Under the Influence (with Jo Piazza) - Art is For Everyone With Liz Lidgett

00:00:00.000 Hey y'all, Jo here, and you are listening to Under the Influence.

00:00:09.940 Really quick, friendly, weekly reminder to order your copy of The Parisian Heist today.

00:00:14.700 It is the book of the summer, the book everyone is already talking about, and the book that's

00:00:18.600 going to make you see art in an entirely different way.

00:00:23.420 And that's what we're talking about today.

00:00:25.540 Art.

00:00:26.420 I started following my guest today in the throes of the pandemic.

00:00:30.000 I was scrolling and scrolling, and I just needed a soft place to land.

00:00:33.440 I just needed something beautiful to look at.

00:00:36.380 It turns out that Liz Lidget had opened her gallery right before the pandemic.

00:00:41.500 And she started putting art from the gallery on social media as a way for people to enjoy

00:00:46.240 it when they couldn't leave their houses.

00:00:48.520 Now, Liz is one of my favorite people to follow on Instagram.

00:00:51.260 She truly is.

00:00:52.480 She takes the often intimidating art world and turns it into something that feels very

00:00:57.260 human.

00:00:57.640 As a gallery owner and a curator, and now an author of the book, Art for Everyone,

00:01:03.240 How to Collect Art and Personalize Your Space on Any Budget, Liz is my go-to person when I want

00:01:09.280 to figure out how to buy art, where to put it in my house, how to hang it, how to live with it,

00:01:14.560 all of the things, all the things. I love our conversation today. It naturally veers into

00:01:20.220 perimenopause because that's where everything goes with me these days. But I promise you,

00:01:25.140 It's mostly art.

00:01:32.700 Hello, Liz.

00:01:33.660 How are you doing today?

00:01:34.720 I'm doing great.

00:01:35.600 I'm excited to talk to you.

00:01:36.740 I'm so excited to talk to you.

00:01:38.220 I mean, I have a thousand questions for you.

00:01:40.780 I want to start off by asking you, and I don't know if you've gotten asked this a hundred

00:01:44.800 times, what is your favorite piece of art in your house?

00:01:50.320 Oh, in my house.

00:01:51.320 So, okay. So in the book, the end papers of the book are a painting that is mine. That is by Kit

00:02:00.420 Porter. And I signed Kit to the gallery about five days after she was given a breast cancer

00:02:08.240 diagnosis. And we went through this whole thing. And when I talked to her on the phone, I was like,

00:02:15.680 I'd love to sign you. And she's like, that's great. I was just told I have breast cancer.

00:02:19.380 and she was just this wonderful ray of light and we worked together for several years she created

00:02:25.100 that piece for me and a couple of years ago she fought so valiantly but she passed due to the

00:02:30.580 cancer and I just look at her and I feel like I still have a piece of her with me you know and

00:02:35.740 now it's in that book and so her husband Tristan gave me the permission to scan the artwork and

00:02:42.320 put it in the end papers and it just it means so much to me it's like that's the first thing you

00:02:46.680 see when you open the book oh I love that so much I yeah I mean I love the stories behind art

00:02:52.800 sometimes you do I mean definitely often as much and sometimes even more than I love the art itself

00:03:00.180 and yes I mean obviously given the book I've been working on for the past three years I think about

00:03:05.180 art all the time now and also how how stories make art so much more meaningful one of the things

00:03:15.520 I hear so much from people is I don't get art or it's not I'm not a rich person art is not for me

00:03:22.020 and I think that your book really turns that on its head I mean literally it's called art for

00:03:26.180 everyone yeah when when did you realize in your life that art is not some rarefied thing it is

00:03:32.280 something that is accessible to everyone yeah so I'm from Des Moines I was born and raised

00:03:37.900 um I was born in Des Moines fun fact I wasn't going to tell you till I got on the podcast today

00:03:42.260 shut that i was indeed i was indeed my parents my parents met and went to drake no did they really

00:03:50.180 they did yeah yeah yeah so i lived in des moines until i was about five years old my gosh went to

00:03:57.740 kindergarten there we could have been best friends we could have been best friends i know i know so

00:04:02.000 so crazy um so born and raised in des moines moved away for a while uh came back but you may know this

00:04:09.160 that we have this wonderful museum, the Des Moines Art Center, that is a free museum and it

00:04:14.320 punches well above its weight. I mean, the architecture is incredible and the pieces.

00:04:20.040 And so I got to, you know, I was raised a few blocks from the museum and I used to be able to

00:04:27.900 go. That was my place, you know, even in high school when times were hard and friends were

00:04:32.500 awful or whatever, you know, I would get to just walk in and it was free. And so I think that that

00:04:39.460 completely changed the way that I just that accessibility of being able to walk in. And then

00:04:44.800 I went to the University of Missouri for journalism, but then started taking a lot of

00:04:50.260 art history classes. And I would open up my textbook and it would be like courtesy of the

00:04:56.060 Des Moines Art Center and so it would be so interesting for me that these were like I would

00:05:01.880 I call them like my friends you know like they were just like I'd get to spend time with them

00:05:06.740 and how lucky I was um to think that that was very very normal and so you know um I think that I just

00:05:14.640 thought everybody should have access to it because I was radicalized by a free museum

00:05:18.920 Yeah. Right. What a radical, crazy thing to happen. Well, we were we were just in London for Thanksgiving and, you know, all the museums there are free.

00:05:29.680 And so it's so cool. Right. Also, so great when you have small kids because you're like, we're going in for a half an hour and then we're going to leave and maybe we'll come back.

00:05:37.120 But maybe we won't. And I saw young people, teenagers, probably just like you were, just in their being because it was a place to escape to and sit and think and to let the art be your friends.

00:05:55.100 Mm hmm. Yeah, it's great. And then also, I think just as a gallery owner now, I see the way that it changes people's lives and I see the way that it changes people's homes and what's more important than home.

00:06:09.400 I think it all comes back to that, that it's your safe space. It's your sanctuary. And when you are bringing in that creativity or that connection that you get from artwork, it makes your home all that more special and meaningful to you. And so I see that on a daily basis, the way that people come back and say, I didn't think I was going to be so into art, but now that I live with it, just one, I'm addicted.

00:06:35.040 it's true it's true and you know you tell people a lot that you know some of your best advice is

00:06:43.500 to believe in your gut grab when it comes to art that like and I think I think that about art I

00:06:50.000 think that about stories and books too it's like what is your gut telling you you want right now

00:06:54.460 in your life yeah tell me a little bit about that because art collecting is so deeply personal

00:06:59.180 Yes. So I think that when you take the time to truly notice and first you have to kind of decide, yes, I'm interested in buying a piece of artwork. Right. But I don't think you should do that right away. I want you to spend time in galleries. I want you to spend time in museums. And I really want you to just sit back and notice.

00:07:20.200 And honestly, that is probably only 10 percent of people do that even, you know, when you're thinking about style, like really paying attention to what you're attracted to you and then figuring out why am I attracted to this?

00:07:32.260 You know, right. Why is this why am I finding meaning in this?

00:07:36.440 And there's this derogatory term in the art world called OTC art or over the couch art.

00:07:42.420 And what I really think that people are understanding now is that your artwork doesn't have to just match your sofa.

00:07:49.180 it really can speak to you on so many levels. Who is the artist? Where are they from? What is the

00:07:55.340 story they're trying to tell? I mean, that's what you were talking about earlier. The stories behind

00:07:59.420 the artwork is where the connection is made. And, you know, and then, of course, everybody projects

00:08:05.580 onto a piece of artwork, especially if it's abstract, because people find their own meaning

00:08:10.540 in it. And so, you know, I think from all of that, you have to notice. And then, you know,

00:08:16.340 there's all of the practicalities of it of where it can go and what your budget is and all of that

00:08:22.320 and then it all comes together to finding the right piece of art for you right exactly the one

00:08:27.400 that you're like oh yes i want to look at i want to be with you on a regular basis i'm gonna yeah

00:08:33.180 i want to hang out with you and i think that that sometimes not all the time the art tells you that

00:08:39.640 Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I think that the pieces that I've always been drawn to to actually acquire

00:08:45.860 into my own home, because I'm lucky that I get to spend all day every day with art like this,

00:08:51.420 it's like those, I call them kind of my onion pieces where they reveal themselves to me in

00:08:55.680 layers. And I want to spend time with it. And I notice something new. And when I start like

00:09:00.980 walking by it in the gallery and I'm noticing something new and I'm noticing something new,

00:09:04.940 And I'm like, I think you could come home with me.

00:09:07.820 We're ready.

00:09:08.840 It's like your fourth date now.

00:09:10.380 Yeah, exactly.

00:09:12.100 You can come home with me.

00:09:14.400 I love that.

00:09:15.340 I love that for you.

00:09:16.080 I love that for the art.

00:09:17.460 It's great.

00:09:18.340 That's actually kind of how we're approaching getting a rescue cat for my middle child who just desperately wants a rescue cat.

00:09:27.720 So we keep going back to the same cat cafe.

00:09:29.840 And I'm like, we might not know right away.

00:09:31.780 We might have to spend time with this cat.

00:09:33.800 That's right.

00:09:34.220 Well, we're really ready to know that this is our cat.

00:09:38.520 But you know what?

00:09:39.520 There is the same way with your cat as there is with art.

00:09:42.900 There is that moment where it's like, is somebody else going to snap him?

00:09:46.500 Right.

00:09:46.800 Snap it up, right?

00:09:47.820 Now it's time.

00:09:48.700 Now it's time.

00:09:49.140 So when is that right time of like, okay, I feel like I've done the research now.

00:09:54.200 I think I know what I want.

00:09:55.620 And then you go back to that gut instinct and you're like, this is it.

00:09:59.380 This is it.

00:09:59.720 That's it.

00:10:00.120 And you have to listen to it.

00:10:01.040 And you have to take that cat.

00:10:02.040 You have to take that art.

00:10:02.820 It's time.

00:10:03.160 exactly same thing it truly is you have your own gallery now but you are also a big proponent

00:10:09.980 of thrifting and also shopping estate sales which i love estate sales have become my midlife hobby

00:10:18.220 much like bird watching um i mean i'm really just a i'm really a cliche i was gonna say do you want

00:10:24.280 to talk about perimenopause do i do actually yeah you're getting in a heartbeat you could just

00:10:29.240 change this whole episode topic. Yeah. And I love an estate sale. Do you have good tips for people

00:10:35.460 who are approaching either the thrift store or an estate sale looking for art or should they just go

00:10:40.920 in and look for that gut grab? Yeah. So I think for thrifting and estate sales, it's such an

00:10:47.820 excellent way to get into collecting art because oftentimes people don't know what they have.

00:10:53.840 And so it's not about the investment per se of all of it and making sure that, you know,

00:10:59.100 you're most likely not going to be the person that's at Antiques Roadshow bringing in a Picasso

00:11:03.820 that you bought for $2, right? Exactly. But I say that because oftentimes people don't know what

00:11:10.520 they have. And the secondary market of reselling work can be very, very tricky. And oftentimes

00:11:16.980 people just are getting rid of it, right? So I think the things that I look for are making sure

00:11:22.980 that everything is like structured. There's no mold. There's no extreme grime or anything like

00:11:28.820 that. I want to make sure that the framing, because the framing can be such a large investment,

00:11:34.600 and I want to make sure that the framing is truly intact, if that's what you want to keep it as,

00:11:39.880 and making sure that we're not going to have all of these like additional expenses that go into it.

00:11:44.820 And then I always try and go for an original piece. So is there some sort of signature? Is

00:11:50.080 there any sort of information on the back? Really spending some time like flipping the piece around

00:11:55.000 and seeing what information you can find is worth the time.

00:11:59.360 And then, you know, like, making sure that you're not getting, like, a giclee or something like that

00:12:03.980 where it's been printed onto canvas and you're actually receiving a real piece.

00:12:07.960 So even, like, doing the finger test of, like, really seeing, like, are there brushstrokes here?

00:12:13.120 Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah, explain the finger test to people in my audience

00:12:16.900 that might not have been researching an art heist, an art forger for the past three years.

00:12:21.720 i'm like of course yeah yeah yeah so really for for what i'm doing is like you know they always

00:12:29.700 tell you not to touch the artwork right but for that as like i'm really trying to see if there's

00:12:33.760 any slight variation so that it's not a completely flat um shiny surface right and so sometimes just

00:12:39.360 actually touching it our eyes can deceive us so touching it and seeing if there is any like

00:12:44.240 pigment or layers to the paint at all and seeing if there's any texture there is going to be better

00:12:49.320 than just looking at it yeah exactly exactly one of the things that i loved uh when i was

00:12:55.580 researching parisian was my heist expert my security expert was actually anthony amore

00:13:01.260 the security uh we had a security for the isabel gardner museum oh yeah he's amazing and you know

00:13:08.300 we talked a lot about brush strokes and and cracklature kind of like the fingerprints yes

00:13:15.140 So like unique, the unique indicators of a painting.

00:13:19.740 And I love that.

00:13:20.740 I love looking at a painting and looking at the at the messes.

00:13:23.660 Right.

00:13:24.060 Yeah.

00:13:24.360 A splotch of paint in the corner.

00:13:26.620 Van Gogh has a ton of just errant splotches of paint.

00:13:29.520 And I love seeing them being like, how'd that get there?

00:13:31.780 Like, what distracted you?

00:13:33.140 And then you just left it, man.

00:13:35.120 Yes.

00:13:35.680 OK, so one of the things also that I'm going to say that makes me think of this when you're talking about cracklature is that for artwork,

00:13:41.580 especially when you're thrifting and antiquing or whatever, and you're looking at artwork that

00:13:46.620 potentially has aged, is that there is a term called inherent vice. I love this term. But the

00:13:52.140 inherent vice of an artwork is that over time, it is not an over, it's not a major issue if the

00:13:59.940 artwork ages, that it could, quote unquote, deteriorate in any way that there may be some

00:14:06.000 cracklature, that sort of thing, that the artwork will have an inherent vice, especially

00:14:12.560 where, you know, hundreds of years ago when they were really creating tempura paint from

00:14:17.360 eggs.

00:14:18.100 So you're really got like an organic substance there.

00:14:21.700 It's going to fade.

00:14:22.760 It's going to change.

00:14:24.340 And so that's an inherent vice, but that doesn't necessarily mean that there's something wrong

00:14:28.260 with the painting, right?

00:14:29.980 Right.

00:14:30.500 Right.

00:14:30.780 Yeah, exactly.

00:14:31.620 Exactly.

00:14:31.920 I think they each have their own personalities, to be honest.

00:14:36.000 And age is just like us.

00:14:37.760 It is just like a fine wine, you mean?

00:14:40.660 Exactly.

00:14:41.040 Exactly.

00:14:41.700 Exactly.

00:14:42.060 Now we're just going to start talking about perimenopause again.

00:14:45.060 Like we just.

00:14:45.720 Well, I'm injecting a lot of chemicals in my face.

00:14:47.920 I'm like, well, actually, I have a Botox appointment next week and I have to go renew my GLP.

00:14:53.180 So, yeah, aging like a fine freaking line over here.

00:14:56.840 Fine wine.

00:14:57.420 Thanks to chemicals.

00:14:58.620 Thanks to all the chemicals that I pump into my body.

00:15:03.000 Amazing.

00:15:03.660 All right.

00:15:03.900 Let's take a quick break.

00:15:04.640 And when we get back, I want to talk a little bit about living with art, because you do some incredible things.

00:15:10.160 Like, you tell people to put art in places where they would not think that art goes, because I think everyone thinks they have to have a gallery wall, and that's not true, right?

00:15:17.620 That's right.

00:15:18.280 Okay, I love this.

00:15:19.180 All right, quick break.

00:15:19.960 We'll be right back.

00:15:28.560 Okay, we are back.

00:15:29.820 talk to me a little bit about the unexpected places that art can go because i hear people

00:15:35.300 tell me all the time especially my friends in cities where they're like i can't have art i

00:15:39.500 don't have any room yeah yeah so i think that oftentimes people think that they the only space

00:15:46.020 that they can hang a piece of artwork is like a flat wall and so i think anything is game um we're

00:15:53.660 talking bookshelves on the sides on the fronts um i mean what is better than a book and abusive

00:16:01.200 artwork paired right like literally nothing no no yeah it's so great and i love the way you put them

00:16:07.180 put them on on bookshelves they're kind of like you you either put them on the actual shelf or

00:16:12.580 then like the seams of the bookshelf where the boards meet each other yes yes um and i also think

00:16:18.600 that's a great tip for renters too not everybody owns their own home you can't put nail holes into

00:16:23.980 the walls but you can put it into your furniture and then you know a little bit of wood filler

00:16:28.060 later when you've decided to move it no big deal um so i think that people oftentimes should get a

00:16:34.080 little afraid of the nail hole and i want people to understand that it is so easy to fix it is

00:16:41.640 right and really like kind of get that worry out of but that's also in the book too about

00:16:45.880 how high how the width all of that about how to install artwork but i'm talking over window sills

00:16:53.860 i'm talking above windows i'm talking on doors i mean i truly think that if you've got some sort

00:17:00.080 of like linear flat surface you could do it there cupboards um the the range the kind of the the

00:17:08.300 thing that goes over a stove i'm not much of a cook can you tell um whatever whatever whatever

00:17:15.820 that thing is there's something that goes above the stove where you cook things i'm not much of a

00:17:20.620 cookie there where my husband cooks things exactly my trad husband cooks all the things there

00:17:26.000 that's all right um so honestly i do think that there are so many fun little places um i in the

00:17:33.260 book i showed um for a client i installed a piece of artwork on a mirror um so again there's like

00:17:40.200 There's just so many fun ways. And like, why not be a little whimsical? Why not have some fun with

00:17:47.380 what you're doing here and add a little extra interest to your space? Yeah, no, exactly. And

00:17:53.180 I love it when art is surprising, too. Like when it's in a surprising place. I went to someone's

00:17:59.660 house the other day and they had a piece of art on the inside of the coat closet. Oh, fun. Fun,

00:18:05.840 right because they're like that door gets opened a hundred times a day so like there's there's like

00:18:11.180 just so much foot traffic there and it's always a delight because like they're like we forget that

00:18:16.280 it's there our guests have no idea it's there I also love a good piece of bathroom art because

00:18:21.680 you spend a lot of time in there yeah absolutely and my favorite fun fact is that the Mona Lisa

00:18:27.480 was once hung in the bathroom before it hung in the Louvre oh wait I didn't know this yes it hung

00:18:31.820 in the king's bathroom it was bathroom art okay i like i like you know what i like that for the

00:18:36.760 mona lisa and for the king that's great the thing that i'm working on right now i haven't done it

00:18:42.120 yet um so when i do it i'll make sure to share but um i'm collecting small thrifted works of dogs

00:18:50.600 so that it might can give a dog gallery wall to my um sheepadoodle woofy oh maybe down low

00:18:58.020 so that she has artwork to look at while she's eating so that she can see it i love that yeah

00:19:03.620 woofie needs art too woofie needs art too totally yeah i i've been yeah i've been playing around a

00:19:10.760 lot uh with art in different spaces also playing around with what my kids like and what they want

00:19:17.860 because kids are how old are your kids they're five and eight okay yeah yeah so the same because

00:19:22.420 I've got I've got six and six and eight six, eight and three. And I find art so much more

00:19:28.060 interesting to me now that I have them because I get to see it through their eyes. And so then

00:19:33.840 asking them the kinds of things they want in their spaces is really freaking cool.

00:19:39.740 It's so great. I mean, the things my daughter in particular, the five year old, is very into art,

00:19:45.040 draws all the time and really thinks what I do is cool. So I'm going to take that for as long as

00:19:50.840 it's take it forever because my there was like a take your kids to work day last week

00:19:56.020 and i was like oh my gosh do you guys want to come to new york with me like i'm i'm making

00:20:00.740 some podcasts and they were like no they're like we literally go to work with you all the time uh

00:20:07.860 no like because they're in bookstores and book events all the time they're just like we're so

00:20:10.860 over you please leave yeah um i saw that for independent bookstore you had your kids with

00:20:19.600 you signing. I sure did. And I had a book signing that day, too. And my kids were crawling all over

00:20:24.640 me. And I was like, I love that these kids get to think this is normal. I think I think it's

00:20:29.880 the greatest. It is actually it is actually the greatest. Like my kids truly think that just

00:20:35.420 being in a bookstore and me me signing books and also because we we do have our mobile bookstore

00:20:40.580 now. They work. I put them to work putting out books. Yeah. Pop up in like pubs and breweries

00:20:48.320 And they walk around. They're like, can I recommend a book for you? It's fantastic. It's so great. And I'm going to put them to work selling your book this weekend.

00:20:57.980 Thank you. Please.

00:20:58.840 Yeah. Done. Done. It will continue to be a job when the robots replace us, much like artists is going to continue to be a job. I mean, I think about this all the time.

00:21:11.780 But, I mean, frankly, it is just the humanity of artwork that makes it art.

00:21:16.960 And I thought about that a lot while I was doing Parisian Heist because I'm like, what makes something famous?

00:21:20.680 What makes something worthy of art with a capital A?

00:21:25.220 And for me, it's the humanity and it's how it's the it's the gut grab.

00:21:29.660 It's how it makes you feel.

00:21:31.560 Right. Right.

00:21:32.100 You know, one of the things that I find so interesting is that there are so many works of art that are incredibly famous that people don't know the backstory to.

00:21:45.100 And so I like talking about all art, but I really like talking about like the Starry Nights and the American Gothics and things like that because people see it all of the time and they don't fully know what they're looking at.

00:21:58.480 And, you know, I recently was talking about American Gothic.

00:22:04.580 One of the things that I love so much about it is that so it was painted for a juried art show for the Chicago Art Institute.

00:22:13.860 And it won the bronze medal, so it didn't even win.

00:22:19.140 But immediately people loved it, right?

00:22:22.480 Like they it was like in newspapers and magazines and it was in living rooms across America.

00:22:29.680 And I think that it goes back to the idea that Grant Wood was like a very normal person that painted it of his sister and his dentist, who were very normal people.

00:22:41.500 And of this place, this little farmhouse that he passed in Eldon, Iowa.

00:22:46.200 And I think that people saw themselves in it.

00:22:48.940 And I think there's that connection somehow that people are like, there's like that recognition, that realness in so many different pieces.

00:22:57.820 But I think there's that feeling and that recognition.

00:23:01.580 And so one of the things that I love about talking about accessibility is that art at its best is never about exclusion.

00:23:09.280 And American Gothic is one of those things that it's like about regular people for regular people by a regular person, you know.

00:23:17.080 And I think that those are where the connection points are made, that you actually moving people to recognize something that they find familiar.

00:23:26.280 That they find familiar, that they connect with, even if they're not sure why they're connecting with it or what they're connecting with.

00:23:35.500 And yeah, I think so. I think about Starry Night a lot when I was I was at the Van Gogh Museum and I got access to the Van Gogh archives and Joe Van Gogh's diaries.

00:23:47.760 Yeah. Which was just it's the raddest part of being an author. Right. So cool.

00:23:52.720 Absolutely. And some of the early reviews of Starry Night said that the stars look like chubby donuts.

00:23:59.780 what a thing to say what but also what a wonderful thing to say like this this particular reviewer

00:24:07.620 and a lot of early reviewers did not love vincent van gogh's stuff but i was like i also just like

00:24:13.460 love that and now i think about it every time that i look at a print of starry night they had

00:24:18.140 i was at ikea on sunday uh with the kids and my kids got very excited they're like they have an

00:24:22.720 $18 Starry Night and a Mona Lisa hair.

00:24:28.480 And I'm like, yeah, indeed.

00:24:29.620 What I love about Starry Night in particular is the basically how and when it was made, where he had checked himself into this mental asylum, basically after a mental health crisis.

00:24:45.000 and he looked out that little window at a very low point in his life um not a special place to

00:24:54.900 be at that moment but he still van gogh in particular had such a joy and creation and he

00:25:02.940 you know he he it was like not he what he made 900 paintings in 10 years or something like that

00:25:08.600 so many and i think something like almost 200 in the last year of his life alone in a right yes

00:25:14.780 He found a real joy in the process and the creation of it, even when, you know, people, critics were ignoring him, when critics were saying things like chubby doughnuts.

00:25:26.420 Chubby doughnuts.

00:25:27.980 You know, he was he was misunderstood, I think.

00:25:32.380 And I but I love the idea that he created something with so much energy and so much aliveness like The Starry Night from such a low point in his life that he was just so moved by the act of creation.

00:25:46.160 And he could find that creativity and that feeling even in that situation.

00:25:52.560 I think there's something so incredible about that.

00:25:55.640 Truly, truly.

00:25:56.240 And I, you know, I spent a day in Auvers, I'm probably saying that wrong, I can't pronounce French, there's a reason I'm not reading the audiobook for this, but y'all know, it looks like Auvers, which is such an awesome day trip from Paris and where he spent the last year of his life and got to, you know, eat and drink wine in this cafe at the inn where he lived and see the church, you know, the famously like crooked church and the wheat fields and everything.

00:26:24.780 And I will say the book was finished when I went there for my research and then I rewrote three whole chapters because I'm like, I know, I know these paintings and the feelings here and my characters, even though Vincent's not even in the book, Joe is so much better now.

00:26:44.440 And, you know, I and I also appreciate Van Gogh a lot more than I ever did getting to read and hear his backstory.

00:26:52.460 All the letters.

00:26:53.160 yes all the letters yeah absolutely yes yes and and it was joe who did that which i think

00:26:59.780 is just incredible that she yes she made this happen so yeah i mean like i said it's it's the

00:27:06.000 humanness it's the stories because art lives alongside us and it does it lives it lives much

00:27:12.360 longer than we do some of my favorite pieces are ones that i've inherited from my grandmother who

00:27:18.960 was a collector. You know, they're not big name artists, but she loved these paintings. She just

00:27:23.060 loved them so much. And because they lived with her, I feel like, you know, they bring something

00:27:30.220 extra. They bring a part of her into our house now. Yeah, absolutely. And that's why I think that

00:27:35.280 I'm so drawn to the thrifting aspect of it. I thrift a lot. I do a lot of Facebook Marketplace.

00:27:43.840 I just did a Homeworthy episode of our house, and many people were like, how many times can this woman say Facebook Marketplace?

00:27:53.020 How many people?

00:27:53.820 Everyone listens to my podcast. 1.00

00:27:55.200 Like, how many times can she say pre-order my fucking book? 0.99

00:27:58.280 Oh, I feel like a broken record. 1.00

00:28:00.620 What a broken record.

00:28:01.320 Whatever.

00:28:01.680 But actually, I've never thought about this.

00:28:03.260 I've never thought about using Facebook Marketplace for art.

00:28:06.460 Let's take our last break, and then I want you to tell me all about this.

00:28:13.840 okay we're back tell me how you use facebook marketplace for art and i don't care how many

00:28:21.760 times you say it what a good friend um okay so i use it for art and then i use it for furniture

00:28:28.320 and things like that too i use it for furniture yeah yeah but no i do for sure oh yeah um my 0.82

00:28:33.400 most recent purchase was a gossip bench oh my god shut your mouth i saw this post i saw this

00:28:39.120 post of yours and then i was in a shop on lunch on friday and all i was looking for is a gossip 0.91

00:28:44.060 bench because of you tell everyone about a gossip bench okay a gossip bench is a piece of furniture

00:28:49.260 that you sit on that also has a spot for a hard line telephone and i am trying to teach my children

00:28:58.000 proper etiquette yes and so we got them a landline did you get a regular landline or a tin can

00:29:05.080 I got a regular landline that we use Google for because that's our internet.

00:29:09.260 Okay.

00:29:09.580 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:29:09.960 And so it's like an extra $10 a month.

00:29:11.740 I'm trying to decide between the two.

00:29:12.720 Yeah.

00:29:13.220 Yeah.

00:29:14.620 But I will tell you, we have, somebody has to, when they call us, they have to say like, Liz is calling and then the kids accept.

00:29:21.460 So we never get spam right now.

00:29:23.400 Okay, great.

00:29:24.000 Yeah, that's amazing.

00:29:25.700 Anyway, but yeah, so a gossip bench is a piece of furniture you can sit on and talk on the landline. 0.97

00:29:30.760 And my kids use it.

00:29:32.100 when they call their grandparents and they call their friends that have other landlines.

00:29:36.480 And it's the best. I was just obsessed. But anyway, the artwork, too, again, all of the

00:29:43.440 same rules apply. But what I think is really special is that sometimes you're talking with

00:29:48.240 the person that originally purchased the work. And so you're getting a little more information.

00:29:53.260 I mean, that Facebook marketplace of like that directness is so interesting. And then they can

00:29:59.100 tell you like this was my grandmother's and she bought it xyz from this place and it was five

00:30:04.240 dollars you know and it's not again about the value over time it's about i just think that

00:30:11.800 having things that are collected and thrifted and antiqued add a little soul to your home

00:30:17.000 they add soul i mean i truly i truly truly believe that i think that the things that live in our

00:30:22.160 homes with us carry a little piece of us around yes they truly because you're enjoying you like

00:30:28.400 your enjoyment goes into them. Of course. And then I think the other thing, my woo-woo-ness

00:30:33.280 of all of this is that I believe that artists place a little bit of themselves into a piece

00:30:38.720 of artwork. Oh, absolutely. And so I believe that like I've got little bits of these wonderful

00:30:44.160 people that I know and their creativity and all of that. I mean, probably could be said for anything

00:30:50.360 like writing a book or any of that, but there's just something about the physicality of having

00:30:54.340 that original piece of work that an artist made I've got a bit of that person like me you do you

00:31:00.340 do and I think that that's why museums are such incredibly special places too because there's so

00:31:05.920 much of that physicality and so much of those artists souls that you know I love it when museums

00:31:11.900 are accessible to everyone and and a lot of museums I mean honestly I was talking about this

00:31:18.140 with Anthony from the Gardner Museum he says a lot of people are nervous when they come in because

00:31:22.220 They're like, I don't I'm on a field trip. Right. I've never been to a museum before.

00:31:25.640 And he's like, no, I want people to know that museums are for you.

00:31:28.160 Like they are here so that this art is not locked away in storage units so that it's not only in a rich person like a king's bathroom.

00:31:36.760 It is meant for you to enjoy it.

00:31:40.780 And so I'm working on trying to create an entire companion to Parisian to get all of the paintings in one place or at least at least links of them.

00:31:50.680 Because I think that'll make it such a more fun experience to get to look at the art.

00:31:55.140 So you can look up at when you're doing it.

00:31:56.380 Yeah, yeah, exactly.

00:31:57.460 I think that's great.

00:31:58.360 Yeah, as you're reading about it.

00:32:00.320 And I think, you know, we're talking a lot about paintings right now.

00:32:03.180 But I think some of the cool things about even with sculpture is really getting to, it's not just the walking up to a flat surface as it is for a painting or drawing or something like that that's hanging on the wall.

00:32:15.800 That there's, again, that physicality piece of it, of being able to walk around.

00:32:20.000 One of my favorite artists in the world is Louise Bourgeois, and she created these, like, 30-foot-tall bronze spider sculptures, and so you get to walk underneath them, and each of these sculptures, many of them are called Mama, they are these odes to her mother, her mother was a tapestry weaver, spiders are weavers, spiders are protectors, right?

00:32:41.840 And I feel like you walk underneath and oftentimes there will be eggs in this cage and the spider cage underneath.

00:32:48.840 And so you really do have to walk around and under to look, but you feel this sense of protection.

00:32:54.740 And it is more than just walking up to a piece of flat artwork, you know.

00:32:59.940 And so I think the physicality piece really adds in like you're getting like all the senses that way.

00:33:05.240 Totally. I love art, especially, you know, with small kids that kids can climb on.

00:33:10.780 that they can be with and that like you know they can that they can physically touch and

00:33:17.480 explore so i public i'm such a huge fan of public art i just and and i think you know my kids now

00:33:25.260 feel very inspired to make art and leave it in public and i'm like there's a fine line between

00:33:29.740 littering and leaving art in public friends yeah right uh but they do paint rocks a lot which i

00:33:35.260 think people appreciate when you find like a lovely little painted rock on the ground what a surprise

00:33:39.560 Yeah. What a surprise. Exactly. Exactly. I think that they're, and especially with a lot of public art, some you can't touch, but a lot of times when it engages you and invites you to interact with it in so many different ways. I mean, it's great. It's great.

00:33:56.620 We have a wonderful sculpture park here in Des Moines.

00:33:59.920 And, you know, there are ones that have chairs that are a part of the piece of artwork.

00:34:04.320 So you're sitting and you're gathering within the piece.

00:34:08.320 I mean, there's just there's art can offer so much.

00:34:12.220 And I love the idea of public art because I believe that people should have art in their lives, even if they can't afford it, even as they're walking down the street.

00:34:21.820 And I think that that's really special to use art as placemaking with publicly.

00:34:26.960 Yes, yes, exactly, exactly.

00:34:29.420 And you've talked before about using art also as a souvenir, as a way to remember a trip.

00:34:36.620 I tend to buy a piece of art on most trips that I go on.

00:34:41.780 I think it is a wonderful way to remember something, which is why I'm constantly searching for flea markets.

00:34:47.080 And I spend a lot of time in the Paris fleas.

00:34:49.100 I was going to say, you must have done that for research. You had to.

00:34:52.320 Oh, my God. Are you kidding? Well, it's funny. Yes, I spent so much time in there. But then we actually nicknamed the young artists in the book who are these struggling artists, these struggling women artists. We named them the fleas. They live in an apartment complex above the flea market.

00:35:09.960 I love that.

00:35:10.280 And they're like, we're essentially fleas on the backs of dogs figuring out how to survive.

00:35:14.760 I love that.

00:35:15.620 Yeah. 0.92

00:35:15.980 So we have a lot of the fleas.

00:35:18.200 But I've gotten some of my best artwork in there.

00:35:18.960 I can't wait to read this book.

00:35:20.280 You're going to love it.

00:35:21.780 I can't wait to hear what you think of me.

00:35:23.580 And I'm also nervous to hear what you think because you know all this.

00:35:25.560 No, I love it.

00:35:26.340 I know that I am.

00:35:27.540 But yeah, I mean, flea markets are just the best.

00:35:29.960 And I think that art makes the best souvenirs to bring home.

00:35:33.220 Yeah, it does.

00:35:34.220 Yeah, they do.

00:35:34.800 I mean, I think that, you know, traveling is so important to me and my life and being able to get new inspiration and creativity and all of that, like it fills my cup in so many ways. But then to remember that time and then like there's no better way for me.

00:35:51.860 I mean, I could buy a top or I could maybe buy a bag or something along those lines.

00:35:56.740 But, like, I want the stuff that I'm going to look at every day.

00:36:00.580 And, you know, if you think about, like, the cost per use and cost per look, I mean, it's a great investment.

00:36:07.680 It is a great investment.

00:36:09.600 Although, I mean, I also love a great vintage jacket.

00:36:12.140 Not going to lie about that.

00:36:13.620 I mean, we're buying multiple things when we're traveling.

00:36:15.360 We're buying many things when we're traveling.

00:36:17.300 Do not.

00:36:17.900 I bring the extra bag.

00:36:19.220 Okay.

00:36:19.860 I always have the extra bag.

00:36:21.080 Yes.

00:36:21.860 my best tip your best yes uh but you're also but you're also a gallery owner so are you

00:36:27.000 constantly looking for new new artists to represent in your gallery you've done an

00:36:32.960 incredible job with representing women and bipoc artists and also making this art accessible to

00:36:37.600 people thank you we have 80 artists from around the world with a commitment to representing at

00:36:42.840 least 50 percent women because the international avid average for galleries is about 15 percent

00:36:48.260 Oh, my God.

00:36:50.180 Which is, I mean, this could be a whole nother podcast, but.

00:36:53.080 Yes, we'll do it.

00:36:55.600 But all of that to say is that I really, truly believe that we can work in this gallery and execute work that shows that you can be successful while doing the right thing.

00:37:06.800 and um and so that's something that we try we try to live our values and we try to work with

00:37:13.660 incredible artists um from a diverse backgrounds and diverse perspectives because i think that

00:37:20.160 makes our world all the more richer and so yes i'm constantly looking for new artists we have

00:37:27.200 artists apply a lot every day. We have artists that are shared to us by clients, other artists

00:37:36.760 that we work with now. And that's one of the best ways for me. When another artist says they want

00:37:41.900 their work next to another's, that tells me like, I got to pay attention. So yeah, I mean, I'm

00:37:48.740 constantly looking for new work and it's one of the best parts of my job. Yeah. Yeah. I think that

00:37:54.460 that's really special and some of my best book recommendations too are coming from other authors

00:37:58.700 and then also booksellers to be honest right yeah because we find the things that end up slipping

00:38:03.900 through the cracks a lot of the time that's right yeah totally yeah i mean i just i respect their

00:38:10.620 opinion so much so much so much well i adore your book i think you were just doing so much of the

00:38:17.560 heavy lifting and also your social media i mean honestly i think about influencers constantly

00:38:22.240 Right. And I think you're doing such an incredible service to make art more accessible to people through your social accounts.

00:38:30.720 Plus, it's beautiful and it's just nice to look at when the world is on fire.

00:38:34.420 You know, you know, really, this really all started in 2020 when we were at home and people weren't able to because that's exactly when the gallery started.

00:38:43.020 We started we opened in late 2019.

00:38:45.400 Oh, gosh.

00:38:47.100 I know.

00:38:47.820 I had a baby then, too.

00:38:48.860 So, yeah.

00:38:49.300 Yeah. Yeah. And I had this 2020 baby and this gallery and all of this. And so I was like, how can I get people to look at artwork when they can't even leave their house? And it was all through social. And so I think that connective tool, I mean, social, there's so many layers to it, of course, as you know, when you talk about, you think about, but there is this like, oh my gosh, I can bring beauty into people's homes every day and talk to them about the things I'm excited about.

00:39:16.160 Are you kidding? I get this opportunity and I get to do it for free. I mean, sign me up all day.

00:39:21.900 Sign me up all day long. Y'all, you have to follow Liz. Will you tell everyone where you are on the

00:39:26.620 socials? Yes. So on Instagram, I'm at Liz Legit and then at Liz Legit Gallery. And yeah, we share

00:39:35.800 a lot of art all day long. You really do. You really do. I mean, it's just it's such a joy.

00:39:39.600 And also, if you I've been I've been trying to explain to the audience how I've trained my

00:39:44.500 algorithm to only give me things i like so the more you look at stuff you like the more you save

00:39:49.380 it and the more you share it the more you get it so i just i get so much like vintage thrifting art

00:39:54.780 right now it is just a dream what a dream what a happy place to go so it is also recipes for cheese

00:40:02.700 and perimenopause tips and making cheese uh yeah yeah yeah i have been i have been i've been making

00:40:09.680 my own mozzarella and doing

00:40:11.680 some other simple cheese

00:40:13.360 situations. Again, midlife hobbies.

00:40:15.820 Bird watching, cheese making. I think we all

00:40:17.740 need hobbies. This is great. This might be what I

00:40:19.720 take up. Yeah. No, come to

00:40:21.780 Philadelphia. We will make some cheese. We will

00:40:23.800 watch some birds. And we will

00:40:25.700 just take some GLP ones. Don't 0.52

00:40:27.740 threaten me with a good time. Right?

00:40:29.920 I am a good time, guys.

00:40:31.800 And I want everyone to get

00:40:33.860 this gorgeous book. It is

00:40:35.860 incredible. Art for everyone. We'll put it

00:40:37.820 up on all of all of the web pages. And I'm just so happy we got to chat today.

00:40:42.400 Thanks. Me too. It was a pleasure.

00:41:07.820 Thank you.

Under the Influence (with Jo Piazza) - April 30, 2026

Art is For Everyone With Liz Lidgett

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