00:01:55.060We can just be outside observers and commentators.
00:02:04.100There Are No Girls on the Internet is a production of iHeartRadio and Unbossed Creative.
00:02:12.220I'm Bridget Todd, and this is There Are No Girls on the Internet.
00:02:17.780Here in the United States, there are 50 days left until our midterm elections.
00:02:23.200Election season can be a bit of a mess.
00:02:26.520I used to work on campaigns, and I can tell you that it wasn't always hope and change.
00:02:31.640Sometimes it was more like eating pizza for breakfast, lunch, and dinner, or crying in a storage closet.
00:02:38.260And even beyond the way that staffers are treated on political campaigns,
00:02:42.700sometimes it seems like the tactics out there to engage voters are just kind of stale or just plain old not effective.
00:02:51.000And with so much at stake, you know, literally the fabric of our democracy, shouldn't things be better? And shouldn't everyone feel represented, engaged, and checked in? So, how can we make sure that all voters are showing up and that nobody is being shut out of our democracy?
00:03:12.880Using digital tools to answer that very question is Tatenda's mission in life.
00:03:18.900I am Tatenda Musapatiki, and I am the CEO and founder of the Voter Formation Project.
00:03:24.220So can you tell us a little bit about the Voter Formation Project?
00:03:27.220So I founded the organization in December of 2020, and we went public in 21.
00:03:32.080And it's an organization that I founded to be a national organization that works in many states to use the best of digital marketing tactics in order to reach Black and brown and other disadvantaged communities.
00:03:44.980We look at different ways that corporate marketers are doing their campaigns.
00:03:48.420That way we can apply it to political work.
00:03:50.680And then also we want to be doing education with people who are running smaller organizations
00:03:55.720and may not have as much knowledge about digital to be able to provide them with resources.
00:03:59.940When we first met, you were working at Facebook.
00:04:02.460And I talk a lot about Facebook on this show.
00:04:05.320People are always like, oh, you really hate Facebook.
00:04:07.740And I used to say like, oh, I have a lot of good friends that work at Facebook.
00:04:10.520And that no longer includes you. So can you talk to us a little bit about how you went from your work at Facebook to doing the work that you're doing now, really working to engage black and brown voters?
00:04:21.720Sure. You know, it's more of a direct path than I think people would think. I loved my job at Facebook and I was there. I was the client solutions manager for democratic politics, which means that I helped people on the left.
00:04:38.520So think parties, committees, candidates and organizations and then the agencies that support them with their Facebook strategies, their buys, thinking through how best they could reach their goals on the platform and really like being the voice of the company to these clients and vice versa.
00:04:56.580As you can imagine, between 2015 and 2019, it got a little rough. There was a lot of things that happened in that period of time, which made my job significantly less enjoyable. But I felt very strongly about the work I did and the causes I got to support and also how I was treated as an employee.
00:05:16.420it was like the best employer I'd had, which I have no qualms saying. And so it got to the point
00:05:23.580where the company was like rethinking how it was that they wanted to do political ads. And
00:05:28.600I liked my old job, and I didn't want a different job. And I couldn't find another role that would
00:05:33.400really fulfill what I needed in my next steps. And so I left to go to acronym to build my own
00:05:37.860program. One of the biggest frustrations of my job, and truly one of the biggest ones,
00:05:42.580And given all the things that happened there, it's saying a lot that this was a frustration is that I kept seeing the same kinds of campaigns engaging the same people over and over again.
00:05:52.720There was very, very little experimentation in terms of tactics or in terms of creative, meaning the ads that were put on or in terms of strategies that people were using for voter registration and mobilization.
00:06:02.980And of the strategies that were being deployed, none of them use corporate best marketing practices, which also just seemed insane to me, given all the things I had learned.
00:06:10.240and it's rare that political marketers or people who come up in digital political work get exposed
00:06:15.540to how corporate marketing works and get exposed to like some of the best minds in corporate
00:06:19.400marketing and how they think about building their campaigns and so getting to see that just like
00:06:23.480blew my brain open and I just became a sponge of like I want to learn so much more about how all
00:06:27.620these different industries do their campaigns and why they do their campaigns and the science behind
00:06:31.260them which only led me to think that the way that we do things is so messed up I was like this
00:06:35.600doesn't make any sense given how the rest, like truly the rest of the marketing industries work.
00:06:42.040So I wanted to go build my own campaign. So I, Tara allowed me to come onto acronym and said,
00:06:47.260yep, build what you want, test what you want. And that is what I did.
00:06:52.580When it comes to testing out new tactics in elections, campaigns are not really testing
00:06:58.320to figure out effective ways to engage black and brown voters the same way they are with
00:07:03.520our white counterparts. Now, the reasons for this are kind of complicated, but one of them
00:07:08.880is just the good old fashioned systemic racism of black and brown people being shut out of systems
00:07:15.580for so long. Oh, we're about to break it all the way down. It is a mishmash of corporate greed
00:07:21.820and racism, like fundamentally. So let's start with the racism is probably easier to discuss.
00:07:29.500So, like, when folks are doing their campaigns, and they're thinking about like, okay, these are the people I need to engage, it is harder to reach people of color online. It just is. It's harder because the data systems that are used both by platforms, and by campaigns to identify voters are based on things called data points.
00:07:51.940and data points are things like your credit history, your addresses, your phone number,
00:07:57.660your racial identity, your ethnicity. And people of color have fewer data points because of systemic
00:08:04.240racism in society due to no access to credit, not allowed to own homes, kept from home ownership,
00:08:10.760kept from car ownership. So all of those things, like if you're a renter, you have a lot fewer
00:08:16.840data points. If you've never bought anything with credit or don't have a credit card, fewer data
00:08:20.420points. If you are unbanked, fewer data points. So data points are the things that algorithms have
00:08:26.140built or like targeting systems have built into many social media platforms, how they reach
00:08:31.940people. It's not exclusive, which is why the internet is great for reaching people of color,
00:08:35.920because it's not the only way you can do it. But it is a pretty heavy way of doing it and the
00:08:39.540systems that campaigns use to identify people. So because it's more expensive, and because many of
00:08:47.060the ways that foundations or donors evaluate programs is by cost. These campaigns to reach
00:08:53.480people of color are often viewed as more expensive and not as effective because the mechanisms used
00:08:58.500to measure them are racist based on systemic data. And the way that programs are evaluated
00:09:05.680is based on this entire thing that makes it harder to reach voters of color. So like that's0.95
00:09:09.360one piece. Like, and I would say the biggest piece, it's something that I'm, the longer I'm
00:09:13.500a founder, the more I just like want to beat my head against the wall. I feel like I'm having the
00:09:17.620same conversations over and over again, and they're just so frustrating. This frustration around
00:09:22.800systemic racism that limits how Black and brown people are engaged by campaigns is one thing. But
00:09:28.680add in the extractive nature of the digital consultant class in the political landscape,
00:09:33.840and all of this inequality gets even more entrenched. Because think about it. If you're
00:09:39.280a consultant being paid by a campaign, you aren't necessarily thinking about how to reinvent the
00:09:44.500wheel. And you probably are not going to take the risks necessary to learn how to do this work
00:09:50.040effectively or really test anything out. In short, you might just play it safe because you want to be
00:09:56.900paid. So in, I would say, the overall digital landscape of progressive politics and even like
00:10:06.040nonprofits. So civic engagement work that is outside of like partisan politics. There are
00:10:11.680a few major agencies that are hired by most folks at a certain level to do digital buying.
00:10:18.160Those people make their money based on promises that they give to clients about effectiveness of
00:10:22.780campaigns. And when you start to experiment or go outside of that, you are introducing a risk,
00:10:27.340which means that you are less likely to deliver for your client. And then when you're talking
00:10:30.740about experimentation. The experimentation tends to be less bold, because how is it that you
00:10:37.700explain to your client like, oh, we're doing this thing and it might not work. You know,
00:10:44.380clients are like not like organizations that have to report to a donor are not like keen to tell
00:10:49.780their like donor like, hey, I'm gonna do this thing. And it might not work. And y'all are gonna
00:10:55.280pay for it. Yeah. Like it's, it's hard to do. I like came into this space, like putting a stick
00:11:00.600in the ground that that's what I'm going to do. So it's been easier to me. Cause I am like, I,
00:11:04.260I am the digital measurement lady and I am the person who's going to say the things that no one's
00:11:07.980going to say to you. I feel like I've built a bit of that reputation. So I don't have the same fear
00:11:12.580as like other entrenched organizations who have made like promises on efficacy or whatnot to
00:11:16.640folks. And, you know, it's a chicken in the egg. Like there is a problem with these organizations
00:11:23.260not taking the risks and not taking the risks in an environment that is constantly changing,
00:11:27.720and folks who refuse to be more lenient about how it is that you evaluate program.
00:11:32.120If a program is more expensive by a couple hundred dollars per voter, it's not great,
00:11:38.060but it also should not be the end of the world. And it shouldn't be the overall metric by which
00:11:41.620you measure a campaign or that you decide to disperse to a campaign. And then to get back
00:11:47.140to the racism, all of those organizations that do the digital media buying or the measurement
00:11:50.700tend to be run by white men or white women, whatever, white people who like aren't promoting
00:11:55.900people of color within their organizations. Or if they are like, bless up, I hope you're okay.
00:12:01.480I certainly wasn't when I was in them. And so it just, it's just this ever evolving cycle where
00:12:09.460there needs to be an organization pushing from the outside saying, this is crazy. This is not
00:12:14.980healthy. And it's actually not good for democracy. Because if we are saying that we know that voters
00:12:19.240of color and people of color are kind of like the barometer for if we have a fair society.0.89
00:12:23.400Are they able to vote at equal rates as their white counterparts? And the answer is no. But1.00
00:12:27.560then we're holding those organizations to an impossible standard to reach the same quotas
00:12:31.960and cost effectiveness of, you know, groups that target not even just white folks, but like include
00:12:37.900white people in their audiences because that can have a tremendous impact on cost. Like what is
00:12:43.340the market rate for democracy? Like you tell me, like that's one thing I've been saying. Like if
00:12:46.920you're going to hold groups accountable to these cost measures what what is what's the market rate
00:12:52.460of democracy for a voter of color that's a brand new and never has voted for before but may vote1.00
00:12:56.720for the rest of their life and furthermore republicans don't do this shit they don't they0.99
00:13:00.880don't care they care about getting power so at the end of the day they do all these things and0.99
00:13:04.740they have some measurement but like they got power over the course of 10 years that's how they operate
00:13:09.540um so it's all just kind of wild the longer i do it the more i learn i'm just like oh i thought i
00:13:15.820knew and i feel like every two weeks i have like a whole other revelation where i'm like why am i
00:13:21.280doing this i should have quit politics like seven years ago like i said i would the first time
00:13:25.260but then i love what i do and i care a lot about it
00:15:03.920It's like if you can hide some real messages inside compelling characters, then that is a Trojan horse.
00:15:11.820Whether you're looking for literary deep dives, smart pop culture conversations, or a community of readers who love to think a little too much, you're in the right place.
00:15:20.980Listen to Pro Society on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
00:15:52.960Every week, I'm with survivors who live through the unthinkable.
00:15:56.100unthinkable. I knew if he woke up, without a doubt, he was going to hurt me. I started feeling
00:16:03.400that there was someone at the end of my bed and I just started screaming. They are abducted,
00:16:10.900stalked, controlled, and nearly silenced. But these aren't stories about what's taken from them.
00:16:17.020They're stories about what it takes to make it out alive. Listen to The Survivor Files with
00:16:22.540Elizabeth Smart on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
00:16:34.480And we're back. In the 2020 election, I heard so many people championing the political leadership
00:16:42.300of Black women for ostensibly saving the United States from another four years of President Trump.
00:16:48.460But these very nice sounding platitudes do not always come with meaningful investment in the leadership of Black women.0.57
00:16:57.000For instance, Tatenda is the only Black woman in the United States who runs a digital-only voter engagement operation.
00:17:05.540I feel like, especially on the left and within the Democratic Party, we love saying things like, oh, trust Black women, elect Black women.
00:17:12.040And I was sort of surprised to find that you are the only, you are running the only digital only voter engagement operation led by a black woman. And obviously, that's very exciting, but also kind of disappointing. And I guess my question would be, if we say things like, oh, black women, black voters, they're the backbone of the left, the backbone of the Democratic Party, why then are we, are more black women not being invested in to do this kind of work?
00:17:40.000Why are we not investing in this political leadership that folks say they want, that folks say, like, is really leading our party?0.99
00:17:49.140Honestly, like, to be very blunt about it, it's performative bullshit by the white people in power.0.99
00:17:54.300Like, I don't have much else to say.0.99
00:17:56.140Like, honestly, it's like, trust Black women until you have to pay us fairly.1.00
00:18:02.440Trust Black women until we want a seat at the table.0.99
00:18:05.040Trust Black women until we're asking for power.1.00
00:18:06.940And, you know, to be fair, there are some black organizations, black led organizations that do the work, but they tend to be for profit or like organizations hosting for profits.1.00
00:18:15.380Or they tend to be field groups that came out of folks who were like came up in campaigns and were told like, oh, you can do the black people.0.69
00:18:20.860Right. One of the things that I care a lot about is like being able to get institutional power for VFP.
00:18:26.400Like, yes, we do work that's designed to reach people of color only or like disadvantaged communities only.
00:18:31.940But like, I'm the best at what I do, regardless of who else is out there doing it. And I want to very much so keep pushing the envelope so that that is something that is seen, and something that is understood. And I feel like whenever I say that out loud, it's like, there's a bit of arrogance in it and hubris. But at the same time, like, if I don't have that, then what am I doing here? Right? Like, I don't get to fail the way my white counterparts do.
00:18:57.600when you say things like that what's the response i think it's like a mixture of like people are
00:19:03.700like okay or they're terrified of me which is like really funny because i'm like five foot three and
00:19:08.180i'm kind of a goofball and people who are like hang out with me and know my friends like i'm
00:19:11.140kind of weird it's it's fine but like i guess i've been told i'm slightly terrifying when i get in
00:19:16.700that mood and okay you know like i've been heard like oh you're a lot to swallow well choke i'm
00:19:23.820sorry. This is what we're doing. We're talking about the future of our democracy, the future
00:19:31.800of what the fabric of our country is going to be like. And people like you don't really have time
00:19:38.920to play small. People like you don't really have time to play humble when we're talking about
00:19:42.720something that is this important. Yeah. And you're fighting for the livelihood of your org.
00:19:49.960It's like my organization. I care a lot about the people I employ. I care a lot about the work
00:19:53.740I do. And so you can't go into it, you know, trying to get into a fairly entrenched system
00:19:59.540of like, oh, these are the people who do the work and these are the people they give money to or
00:20:02.820whatever. If I'm coming in and wanting to establish an organization that does this work at scale,
00:20:07.460you know, you don't get there by thinking to yourself a little bit by little bit. You kind
00:20:12.340of get there by setting a really big goal and chasing after it relentlessly. I just don't feel
00:20:17.620like I have any other choice, to be honest. And I know I'm, again, very, very, very good at what I
00:20:22.480do. So you almost got to adopt that Olivia Pope swagger and go for it because otherwise you are
00:20:28.940going to fail. And so it's almost like a catch 22. I don't know anyone who got to where they
00:20:35.720are leading an organization or leading a large organization who's like, you know, I was just
00:20:42.140hoping for the best. Like, no, like there has to be some deliberate and there are days I wake up
00:20:46.960and I'm like, how the hell did I get here? Because my career has been wild to say the least.
00:20:52.480I've had a wild variety of experiences across a number of orgs.
00:20:56.620But yeah, you just have to do it and you have to think big.
00:21:00.840Well, and I know for you, part of thinking big is the ability to pivot because, you know,
00:21:05.440our digital landscape is always changing.
00:21:08.000Like Apple's privacy change last year really limited the tracking capabilities of digital
00:21:12.280advertisers, which I'm sure changed everything about how you're reaching people online.
00:21:17.100So can you tell me a bit about your goals and how they've evolved?
00:21:19.500Yeah, so I would put them in kind of free buckets. I think one is I'd love to register and mobilize half a million people of color in this next election cycle. So register or mobilize. And I think that's very doable if we reach our fundraising goals. We have to just run a very, very smart campaigns and think very strategically and be pretty relentless in our measurement.
00:21:40.580And so I think the second goal would be for us to be able to release a lot of measurement about how doing these campaigns has changed. We've already started doing that with our 21 programs, where we uncovered just how much the Apple privacy measures have impacted certain types of advertising programs across all the platforms.
00:21:59.580So we have to retool, you know, the cost estimates that we have. We have to retool the strategies that we're using. We have to remeasure and understand what is working to reach these communities, what types of creative are getting us there, what types of data strategies are getting us there or not getting us there, right? Like eliminating this idea, if we do an experiment and the results are negative, that's not failure, right? That is a learning that we can then spread to everyone and say, don't waste your money doing this. We already did. And guess what? It does not work.
00:22:25.500um so that's a big one being able to disseminate information um another big goal of ours is to do
00:22:32.220a lot of trainings for smaller field organizations i care a lot about being able to give the
00:22:36.140information that is in my head and in my my team's head about how it is that you can understand
00:22:40.480digital to people who run organizations who haven't really had a place to go and get information about
00:22:46.380like this is what an ad is this is what an impression is this is what an influencer is
00:22:51.980this is what people mean when they say influencer marketing, or like, this is a text message
00:22:56.640program, you know, like these things are basic things that I take for granted, because I came
00:23:00.940up in this space. But, you know, if you've been organizing in the field for years, like you're
00:23:04.500not paying attention to like, a lot of it. And so we need a place for those folks to go and learn
00:23:09.920about what these terms are, what they mean, and how they can structure their organizations and
00:23:14.500resource their organizations to be able to do experimentation and learn what works for them.
00:23:18.800So that's another big goal that I'm excited about.
00:23:21.800And then the fourth one kind of has nothing to do with the work, but how we do the work.
00:23:28.480It's a tricky question that a lot of people on campaigns don't really like to talk about.
00:23:33.560For instance, the fact that campaign work is usually pretty grueling.
00:23:40.080You work terrible hours for terrible pay and are treated terribly too.
00:23:45.060And I actually have a theory that it's one of the reasons why there's such tight-knit camaraderie on political campaigns.
00:23:52.900Because staffers have all gone through something traumatic together just by being on the campaign.
00:23:58.760And it doesn't even stop when the election is over.
00:24:02.740Earlier this year, Instagram accounts like Dear White Staffer popped up on social media
00:24:09.300to shed a little bit of light onto the mistreatment of rank-and-file staff
00:24:13.940on campaigns, nonprofits, and political offices.
00:24:17.820This used to be Tatenda's life, and my life.
00:24:21.940And I can't say that I really miss it.
00:24:26.580I have been loving the great resignation and the result of these, like,
00:24:31.020Instagrams, like, dear white staffer and dear nonprofit, all of them,0.51
00:24:36.220because I was that person when I was until recently who was just like this industry is sick0.93
00:24:44.840and like crazy and run by maniacal people who like do not care about stabs and there are so
00:24:49.780many things that are taken for granted because this is how it's always been done and one of the
00:24:54.180big things for me in starting this org is like we're going to change how people work and we're
00:24:57.700going to change how people work at political organizations and we're going to treat people
00:25:01.440with dignity and respect and pay them well and we're going to do it all under a non-profit
00:25:05.700an umbrella and we're going to do it during election years. And we're all going to live
00:25:08.620healthy lives. My nightmare would be to wake up after an election and have someone tell me I had
00:25:14.080to do two all-nighters or like, sorry, like I got to go. I picked up an ad or I got to go because I
00:25:20.920was working too much. Like, no, I don't want that for any of my staff. I want my staff to be well
00:25:25.220rested. I want them to have vacations during election cycles. I want them to not be on public
00:25:32.040assistance and to be able to you know there's a minimum salary of 55k at our org it is what it is
00:25:37.980because if people are living in cities and if you are a scheduler for me you are still doing
00:25:42.440meaningful work and you deserve to be able to like pay rent and pay for groceries and maybe
00:25:46.720your student loans and like live your life right i don't want people picking up second third jobs
00:25:52.300out of necessity for living and i think in turn what we're going to find out i'm 95 positive is
00:25:58.020that when you treat people with this level of dignity and respect you get better work
00:26:00.760because people are arrested. So, and there has not been an example of an organization that has
00:26:09.820done this at scale. Like I will fight anyone about it. Like I am sure, like I can't, I was
00:26:18.580a Facebook lady for so many orgs. Like I know exactly what was going on with many of these
00:26:22.860folks based on the email times I was receiving things, let alone like how they were feeling or
00:26:28.120tone or whatever like there's got to be a better way and the only way that there's going to be a
00:26:32.580better way is if we have like actual disruption with a proof point so that people are leaving
00:26:37.060jobs to force it to be better it's something I care about like as much as the rest of the work
00:26:43.680I'm so glad that you're that that is something that's baked into what you're doing because
00:26:48.220I am the same as the same as you like I came up at a time where it was just standard that if you
00:26:54.740worked in campaigns, if you were working in the progress, even the progressive movement that you
00:26:59.300were working until, you know, my, the last time that I was in that world, my nine to five was
00:27:04.580really more like a seven to 10. Right. And then, you know, when you go out on campaigns, the sort
00:27:10.540of like idea that like people are working second jobs or like going on government assistance,
00:27:15.020like it wasn't great. And I think that whenever we, you know, I'm, I'm a little older than some
00:27:20.620of our listeners, I think, but whenever we would have converse, like we weren't having a national
00:27:24.460conversation about sort of how to treat people in a workplace. It was still seen as like a badge
00:27:29.100of honor that you care so much that you basically don't really have much of a life and hate. You
00:27:35.520wake up like exhausted every morning. That was seen as a good thing. I'm so happy that we're
00:27:40.060now having conversations that are getting away from this culture of hustle, hustle, hustle all
00:27:45.640the time and glorifying that because I have done that and there is nothing to be glorified about
00:27:51.200it those times in my life I I cannot even imagine going back to those times but I also think that
00:27:57.300we like when I would talk to others about them it would be like well that's how I did it and it was
00:28:02.300this like weird thing where nobody would break the cycle because that's how they did it when they
00:28:07.300were coming up or it was like a pissing contest of like well this happened to you this week you
00:28:12.340know what happened to me and then you all feel like okay well it's fine because like everyone
00:28:17.440else is in this and this is how it's supposed to be. But like, one, I was always winning these
00:28:21.320pissing contests. Like I really have worked for some exceptionally like difficult people.
00:28:25.820And two, what is the, like, if someone's willing to disrespect you at one level, right? Like
00:28:30.240I have been cursed at, there was a day I thought I was going to get hit by my manager at work,
00:28:34.300physically hit, they hit something else instead of me. They're like, and then like, what is the
00:28:40.100line between that? And then like, oh, well, you didn't get sexually harassed, but then there are
00:28:42.880people who are, and we're not talking about it. There are predators running around that we all
00:28:46.160They were running around doing whatever, but no one got in trouble and still, frankly, have not gotten in trouble to the level they probably deserve.
00:28:54.140Because if we tolerate one and we tolerate the next, then we are tolerating probably most of it because the Overton window is already on the side of abuse.
00:29:01.440So, like, we got to move it completely and we have to shift about it.
00:29:04.140And I think it's, like, our generation that's starting to come up and, like, start our own orgs that's probably going to change the tide.
00:29:10.000but like this old mentality of like we need to suffer and continue to be paid discriminatory
00:29:15.120compared to our white counterparts or deal with x abuse like uh-uh I'm done I can't do it anymore
00:29:20.400I can't and I'm so glad so many other people are getting to that point because I've only
00:29:27.640not helped to deal with like pay issues at one job so what are we doing especially as progressives
00:29:35.140Exactly. Well, that's my thing is that we are meant to be the folks building a different future. And how can we say that we're going to build a more free, more inclusive, more equitable future when the structures that we are operating in, the structures that we are mired in are not even more free or not even more equitable or not even more inclusive? It just like doesn't compute to me.
00:29:55.700yeah because it's uncomputable it doesn't make sense but here we are so i i feel like it's not
00:30:01.180until more of us like snatch seats of power that what's gonna be like different and you know i i
00:30:07.440think because of my employment past over the last like what 12 13 years that like i care so much
00:30:13.860about like you know everyone on my staff and i think they know they're like to a degree where
00:30:18.500they're like i know i just have the sniffles i'm not sick you don't need to make me go home like
00:30:24.000I'm good. And I'm like, okay, but like, are you? Cause you're snuffling. So like, get off the
00:30:28.500zoom, you know, like, right. That's the kind of the relate, like they know I'm paying attention.
00:30:34.740Where are we in terms of voter registration? Are we in a good place? Are we in a bad place? Like
00:30:40.200what, what is it, what is the future looking like in terms of getting communities of color
00:30:45.020registered to vote and mobilized? I would say for me, it's a frustrating place. So from what I can
00:30:51.740gather from, you know, the campaign world, it's a midterm. And generally with midterms, people are
00:30:56.240less concerned about registration, one, because it's harder and more expensive to do. And then
00:31:01.100two, because at least in this period, we've had like really unprecedented growth in voter
00:31:07.920registration since about 2018, frankly, over the 2018 cycle and 2020 cycle. And so I'm starting to
00:31:16.060hear whispers of like we need to do less of this work because we have so so many voters and I that0.99
00:31:24.480just concerns me like why should you put the brakes on getting more people involved like from a
00:31:30.920just like a an American point of view like shouldn't we be trying to get everyone to vote
00:31:36.320like isn't our job done when everyone's registered to vote like that that makes sense to me but but
00:31:42.460you know what I mean like campaigns and especially organizations that have political aims are
00:31:46.040resource constrained. And so they have to spend their money on getting to like 50 plus one.
00:31:50.800And so voter registration is not going to be a priority for many of these orgs. And it's probably
00:31:54.120going to be less funded than it will be in 24 and definitely than it was in 20. So I find that
00:31:58.760disheartening, disconcerting to hear that. But the other thing that actually is quite concerning
00:32:03.440that it's heartening to see, but also concerning is that we do have so many new voters and so many
00:32:08.780new voters who voted in 2018 and didn't vote in 20. And we have so many new voters in 20 who
00:32:13.140probably won't vote in 22. And so mobilizing these folks who are going to be viewed as like
00:32:18.000not likely voters, who probably won't be included in these like campaign mathematics of 50 plus one,
00:32:24.320however, are so imperative to keep involved, especially because this is probably the first
00:32:28.260midterm or second midterm or first midterm after they've been registered is really, really crucial
00:32:33.420because if you aren't working to help establish those habits of regular voting, you know, you
00:32:37.580can register someone, but that doesn't mean they'll vote. And so what is happening or like
00:32:42.320the necessity of getting folks who are new, newly registered over the course of the last
00:32:47.220four years is also really, really important work that I think folks are starting to pay