Under the Influence (with Jo Piazza) - Meet the Anti-TradWife

00:00:00.000 anita templeton considered herself a trad wife for 10 years 0.99

00:00:09.500 she says that she felt like a slave in her own house and it eventually got to the point where 1.00

00:00:15.640 she wanted out where she didn't want her four children to see her being treated like this any

00:00:20.720 longer. And so she left. And it was the bravest decision of her life. But she also had a 10-year 0.79

00:00:30.060 gap on her resume and four kids to support as a single mother. Her husband was with another woman

00:00:37.540 at this point, and she had no choice but to go on food stamps. Anitza actually made a video,

00:00:44.160 a TikTok video from the food stamp office that went completely viral. We're talking like two

00:00:51.620 million views. In that video, she is really honest about her decision to leave the trad

00:00:58.220 wife lifestyle behind. So many of you sent it to me and asked me to do an episode on the anti-trad 0.98

00:01:05.040 wives, the women who used to be trad wives and are now speaking out about it. And when you ask me, 0.98

00:01:12.320 I deliver. I messaged Anitza and she got back to me right away. In this episode, she tells me

00:01:20.940 that she's never felt happier or more empowered as she does on the other side of being a trad

00:01:27.980 wife. But she's got a lot to say to the women out there who are aspiring to this lifestyle.

00:01:34.820 this is her story 0.99

00:01:37.880 hello

00:01:41.460 hi thank you so much for being here thank you so much for having me i'm really excited

00:01:47.260 i'm excited too you might be the first guest that i found on tiktok a lot of people sent me

00:01:55.620 your tiktok and said oh my god you have been you have been covering trad wives so much this is a

00:02:02.780 woman you have to talk to and then I went deep into your stuff and and I messaged you on tip 0.85

00:02:09.720 I messaged you on tiktok and and I was like I don't know she'll she'll probably never see my

00:02:14.800 message I have like two followers on tiktok but you wrote back and here you are I really I started 1.00

00:02:21.500 posting a tiktok because I realized how horrible the trad wife life was and I was like oh say it 0.99

00:02:29.920 louder for the people in the back, you got it. I'm going to stand on my little soapbox and scream 0.99

00:02:34.780 as loud as I can. It's horrible. It's a nightmare. It's a nightmare. I think it's genuinely a

00:02:41.780 nightmare. So talk to me. Actually, let's start out. Tell me your story. I want to hear your

00:02:47.980 story. Okay. So I'm an elder millennial. I was born in 1982. So I'm still a millennial,

00:02:57.480 but I was raised by boomers. I'm Puerto Rican and born in the Northeast of New Jersey. So

00:03:02.520 it was a very, very traditional upbringing for people who know about that. It was,

00:03:09.040 you know, the women are barefoot and pregnant and cooking and making sure that all the men 0.98

00:03:12.260 are taken care of and the men are out cheating on their wives, drinking, getting drunk,

00:03:16.780 but they pay the bill. So just keep quiet and, you know, be happy. And that was kind of the

00:03:22.020 example set for me. I did have, since it was such a large family, I did have some aunts that were

00:03:25.780 like, no, it's not going to work for me. And they had some attitude and they, so I did have examples 0.88

00:03:30.500 of women who kind of did their own thing and broke off, but it was told to me like they, I don't,

00:03:36.160 it was just very much ingrained in me that I wouldn't be happy until I had a husband and I

00:03:42.080 had children. I wouldn't start my life. I just, it was, and going to church was huge. I was raised,

00:03:47.900 I was, I went to Catholic school until third grade. And then just, we continued, then my parents

00:03:54.760 left the Catholic church and we started going to like more non-denominational churches. And then

00:03:58.800 that's where I kind of fell into the cult of evangelical Christianity. And that just reinforces

00:04:04.840 the traditional gender roles even more. And then they use scripture, like, you know, be a Proverbs

00:04:08.640 woman, a woman of the Proverbs, you know, getting up early to bake the bread for your family. And

00:04:13.620 so I was getting it from every side. And then all the media that you watch on TV, you know,

00:04:18.140 I grew up watching regular TV shows like everybody else, where everybody loves Raymond,

00:04:23.420 where the wife is miserable and she does all the labor the mental load everything and the husband's

00:04:28.400 just this dope who sits on the couch where he pays the bills so be happy i have so many issues with

00:04:33.720 all of those sitcoms that we're on i'm i was born in 1980 so i am also an elder millennial but like 0.91

00:04:40.920 king of queens everybody loves raymond it's like ugly dad hot wife um and he's like oh also um

00:04:51.420 home improvement like all of these sitcoms just glorified like the male breadwinner who's just 0.72

00:04:59.240 kind of dopey and there um and then comedy like hilarity ensues yeah and it's yeah al bundy the

00:05:06.560 shoe salesman but and he's got peggy the hot wife like it was just just i mean i feel like from

00:05:12.280 every angle it was ingrained in me to grow up and be a trad wife and that's when i would be happy so

00:05:16.600 but i was always really i remember as a little girl telling my dad like little i was like six

00:05:20.900 years old saying, you know, I think it'd be cool to be an attorney. And he literally looked at me

00:05:25.020 and said, oh, honey, no, that's for men. You can't do you can't do that. You know, that's silly.

00:05:31.900 You know, and if I wanted to do anything I wanted to do, it was like, no, no, no, that's a man's 1.00

00:05:36.300 world. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. There was no encouragement for like my dreams 1.00

00:05:40.640 and goals. It was very much like, well, duh, you're going to be somebody's wife and be someone's

00:05:45.160 mother. There was never I was going to have my own identity. There was no encouragement of that. So

00:05:49.120 yeah I don't know I don't know how I could have avoided becoming a trad wife I moved out to 0.98

00:05:54.560 Denver Colorado and I think I was like young scared and in a new city and I met somebody at 0.98

00:06:02.060 the first place that I worked at and he and I was 24 and he we dated for a couple years and he

00:06:08.040 proposed to me and even though I didn't feel this excitement and I wasn't I remember when he

00:06:12.220 proposed to me the table sitting across from us um offered to take our picture because he proposed

00:06:17.640 at a restaurant. And I was like, no, we're good. And the woman looked at me. I was like, I'm super

00:06:23.180 not excited, but I think this is just like what you're supposed to do. And that's just how it was

00:06:28.260 like, I just, I just did everything that you're supposed to do. And then when I realized this is

00:06:34.800 miserable, I want to warn every single woman I can as loudly as I can. It's, it's, it's, it's

00:06:41.040 misery. You're, you're literally signing up to be a slave, a domestic slave. What was your marriage 0.83

00:06:47.200 like and how did you feel when you were in it? A lot of times it's based in poverty and that was

00:06:53.440 totally my experience and every other person I know and that's why I think the the influencers

00:06:58.840 who try to make the trad wife life look glamorous it is extremely dangerous because here in Denver

00:07:07.000 the average cost for daycare is going to be like $2,200 $3,800 like I've heard the most out people

00:07:12.720 pay more in daycare costs than they pay for their mortgage. And that's a month. We're talking a

00:07:19.460 month, right? Per month. So obviously, oh, well, mom will just quit her job. Like this is just

00:07:24.880 going to be so ideal. If mom quits her job, we say I have on daycare costs. She can now start

00:07:29.460 making the bread. Maybe we'll have a garden. We're just going to save so much money because

00:07:33.920 you're going into poverty. It's not like my marriage was not one where I was taken care of

00:07:40.420 And I actually became a trad wife accidentally when I got pregnant, 20 weeks pregnant.

00:07:45.540 I lost my job.

00:07:46.920 And he's like, don't worry, I'll pick up the slack.

00:07:48.640 You just stay home.

00:07:49.380 And we kind of just veered off into some conspiracy theories.

00:07:54.480 And when we started homeschooling, we didn't vaccinate our children.

00:07:58.660 I wanted to do a home birth.

00:08:00.200 That part just really scared me too much to not do it.

00:08:03.220 I mean, our marriage was traditional.

00:08:05.600 I did all the cooking, cleaning.

00:08:07.800 He went hunting.

00:08:10.420 And he went drinking with his friends. Like it was it was the married with children life of misery, of misery, of complete feeling alone, feeling the burden of everything. And like when a problem arose and I felt like, oh, well, I have a partner. Let me turn to him. It was like, well, I don't really know what to do. And then it wasn't. It just was not ideal. It was not. It's not it was not the dream that it was sold to me that it was going to be.

00:08:36.740 And then, of course, everybody says, oh, well, you guys are young, he'll mature.

00:08:40.580 Don't worry.

00:08:41.520 Or, you know, maybe with another child, he's really going to he's going to snap his head

00:08:46.060 together.

00:08:46.700 And we were always going to church.

00:08:48.100 So there was always like people kind of supporting us, but they were also really making us feel

00:08:53.680 like a burden.

00:08:54.420 Like, you're so lucky we're here for you in the church.

00:08:57.620 So there was just like guilt coming from every angle.

00:09:01.840 I just felt like such a burden to everyone.

00:09:04.480 I felt like my husband didn't even like me.

00:09:06.740 And I still don't think he ever did.

00:09:09.440 It was, I was filling this role.

00:09:11.620 You know what I mean?

00:09:12.020 I was his new mommy.

00:09:13.000 I was the one who made the appointments, took care of the bills. 0.95

00:09:16.980 And it was miserable, miserable, miserable, miserable, miserable.

00:09:22.780 And so talk to me about what happened when you guys split up.

00:09:28.520 So my story is really intertwined with like touches of domestic violence.

00:09:36.100 the ending of our marriage was not fun it still is five years post-divorce we're

00:09:46.140 still battling it out in the courts all the time it's when you give up so much of autonomy in a

00:09:52.700 marriage and i was married for 10 years when you give up so much of your personal autonomy control

00:09:58.080 everything decision making because a good wife is submissive and quiet and serves her family and 0.97

00:10:04.360 You give up. You give it up to your husband. He's the leader of the home. Like the structure is God 0.98

00:10:09.780 first, then the man of the house, then the woman, then the children. And shit rolls downhill. Like 1.00

00:10:16.360 the kids always get the shit end of everything, the worst version of everybody. They get pushed 1.00

00:10:21.580 aside, pushed in corners because everybody has more important things to do, like argue and

00:10:28.340 stress about bills and money. It was his world and everybody else was living in it,

00:10:33.280 including me and my children. And that just got hard. So I was like, OK, how about you just live

00:10:37.440 your life and I'll live my life and we can just share the kids and that'll be it. But somebody

00:10:41.300 like you have to think entering a relationship with somebody who wants that much control and wants

00:10:48.300 and is OK with you giving up so much autonomy. What are they going to be like when you don't

00:10:53.900 want to participate anymore? When you're like, hey, this this doesn't really suit my feelings

00:10:58.380 anymore. You know, that's not usually going to be well received because now you're saying, hey,

00:11:05.220 on top of working and earning the income, now I want you to also help me at home and do some of

00:11:09.980 these domestic chores. And I want to do a little bit of what you're doing. I want to kind of mix

00:11:14.340 it all up. That's not usually well received. And so when you try to leave, it's not well received

00:11:19.920 either. You know, like they're not going to like that. They're not going to like that. No, no.

00:11:28.380 And then the people who are posting and making it look aesthetically beautiful are so harmful to our community and society, like, at large.

00:11:39.480 It's so harmful. And what I think makes it even more harmful is that you have these tradwives on social media who are trying to make it look so unattainably beautiful. 1.00

00:11:54.460 in a way that I do think is very persuasive to young women who are looking for answers about 0.93

00:12:02.960 how to be in the world. Yes. I think a lot of little girls are raised, women and little girls

00:12:08.980 are raised to have this fear of the world. Like it's a man's world. It's a dog eat dog world. 0.92

00:12:14.780 It's rough. It's wild. You, you're so precious and pretty. Just sit here while us men go take

00:12:21.960 care of everything and we'll take care of you too but this is not the fucking middle ages when he 0.99

00:12:27.700 gets bored of this fucking life because it's it's not as a single mother now i can tell you 0.97

00:12:31.980 it's really fucking hard to have the burden of being the one to provide for a large group of 0.99

00:12:36.320 people so a lot of the chadwives don't even want to imagine the thought that their husband could 0.98

00:12:41.500 cheat on them no not mine okay well what if he dies like their structure just makes no sense

00:12:48.420 and then it's putting people in danger because when you have to pick up the pieces of your life

00:12:55.260 it's it just sucks to be on the other end you know what i mean i would love to see those women

00:13:00.240 on the other end in a few years i sometimes i actually a lot of them that i follow it's kind

00:13:05.420 of like i hate watch because i'm like i can't wait i'm watching to watch the demise i cannot

00:13:10.520 wait to see the video where you say i'm like the ace family i don't know if you know about them

00:13:15.000 the YouTube family? No, tell me about the ace family. I love it when people tell me tell me

00:13:19.500 about influencers. I don't know because the world of influencers is large. Pro Joe, you're going to

00:13:24.380 love this one because the ace family, you're you if you catch them now, you get to catch you get

00:13:30.540 to binge all their all of it, including the blow up of the end. They're now getting a divorce.

00:13:34.640 They were just this like really cute couple on YouTube and they posted like pranks and fun stuff.

00:13:39.240 They actually got in trouble because they shut down the city of L.A. doing like an unauthorized

00:13:44.040 parade. And because they like called out their ace family to come out and like support them for

00:13:49.340 something. So they've been huge on YouTube and they're this little family. And then as soon as

00:13:52.840 they started having kids, she started, you know, like I heard in your episode, how every kid,

00:13:57.780 you know, kind of starts to boost your numbers. And so now they have three kids and they just

00:14:02.260 announced that they're getting a divorce. And they're like, after these years, blah, blah,

00:14:05.720 blah. This just isn't, you know, fulfilling for blah, blah, blah. Just whatever bullshit ass story

00:14:11.960 to be like yeah this sucks the traditional you know shit doesn't work it's not fun for anybody 1.00

00:14:18.980 and it's usually fake the people who are posting on social media know the fuck they're not as happy 1.00

00:14:24.540 as they act like they're no no they're not no no they're not no they're not it's fake it's very 0.98

00:14:29.720 fake and you know it's a i i want we talk about this a lot on the show uh but it's performance

00:14:37.400 things that we see on social media are performance and that's okay but we have to realize that we

00:14:44.620 can't think that we're just getting this weird voyeuristic window into people's lives absolutely

00:14:52.400 like i kind of i kind of think of my content as like the anti-trad wife content like that's why

00:14:57.680 i will post a picture of me sitting in the food stamps office i was just annoyed that i knew what

00:15:02.580 was going on. The phone list was down. I can tell my story in a way that makes it, you know, that

00:15:07.900 kind of turns it one way like, and now he's living with another woman. Yeah, well, I left him. I'm a

00:15:12.600 single mom by choice. I did it because I'm happy. I have had to apply for food stamps because I lost

00:15:17.760 my bartending job. I just want you to know that the trad wife life is literally becoming a domestic 1.00

00:15:22.940 slave. It's misery. And when everybody says, oh, she's having a midlife crisis. No, she had her 1.00

00:15:28.940 midlife crisis in her 20s she had a quarter year crisis and was like oh my god everybody else is 0.99

00:15:33.740 getting married everybody out my biological clock is ticking she made some some rash decisions based

00:15:39.160 in fear and now at 40 she's a little more comfortable in her skin she's got some senses

00:15:44.980 about her she's like okay we're gonna start over because i'm good on all that yeah yeah i i love

00:15:52.100 that i love that we are going to take a quick break here and when we get back i want to talk

00:15:57.100 about life on the other side of being a trad wife. And you are what we're now calling an

00:16:04.220 anti-trad wife. And I want to hear a little bit more about what that is and what you want to say 1.00

00:16:11.140 to the women who want to be trad wives, the aspiring trad wives, the soft girls,

00:16:17.000 the stay-at-home girlfriends. But we'll do all of that after a quick break.

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00:18:25.500 and we're back we are back talking about anti-trad wives on social media of which you 1.00

00:18:38.920 of which you are one of which i feel like you're the queen actually you are the queen of the anti-trad

00:18:43.540 wives i will proudly wear that crown thank you yes yes so talk to me about your life on the other

00:18:50.860 side of this. You have four kids and you are figuring out how to support them, how to support

00:19:01.320 yourself. And what is that like for you? It was hard at first because I literally look at it like

00:19:11.060 a seed. You are going to enter the darkest part of your life and you are kind of surrounded by

00:19:18.540 this hard shell because you are so confused at everything you don't you can't even trust yourself

00:19:24.480 because you thought you made the right decision by picking that religion or that husband or that

00:19:29.500 lifestyle like you are faced with having to change your upside down your entire life and so it's like

00:19:36.520 a little seed in the darkest place and so I've been divorced for five going on five years this

00:19:41.920 year will be five years and that milestone just feels so good to me for some reason um but I was

00:19:47.240 married. I did the trad wife life for 10 years. I've been a single mom by choice now for five 0.58

00:19:52.920 years. And it, it's just been amazing. I mean, and I mean, instantly, like the minute I was like,

00:20:01.420 I'm done. This is over. We're splitting up. That first night that I cooked dinner for just me and

00:20:09.500 my kids, the fact that we could sit there and eat dinner and not, there was no eggshells anymore.

00:20:16.260 we swept up all the eggshells it was there was just such a an instant tension release

00:20:21.960 and you know it was a journey the shell had to come off like the little seed

00:20:27.260 the little plant had to start sprouting and it had to grow and you know um and now five years 0.90

00:20:34.960 later I've done a lot of therapy um even if you don't think you're if you were in a trad wife 0.56

00:20:40.720 situation there probably was some domestic there was at least financial abuse because you were

00:20:44.760 stuck with no money and he had all the money so that piece alone you can contact a domestic

00:20:48.980 violence shelter and get therapy usually for free because it's people that are trying to get their

00:20:53.800 degrees that are that are providing their services to the domestic violence shelter so you know

00:21:00.260 everybody wins you get free therapy they get their their hour their clinical hours done

00:21:04.100 and everybody wins um so i did a lot of therapy and now it's just amazing i just have you know

00:21:11.400 when you're living the trad wave life and you're getting in some arguments with your husband and

00:21:14.600 you know, things are, you're not happy. Like I've had to become a lot more vulnerable with my kids.

00:21:19.800 Like I can't just hide away and cry because they need lunch and they need dinner. So I have to kind

00:21:24.140 of show them my humanity while living life. And isn't that what we're supposed to do as mothers

00:21:29.100 anyway? Like our job isn't to make their life perfect. Our job is to show them how to live

00:21:34.780 life and get through it well. And problems, it's not our job to like clear the path for them and

00:21:42.720 make everything perfect. One day we're not going to be there. It's our job to just teach them and

00:21:46.840 live life alongside them and bring them along. And you get that opportunity when you're no longer

00:21:55.480 distracted by baking someone's fucking bread and cleaning their toilet and getting his lunch ready 0.99

00:22:00.660 so he can go to work because he's the most important one because he's the one that earns 0.99

00:22:03.380 the money. And half the time, he's not even earning enough money. Life is scary. And I think

00:22:08.240 that's why a lot of women choose the trad wife life because they're like, well, I'll just hide 0.99

00:22:11.160 behind this and he's going to take care of me and if I could just you know cover my eyes and 1.00

00:22:15.780 la la la la and pretend like everything's okay but like life is going to come at you and you know

00:22:23.000 whether you whether you choose to believe it or not life happens and when life happens

00:22:29.540 yeah I did to quote Jeff Goldblum in Jurassic Park life finds a way yeah yeah and you can't

00:22:37.540 hide in life forever. And it is scary. It's just pick your scary, pick your hard. I would so much,

00:22:43.260 I would so much rather be at the food stamps office than sleeping next to a man that I know

00:22:48.540 doesn't love me and doesn't support me. I'm here to serve him. And I'm only as good. I'm only as,

00:22:54.280 you know, valuable to him as much as I can serve him. That's why I'm annoying when I'm sick and I

00:22:58.860 don't get taken care of. That's why so many women get left when they receive a cancer diagnosis 1.00

00:23:04.180 because you weren't loved you were you were an employee an unpaid servant and you gave your life 0.97

00:23:12.240 for that your life you had life you were a little girl you had dreams you had goals before the world

00:23:19.180 got to you you you know you did other things that barbie movie like i could watch it every day it

00:23:26.520 just the billy eilish song that you know what was i made for i my whole family knows change a song

00:23:33.400 if that comes on because mommy instantly starts crying because oh it's just and I'm right I have

00:23:40.720 three little girls and one little boy and so the weight of like decisions that I made influencing

00:23:48.580 them like I'm always like you know you don't have to be a mom I know that mommy's a mom but you don't

00:23:51.960 have to be a mom you can also be these other things you know I want to take a look at some

00:23:57.420 of the comments that you've gotten on your TikTok because they're really supportive they're really 0.52

00:24:02.900 supportive and they're very anti-trad wife. But I don't think that those thoughts float to the top

00:24:09.420 in social media because social media keeps pushing the trad wife life on the algorithm.

00:24:15.860 It has two million views about being an anti-trad wife saying, look, this is hard. I'm on my own.

00:24:24.760 I've got four kids. I'm getting food stamps. And the comments on this were very positive for the

00:24:33.400 most part. I want to read some of them, actually, because they are beautiful. So, you know, we've

00:24:39.220 got one. The struggle is real. I did the same thing you're doing 29 years ago. There's no shame.

00:24:45.700 You've got to do what's best for you and your kids. And then there's mine being like, hello,

00:24:50.080 I'm Joe Piazza. Would you like to come on my podcast? This is another one from a woman named

00:24:54.100 Jane. This was me, four kids, no education, no career. We were married 17 years. After 10 years,

00:25:02.680 I'm finally on my feet and comfortable. Another one, this one, just, oh my God. My ex tried and

00:25:09.760 my ex tried to force me to stay at home. I would not. I still managed to climb the ladder while

00:25:16.920 doing all of that trad wife stuff. Thankful that I fought to keep working because I'm divorced. 0.80

00:25:24.100 good for her. And again, like just more and more and more. This has happened to so many women that

00:25:31.120 I know. So many women saying, hey, hey, it happened to me. It happened to me. But you know what? 0.97

00:25:39.580 That story is not beautiful enough to usually go viral on social media, especially not on

00:25:48.160 Instagram. I see so much crap on social media that this is nice to see women supporting other 0.97

00:25:55.140 women, which we do not see nearly enough. One last thing. What is your advice for any woman 0.98

00:26:01.940 who is in this, is in the thick of it and wants out? What would you tell her?

00:26:08.260 It's just such a horrible, horrible, you are just prey. You're just sitting prey as a trad wife. And 1.00

00:26:16.380 it just feels so empowering on the other side. That's all we have for today, friends. Thank you

00:26:21.460 so much for being here. I loved this conversation. It is so incredibly inspiring. And Anitza is very

00:26:30.560 brave. If you love this show, please leave us a review, send it to a friend, all of the things

00:26:36.760 help. And as always, if you pre-order the book of the summer, The Sicilian Inheritance, you will get

00:26:43.240 a free lifetime subscription to my newsletter, Over the Influence.

00:26:47.580 Have a great day and do something nice for yourself.

00:26:50.960 You're doing a great job.

00:26:52.680 You're amazing.

00:26:54.040 And you deserve nice things.

00:27:13.240 Thank you.

Under the Influence (with Jo Piazza) - February 13, 2024

Meet the Anti-TradWife

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