Poog with Kate Berlant and Jacqueline Novak - Is The Man In？

00:00:00.000 This is an iHeart Podcast.

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00:00:04.420 This is Ryder Strong, and I have a new podcast called The Red Weather.

00:00:08.020 In 1995, my neighbor, Anna Traynor, disappeared from a commune.

00:00:11.960 It was nature and trees and praying and drugs.

00:00:15.780 No, I am not your guru.

00:00:19.420 Back then, I lied to everybody.

00:00:21.720 They have had this case for 30 years.

00:00:24.660 I'm going back to my hometown to uncover the truth.

00:00:28.220 Listen to The Red Weather on the iHeartRadio app,

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00:01:05.080 Hi, I'm Kate Berlant.

00:01:06.520 I'm Jacqueline Novak.

00:01:07.620 And this is POOG, an ongoing conversation about wellness between two obsessive friends.

00:01:12.360 Two untamable intellects.

00:01:14.140 This is our hobby. 0.97

00:01:14.980 This is our hell.

00:01:15.840 This is our naked desire for free products.

00:01:18.120 This is POOG.

00:01:19.540 Today's topic, loosely speaking.

00:01:21.440 Angry plank.

00:01:22.880 Soul transplant.

00:01:23.920 brad's status oh welcome to poog it's morning poog they used to call it morning poog this is

00:01:33.160 wake up with poog because folks i'm here to admit something i consider myself deeply punctual

00:01:39.120 punctual on time i don't i really am deeply punctual in fact i'm usually 45 minutes early

00:01:43.500 no i'm so terrified of being late to any kind of professional engagement i'll be circling the

00:01:47.020 block for hours and i last night theta jacqueline and i are on a text i won't go into the micro

00:01:52.180 details i slept through yeah if you're about to name me okay no i'm not when i went to bed there

00:01:57.980 was questions from jacqueline i slept i slept boldly through we had a 9 a.m morning pook

00:02:04.800 it is a great day here in los angeles i did not sleep well the previous night i was running on

00:02:09.620 four hours so i really needed it guess who slept 11 talk about the 11s doll i slept them really

00:02:17.640 wait 11 hours oh sorry the 11s okay i thought you meant you slept in a scrunched position

00:02:22.340 sorry sorry sorry um so 11 hours okay so then i so then i wake up my eyes open like a doll's

00:02:28.180 they flutter open and i think and what is it my first thought was i thought go on finish

00:02:34.120 i bet it's like 8 a.m and then i look over at my analog clock it's 9 34 i've blown through

00:02:44.880 who i grabbed my phone really cute texts including an audio from you that was so cute

00:02:51.280 but that was me trying to wake you up listen to this

00:02:54.180 so cute if i could wake up to that every day oh i'm i i will i will deliver it to you because it

00:03:06.560 made me so happy it's hysterical and then theta and jacqueline welcomed me with open arms and

00:03:13.300 here i am with my morning cup and guess who's i do feel welcome i feel it was rude and i feel

00:03:18.020 it is obnoxious what i did no i said i feel i was rude not it was rude i think i'd ever say that

00:03:24.720 we're not i didn't think you said it was you were not rude and here i am with my morning cup and

00:03:30.160 it's a morning poog and i feel energized from the 11 hours and here we are would you like to know my

00:03:34.600 sleep story please oh it's deranged so so i'm actually in the opposite position okay i got up

00:03:42.080 at six whoa okay doll's eyes opening or alarm oh so that's right that's what it is that's what it

00:03:51.380 means opening means like a natural like the ideal way of waking up unalarmed like right

00:03:56.280 oh here i am rested person the idea of truly waking naturally like what does it mean to wake

00:04:02.060 up if you're in a sensory deprivation tank right like like you know it's just an interesting

00:04:06.440 question no but i mean i mean like you know you're going in there you sleep there like you've

00:04:11.180 naturally. Anyway. All right. So hold on, hold on, hold on. I think it would happen a hundred

00:04:14.260 percent. Yeah, it would have to. And like, I get into that where I wake up, boom, like 8am on the

00:04:20.800 dot. Well, you know, if you train, if you tell your, Oh, you know what I meant to say the other

00:04:24.860 week about this? And I'm going to tell you my sleep story momentarily, but it was that I trained

00:04:29.340 myself once I realized I have such a hard time getting up in the morning. And then I, and I only

00:04:33.460 have one shot every day to one shot to get it right. Like how am I supposed to train? You know

00:04:38.680 what i mean yeah so i decided one day to train in rapid succession so i laid down on my bed

00:04:45.360 i sort of try to like let myself fall asleep and then i have an alarm go off yeah i mean i did this

00:04:50.480 once alarm go off like two minutes later fly out of bed okay like were you able to fall asleep in

00:04:56.620 the two minutes i didn't i decided i didn't even matter okay if i fell asleep it was more about i

00:05:01.200 just i did reps okay of hearing my alarm and getting up and getting out literally practicing

00:05:06.180 the movement like 20 times and i don't know you know it's it's rarely about result for me

00:05:13.300 i know i know so so two days ago yeah saturday i've been feeling depleted you've heard me use

00:05:19.980 the word a couple times now language is you know all we have all we have and less we turn to dance

00:05:28.000 which also has its limits well yeah you believe dance will save you so i slept all of saturday

00:05:34.360 I slept for a number of hours in the afternoon on Saturday.

00:05:37.000 OK, Sunday, I did it again.

00:05:39.420 Sunday, I slept like six hours on the couch.

00:05:42.040 What hours?

00:05:42.620 Give me give me an idea.

00:05:43.620 That was yesterday.

00:05:44.140 I can't even remember.

00:05:45.100 OK, noon to six.

00:05:45.940 One.

00:05:46.940 Oh, noon to six.

00:05:47.360 I don't know, like eleven to four. 0.99

00:05:49.860 Damn, that's a chunk. 0.99

00:05:50.640 And then last night I was emotionally deranged. 0.99

00:05:54.500 OK, I was writhing in emotional pain.

00:05:56.780 That makes sense, by the way.

00:05:57.360 Writhing in sourceless emotional pain.

00:05:59.240 Now, it's not sourceless.

00:06:00.820 It's that.

00:06:01.380 You mean sleeping during the day?

00:06:02.240 i just want to say that that kind of sleep strangeness will i mean if i take a bad nap

00:06:08.520 i'll wake up the hopelessness is so searing in my blood in my blood i'm like interesting so acting

00:06:14.260 bold choice wow you know like i will go oh yeah my life my career i if i take a wrong nap i wake

00:06:21.560 up and i'm like okay so and i just every relationship in my life i see clearly for

00:06:27.100 the first time and they're all looking at me going what if you tried listening to someone 0.97

00:06:31.360 for once what would that feel like you bitch you know like i'm just saying i get i get really dark 0.98

00:06:38.420 with a bad with a bad sleep with a strange nap sleep disruption is is the is the fastest way to 0.97

00:06:45.380 shocking mental illness no absolutely and i cannot decide i cannot decide in this life

00:06:52.040 whether or not naps serve me okay half the time i take them and i go why am i so afraid of a nap

00:07:00.400 you know and all this okay this is this is who i am i have a siesta after lunch okay there's a long

00:07:06.080 tradition of this yes and then i go i cannot nap okay it yeah it's it's a waking hell uh when you

00:07:14.220 wake up i mean it's unspeakable to even speak of waking up and it's dark out because the evening

00:07:19.080 has fallen i mean i mean that is uh suicide watch i'm sorry but it's it's so it's really dark it's

00:07:26.380 really dark and i was trying to observe so i was creating i was doing fists i was doing claw fingers

00:07:32.200 okay with my emotional because i i wanted to like punch something that kind of energy i want to

00:07:37.340 destroy something but i want to destroy anything and punch i don't really have anything good to

00:07:41.440 punch and punching never works for me anyway i'm always like you know the fantasy of being one of

00:07:45.420 these people who boxes out the aggression take it out of my bag they say okay so then i punched a

00:07:52.660 pillow yeah but it sucks it's like there's just not so this was like and i was thinking i was like

00:07:58.100 i was like aware of the absurdity but i was like lying there on the couch and i was like i gotta

00:08:02.480 get like gotta get it out somehow like i gotta get the energy out and so i like flew into plank

00:08:07.480 okay i like rolled off the couch and into plank something yes i had a therapist brilliant therapist

00:08:14.460 brilliant post-modern therapist who i worship and i will not say her name out of respect for

00:08:20.000 her anonymity, told me that when you're really overwhelmed, she was actually the first person

00:08:24.800 to say, you're not supposed to meditate if you're really like, there's this assumption, like,

00:08:29.160 I'm really upset. I've been triggered. I'm spiraling here. Let me meditate. It's actually

00:08:34.360 not recommended. She said, push up against a wall, go up against a wall and just push the

00:08:41.100 wall as hard as you can. And something about the vagus nerve or something like that's a really,

00:08:45.600 so your impulse to plank is very similar in that no that's interesting you did the right thing

00:08:51.080 i think it's utter comedy too like so i'm writhing i'm writhing in this thing and i'm like oh but i

00:08:56.100 was very aware of i was like i have to i need movement like the problem here is like i can go

00:09:02.480 so you know sleepy and nap and lie there and just completely detached from my body my body is a lump

00:09:08.800 and then and then it gets to this point i think where it's like okay your body's actually screaming

00:09:15.320 out for movement now screaming totally and so i was like do i get up and do like like a full

00:09:21.960 practice right now and whatever and i don't know but i was like how was plank though it was nice

00:09:26.340 to have it was nice to experience plank as angry okay angry plank okay because first of all i've

00:09:35.520 been going i was like i have to engage all of my muscles in an unpleasant way that i can go

00:09:39.600 that i can kind of have the like right and all because i was lying on my back just doing

00:09:44.180 like stiff claws and then i like did like a one i tried out to see how it felt to punch the ground

00:09:49.600 okay like punching the ground with your own fist the ones i know okay it was sort of like you know

00:09:55.940 chris please don't do that to yourself or whatever like that kind of thing and then i'm like oh my

00:09:59.880 god i need to do something and then yeah plank was all right it was like it was nice to be in

00:10:04.940 an angry plank versus a the promise of placid plank the yoga kind of you know i'm in the most

00:10:11.840 uncomfortable position of my life elbows are slightly bent right when you're planking just

00:10:16.180 yeah i don't want to lock at the joints you know right and then so i was like i have to move i've

00:10:21.580 slept all weekend right yeah i slept yesterday i slept today and then i'm like okay and i'm

00:10:26.480 falling asleep early this was all very early and so i fell asleep so i'm like i'm getting my ass up

00:10:31.280 at six and i was like i was like i'm doing yoga i was like i'm doing it it's back it's time

00:10:36.000 so i got up i went down i tried to turn on the dvd of it's a crass name fat free yoga but it is

00:10:45.300 it is but it happens but laughably it happens to be the most you know spiritual metaphysical

00:10:51.780 of the yogas it's it's i mean like of the videos i have it's it's uh the raviyana

00:10:56.240 kundalini that i like and they're but they're rogue they're not part of the institution that's

00:11:01.380 why i've liked them i've said this before i like to make it very clear because people come at me

00:11:04.280 hey well do you stand by everything kundalini organization has has stood for no okay people

00:11:10.600 have come at me okay so so um the remote was nowhere to be found and so channeling turning

00:11:18.300 the input you know input the television to get to the dvd input you know oh sure cling through the

00:11:23.000 inputs hdmi one hdmi two that sort of thing see i don't do that okay and so you can imagine me

00:11:28.700 not finding a remote and wondering if i was gonna have to locate an input button on the back of the

00:11:33.520 television occasionally those exist if you can believe it and i took it one breath and i saw

00:11:38.140 where it was the remote i got on the table i got on the mat it was dirty mat there's coffee spilled

00:11:44.100 on it but i said it doesn't matter okay yeah sorry i'm telling this like it's really dramatic like

00:11:50.700 no keep going honestly i'm riveted and the murderer came in and then the murderer came in

00:11:55.100 and then i turned on my red light yeah you know my red light that you also have the i need to

00:11:59.940 blast my knee with light path led yeah well i've been blasting my my inner ankle my navicular

00:12:04.940 accessory that the poog listeners have done nothing for i fell asleep worried about my knees i was

00:12:09.480 like okay see you in 10 years knees um but i did i did the yoga and it was unpleasant to revisit

00:12:15.440 the movements that i've mastered in the past and yet find myself suffering through hauling my my

00:12:22.060 limbs up into the air stretch pose are you familiar downward dog i assume but downward dog

00:12:28.580 downward dog is you know they're like you know this is supposed to be a restorative pose and it

00:12:32.000 actually is for me it's one of the few but it does it to me too honey are you familiar with

00:12:35.960 stretch pose no where you lie on your back and you lift up your feet six inches off the ground

00:12:41.780 and then you lift your head and stare at your feet it's literal hell it's like my least favorite

00:12:46.720 yoga pose like an ab crunch and no yeah but it's you're not crunching in you're lengthening so 0.66

00:12:51.560 you're you're shooting your you're like your neck is like your neck hurts i hate when your neck that 0.71

00:12:57.860 sounds awful it's tense mabel your neck shouldn't hurt not hurt that way hurt like muscle i guess 0.77

00:13:03.600 oh they're like and they say they go if it's uncomfortable if this is uncomfortable for you

00:13:07.740 or you feel angry or whatever they're like that's because your glands need it oh christ mabel come

00:13:13.100 here you're gonna have to settle in you're gonna have to settle in fast and then the question of

00:13:16.920 whether or not leaning on mabel you know emotionally on her small body how much to lean on her but

00:13:22.280 anyway i did yoga okay and that's why you get the beautiful mood that you see now no for how did it

00:13:27.540 the yoga was fine how long did you do it for um it was probably like 45 minutes or something then

00:13:31.720 i was like oh that's a lot gotta cut it short to get to poog on time and i'm i'm role-playing

00:13:37.340 being on poop being no i'm role-playing being being to poog on time because i'm always late

00:13:43.960 so it's fun for me to be like where was and there i was on the dot you see i am late um i'm a late 0.72

00:13:50.920 bastard i'm gonna do some yoga today some poga as i've said pilates yoga i pull up my pilates

00:13:58.380 yoga fusion um oh here's a question yeah yesterday overwhelmed with the urge to watch moonstruck was

00:14:06.320 it you yes it was me love it i knew it was my favorite film my family's like it is astonishing

00:14:12.420 i haven't seen it since i was i think a child and all i remember was like share his hair like

00:14:18.160 so essentially have not seen it i'm tearing up okay minute 35 the first tear arrives perfection

00:14:23.820 well i also recalled a line that you used to describe my god you're richer than roosevelt

00:14:28.640 you're rich as roosevelt you're just cheap cosmo i say it to kate all the time jacklyn calling me

00:14:33.620 cheap is like one of the greatest joys of my life it's like funny it's i really love it because um

00:14:37.660 i guess i am and i have to no it's just because i think of myself as like as being like really

00:14:42.480 kind of overly extravagant yeah that's why it's hysterical yeah and so i uh oh but i'll just say

00:14:49.380 i'll just quickly say we can move on but the line that made me tear up because i'm assuming everyone

00:14:53.620 wants give me one word of it and then i'll guess sorry you know in this light of course you look

00:14:58.100 about 25 years old it's perfection and he does without expression on your face expression you

00:15:03.760 look about 25 years old and that moment i was like truly a tear didn't i wouldn't say tear fell 0.69

00:15:09.000 but i welled up it became it welled up in the eye and i was like god damn well here's the thing so

00:15:15.780 in that moment it's it's not the main characters it's the friends it's a couple friends they're

00:15:20.860 very sweet i love them um and in that moment the husband gets up and he's looking at the moon and

00:15:28.020 he's out the window it's the bright moon and he's saying it's cosmos moon cosmos moon yeah and he

00:15:32.100 turns and he looks back at her and what's amazing is in the way that shot is i see it i see him at

00:15:38.240 25 years old works it works you see him as a perfection now did did you all you'll weep if

00:15:43.180 you haven't processed the fact that olympia dukakis i know passed away last week so i know

00:15:49.460 to watch it right now is and i didn't know that she had passed away recently so of course i i go

00:15:57.020 psychic i go she's asking me to watch i'm making it about myself not that i probably caught the

00:16:02.320 headline somewhere scrolling twitter for 14 hours yeah anyway so it's a gray day which i

00:16:07.860 nicholas cage is i mean it's nicholas for me i'll never support anything other like to me nicholas

00:16:13.680 cage's excellence can never be denied and if you need some early convincing start with moonstruck

00:16:19.340 and then watch every film he's ever made after that and and actually celebrate almost unbearably

00:16:24.760 hot in it they both are it's like very shocking i'll just say that i'm looking out and i see the

00:16:30.860 gray day and you and i have talked about this you've talked about your sensitivity to weather 0.98

00:16:34.700 right and light is really affecting your mood daylight savings knocks me on my ass okay it

00:16:40.440 takes me a week to adjust you know you're a fairly recent los angeles resident and the thing about la 0.53

00:16:46.560 that used to really depress me coming from new york was the kind of you know monochromatic nature

00:16:50.560 of every day right every day is like there's beautiful sunlight and blue skies and palm trees

00:16:54.800 every day you're like by the way meaningless i'm not going to i'm not going to start i had an urge

00:16:59.620 there to self-flagellate and be like wow kate you're the first person to say something like

00:17:04.300 that los angeles kind of like permanent weather status with no interruption it's kind of confusing

00:17:09.880 to the mood because naturally we expect the weather to punctuate our mood and allow us to 0.97

00:17:13.600 be sad but instead you're just forced to be sad in the beautiful day but it's the goddamn truth 0.91

00:17:18.100 yeah and today's a gray day which allowed me to a sleep in because the sun wasn't bursting through 0.93

00:17:23.620 and i'm looking out there and i'm going i'm so glad it's gray today so i can read and watch

00:17:28.300 moonstruck at 2 p.m without yes without judgment from the elders are you are you hounded by phantom

00:17:34.040 elders by the way i don't know why i said elders i was exciting it was exciting yeah i guess i was

00:17:40.740 thinking i wish i had yeah i wish i felt honestly i i suffer from a lack of elder haunting like i

00:17:47.940 would like to feel my elders more yeah in fact i want to i think because i essentially never knew

00:17:54.200 my grandparents like my grandfathers I never met we have to go to break but this is a rich place

00:17:58.420 to start like Hemingway said or whatever you know leave a little something like don't stop your

00:18:03.740 writing for for the day when you feel complete like do it when you're kind of in the middle

00:18:09.040 of something so that there's something to pick up on when you come back and I have to pee so

00:18:12.180 this is beautiful oh wow okay hold that thought all right off you go

00:18:16.240 this is writer strong and I have a new podcast called the red weather

00:18:23.800 It was many and many a year ago in a kingdom by the sea.

00:18:29.780 In 1995, my neighbor, Anna Trainor, disappeared from a commune.

00:18:33.500 It was hard to wrap your head around.

00:18:34.840 It was nature and trees and praying and drugs.

00:18:38.460 No, I am not your guru.

00:18:42.240 And back then, I lied to my parents.

00:18:44.880 I lied to police.

00:18:46.140 I lied to everybody.

00:18:47.140 There were years right where I could not say your name.

00:18:50.100 I've decided to go back to my hometown in Northern California,

00:18:52.540 to interview my friends, family, talk to police, journalists, whomever I can to try to find out

00:18:57.520 what actually happened. Isn't it a little bit weird that they obsess over hippies in the woods

00:19:01.880 and not the obvious boyfriend? They have had this case for 30 years. I'll teach you sons of

00:19:07.540 to come around here and my wife. Boom, boom. This is The Red Weather. Listen to The Red Weather 1.00

00:19:15.020 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

00:19:22.540 and we're back sorry i got excited about ancestors about all of that to be haunted i was just saying

00:19:31.300 that i i could use some more ancestral presence because i that again if they're here i'm not

00:19:37.080 saying you're not here you know but where are you and i think because i never knew my grandfather

00:19:43.040 can you imagine and um no but i i didn't just due to time and my grandmothers i both you know died

00:19:52.120 when i was like one or two so even though i swear to god i have memories of both right but wait and

00:19:59.060 then i actually ended up then for the rest of my life calling my aunt my grandma and to this day

00:20:03.500 right call her grandma desperation for christmas with grandma or whatever yeah yeah and they gave

00:20:07.840 forced it on them like those ducks those ducks imprinting on a laser printer or whatever

00:20:13.560 exactly i was gonna say this is hysterical okay so like do you have a single photo of them

00:20:21.300 anywhere around because that might be a way to bring them in oh not my home i don't mean literally

00:20:25.940 i mean if you honor them a single photo they might be more inclined to show up yeah because

00:20:33.380 would you want to go traipsing around your granddaughter's home when there's not a single 0.98

00:20:38.880 yeah like she carries your damn nose i know you're like staring at your own face completely 0.99

00:20:44.540 a strange technology that's devastating my at my parents house my mom has photographs of her mom 0.99

00:20:51.520 yes i'm a little scared of my dad's mom really what i heard tell me everything the spark plug

00:20:58.460 really no yeah well apparently she was like brutally funny no everyone was terrified of her

00:21:05.360 and she was like quite mean okay well the fact that you have not called this energy

00:21:11.380 in to work with in some capacity shocks me this is so exciting okay now you're really going to be

00:21:18.120 shaking because listen to this she was one of the very first women pharmacists to have her like her 0.87

00:21:24.920 own like pharmacy and this is in queens in like the goddamn 20s and she was writing a book called 0.99

00:21:32.640 is the man in because that's what everyone would say when they came into her pharmacy excuse me 0.94

00:21:37.280 can you believe that wait but she's dead before you were you were born you know why i'm asking

00:21:41.560 right like you know two well i was gonna you know while i was asking right the question of whether

00:21:46.440 it was a direct soul implant immediately upon birth okay now i refuse to accept that just

00:21:52.480 because there was overlap okay just because there was overlap you were two when she died

00:21:56.220 that there still couldn't have been a transfer there's a concept i've read about this i don't

00:22:00.200 know if i want a full transfer i i from what i've heard you're feeling like no because you're feeling

00:22:05.760 like that's impinging upon yourself but what if yourself is her so it's you the whole time kate

00:22:12.200 i don't like that i know it's so funny how you don't like it i want to desperate i want to

00:22:16.500 cling to some idea of i think she i mean she's in there lord knows she's in there but i just i've

00:22:21.700 read about this is not the point it's just enchants my imagination but this idea that sometimes souls

00:22:26.800 come in like not at birth what do you mean you mean they come in two years later you mean that's

00:22:32.860 just a husk for two years you're no i think a demon occupies you that's a joke okay but

00:22:37.980 anyway i'm just i'm pushing it because you're thinking the grandmother's other but if she's

00:22:42.640 literally you then it's not impinging on yourself that's all i'm saying it's kind of interesting

00:22:48.100 and again no i actually i'm not i refuse to apologize or explain that i'm even

00:22:54.040 you know utilizing the language of past lives there's no time for it okay see footnote okay 0.97

00:22:59.580 I see footnote and there is no footnote sit with yourself um damn Kate I mean that's I mean is the 0.97

00:23:06.160 man in did she ever did she ever finish the book I don't know I have to ask this is like something 0.94

00:23:11.560 that my dad told me I have to I have to figure it out I don't know but yeah I found but then

00:23:16.620 you'll love this because I found a box I was in my parents basement you know this is like my

00:23:21.520 the fear my the one of the images one of the images that plagues me as an only child

00:23:26.200 with at this point truly elderly parents is you know them dying and it's me alone in the basement

00:23:32.580 with all the banker's boxes like weeping alone right like that's like like the beginning of um 0.95

00:23:38.240 fuck i can't jonathan franzen's book oh my god i can't i can't access it but i but then i have to 0.92

00:23:44.320 remind myself no you know we make we make families and i'll have friends there and there will be and 0.98

00:23:48.380 jacqueline and i but it's good to have this on record that like when i'm orphaned there needs

00:23:53.280 to be a google doc my friends need to take over and there needs to be there needs to be who's

00:23:57.640 doing shifts and i'm not and that's hysterical and outrageous that's what people do no i well

00:24:04.440 i guess maybe i don't know what you mean i do you mean to just be there be around you i mean what

00:24:09.560 about shiva why don't you just if you call it shiva but i'm talking about then you won't then

00:24:14.140 you'll be surrounded at all times like this is kind of like you know the great fear of me alone

00:24:18.740 to handle the bankers this is me i thought it was shift to handle the bankers boxes like so my

00:24:23.260 friends are gonna need a google doc with all of my parents financial information no no i just meant

00:24:28.600 what what do you call the pose where someone comes up behind you hooks their arms underneath

00:24:32.260 you so you can collapse in their arms i'm talking about a dream come true i don't know i'm talking

00:24:36.820 about some kind of google doc to manage that and this is kind of my vision of myself like oh the

00:24:41.840 following my great fear right of like being completely alone which is again one of those

00:24:45.300 images you have to like actually look at and face and like we're never alone or whatever so but the

00:24:49.640 point is yeah or always yeah greater you were never you're not in control you never were hun

00:24:55.400 so get used to it so yeah but uh yeah just like i guess i'm thinking meal delivery who's here to

00:25:01.900 you know hold me and stuff like that so uh there will there will need to be that um i think the

00:25:08.360 shock for you here's how i see it playing out you're gonna be like can you believe i'm standing

00:25:11.940 or whatever like like you're gonna be like you're gonna be confused that you're not literally

00:25:16.140 constantly sobbing and falling i think you're gonna be like i don't know that i love that how

00:25:19.740 i see that seeing my future strength through your eyes really helps and um okay great i mean you're

00:25:25.440 you're a hard bit right you're right there's that part of you like totally you're not small you know

00:25:30.140 like spiritually you're you know you're none of these things like you you identify in some ways

00:25:34.880 these factors of your fears of loneliness and whatever i mean yeah the mother wound um yeah 0.99

00:25:41.120 maybe you need to what is it I don't know I what was I thinking about I don't know fuck it 0.99

00:25:46.860 no you really you see me as usual you understand me I feel seen so god damn it I went like you're 1.00

00:25:52.880 a hard-ass bitch like and you like you are you're like this kind of it impresses me like you you 1.00

00:25:59.480 actually you have a developed I don't know like ego or or whatever in the healthy sense as the 1.00

00:26:05.900 chairman of the board or whatever of your psychology but like you have certain areas

00:26:12.220 like definitely they're very boundaried very like no like you're like no i'm not doing that 0.95

00:26:18.640 or whatever you're like no fuck them you're like let him hear like kate quiet the waiter's gonna 0.96

00:26:24.280 hear you complaining about his hurt let him hear i changed it to waiter actually because i didn't 0.99

00:26:31.380 want to like i wanted it to be an arbitrary example but i feel like you would do that like

00:26:35.560 i don't know whatever someone was wronging you for real and you're like no oh my god like you

00:26:40.940 have as usual you're telling me you're strong you see me as strong allows me to finally animate my

00:26:46.000 strength so thank you oh i love you i'm finally free etc etc now i can handle anything i feel

00:26:51.800 completely powerful i want to go on my deck and scream in a good way but i oh i was saying that

00:26:56.100 I found this old banker's box filled with my grandmother's like stuff or like papers,

00:27:00.980 which I'd never, you know, it was the thing of opening it up. Also, I just want to chime in here

00:27:05.160 to say there's debatably nothing more boring than hearing about other people's grandmothers,

00:27:09.440 like going through their stuff. Do you see what I'm saying? Like, like, even as I'm, it's like,

00:27:12.940 it's like what we were talking about, about people's fascination with their own baby photos,

00:27:16.580 right? I mean, look at me, look at me. And we've all fallen prey. And so here I am being like,

00:27:21.700 I found my grandmother's driving because I truly found her Italian driving passport you know and I

00:27:27.420 was like that's hot and then I was like yeah but how dare I force our our beautiful listeners to

00:27:33.380 listen to me going through you know it's like save it for my cousin check-in you know it's kind of

00:27:38.380 like so I'm abandoning here but I just gonna say because I think this is funny I was with my mom

00:27:44.040 and I was looking at it and here's what's really funny is that there were photo after photo of my

00:27:48.240 of my dad's first wife like she like loved my dad's first wife and so it was like all these

00:27:54.080 i was like who's this i'm almost like well that's your dad's first wife they're you know and they're

00:27:58.680 like photos of them and photos of the dad's first wife with her they never told her baby and the

00:28:03.840 husband that she remarried and like letters between the first wife and my grandmother no

00:28:08.700 yeah anyway so that's funny oh my god so they were really close did your mother ever form a

00:28:14.120 relationship with your father she was my grandmother was quite like mean to my mom

00:28:18.760 wow apparently like hit her with a cane and stuff wait wait she your grandmother hit your mother

00:28:23.280 with a cane incredible a gentle tap on the back of the calf to say you're in the way i'm not sure 0.61

00:28:29.080 i'm not sure but i believe there was a little there was a little there was a moment there

00:28:33.240 see i i think though for whatever reason i i think talking about one's own grandmother actually is

00:28:38.560 there is a universality that can be experienced through the particulars of of someone else's

00:28:43.720 i don't think it's as like i don't think it's as ego as the baby photo thing i think yeah because

00:28:49.900 it's another person good point you're expressing some interest someone outside myself yes and i'm

00:28:57.220 yeah i'm fascinated it shocks me um how few generations it takes to be forgotten by your

00:29:07.060 own family i am constantly shocked in one generation how much can change first of all

00:29:13.340 every hundred years new people just let that sink in well that's huge so that's why actually let's

00:29:18.120 take a minute because i know they're not every hundred years new people so really just imagine

00:29:22.520 what that means and we look around we go climate change how's the world ending because every hundred

00:29:28.300 years it's new people no and people cannot be expected to see outside themselves let alone

00:29:34.120 future generations we're disconnected from the earth etc every hundred years new people i'm very

00:29:40.980 excited okay and i want to take it a little further okay because i'm worried that people

00:29:44.440 are hearing every hundred years new people maybe by the fourth repetition they got it but like

00:29:48.740 i'm still afraid they're not mystically experiencing it because new people almost

00:29:52.080 just sounds like there's fresh blood right okay like oh we got some new meat in here whatever

00:29:56.400 to be clear kate berlant is dropping news on you that in a hundred years okay putting aside

00:30:03.880 technological advancements every single person that is alive now is dead and there'll be a bunch 0.96

00:30:10.120 of motherfuckers who are currently in the ether and they will be the ones living that's weird 0.88

00:30:16.540 that is super weird 100 years okay and we should live to be like 400 let go of the vitamin okay 0.99

00:30:22.800 yeah even if we live 400 you'd be like oh like there would be like some kind of memory that

00:30:28.560 could actually there or like would it merely expand to the same dynamic like right right right

00:30:34.820 right like well it's disturbing how much lifespan and expected lifespan dictates our lives and it's

00:30:40.720 very strange that's why we're also freaked out by tortoises okay and like when they're like you

00:30:46.600 know that tortoise is 400 totally oh my god i think some of them are like i think some of them

00:30:50.980 might be 400 and like that is so brilliant and also this as a kid i remember you know they would

00:30:55.720 cut the tree and they'd show you the rings are 100 years and you'd be like wait what like it's

00:31:02.080 like absolutely it's the fossils all of it it's like the inability that the actual inability to

00:31:07.960 understand time but then also wait cut it cut me off for the love of god i'm trying to think

00:31:14.460 of course i'm trying to give a little more space i'm so overwhelmed by how massive this is no no

00:31:18.920 i want to really really sit with this okay so i've had these moments about like the tortoise

00:31:24.240 and how i guess i what i want what i imagine is almost this like forest gump like i imagine the

00:31:29.700 tortoise like strolling across various historical events okay like strolling at a tortoise's you

00:31:36.900 know pace okay so you see like like you know the revolution like the yeah 1776 and the tortoise

00:31:45.520 like slowly walking past like men with ponytails like screaming of revolution yeah okay and then

00:31:52.560 like i don't know i just think my god to think that their consciousness has endured on this plane

00:31:57.920 you know and then but wait i just want to take a minute with this i'm not over it yet new people

00:32:02.920 yeah okay because here here's what's even more shocking okay we all know and again let's just

00:32:07.940 use the hundred years metric and i'm gonna stop apologizing for it and i don't want to hear the

00:32:11.420 futurists no because i know everyone's going well we're all gonna you know now we're all gonna live

00:32:15.160 to whatever i don't care okay make it 120 and no we're not so a hundred years from now even more

00:32:21.920 than the fact that we'll all be dead everyone you know will be dead everyone whose status have you

00:32:26.280 seen brad status one of my one of the most undersung films of the last 600 years and it's

00:32:32.220 literally it's mike white and listen yeah it suffers from a terrible title right brad status

00:32:37.480 actually makes no sense but no it's ben stiller is don't even get me started on ben stiller one of

00:32:43.020 the most brilliant nah magnify magnify i was like magnetic it is i think i it is so beautiful everyone 0.56

00:32:55.520 run and go see brad status mike white is one of the greatest creators of our goddamn time

00:33:00.600 ben stiller's importance in the culture i was actually i had like two cocktails and i was 0.51

00:33:05.280 screaming about how you mean about ben stiller's importance in the culture and how thank you and

00:33:10.340 let's like these these 19 year olds have no idea okay i don't even know who i'm talking about when

00:33:15.640 i say that but i'm just like to us i ben stiller is like huge on in the culture his imprint cannot

00:33:22.540 be over overstated but i'll just say and uh the the moment and this isn't giving anything away

00:33:29.260 yes at the concert when he's like i realized i could love them and i didn't have to possess them

00:33:33.520 or whatever well oh my god you just referenced love and possession just last week and i had no

00:33:38.940 clue that there was even a brad status element in here okay sorry theta wants to wants a

00:33:46.200 connection to be drawn okay okay the cordon will tighten or whatever the cordon incredible use of

00:33:51.720 score okay keep going okay incredible use of score i mean literally there's okay so the reason i say

00:33:59.020 brad's status right then was because i was saying 100 years not only oh right well we all be dead

00:34:03.520 okay to me what's important also about that and this is why the in memoriam at the oscars is so

00:34:08.440 huge for me okay is is the intersection of status and mortality okay in memoriam we recognize

00:34:15.260 mortality of those who we hold up as beyond death and yet there they are so you see it's always to

00:34:21.900 me it always kills me it's um what's your favorite sort of shot slash role to see in an in memoriam

00:34:29.000 okay for me the ones that get me i think public perhaps the most yeah keep going those i'm always

00:34:35.360 like those are distracting no i know i'm joking okay but when it's like when it's like a guy with

00:34:39.900 a twinkle in his eye and he's like a you know 70 year old bald man okay who's got like his apple

00:34:46.380 cheeks like grinning to all hell okay and it's like you know and it says something like you know

00:34:51.100 sound editor or something okay and you're like oh my god and they're like it's like you know like

00:34:54.900 jack whatever like some man okay you're like you can just tell like johnny apples he fulfilled his

00:34:59.640 role yeah he fulfilled his role he had the time of his goddamn life and i like when it's a vintage 0.90

00:35:04.900 pit okay yeah i think anyway i don't know i'm lost okay but of course let me come back let me come 0.97

00:35:10.180 back i saw another connection i had to make so brad's status is about is about ego and status

00:35:15.800 and jealousy and aging how am i doing versus my yes versus my you know peers and so knowing that

00:35:22.360 we all are going to everyone you know have jealousies of have dynamics with all of them

00:35:28.220 all the status will be erased as we are turned to dust okay and that's comforting but actually

00:35:33.520 weirder to me is when you say new people 100 years from now imagine just you're filled with

00:35:38.540 people walking around doing whatever the fuck right that they think is life okay not a one of

00:35:43.620 them is alive now oh i know without by the way when i see i just felt like reversing it there

00:35:48.080 i was gonna do something for well people if they hadn't gotten one that sometimes i was driving

00:35:51.960 the other day and i and i was at a stop sign and there was this truly ancient man like he was like 0.51

00:35:56.280 600 years old bent over crossing the street and i was like how the fuck are you still alive like

00:36:01.740 when you it's amazing we're not just constantly all dropping dead it's actually they're bent like 0.91

00:36:05.740 an n was he shaped like an n was a full n and he was like and i just was like how is he still alive

00:36:11.720 and there was something about that that is miraculous like i just couldn't believe it

00:36:15.740 and and like like it's devastating to lose someone to lose someone young but sometimes i'm like i

00:36:21.620 can't believe it so they're not just always dropping like flies i mean it's crazy out there

00:36:25.640 it's shocking okay i just wanted to quickly say that in the memoriam you're describing that like

00:36:30.300 that cinematographer jack appleseed or whatever i have a dream i have a dream i want to live that

00:36:39.180 life like i want to come back there's something really like horny but also like i really want to

00:36:43.160 spend like i would love to spend six months inside the body of a rich 75 year old bald guy

00:36:49.620 who has a wife who like gets blown by like his secretary who drives like a really nice car 1.00

00:36:57.060 and just like eats fucking spaghetti every night 0.99

00:37:00.760 and like, and like, and like coughs 0.99

00:37:03.200 like a gravelly cough at 9 a.m. 1.00

00:37:05.180 And his wife's like, 1.00

00:37:06.020 you forgot to take your pills again, Jack, or whatever. 0.99

00:37:08.820 Like that to me, like that's the kind of,

00:37:11.400 I really want to know what that feels like.

00:37:13.400 And to be like slow going up the steps

00:37:15.560 and to kind of like oogle someone.

00:37:17.800 We have to go to break.

00:37:18.600 I want to talk about this extensively.

00:37:21.140 This is all, this is probably why we're friends

00:37:23.200 and we didn't know it.

00:37:24.000 And this is why Pooh came about in a sauna.

00:37:25.940 We'll talk about that in a second.

00:37:27.060 We're going to break.

00:37:28.560 Okay, okay, coming back, coming back, coming back. 1.00

00:37:30.960 Go eat your ads, hogs. 1.00

00:37:37.620 This is Ryder Strong, and I have a new podcast called The Red Weather. 1.00

00:37:41.680 It was many and many a year ago in a kingdom by the sea.

00:37:46.960 In 1995, my neighbor, Anna Trainor, disappeared from a commune.

00:37:50.800 It was hard to wrap your head around.

00:37:52.140 It was nature and trees and praying and drugs.

00:37:55.420 so no i am not your guru and back then i lied to my parents i lied to police i lied to everybody

00:38:04.240 there were years right where i could not say your name i've decided to go back to my hometown in

00:38:09.100 northern california interview my friends family talk to police journalists whomever i can to try

00:38:14.220 to find out what actually happened isn't it a little bit weird that they obsess over hippies

00:38:18.720 in the woods and not the obvious boyfriend they have had this case for 30 years i'll teach you

00:38:24.480 sons of come around here and my wife boom boom this is the red weather listen to the red weather

00:38:32.340 on the iheart radio app apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts

00:38:36.400 okay go go i know it's coming go okay i'm so excited because you brought up the most i mean

00:38:48.920 my fantasies of there are certain things that i believe i could only experience if i was embodied

00:38:54.060 as a bald older rich man yes yes like i used to wonder could i just become someone who ate

00:39:01.300 without all the food fear okay what if i were just someone who believed like mama's meatballs okay

00:39:08.160 okay like if i was someone who believed like like oh you're in a bad mood you just need mama's

00:39:14.440 meatballs and bucatoni okay or bucatini okay yeah instead of you know green is green yeah well you

00:39:20.920 know it causes grain grain okay yeah if i just had if i had like if i had a different system of

00:39:25.780 meaning but anyway like being one of those men and you go down for a bowl of ice cream he would

00:39:30.600 go for the bowl of ice cream he'd have the two scoops sliding around the bowl yes in like some

00:39:35.140 china or like something that his wife picked out yes for all the dishware to to for me to have no

00:39:41.480 emotional relationship to the dishware in my own home would be oh my god to finally be free yes i

00:39:46.780 know to me it has no relationship because that is like those men that's kind of they have no

00:39:51.760 relationship it's all done for them right you know rage out here the labor right it's not just the

00:39:56.920 labor it's the also women okay yeah sorry keep going no no i just it is the way that men benefit

00:40:03.140 from marriage to women right yes like so profoundly and this has obviously been like

00:40:07.120 well well-worn well-researched but like women who are single and unmarried live longer right

00:40:12.160 Like, duh, the women who are typically married to a man. 0.60

00:40:15.780 And men who are single die at 12.

00:40:16.840 And I only see this like, yeah, exactly.

00:40:19.580 I'm only looking at this through a very, you know,

00:40:21.980 I'm only here chastising heterosexual relationships.

00:40:26.580 But yes, to be that man who has no relationship to the,

00:40:29.840 you're the man, you've paid for everything.

00:40:31.880 You have no relationship to the objects.

00:40:33.360 You're eating mama's meatballs, right?

00:40:35.080 She sets them down in front of you,

00:40:36.380 pats you on the shoulders, take your pills. 0.92

00:40:38.500 And then the secretary under the table is giving you heads.

00:40:42.160 Well, right. There's a there's a there's like there's this thing we see in these television shows. Right. Tony Soprano and the whole thing. But I think that's like there's something about them where they where they have it all. And yet their existential crisis leads them into the arms of a mistress.

00:40:58.040 do you remember did you see summer of sam no with mira sorvino and um i think maybe leguizamo but 0.95

00:41:04.160 but in it he's like you know can't have sex with his wife because he's got these like religious 0.78

00:41:09.840 hang-ups and so it's like very much like she's his madonna like and so he goes and he finds like 0.98

00:41:14.620 these other women to be like dirty and she like tries to wear one of the wigs that they're wearing

00:41:19.340 to to obscure themselves from son of sam it's like look i'm wearing a wig you know i did this 0.92

00:41:24.280 for you recently the other day my fear making me laugh so hard no wonder i'm bringing it up again

00:41:29.700 it is it but it's so funny my hell there's two hells one hell i used to dream of was are you 0.51

00:41:35.700 coming to bed okay which is you know the classic thing of the woman saying in movies have sex okay 0.82

00:41:40.960 no no sorry sorry i i confused because i said two separate things but the first being you know just

00:41:47.280 in movie are you coming to bed while the hero man is like pursuing you know going through the case

00:41:53.080 or the murder or whatever right and she just wants him to like relax and so my great fear was always

00:41:57.320 like that i would somehow end up in like in this like relationship where like i'm removing the

00:42:01.460 glasses from a man and like closing his computer being like it's time for a sandwich okay like

00:42:07.780 caring for his knees not i don't mean like sexually i mean like it's like it's time to go to sleep and

00:42:12.580 then eventually later in the film i go i'm taking the kids to my mother's house i don't know if

00:42:16.600 we've covered this on poop no no they always they exit the plot by taking the kids to the mother's

00:42:21.880 house and it's it's seen as like you know like you know he's taking it too far okay sorry take

00:42:26.900 me back okay so the china is key i'm seeing i'm seeing a sliding door okay and what are the other

00:42:31.720 objects i mean obviously it's like the dry cleaning is prepared yes of course dry cleaning

00:42:36.700 but it's more than just labor it has something to do with being a you're almost like a tourist in

00:42:42.180 your own home yeah yeah it's like untethered being able to float through a space that's been

00:42:47.380 curated for you designed for you and your comfort is the primary goal well also like there's

00:42:53.780 something like i feel like it's treated almost like let's just say the wife has chosen your

00:42:58.660 jack's china okay jack and genie's china it's like that's almost treated as some kindness to genie 1.00

00:43:07.180 that the husband didn't get in the way yeah that she got to pick it out so he gives a goddamn shit 0.98

00:43:12.320 yeah right and that's almost like well you have your home right that i right right i mean just to 0.99

00:43:18.060 be being the woman at this i'm picturing this house yes being a woman at the base of the stairs

00:43:22.140 with a designer kind of pointing going i want this there and we're gonna do we're gonna do

00:43:26.980 eggshell carmela has that yes carmela has that and sopranos in a big way oh that's it and everything 0.64

00:43:32.940 she sacrificed for right like the home yeah even like i'll take dirty money yeah right yeah she

00:43:39.060 loves the sapphire ring i mean that's what's so comical when it's like she's like looking at her

00:43:43.680 own ring that tony's given her and it's just like it's beautiful like people who are just like it's

00:43:47.620 beautiful like knowing like but how'd you get it and not even saying that like just like thank you

00:43:52.340 tony like it's truly i mean that's another thing like the belief that like that jewelry creates

00:43:58.560 that kind of reaction to me has been oppressing me for you know since 10 right like the expectation

00:44:03.540 that you love jewelry that's given to you like in this way that's supposed to just knock you on your

00:44:07.600 grass it is still hot the sort of kales the sort of whatever no i'm not saying i don't want jewelry

00:44:13.040 i just i don't know it's like it's it's treated like it's a frying pan i think i like it because

00:44:17.920 it is theater right like sometimes those very scripted emotional cultural moments there is

00:44:23.720 relief in it that's what's so terrifying like the like proposal right of like right that moment like

00:44:28.660 when we reenact those it's like tourism through the ages it's like you through an act and that's

00:44:34.260 why the power of ritual is like so real and that's why also we suffer in so many ways it's

00:44:37.800 the lack of ritual right so it's like ritual lack of ritual is everything yeah okay we think we're

00:44:42.200 above it you think leaky gut is the problem it's lack of ritual doll i mean truly we have to force

00:44:47.820 it on ourselves now i know and it's hard to create when there's no because the pick and choose the

00:44:52.880 a la carte nature of ritual these days uh find a little ritual online that's meaningful to you

00:44:58.120 exactly there it is meaningful to you in that very moment the individualism you've eradicated

00:45:04.700 any sense of what it is ritual of ritual of any sense of what it is and um humbling oneself before

00:45:10.820 i actually was emailing with a ceremonialist recently i'll just throw that out and not

00:45:14.720 explain no i knew i know that ceremonial is right people who study ceremony and ritual and they can

00:45:19.800 like you can kind of like you know they'll help you into a new home and i want to like yeah will

00:45:24.400 you help me create a ceremony to process this which is ultimately a la carte and not ritual

00:45:29.700 it's actually no you need the whole community it's actually the perfect example right it's like

00:45:33.360 because what i should do is be like okay and then i'm gathering um doing something to for the greater

00:45:39.800 health of the community is that is what we are so broken from if it hasn't been beaten into you

00:45:45.680 through your own culture if you weren't forced as a child then does it command that thing because

00:45:51.600 it's still all a cart like if you if it wasn't forced on you through your community like you're

00:45:55.720 still choosing you know that's a problem it's like right that's the tourism problem yeah or

00:45:59.720 the tourism version i know you were saying in a different way that i like which is connecting you

00:46:03.540 through the ages yeah like i don't know like all you oh god are you ready for this one i mean this

00:46:09.040 would require having children i guess but like you can't do it for yourself you can only do it

00:46:13.700 for like four generations ahead of you by starting something now it's like you can be the tradition

00:46:18.680 starter right now okay oh wow i mean you and me could go hard this year and come up with like

00:46:24.180 eight at least rituals that we do i love that and we like lock it in till 99 i love that even if

00:46:30.040 it's just us i'm craving that so desperately i like a tradition that dies with those that it

00:46:34.660 dies with yeah it's actually romantic it's actually romantic imagine the the the secret

00:46:39.560 little habits of people or the wild things that people may have done and died without podcasting

00:46:45.780 about it is kind of you know like i feel like we assume that recorded history is like maybe not

00:46:51.540 recorded history but like i don't know i don't know what will happen yeah i yearn for ritual

00:46:55.180 i yearn for ritual yeah um do you ever think about a single one well maybe that's why i dream

00:47:00.920 of christmas weekly okay because that's the one thing my family holds really that's another thing

00:47:04.820 of why we're so close is that christmas for us is this like overwhelming archetype it's like

00:47:09.200 the christmas you're the only other person that it's all we have like your relationship to

00:47:14.140 christmas you're the only other person in my life who has such a loaded and like permanently

00:47:19.080 significant relationship to christmas yes and that's so much so that i've said to you like

00:47:23.920 when i'm orphaned you know i'm gonna have to do christmas at your house like yes yes like i'm

00:47:27.480 like i think we're ready to embrace you my recurring dream has actually has there's been an

00:47:31.800 uptick of it's either late on christmas eve so stores are closed or it's early christmas morning

00:47:36.860 and i realize i have forgotten to get gifts for certain people in my family or for everyone

00:47:40.860 and every time I have the dream I'm like oh my god it's happening again and I'm like

00:47:44.860 and I'm always like can I just say it can I just say guys I forgot and it's like that is a non-option

00:47:50.840 in my soul it is a non-option and so it's always this going out to CVS going out running trying to

00:47:57.180 go it's like looking for things in my room but that's not going to work like I will not re-gift

00:48:02.480 it has to be purchased that kind of vibe god it's just it's been coming up a lot what else did I

00:48:07.520 dream i'm trying to get back in i i searched dream journal in my i want to get back to brad's status

00:48:13.100 but i searched dream journal in my my phone whatever everyone watch brad's status i'm gonna

00:48:18.000 re-watch it this week and if you if you go tagging okay the stars of brad's status and everyone

00:48:23.360 involved in the film please say that poog spoke highly of it okay i can't have it just seeming

00:48:27.540 like you know them not realizing okay that our love whatever okay sorry what's i saying i mean

00:48:34.160 not saying it was interesting just christmas uh oh so i looked at my i looked at my phone dream

00:48:39.520 journal okay i opened my notes app knowing that i've started a thousand notes in a thousand

00:48:43.660 centuries for this reason i see when i go oh maybe that maybe there's a bunch of dreams i

00:48:47.740 logged and forgot about i open it up of course it's a single note from 2015 with one dream and

00:48:52.620 so i was like okay i guess this is my dream journal i guess we'll continue from here literally

00:48:58.240 six years later dream notes let's see do you want to see oh my god do you want to see what my note

00:49:02.840 was from 11 13 it's only a single line balloon that you float and collects dirt pushing for

00:49:08.880 and this is pushing for pushing for oh my god the next note oh no that's that's because this is

00:49:14.460 yesterday strange la slash new york apartments something to do with christmas what sorry

00:49:21.100 yeah yeah let's get back and wait wait yeah just pull me back i don't know i was talking for a

00:49:26.980 while and i i don't know what to do about it so okay we're talking about christmas we're talking

00:49:31.320 about yeah yeah oh you know what speaking of christmas i was reminded of recently and halloween

00:49:37.200 frankly because you and me were gifted a series of makeup items and while some brands have sent us

00:49:45.060 you know the exact same product set one for each like two grandchildren you know and you don't

00:49:51.340 don't want to show favoritism right we in this case received a bunch bunch of items a plentiful

00:49:56.980 cornucopia of items but the trouble not one of each honey yeah we had two of each for some days

00:50:03.140 but there were some rogue lipsticks yeah rogue lipsticks different colors some rogue products

00:50:08.880 some rogue serums by the way i still covet i'm still in a place of coveting i landed an eyeshadow

00:50:13.840 that you got yeah well that's deranged because you got two out of the three eyeshadows you're so

00:50:18.680 correct i made a strong case for why i wanted why i deserve my desire deserve my desire yes

00:50:27.700 for the liquid eyeshadow and then so i took two you took one and i'm still fixated on the one i

00:50:33.040 didn't get i know and i'm so sick that i started to fantasize about sending you that third color

00:50:38.500 purchasing and sending it to you okay okay because i yearn to please you oh my god jacqueline no

00:50:44.240 also there was another thing where we received where i received because i i asked for it the

00:50:49.360 a bath soak and you didn't because you didn't ask for it you didn't want to over ask yeah and i

00:50:54.780 started apportioning out into a little ziploc a jacqueline no for you and then i but i didn't end

00:51:01.100 up giving it to you it just sat there so you know it didn't happen and actually oh no because we got

00:51:05.080 a bunch of bath soaks they came through and so i was like kate's fine kate's fine she'll need a

00:51:08.800 ziploc offering bless you it's beautiful wait so the but it was a fascinating experience for you

00:51:16.660 and me to it brought me back to being like 10 and like divvying up like halloween candy or something

00:51:20.980 okay it was like because you had your techniques and i had mine so we have these gorgeous fresh

00:51:25.860 cosmetics right in packages and it's like okay let's see what's what and we'll start dividing

00:51:30.900 like we sit like like uh we're cross-legged on the couch we're like we're like eight years old

00:51:35.340 we're cross-legged on the couch facing each other with spread out between us now you i've been

00:51:39.640 thinking about it since so fascinating you start wildly pulling things out of packages okay and to

00:51:45.080 me that creates like this anxiety because part of like the joy of the product yeah yeah totally so

00:51:50.660 kate's throwing packages over her shoulder okay okay opening up a lipstick okay tubing it up okay

00:51:58.120 like you know like in kate's like speedy kind of action like so fast like the tube's going up it's

00:52:02.860 going up it's going up now it's on her wrist now it's on her wrist okay like the color the pigment

00:52:06.020 is arriving on her wrist like it was just moving so fast for me and then what i thought was hysterical

00:52:10.940 was that you did a thing where you go you can have this you can have this okay the second that

00:52:15.120 you realized you didn't want something okay so you'd realize you didn't want something and then

00:52:18.640 go you can have this you can have this totally you have this okay and and i felt that you were

00:52:22.480 setting up this idea that you had been generous early in the process right so then i'm entitled

00:52:28.080 so then you're entitled to the things you actually want when i had said nothing and therefore had

00:52:32.840 said for example oh you can have this i don't want this yeah yeah what was your experience

00:52:37.720 i love being seen like that yes i experienced well as you can imagine i experienced the feeling

00:52:43.020 of wow a phantom sibling having never had that experience in my life of divvying up of having

00:52:47.940 like the only child thing like the gifts are purely for me there's no there's nothing here

00:52:51.740 we're not sorting through i never experienced you know dubbing out the halloween candy at the end

00:52:56.060 of the night and you know you know well technically i realized that metaphor was false because i

00:53:00.760 actually don't we had our individual cans that we filled them with but we did lay them out in front

00:53:04.380 of us arrange them yes look at them right nonetheless nonetheless there's certainly

00:53:08.500 divvying that occurs in life but i experienced that the the kind of the horror of letting go

00:53:13.280 of a certain item only to then go oh no do i actually want that and the sharing of again

00:53:20.700 the the eyeshadows were everything kind of really coalesced right because it was like these are

00:53:25.640 these three colors of the eyeshadows i was instantly drawn to all of them privately had

00:53:29.920 to think which one can I relinquish and still go on to live a life you know and exactly I can't

00:53:35.340 believe I even got out of there with an eyeshadow I really I can't I can't you were like throwing

00:53:39.760 like other things like on the table in order to you know it was wild and I had to keep reminding

00:53:44.880 myself I can buy eyeshadow right which is what I also had to and I went later on the website

00:53:50.120 there's scarcity mindset when there's free stuff I know free stuff brings up this because it feels

00:53:55.180 like you're getting away with murder and so there's something in that excess that makes you

00:53:58.800 almost feel like you have to the hoarding of my day was almost ruined by an incredible deal okay

00:54:05.100 last week my day was ruined when a friend of ours sent a link oh oh my god I also panicked I mean

00:54:13.540 the brand oh my god I panicked Jacqueline so I receive first I receive a text from our friend

00:54:19.380 that says like crazy new deal for an app alarm alarm like I didn't have to pay anything up front

00:54:25.740 okay i was like i thought it was spam it was spam at first and then i realized it was handwritten

00:54:30.500 yeah it was handwritten spam it was personalized i literally got it when you hacked okay and then

00:54:36.320 no this is real he's like download this app and receive yeah and so it's a hundred dollars off

00:54:43.540 of a new app that delivers from a thousand stores that are all you know wellness beauty um clothing

00:54:50.520 focus pantry items top shelf brands of the extreme certain items and it's a hundred dollars off and

00:54:58.220 it doesn't require any expenditure so if you spend 101 folks guess what that evens out to a dollar

00:55:04.000 plus a little something for a tip okay a dollar my day was was nearly ruined trying to figure out

00:55:09.800 how to utilize i ended up getting a bunch of i was yes you bought you're jealous that i had the

00:55:15.660 courage to push through i got two spritzes missed and i got yeah you know how much i missed my face

00:55:22.320 and i got some billy razor blades they were out of the billy so i ordered the razor and i had to

00:55:28.520 order it from moma can you imagine okay billy i love her i love a razor like that though gives

00:55:34.280 you such a close shave okay no we have to wrap it up i was so panicked by the free items that i

00:55:39.920 actually had to step away and go okay do i really need these things just because they're free and

00:55:43.900 And of course, the greater voice says, yes, of course, you need it more than ever because it's free.

00:55:48.160 But I didn't do it.

00:55:50.260 And ultimately, they won because the app is still on my phone.

00:55:53.560 OK, so this was great.

00:55:56.140 And what a way to start the day.

00:55:57.220 Absolutely.

00:55:57.940 Heaven is ours.

00:56:00.740 That was POOG.

00:56:02.980 If you enjoyed POOG, please subscribe, rate and review.

00:56:06.460 If not, we will press charges.

00:56:13.900 and I have a new podcast called The Red Weather.

00:56:16.780 In 1995, my neighbor, Anna Traynor,

00:56:19.320 disappeared from a commune.

00:56:20.680 It was nature and trees and praying and drugs.

00:56:24.500 No, I am not your guru.

00:56:28.180 Back then, I lied to everybody.

00:56:30.480 They have had this case for 30 years.

00:56:33.420 I'm going back to my hometown to uncover the truth.

00:56:37.180 Listen to The Red Weather on the iHeartRadio app,

00:56:39.540 Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

00:56:42.200 This is an iHeart Podcast.

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Poog with Kate Berlant and Jacqueline Novak - May 25, 2021

Is The Man In？

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