pipe will pay.
00:11:31.660 Do-si-do, swing and sway, dead will dance on judgment day. 0.93
00:11:35.640 Little wheel spin and spin, big wheel turn around and around.
00:12:05.640 I've heard your excitement about this current movement towards global awareness.
00:12:13.960 When you came out with the song, Now That the Buffalo Are Gone in 1964,
00:12:19.220 and My Country, Tis of Thy People You're Dying, in 1966, it was shocking.
00:12:25.260 It was shocking not only because you were speaking about the genocide of indigenous people
00:12:29.420 that was being ignored and hidden from the mainstream,
00:12:32.100 but speaking out as an indigenous person and a woman nonetheless was unheard of.
00:12:37.660 So even though there is this growing awareness that Native Americans were murdered
00:12:42.160 and their land stolen and their children stolen from them and sent away to residential schools,
00:12:48.040 there are still injustices burdening Native communities today.
00:12:52.120 For example, the uranium mining or the tar sands in Alberta, Canada.
00:12:56.360 What are some tangible solutions towards justice for Native people?
00:13:00.880 And how do people of different races work through intergenerational trauma
00:13:05.020 and become allies towards a restorative future?
00:13:08.720 Wow, that was kind of a bunch of questions.
00:13:10.480 They were all good. I don't know where to start.
00:13:12.980 No, good questions, good questions, very good.
00:13:15.920 I would agree with you, you know, in saying that awareness alone about Native issues isn't enough.
00:13:21.580 You know, what can we actually do?
00:13:23.400 There's a lot that we can do, but I don't think that it's the kind of what you can do that your parents and teachers would give you as an assignment, so I'm not going to do that, because I think each person's life is different, and I think every day we have an opportunity to make something better, and if you're thinking about it like that, it automatically crosses racial lines anyway, because if you're making things better, in my opinion, you're making things better for everybody.
00:13:52.300 If you make things better for aboriginal people, you're basically on the level of fairness and correcting injustice.
00:14:02.360 That's good for everybody.
00:14:04.340 So in the first place, you want to get out of the race box.
00:14:07.500 I have a strange life.
00:14:08.760 You know, I'm in the big cities one day, you know, operating at a very high level.
00:14:13.600 Other times, I'm lost in a city.
00:14:15.500 Nobody knows who I am, and I'm just wandering around the streets.
00:14:18.560 Other times I'm out in some reserve or an indigenous area in, you know, Scandinavia or Australia or something.
00:14:25.040 So I get to see a lot of ways to do things, and I'm aware that people have different languages and different styles,
00:14:34.140 and people are at different degrees of ripeness.
00:14:38.100 So when I'm trying to do something through a song or a painting or something, I really know all these people.
00:14:44.800 You know, they are actually a part of my day-to-day history.
00:14:49.420 I know I've been with them.
00:14:50.720 I know them.
00:14:51.660 And so just the idea of communicating as an artist to the whole wide world,
00:14:57.100 you do it in a way that's very much a parallel to think globally, act locally.
00:15:03.600 And what I try to do is everything I can when something comes up.
00:15:08.460 You know, I try to be able to, you know, I see someplace that needs a check or that needs some money or needs some advice or different needs come up every day and you address them as you can.
00:15:22.540 But as a singer in a big concert or a global person writing something that I want to be kind of like a folk song in that it's going to last for generations and cross language barriers and country barriers, actually I'm singing or writing for the individual in each person.
00:15:45.240 I'm only singing to one person.
00:15:48.000 I'm not singing to 120,000 people all at the same time,
00:15:51.060 even though that's the reality of who shows up.
00:15:53.300 I'm still singing to the eachness of each person,
00:15:56.860 the person that is similar to me inside or different to me inside.
00:16:02.040 So it's funny how I think that's what artists do.
00:16:06.320 I think that's one of the characteristics of the work of many artists. 0.65
00:16:11.920 You know, if you want to think about white folks' art, think about the Renaissance, the sculptures and the paintings.
00:16:21.500 Some of them kind of don't travel out of 15th century Italy, and others of them really do. 0.51
00:16:28.460 And I think that if you look at the world kindly and you look at history kindly,
00:16:32.800 And when you're thinking about artists, many artists have managed to reach both the global and the individual in whatever their work is.
00:16:43.140 And I think I've gotten lucky with a few songs that did that, you know, whether they were simple love songs or, you know, songs that addressed war and peace or real complicated issues like My Country Tis of Thy People, You're Dying and You Are Right.
00:16:53.940 That was the first time that the word genocide was used by an artist in describing North America.
00:17:00.820 That's real important.
00:17:01.520 You know, I rewrote that song.
00:17:03.240 I rewrote it recently for Truth and Reconciliation in Canada.
00:17:07.520 I kind of localized it to Canadian issues, but it's basically the same thing.
00:17:11.980 Are you aware of the Doctrine of Discovery, by the way?
00:17:15.300 You read my mind.
00:17:16.520 I was just about to ask you about the Doctrine of Discovery,
00:17:20.240 because I listened to a lecture you gave at Arizona State University
00:17:23.740 where you explained that this genocide of Native people didn't stem from racism,
00:17:28.820 but rather colonialism.
00:17:31.480 Yeah.
00:17:32.160 You know, some of the questions that you're asking,
00:17:34.700 it kind of all can go back to the doctrine of discovery.
00:17:38.080 And I'm with a lot of non-Indian people with good hearts
00:17:41.700 who ask, how could my ancestors ever have done this?
00:17:46.160 And they feel terribly guilty and quite challenged and confused
00:17:50.760 as to how it could have happened.
00:17:54.140 And if you go back to the doctrine of discovery,
00:17:56.800 The Doctrine of Discovery was put together in the 15th century with several overdubs by several popes, but it was done during the Inquisition.
00:18:06.660 I mean, that's a very important point.
00:18:09.460 The indigenous people of the world were discovered by colonials during the Inquisition.
00:18:16.620 Do you realize what white people were doing to white people in those days?
00:18:19.780 So for me, it's a very informative and somewhat comforting, in a funny way, thought to realize that the cruelties of the 15th century that came around the globe and wiped out indigenous people legally because they had not already been Christianized by some Christian power. 0.57
00:18:45.280 The Doctrine of Discovery said that if European explorers were exploring and came across a piece of land that was inhabited, 0.62
00:18:53.600 that if the people were not Christian, they were not supposed to be treated as human.
00:18:57.300 They were supposed to be enslaved or destroyed or converted.
00:19:04.200 But in any case, the racket said that they were to be controlled and exploited by the people who were running the church,
00:19:12.260 who, in my mind, were not Christians.
00:19:14.420 that was Christendom. Christendom is the racket that racketeers make out of, you know, the
00:19:22.040 teachings of Jesus. It has nothing to do with the teachings of Jesus. It's just another racket,
00:19:25.440 and it's been going on since before the Old Testament. And that's what happened to Indigenous 1.00
00:19:29.980 people. So if we remember that the doctrine of discovery is still in effect in both the United
00:19:38.280 States and Canada. And Johnson v. McIntosh, which is a law, it has been quoted during the last 10
00:19:47.440 years. So don't think that the doctrine of discovery, which gives colonialism from Europe
00:19:53.260 the legal upper hand to enslave, to exploit, to extract natural resources, everything. It's all
00:20:01.620 based in this stupid thing that needs to be expunged. So, you know, of course, we're working, 0.99
00:20:06.960 We're hoping that Pope Francis might be the one to finally expunge this.
00:20:11.600 But who knows whether it happens or not.
00:20:13.880 The good news about the bad news is that more people are starting to understand
00:20:18.660 the position of indigenous people throughout the world
00:20:22.080 because we're exposing the doctrine of discovery to ordinary moms and pops.
00:20:28.280 And it helps to answer that question, how could my ancestors have done that?
00:20:32.460 They were forced to do it.
00:20:33.860 Henry VIII was making business deals with the church at the same time as the Doctrine of Discovery.
00:20:39.940 He went along with the Doctrine of Discovery because it was a business deal for him.
00:20:45.200 He had to seem as though he were on the side of the political church at the time.
00:20:49.240 So in the laws of the Doctrine of Discovery was very powerful in Spain, in Italy, in the Netherlands, in France, in Portugal, and in England.
00:21:02.520 And those were the laws that were operative when Columbus was out sailing the ocean blue and Cabot and Cartier and the rest of them were claiming indigenous land for the crowns and churches of Europe.
00:21:18.360 So I think that if people know that, there's a lot of forgiveness and understanding of just the boneheadedness and the racketeering of those faraway times.
00:21:27.080 And it also gives people somewhere to go with it.
00:21:29.840 Let's do away with the doctrine of discovery.
00:21:31.760 Let's discuss it. Let's see some eyebrows go up.
00:21:35.720 Oh, I never knew that, you know.
00:21:37.900 To me, it's all good.
00:21:39.860 Now that your big eyes have finally opened
00:21:43.600 Now that you're wondering how must they feel
00:21:50.540 Meaning them that you've chased across America's movie screens
00:21:55.180 Now that you're wondering
00:21:59.100 How can it be real
00:22:01.860 That the ones you've called
00:22:04.420 Colorful, noble, and proud
00:22:07.780 In your school propaganda
00:22:10.120 They starve in their splendor
00:22:14.400 You've asked for my comment
00:22:18.000 I simply will render 1.00
00:22:20.300 My country, tis of thy people you're dying 0.99
00:22:30.000 Now that the long houses breed superstition
00:22:40.400 You force us to send our toddlers away 0.87
00:22:46.320 Radio schools where they're taught to despise their traditions, forbid them their languages, then further say that American history really began.
00:23:03.440 When Columbus sets sail out of Europe and stress that the nation of leeches that's conquered this land are the biggest and bravest and boldest and best.
00:23:19.940 And yet where in your history books is the tale
00:23:25.360 Of the genocide basic to this country's birth
00:23:30.540 Of the preachers who lied, how the Bill of Rights failed
00:23:36.160 How a nation of patriots returned to their earth
00:23:41.560 And where will it tell of the Liberty Bell 0.99
00:23:46.880 As it rang with a thud over Kinzoa mud
00:23:52.280 And of brave Uncle Sam in Alaska this year
00:23:57.780 My country, tis of thy people you're dying
00:24:03.800 Hear how the bargain was made 0.99
00:24:12.260 For the West with her shivering children 0.97
00:24:16.600 In zero degrees 0.99
00:24:19.940 Blankets for your land
00:24:22.780 So the treaty's a test
00:24:25.440 Oh, well, blankets for land
00:24:28.760 Is a bargain indeed
00:24:31.220 And the blankets were those
00:24:34.560 Uncle Sam had collected
00:24:37.180 From smallpox disease
00:24:40.020 Dying soldiers that day
00:24:43.020 And the tribes were wiped out
00:24:45.900 And the history books censored. A hundred years of your statesmen have felt it's better this way. Yet a few of the conquered have somehow survived.
00:25:00.560 Their blood runs the redder, though genes have been paled
00:25:05.980 From the Grand Canyon's caverns to Craven's sad hills
00:25:11.780 The wounded, the losers, the robbed sing their tale
00:25:17.260 From Los Angeles County to upstate New York
00:25:22.620 The white nation fattens while others grow lean 0.91
00:25:28.460 Oh, the tricked and evicted, they know what I mean
00:25:33.740 My country, tis of thy people, you're dying
00:25:40.040 The past, it just crumbled, the future just threatens 0.93
00:25:48.640 Our lifeblood shut up in your chemical tanks
00:25:53.640 And now here you come, bill of sale in your hand, and surprise in your eyes that we're lacking in thanks for the blessings of civilization you've brought us, the lessons you've taught us, the ruin you've brought us.
00:26:17.520 Oh, see what our trust in America's bought us.
00:26:23.080 My country, tis of thy people you're dying. 0.99
00:26:33.480 Now that the pride of the sires receives charity,
00:26:40.160 Now that we're harmless and safe behind laws
00:26:48.160 Now that my life's to be known as your heritage
00:26:54.900 Now that even the graves have been robbed
00:27:02.000 Now that our own chosen way is a novelty
00:27:08.820 Hands on our hearts
00:27:11.840 We salute you, your victory 0.99
00:27:15.940 Choke on your blue, white and scarlet hypocrisy 0.99
00:27:22.200 Pitying the blindness that you've never seen 0.99
00:27:28.560 That the eagles of war whose wings lent you glory
00:27:34.600 They were never no more than carrion crows
00:27:41.280 Pushed the wrens from their nest
00:27:44.120 Stole their eggs, changed their story
00:27:47.360 The mockingbird sings it
00:27:50.580 It's all that she knows
00:27:53.760 Ah, what can I do?
00:27:56.640 Say a powerless view
00:27:59.000 With a lump in your throat
00:28:02.180 And a tear in your eye
00:28:05.700 Can't you see that there are poverties profiting you?
00:28:13.640 My country, tis of thy people you're dying
00:28:19.880 Yeah, absolutely incredible to view it through that lens 0.99
00:28:29.240 and work through it.
00:28:31.180 And I'm wondering how you move through your feelings about the government, especially after they blacklisted you from reaching people with your messages of truth.
00:28:40.720 How do you think the millennial generation can engage in a proactive relationship with the government in these times of disruption and distrust?
00:28:50.500 One of the reasons for disruption and distrust is because we keep using the word the government.
00:28:56.520 It's not the government.
00:28:58.340 The United States government didn't blacklist me.
00:29:02.080 They didn't pass an act of Congress saying Buffy's music sucks or Buffy's music is too radical or she tells the truth to it.
00:29:09.520 None of that.
00:29:10.480 No.
00:29:11.300 It's not the government.
00:29:12.740 And people will sometimes say, well, didn't that make you hate the United States?
00:29:16.180 No.
00:29:16.980 And doesn't Harper make you hate Canada?
00:29:20.820 No.
00:29:21.600 No.
00:29:22.700 What we elect is an administration. 0.96
00:29:25.300 It's a handful of cronies.
00:29:27.580 No matter how you look at it, that's what it is.
00:29:29.560 It's a handful of guys, and they are hell-bent for success according to whatever they're going for.
00:29:35.860 It's usually money and power.
00:29:37.340 It's not the government.
00:29:38.640 It's an administration.
00:29:40.740 And with Lyndon Johnson, who was a Democrat, and Richard Nixon, who was a Republican,
00:29:46.600 each of them had guys in the back room making nasty phone calls.
00:29:50.860 That's how it's done.
00:29:51.880 It's not the government.
00:29:53.340 So the millennials, don't be afraid of these people who come on as if they're cobras.
00:29:57.920 They're not. 0.98
00:29:58.580 They're little worms. 1.00
00:29:59.900 They do nasty little things. 0.99
00:30:01.500 They do things like, you know, like some teenage girl movie.
00:30:05.920 It's really nasty, you know.
00:30:07.620 It's word of mouth, and it's personal networking.
00:30:10.940 It's a good old boy thing, but it's not Canada, and it's not America, and they only last for a few years.
00:30:19.060 Then we throw those rascals out, and we elect somebody else.
00:30:22.860 I hope that that's helpful in people demythologizing the government.
00:30:28.560 The government is us.
00:30:30.620 We elect somebody, and then our lamest reaction is to elect somebody,
00:30:35.620 give him the keys to the cash register and power, and then forget about him.
00:30:40.560 It's too tempting.
00:30:42.380 That's how politicians turn into racketeers.
00:30:45.120 The game is kind of fixed, and what we need to do is vote, you know, elect.
00:30:52.860 and follow up but you've got to keep on you've got to keep the pressure on you know we think
00:30:59.440 that we our role stops when we vote but no it doesn't unfortunately
00:31:04.220 kids were sent from heaven inside to lead you to the future
00:31:21.840 Wrap their eyes in blindfolds
00:31:26.000 And still they'll find their way
00:31:28.020 Blind their lives with pills and lies
00:31:32.040 And still they find their vision 0.71
00:31:34.240 And soon they'll leave you to your yesterday
00:31:38.280 And they'll sing bye-bye scars of history
00:31:43.280 And bye-bye banker's trust
00:31:46.160 Aquarius is shining, but the sun is one of us
00:31:52.040 And me, I don't want to go to the moon
00:31:55.740 I'm gonna leave that moon alone
00:31:58.180 I just want to dance with the rosebust
00:32:01.520 Still this summer, yes, yes
00:32:06.000 The media is saturated
00:32:10.560 But the sweet grass still grows tall
00:32:13.200 And Jesse John Blackbeard talks to God in Cleveland, Ohio 1.00
00:32:18.920 And Washington is joking, but the Navajos are not
00:32:25.240 And Mother Earth just keeps on giving while we're ripening
00:32:30.280 I talked to seven congressmen, their ears were filled with gold
00:32:37.360 At their grandfathers had stolen out of the Black Hills
00:32:43.100 And round and round the dance goes on
00:32:47.060 And the children are idle no more
00:32:49.240 And they will dream the dream my mother sends to them
00:32:54.900 And they'll sing bye-bye stars of history
00:32:58.500 And bye-bye bankers trust
00:33:01.220 Aquarius is shining honey
00:33:04.860 But the sun is one of us
00:33:07.080 And me, I don't wanna go to the moon
00:33:10.800 I'm gonna leave that moon alone
00:33:13.080 I just wanna dance with the rosebugs
00:33:16.520 Till this summer
00:33:17.960 Yes, yes, yes
00:33:21.180 Way from me, your brown-eyed man
00:33:40.800 guitar solo
00:34:10.780 Sing bye-bye, stars of history, and bye-bye, bankers' trust.
00:34:17.600 Aquarius is shining, honey, but the song is one of us.
00:34:22.980 And me, I don't want to go to the moon, I'm going to leave that moon alone.
00:34:28.820 I just want to dance with the rose by sea, this summer.
00:34:33.480 Yes, yes, yes, wait for me, a brown eye, man.
00:34:38.600 Yes, yes, wait for me, you're blind man. 0.97
00:34:58.000 Many well-meaning non-native people romanticize indigeneity.
00:35:02.720 I heard an interview that you once said that people wanted you to come on stage as some Pocahontas figure earlier in your career.
00:35:11.100 But you have shattered a one-dimensional perception of yourself and embody so many dimensions as artist, musician, teacher, philosopher, activist, farmer.
00:35:23.500 So in these times of great displacement, whether from land or ancestry, what does it mean to be indigenous in today's world?
00:35:32.720 And do you think that people can grow to be indigenous to land that they don't historically come from?
00:35:39.340 I think people can become something like indigenous, but no, I don't know.
00:35:44.240 You know, I think we're kind of stretching the definition of indigenous a little too far.
00:35:49.620 We need a different word, and I can't come up with it right now.
00:35:52.180 I think that you can become effective and you could become a supporter of the indigenous people who happen to come from there.
00:35:59.100 But, you know, there are a lot of ramifications to identity, including an indigenous identity.
00:36:06.120 I mean, if you marry an indigenous person and, you know, you've been married and raising a family for 40 years,
00:36:12.720 you're pretty much a member of the group.
00:36:15.100 So I'm not going to worry about the definition so much.
00:36:18.560 Truly indigenous people who come from colonialized nations.
00:36:24.660 I mean, now we're starting to define it a little more, you know.
00:36:27.320 Truly indigenous, you know, like aboriginal people from Australia who are unfortunately sitting on the only land to which they have title and it has uranium. 0.99
00:36:38.160 I mean, they're screwed, you know, because they're indigenous. 1.00
00:36:42.260 Now, if they had grown up in families, in colonialized families, how you grow up is very, very important as to your worldview and your effectiveness in the world. 1.00
00:36:53.080 in both show business and what we're talking about now,
00:36:57.240 you know, contemporary issues of indigeneity.
00:37:00.380 Because, like, when I first went to Greenwich Village,
00:37:02.980 I had never met a businessman.
00:37:04.620 I had never met a lawyer.
00:37:06.400 I was dealing with people who, for generations,
00:37:09.240 had been colonial racketeers.
00:37:12.100 I mean, I would call them colonial racketeers.
00:37:14.060 Other people would just say that they were very good at the profit motive.
00:37:17.500 But they knew how to exploit.
00:37:19.780 They knew how to steal. 0.89
00:37:23.080 They knew all about payola. 1.00
00:37:25.800 In other words, they were networked, and indigenous people traditionally are not.
00:37:31.000 So there's a lot to be said in contrast between someone who was coming from a non-business family like myself,
00:37:40.160 and most indigenous families would be coming from non-business families.
00:37:43.980 We don't know the rules of the game. 0.99
00:37:46.320 It's like walking into a Vegas casino.
00:37:48.780 You've never been there.
00:37:49.660 The deck is stacked against you, and you're going to lose because it's a setup.
00:37:54.240 It's meant to exploit you.
00:37:55.780 It's not meant to be fair.
00:37:57.200 It's a game to some people who grow up like that.
00:38:02.960 The whole idea of colonialism is, I mean, my motto, stay calm and decolonize.
00:38:08.900 We're all living in this colonial, ever-ripening, ever-changing, what do you call it, like a hallucination.
00:38:16.600 I mean, money itself is a hallucination.
00:38:18.440 And of itself, it has no value, you know?
00:38:21.060 Yeah, people are traveling across the globe at such speed these days
00:38:24.600 and moving from countryside to city, and it's like a diaspora of sorts. 0.91
00:38:30.540 It kind of is, but that's not necessarily all bad.
00:38:33.400 See, I think travel is good for anybody,
00:38:35.760 and I'm really happy with certain Canadian reserves
00:38:38.880 whereby they take the junior and senior classes traveling
00:38:42.460 to places like Africa and New Zealand,
00:38:44.940 and they take them to other indigenous areas.
00:38:48.440 to see the world through other Indigenous eyes and how wonderful that is.
00:38:52.440 In my own case, even though I come from a heartfelt position of indigeneity,
00:38:58.760 I love the big world, too, and I have certainly profited in both the brain, the heart, the pockets, everything, by traveling.
00:39:05.720 It's fun. It makes you smarter.
00:39:08.420 And yet our reserves in Canada, especially in my own family, the people who've stayed on the reserves are very, very dear to us.
00:39:16.260 They haven't had travel, and we have, but they have had community life in a very special way, too, which, you know, hopefully they share with us.
00:39:26.160 So I like it all.
00:39:27.520 I say travel as much as you can, learn as much as you can, read as much as you can, listen to all the music you can.
00:39:33.540 You know, who knows?
00:39:34.560 We might only live once.
00:39:35.620 hold your head up lift the top of your mind put your eyes on the earth lift your heart to your 0.99
00:39:51.900 own home planet what do you see what is your attitude are you here to improve or damn it 0.98
00:40:01.220 Look right now 0.98
00:40:02.600 And you will see
00:40:04.680 We're only here
00:40:06.640 By the skin of us
00:40:07.980 As it is
00:40:09.100 So take heart
00:40:10.040 And take care
00:40:11.040 Of your life
00:40:11.880 With a blind bear
00:40:13.380 Oh, carry it on
00:40:15.940 We're saying
00:40:17.020 Oh, carry it on
00:40:19.600 Keep playing
00:40:20.660 Oh, carry it on
00:40:23.320 And playing
00:40:24.380 Oh, carry it on
00:40:31.220 It ain't money that makes the world go round
00:40:37.300 It's only temporary confusion
00:40:40.260 It ain't garden events that make the people strong
00:40:44.880 It's the opposite illusion
00:40:47.740 Look right now
00:40:49.580 And you will see they're only here
00:40:53.460 By the skin of their teeth as it is
00:40:55.980 So take heart and take care of your liquid life
00:41:00.140 Oh, oh, carry it on
00:41:02.720 Keep saying
00:41:04.020 Oh, oh, carry it on
00:41:06.340 And playing
00:41:07.660 Oh, oh, carry it on
00:41:10.160 And praying
00:41:11.200 Oh, oh, carry it on
00:41:14.100 Look right now
00:41:15.820 And you must see we're only here by the skin of our teeth
00:41:21.260 As it is, so take heart and take care of your link with life
00:41:26.260 is beautiful
00:41:27.140 If you got the sense
00:41:29.800 to take care of your source
00:41:31.740 of perfection
00:41:32.740 Mother Nature
00:41:34.880 She's the daughter of God
00:41:37.420 and the source of all protection
00:41:40.180 Look right now
00:41:42.100 And you'll see
00:41:43.940 she's only here 1.00
00:41:45.960 by the skin of her teeth 1.00
00:41:47.460 as it is
00:41:48.460 So take heart and take care
00:41:50.300 of your link with life
00:41:54.420 Holder, carry it on
00:41:57.000 Keep saying
00:41:58.300 Carry it on
00:42:00.940 I'm praying
00:42:02.240 Carry it on
00:42:03.940 Keep on praying
00:42:05.860 Carry it on
00:42:08.960 We're saying
00:42:13.140 Come on, come on, keep playing
00:42:17.120 Carry it on
00:42:19.160 I'm praying
00:42:20.580 Carry it on
00:42:24.020 I love your spirit and non-judgmental, non-shaming openness to the world.
00:42:35.720 Thank you.
00:42:36.300 And I'm wondering, because of your connection to your ancestral cosmology and beliefs,
00:42:41.320 and because you studied Eastern philosophy,
00:42:43.860 I'm wondering what are some of the most powerful spiritual wisdoms or takeaways
00:42:48.340 that help guide you to live your life so fully?
00:42:51.260 You know, there's not one single thing that I would mention. Oriental philosophy, what it got me was a big smile, because I was so thrilled to know that other people besides myself loved the Creator.
00:43:08.980 When I discovered Oriental philosophy, it showed me that minds were greater than what I was finding in my own little neighborhood.
00:43:17.660 I found Oriental philosophy when I was in high school.
00:43:20.120 And there wasn't anybody who had ever heard the word reincarnation.
00:43:24.480 Not that I believe in it, I don't.
00:43:26.260 But after the Beatles came along, there was a big fad for people to study pseudo-Hinduism.
00:43:31.820 So I've kind of seen it come and go. 0.89
00:43:34.040 So what I learned from studying all these religions was that, you know what?
00:43:39.560 originality in how you perceive the creator comes directly from your circumstances of where you live
00:43:46.960 on the planet and who you ran into and what you read and all of that but all these people agree
00:43:54.000 that we are continually ripening and if i have a religion or a spiritual or you know kind of
00:44:01.620 heartfelt concept to impart to people that kind of comes from this area of my brain it's that
00:44:08.980 We're ripening. It's like it says in my song, we are circling, and what it implies in Carry It On,
00:44:15.140 that other song that's also on Power in the Blood, which is my new album, it has to do with ripening.
00:44:20.780 We are ripening, ripening together. Babies, elders, bozos, and angels. This is how we grow. This is
00:44:27.800 how we get to know. And I think that every single one of us, even the people we don't like, is,
00:44:33.580 whether we like it or not evolving getting better learning we're all different and we're all
00:44:39.340 starting from each one from our own original place and we all go at different rates but i don't think
00:44:46.900 any of us is very ripe i think if you say that you know i have a positive attitude and a humility
00:44:52.720 it's because i i think that we're all really kindergarten babies on this planet i think we're
00:44:57.120 just beginning and just like a second grader will look down his nose at a first grader and say
00:45:03.220 she spills her milk. I don't. The first grader will look down her nose at a kindergarten kid
00:45:10.000 and say, they wet their pants. I don't. We're always looking down our noses at somebody who's
00:45:17.020 five minutes younger than we are, and there's no profit in it at all. You might as well realize
00:45:22.860 that we're all evolving, and it's very exciting. Mine is, and yours is, and so is even that
00:45:29.120 neither one of us likes.
00:45:31.340 I don't know.
00:45:32.020 I just think that's the reality of life.
00:45:34.380 And that being the case,
00:45:35.340 it doesn't pay to put your nose too far in the air.
00:45:37.960 God is alive, magic is a foot
00:46:02.500 God is alive, magic is afoot, God is afoot, magic is alive, alive is afoot, magic never dies, magic is afoot, God never sickened, many poor men lied, many sick men lied, magic never weakened, magic never hid, magic always ruled, God is afoot, God never died.
00:46:32.500 God was ruler, though his funeral lengthened, though his mourners thickened, magic never fled, though his shrouds were hoisted, the naked God did live, though his words were twisted, the naked magic thrived, though his death was published, round and round the world, the heart did not believe.
00:46:54.760 Many hurt men wondered, many struck men bled
00:47:00.800 Magic never faltered, magic always led
00:47:04.900 Many stones were old, but God would not lie down
00:47:09.140 Many wild men lied, many fat men listened
00:47:13.080 Though they offered stones, magic still was fed
00:47:17.340 Though they locked their coffers, God was always served
00:47:24.760 Alive as a foot, alive as in command
00:47:28.800 Many weak men hungered, many strong men thrived
00:47:33.240 Though they boasted solitude, God was at their side
00:47:38.200 Nor the dreamer in his cell, nor the captain on the hill
00:47:42.480 Magic is alive, though his death was pardoned
00:47:46.640 Round and round the world, the heart would not believe
00:47:51.020 Though laws were carved in marble, they could not shelter men
00:47:56.480 Though altars built in parliaments, they could not order men
00:48:00.580 Police arrested magic, and magic went with them
00:48:04.780 For magic loves the hungry
00:48:08.100 But magic would not tarry
00:48:12.760 It moves from arm to arm
00:48:15.700 It would not stay with them
00:48:17.820 Magic is afoot, it cannot come to harm
00:48:22.020 It rests in an empty palm, it spawns in an empty mind
00:48:26.280 But magic is no instrument, magic is the end
00:48:30.520 Many men drove magic, but magic stayed behind
00:48:36.360 Many strong men lied, they only passed through magic
00:48:41.560 And out the other side, many weak men lied
00:48:45.960 They came to God in secret
00:48:47.980 And though they left him nourished
00:48:50.260 They would not tell who healed
00:48:52.380 Though mountains dashed before them
00:48:54.820 They said that God was dead
00:48:56.700 Though his shrouds were hoisted
00:48:58.960 The naked God did live
00:49:01.320 This I mean to whisper to my mind
00:49:04.520 This I mean to laugh within my mind
00:49:07.660 This I mean my mind to serve till service is
00:49:11.160 But magic moving through the world
00:49:13.480 And mind itself is magic
00:49:15.360 Coursing through the flesh, and flesh itself is magic
00:49:19.340 Dancing on a clock, and time itself
00:49:23.100 The magic length of God
00:49:26.400 Oh, God.
00:49:56.400 Slide, magic, guard, slide, magic.
00:50:26.400 I'd like to end this conversation
00:50:29.360 by asking you about your new album
00:50:31.440 Power in the Blood
00:50:32.340 what are you wanting to inspire in people
00:50:35.480 who engage with your music
00:50:37.060 the whole song we are circling
00:50:39.720 to me is like a mantra
00:50:41.120 it's like a deliberate mantra
00:50:42.720 it's real simple but I don't know
00:50:45.180 it's what I really mean and what I really say
00:50:47.380 I try to kind of make those little pearls
00:50:49.660 of wisdom stickable
00:50:51.180 especially in a little campfire song like that
00:50:53.520 and the idea of
00:50:55.080 I really believe in the positivity that's coming through in the songs, but I also clearly do see some of the negative portraits that I present in songs.
00:51:07.560 And none of it's deliberate, it's just kind of the way I see it and what's happening in my own daily life.
00:51:13.360 I mean, I'll go through an airport and all kinds of things will happen.
00:51:15.920 There'll be all kinds of joys and bummers, you know, every five minutes is something new.
00:51:20.280 you know you see somebody who you wish you could know and then you see somebody and you hope you
00:51:25.780 don't sit next to them and sure enough you do and it turns out you have things in common so i don't
00:51:30.460 know life's a trip you think i would have come up with something better than that in the last 50
00:51:35.400 years but keep your nose on the joy trail and share what you can share when you can share it
00:51:40.680 and don't be afraid to take a bath and take a nap and don't burn out you know that's kind of my
00:51:45.920 advice. It's very, very easy when you really do care and when your eyes are being opened to
00:51:51.160 some of the justices and injustices of the world. It's really tempting to just have an emotional
00:51:57.260 reaction and burnout and then go nowhere. No, no, your observations are probably true.
00:52:05.660 You know, go slow and careful. If you really care, come up with a little strategy of how you can
00:52:11.760 be happy and share that happiness and make things better for yourself and others. It's really a lot
00:52:18.200 of fun. Well, Buffy, thank you so much for your time, your wisdom, and your spirit. You are in
00:52:25.840 the truest sense an inspiration, and it's exhilarating to hear you speak. So thank you
00:52:31.840 again for being on Unlearn and Rewild. Oh, my pleasure. My pleasure, Anna. And again,
00:52:37.540 And congratulations on your great title, Unlearn and Rewild.
00:52:40.840 I'm going to be thinking about that.
00:52:42.180 Well, wonderful.
00:52:43.420 And I got one for you. 1.00
00:52:44.100 Stay calm and decolonize. 1.00
00:52:45.960 I'm keeping to that. 0.99
00:52:47.380 Okay.
00:52:47.800 Have a great day.
00:52:48.660 Enjoy your day, Buffy.
00:52:49.920 Thank you again.
00:52:50.700 Thank you.
00:52:51.340 Bye.
00:52:51.520 We are circling, circling together
00:53:07.620 We are singing, singing our heart song
00:53:12.160 This is family, this is unity
00:53:16.080 It's a celebration, this is sacred
00:53:20.440 We are spiraling, spiraling together
00:53:28.900 Onward, inward, creature to creation
00:53:33.080 Holy mystery, mother earth, childbirth
00:53:37.580 This is mother nature, this is sacred
00:53:41.740 We are circling, circling together
00:53:50.080 We are singing, singing a heart song
00:53:54.580 This is family, this is unity
00:53:58.580 This is celebration, this is sacred
00:54:03.080 We are spinning, spinning all together
00:54:11.360 We are singing over the rainbow
00:54:15.640 This is harmony, this is community
00:54:19.760 This is celebration, this is sacred
00:54:24.260 We are circling, circling together
00:54:32.560 We are singing, singing our hearts
00:54:36.780 This is family, this is unity
00:54:41.060 This is celebration, this is sacred
00:54:45.320 We are ripening, ripening together
00:54:53.860 Babies, elders, bozos and angels
00:54:58.260 This is how we grow, this is how we get to know
00:55:02.480 This is celebration, this is sacred
00:55:11.060 We are circling, circling together
00:55:15.040 We are singing, singing our hearts all
00:55:19.560 This is family, this is unity
00:55:23.520 This is celebration, this is sacred
00:55:28.040 We are circling, circling together
00:55:36.400 C.A.S.A.S.A.S.A.I.
00:55:40.880 C.A.S.A.S.A.S.A.J.
00:55:42.900 C.A.S.A.S.A.S.A.S.A
00:55:44.620 C.A.S.A.S.A.S.A.
00:55:47.360 C.A.S.A.S.A.S.A.S.A.S.A.S.A.S.A.S.A.S.A.
00:55:52.020 C.A.S.A.S.A.S.A.S.A.
00:56:06.400 Thank you for listening to Unlearn and Rewild.
00:56:10.380 This is Ayana Young.
00:56:12.180 The music you heard today was all by Buffy St. Marie.
00:56:15.520 The songs included Native North American Child,
00:56:19.340 Little Wheel Spin and Spin,
00:56:21.860 My Country, Tis of Thy People You're Dying,
00:56:24.940 Generation, Carry It On,
00:56:28.160 God is Alive, Magic is Afoot,
00:56:30.800 and We Are Circling.
00:56:32.160 Our theme music is Like a River by Kate Wolfe.
00:56:36.400 And thank you to our editor, Nicole West, and producer, March Young.
00:57:06.400 Sweet smell of pines
00:57:15.460 Tall western cedar
00:57:17.240 Drifting on the wind
00:57:21.020 Through the mountains like a river
00:57:23.200 Sweet smell of pines
00:57:27.300 Tall western cedar
00:57:29.860 Drifting on the wind
00:57:33.240 Through the mountains like a river
00:57:35.960 I love you