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00:03:18.800So watching you from the very beginning of our friendship travel with those three girls has been so inspiring to me that I'm like, I can do this.
00:03:29.460Again, you already mentioned it, but the magic of Instagram.
00:03:32.920You know, somebody wrote a piece a few years ago that I think about all the time about how when you're in the middle of traveling, especially with your kids and everything's going wrong.
00:03:42.600Why would we ever leave the house?0.98
00:03:44.560And then something funny happens to your brain.
00:03:46.520And I'm curious if this happens to you, too, but you get home and like two weeks later and all you can think about is every great moment that you had throughout the five days or the 10 days or whatever it was.
00:03:56.640And it's a it's like a trick that your brain plays on you that you're like, that was the best vacation we've ever had, even if there were like seven times in the first day that each person had a meltdown in a row.
00:04:08.900That exact thing happens to me. And it's similar to, I think, how we black out birth so that we do birth again.
00:06:19.060I want to get into what it's like to travel with big kids because I get asked a lot why I travel with my kids when they're so little and they won't remember it.
00:06:28.620And I know that you get asked that too.
00:06:30.860My friend Jordi Lidby, who you know, asked me that for a Wall Street Journal story.
00:06:36.340My answer was that we're building a collective family story and that, you know, they will—Charlie remembered Italy and Bea and Eliza didn't, but they see the pictures.
00:06:52.080And so we're building this collective family story of how we did this, number one.
00:06:56.620And so they will remember through what we tell them.
00:06:58.960But number two, I'm just trying to teach them to be one, good travelers and two, good citizens of the world.
00:07:06.640And I don't think that you can do that early enough.
00:07:10.860Agreed. Fully agreed on everything you just said.
00:07:14.120It's always such a silly question to me.
00:07:16.920Why do you take your kids with, I mean, I understand why people ask it.
00:07:22.660um it's it's obviously extreme it's a lot easier to stay in our house in Philadelphia and go
00:07:29.000nowhere um especially when the kids were really little but if you like to travel um you're going
00:07:35.800to keep doing it after you have kids and I think the biggest thing to me is um even when Benny I
00:07:41.380mean I think we took her abroad when she was about two and a half and I it was just her at the time
00:07:47.240And I like she obviously doesn't have vivid memories of that trip, but she certainly sees the pictures.
00:07:54.400And we have all these funny stories that we tell her.
00:07:56.780That's part of her identity, you know, where she like played in a fountain or dumped an entire bowl of pasta on the floor and, you know, or was held by the people.
00:08:05.460I know Charlie. I believe it was Charlie, right, who was held by one of the Italian grandmothers at the restaurant.
00:08:10.900By one of. Oh, no, by one of the Nonas.0.97
00:08:12.740He was babysat by a random Nona on an island off the coast of Sicily.0.93
00:08:16.100Yeah. Yes. And he that's part of his identity. Even if he doesn't remember it, he tells us, you know, he tells this story. He tells the story. Exactly. And so that's a big thing. I mean, obviously, it's changed. And now my kids do remember these things and have points of collective memories.0.92
00:08:34.720we have is the biggest thing to me is building these collective memories as a family um but but
00:08:39.700as benny our oldest daughter got a little bit older i you know not that she's i mean i would
00:08:46.060let her tell you i i um i'm protesting too much i don't think she's super embarrassed of us
00:08:51.300on the regular but i think just like any kid when you're awkwardly at age 12 13
00:08:57.120maybe you remember being that age it was oh god i was just i hate it i hated my body i hated myself0.92
00:09:02.540I hated my parents I hated the world yeah okay races skin all of it all of it gross but all of0.99
00:09:09.980a sudden you're somewhere else and it's not as like um pronounced I think it's not as like intense1.00
00:09:16.060to be somewhere else be who you are somewhere else you because you can kind of be anyone you
00:09:21.680know like you you're and so even at 12 or 13 years old I sort of watched her um feel almost like be
00:09:30.920more like childlike you know she wasn't embarrassed to sort of like play card games with us be goofy
00:09:36.520with us and um that was such a gift to just be able to sort of like have that um those moments
00:09:42.720when we're traveling um you know she's 14 now and and has things have sort of like settled from the
00:09:48.680super awkward time but um anyway i i yeah i mean there's definitely there are definitely ways to
00:09:54.540make this easier too and and and i think you probably you know we talked a little bit about
00:09:59.960like tips for traveling with kids i think you know all of them already um i continue with
00:10:06.580oh no i mean look i don't know all of anything already i know i know some stuff and oh my gosh
00:10:14.020i found the cutest uh little wall hanging in camden market in london for the pop-up book
00:10:20.840trailer that just says i read books and know things why does it feel like something b would
00:10:27.380say. Well, the thing is, like, she saw it and she's like, what's that say? And I'm like, oh,
00:10:31.520you clearly gravitated towards this, my young friend. Yeah, exactly. I read books and I know
00:10:38.180things. So I know some things. I don't know others. I will say that I take a lot of advice
00:10:43.980from other parents when it comes to traveling. I really, really absorb a lot, which is why I
00:10:50.720wanted to do this podcast. So let's... I want to date with Rawls, Carti says. Rawls? Rucka asks.
00:10:58.580This is the love story of real hinge couple Carti and Rucka. Written and read by me,
00:11:04.080Nicola Dinan. Listen to the free audiobook now.
00:11:09.500Take a quick break. And when we get back, let's talk about tips.
00:11:20.720and we're back so tell me some of your tips and let's break it up let's start with when
00:11:29.600you're traveling with youngers so we're gonna go below eight and then we'll go above eight
00:11:33.900so one of the first things um and again you are the same you and nick met while you were traveling
00:11:42.380on the galapagos like um as everyone does the way normal people do everyone as every meet cute
00:11:48.900happens every great meet cute um so obviously oh wait speaking of speaking of meet cutes i mean
00:11:54.300because i can't help a tangent i watched the holiday on my last flight um have you never
00:11:59.400seen that before i haven't seen it in 20 years were you confused as to why jack black was a love
00:12:04.460interest um you know he's cuter than you think he's gonna be he's cuter than you think he's gonna
00:12:09.820be and um in terms of charming and funny he has jude law so hard beat but jude law in that is so
00:12:18.400freaking handsome that it is painful to look at his face he's otherworldly like you genuinely are
00:12:25.380like who created you in what lab yes like you i'm it made me want to go back and re-watch talent and
00:12:31.520mr ripley actually which i might do that's his peak it's his that's his pure peak pure peak um
00:12:37.020but i mentioned that because that was the moment meet cute came into our lexicon and i'd forgotten
00:12:41.340that oh you're kidding me i didn't know that that it it is i mean it is a thing that existed but the
00:12:47.980holiday made totally normalized it and made it something people say I love learning new things
00:12:54.300I know I know I love it I know I read books and I know things okay so yeah tell me your tips
00:12:59.760so the first thing that I would say is after you you know because you two have been used to
00:13:05.840traveling a certain way even with I guess small infants you can kind of keep that clip up in some
00:13:11.840ways you know like you're stopping for like diapering and feeding and but like they really
00:13:16.640are just kind of coming along with you like a little sack of potatoes they really are they're
00:13:20.120lumps we call them lumps yeah a little lump it's like having an extra perion sort of that eats and
00:13:27.080also poops but there there sort of came a time in the collective family travel like adding when they
00:13:34.960get a little bit older and they're you're adding a second or a third um or more and it we realized
00:13:41.720that we had to um shave things down like what's the and so we have like an anchor thing an anchor
00:13:47.860activity every day maybe it's two things you know depending on how big but like after taking my kids
00:13:54.020to the Louvre we're not doing anything else we're not going then to see Notre Dame Cathedral we you
00:13:59.280know we have to where you're doing one thing in the day um and so um it just feels sort of like
00:14:06.440a recipe for disaster if you're asked. And I get it. I very much understand the desire,
00:14:13.640like the compulsion to put in as many things. You know, traveling costs a lot of money.
00:14:18.580You're taking time off of work. You're all together. This is a lot of planning. You want
00:14:23.560to make sure you get sort of like hit every single thing. But I don't know, something,
00:14:27.140we had to shift our sort of view about what this was. Is it going to tick off every box of Paris?
00:14:36.960Am I sort of like, is it important for my, you know, eight-year-old to see every single thing there is?
00:14:42.700Hopefully, God willing, she gets back there someday and gets to explore other things on her own just like I did.
00:14:48.860But for now, if we're like really optimizing for having the best possible vacation, it's one major thing a day.
00:14:56.600And then filling in the blanks with like the smaller things and honestly the eating, which is a huge part of the Stevens family travel schedule.
00:15:05.640We are also a family that travels for food.
00:15:37.380For the Anchor activity, like, you know, you have these sort of fantasies or maybe I do about bringing your kids places.
00:15:44.700And one of the things, one of the big things is like, you know, seeing things through their eyes, you know.
00:15:48.900So even things that we've already seen before were like, I'm so excited to show my kids Michelangelo.
00:15:53.200Like, I remember walking in to that museum in Florence and seeing that statue for the first time, that sculpture, and just, like, my jaw dropping and feeling, like, tingly all over.
00:16:03.620And I just couldn't believe someone made this with their hands.
00:16:06.680And, you know, side note, Sloane walked into the very busy, where the man is shushing everybody because you're in the presence of greatness.0.99
00:16:14.700And she just, like, points at it and says, penis.0.99
00:16:16.700I was just going to say, I'm like, my kids, in the presence of such beauty, would be like, would just start giggling and say penis.0.99
00:16:27.980But, I mean, they're not, look, as much as I loved that moment of being like, guys, look at this majesty.0.93
00:16:34.720They're remembering, the things that they remember that they still talk about are filling up the water bottles around Rome using the fountain.
00:16:41.800Oh, my God. Yes. My kids love that. Yes.
00:18:03.920I mean, my kids also have awesome clothes, sweatshirts and T-shirts from like, you know, Madrid and places that like, you know, some coach of hers the other day was like, oh, where'd you get that shirt?
00:18:20.500And, you know, like I think it's it's so it's such a cool, cheap souvenir for them.
00:18:25.380But anyway, I would have never picked – that would have not been the top of my list.
00:18:29.180But having something that she loved doing made her excited to be there.
00:18:34.400They loved – they picked the Tivoli Gardens in Copenhagen.
00:18:38.260I mean, maybe we would have gone there, but I don't know that I would have paid all the money to go to an amusement park in a different place.
00:18:43.680It's not, like, usually my favorite thing to do.0.81
00:23:03.340But so many times so much ink is spilled about, you know, how do you keep your kids entertained?
00:23:10.080And obviously, again, my kids are like a little bit older.
00:23:12.940But even I would say for like the last three or four years, it was literally just about talking to them, like not trying to have them at the meal and just have a date with my husband while they were still sitting there.
00:23:24.540You know, like it was let's draw what we think our dinner is going to look like.
00:23:28.580Let's talk about what has been your favorite thing so far today.
00:23:31.480What was the worst moment of the day today?
00:23:33.180Like, because that's sort of like, especially on vacation, I think like it's making those memories that are, you know, again, my kids aren't remembering right now.
00:23:44.280They're not like they're at least not talking about the Coliseum.
00:23:47.320They're not talking about, you know, our our like Mad Dash tour through the Vatican museums with eight billion pieces of artwork.
00:23:55.480They're talking about the whipped cream bowl that was at the bakery that we used to go to every morning.
00:24:00.540You know, like they're talking about playing cards against humanity and eating olives at a Peritivo spot, you know.
00:24:07.880So, well, that was actually another thing I was going to tell you that I think I'm curious how you feel about this.
00:24:13.460But I it's this is a newer thing that we've been doing and it's trying to become a regular somewhere.
00:24:44.040I mean, obviously, you want to get to as many places.
00:24:45.780You want to experience the place to its fullest.
00:24:48.080But when we travel, even if it's like the coffee shop that's next to our Airbnb or, you know, this aperitivo place that I mentioned in Rome, there's something that happens the second time you come into a place for the relationship that you have with the purveyors, you know, the shopkeepers, where there's even like the most, I've noticed even the most brusque people will sort of soften a little bit when they see you because they're so delighted that you're coming back to their place.
00:25:17.020especially places that are like oversaturated with tourists who are checking off the boxes of
00:25:21.980Instagram um and so there have been a few moments um there was this spot that we went to in Rome
00:25:28.080that was actually in Katie Parla's Saltette guide that she called the best people watching in Rome
00:25:32.980and it was just around the corner from our place and we would go every night at you know once we
00:25:38.880got back four o'clock five o'clock whatever it was sit down and it was packed every night and I
00:25:43.740remember the second or third time we came, the waitress looked at me and there was a table that
00:25:49.120they reserved for what they called ibruti, which is the ugly ones. And it was their regulars that0.99
00:25:54.820would come in, these like group of old men. And maybe they came in at seven o'clock or eight1.00
00:25:58.600o'clock every night. Well, she let us sit there because we had come the night before, the night
00:26:03.420before that. And they were, you know, attentive and kind. And like, I, the takeaway for me, you
00:26:11.240You know, not only is that like we're having this sort of like nice moment with locals, but also like what I have remembered another another aperitivo spot where my kids remember that, especially do they remember that they they shoot everybody away and put us at this table and we're, you know, and also like they they have more of like a deeper memory of this of this spot, you know, that we can that we can all remember instead of everything bleeding together.
00:26:35.820Like, it was this one bakery that had the, you know, or a coffee shop where we stood at the counter and drank our, you know, morning hot chocolate and cappuccino.
00:26:43.760And they would give the kids lollipops because we came more than one time.
00:33:39.280Well, being on the metro, being on the bus, I mean, those things feel like you're part of the city, like the fabric of the city, which is great for your kids.
00:33:53.820And I mean, not just the park, like sort of having that like escape valve for when you're somewhere and you're like, I just need my kids to run around.
00:34:03.120But the beauty of it, I mean, I have this like we have these photos of Blake and Sloan sitting on these little toy, you know, motorcycles in an Italian playground.
00:34:15.060And one of them's a Vespa and one of them's a Ducati.
00:34:20.080And they're talking to these kids and nobody speaks the same language.
00:34:23.820You know, these like tiny little babies are not speaking English to my kids, but they're having the time of their life together.
00:34:29.840And it is it is truly like one of my favorite moments of, you know, getting to sit down, watch that, have them be on Italian vehicles and chat with, you know, other little babies not using the same language.
00:34:43.840It is it feels like you're part of the fabric of of the city.