Poog with Kate Berlant and Jacqueline Novak - Open Casket

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00:02:08.720 Hi, I'm Kate Berlant.

00:02:10.140 I'm Jacqueline Novak.

00:02:11.260 And this is POOG, an ongoing conversation about wellness between two obsessive friends.

00:02:15.980 Two untamable intellects.

00:02:17.760 This is our hobby. 0.97

00:02:18.600 This is our hell.

00:02:19.460 This is our naked desire for free products.

00:02:21.740 This is POOG.

00:02:23.160 Today's topic?

00:02:23.780 Loosely speaking. 0.99

00:02:25.220 Retinal.

00:02:26.100 $200 the pallbearer shuffle hello hey it's me noticing anything different about me today

00:02:35.480 well yeah so the listener can't see of course but Jacqueline just before we started recording

00:02:45.240 um showed me that she has a zit which for her is unheard of so it's a remarkable day

00:02:52.100 for you to actually have a blemish a visible blemish only unheard of you know in the lore

00:02:59.160 of the podcast i feel right it's it's well i've been looking at your face for years and i've never

00:03:03.940 seen a blemish well i'm covered in rosacea of course i think although that that remains but

00:03:11.760 i don't i've never minded my rosy i've never reminded remind there's a lot of controversy

00:03:17.220 in the rosacea community i feel like people ascribe rosacea like i had a dermatologist

00:03:22.400 recently be like oh whether it's real or not right well she no no she was like she was like

00:03:27.300 maybe that's rosacea and i'm like well wouldn't you know you know well exactly well i had a derm

00:03:33.700 say it's acne and i don't mean saying what you have in your skin jacqueline is acne i'm him going

00:03:39.000 rosaceous acne oh wow wow and then yesterday I was reading well I was reading that so a couple

00:03:48.880 things one well yesterday I was googling retinol purge retinol breakout whatever because I finally

00:03:55.860 tried my tretinoin okay see I'm so glad we're getting into this because I live in fear I don't

00:04:02.880 know about retinol I don't know about it I feel left out I remember using it a little bit in my

00:04:07.300 like early twenties, like my mother had some and I like, and I was like, please give it to me.

00:04:12.260 And so she gave me some, but then I stopped and I never returned. And now I'm feeling the anxiety

00:04:16.880 of have I destroyed my life by not using retinol for the last, you know, six years?

00:04:21.840 No, I don't think so. I think, sorry, I'm just noticing a little redness. So I'm grabbing

00:04:27.140 that concealer. It's actually eyeshadow primer, you know, this old Too Faced,

00:04:32.620 uh it's one of these babies and it oh wow what is this two-faced shadow insurance 24 plus hour

00:04:40.600 anti-crease i've been enjoying keeping your eyeshadow on um i have to get this lipstick

00:04:47.800 off immediately you know why why it's it's the exact color that makes my oh so pearly white

00:04:55.500 teeth have a hint of another color to them teeth whitening actually something we've never discussed

00:05:02.000 and I have curiosity I did crest white strips as like a 13 year old yeah for like two days and

00:05:07.540 then gave up but now did you have pain I think I did experience some sensitivity but I don't recall

00:05:13.820 I was like I was flat on my back screaming

00:05:17.100 I was like literally and you know I'm not like that like I'm like very like

00:05:23.780 stoic yeah you know or or just yeah like for beauty yeah like i was i was trying this laser

00:05:32.580 thing on my face this um nira i was oh my god and i was trying i'm like and to me it feels like

00:05:40.440 you know what what laser feels like which is to me feels like it hurts a burning needle

00:05:45.120 yeah like a needle that's lit on fire piercing you yeah now while in one sense that sounds

00:05:53.460 horrifying might be better than a cold needle you know that might actually be a creeper sensation

00:05:59.600 yeah but i i i turned to chris once again always turning to him and i was like you could never

00:06:08.400 withstand what i withstand for beauty or whatever you know of course i mean it's like it's the

00:06:12.740 unspoken thing like i mean we all know like but literally like drag you know an exfoliant

00:06:20.180 across the average you know hetero man's face i'm just i'm just talking but you know what i mean

00:06:26.600 yeah oh of course they don't know what we do so the exhausted femme is a favorite archetype of 0.99

00:06:34.240 mine and one that i lean into at every chance that's genius the exhausted femme you're damn

00:06:40.240 right i'm tired honey you're damn right i'm tired you're damn right i'm tired well you know what i've 0.85

00:06:48.960 I'm pretty interested in people who, and we'll get to the retinol, but I'm, I'm pretty interested 0.69

00:06:53.620 and compelled by people who truly put on a face. Oh yeah. And that's their face to the world and

00:07:01.340 the concealer with the, and I'm actually impressed by it. Yeah. Well, what's the,

00:07:05.880 it's the classic trope, right? If the woman who goes to sleep with the full face of makeup, 1.00

00:07:09.860 lest there be an emergency in the night and the firemen show up and she's, you know, 0.96

00:07:13.640 unpresentable meanwhile i've gone the other route i'm like this idea of stained underwear which

00:07:19.900 you know and you know oh you don't want to wear stained underwear what if you get in a car accident

00:07:23.380 it's like well first of all glad that that's what you'll be thinking about mother and second of all

00:07:27.300 i mean my mother never said that explicitly no i know where was that i'm also like what movie is

00:07:30.980 that in that's so familiar i know it's i think it's i think it's i think it's a common 1950s

00:07:37.780 concern and then it's a brilliant um idea it's a it's a brilliant horror distilled to something

00:07:45.560 that's very tangible and real it's of course you know and i'm not going to get into ways of seeing

00:07:49.300 in john berger we all know it right yeah but but a line that always haunted me from that text was

00:07:54.260 you know a woman what is it like even at her father's funeral she is aware of being watched

00:07:59.980 or whatever and it's like yeah you can't even you can't even that image of like a woman weeping

00:08:05.220 over her father or whoever's grave and having to have like a cute dress on is so

00:08:11.880 do you have a lot of experience weeping at funerals and i i like do you have you i love

00:08:16.920 this question i don't have a lot lucky me but i've i recall i've had a couple weeps

00:08:29.920 yeah how about you

00:08:31.820 yeah i mean there's been some some sort of tragic deaths in the family that

00:08:42.180 you know have that quality at the funeral that is not just no it's not just the morning it's the

00:08:50.120 life well lived you know you know death is always sad but and but there you know it can all be very

00:08:57.820 six feet underish in a kind of like to eat after a funeral the way that feels to me is so ecstatic

00:09:03.560 you know what tell me like like well there's two versions there's one which is they're like

00:09:09.100 want to go get a burger okay there's that which I love and then like entering a diner or something

00:09:15.260 and just under the context of of death yeah then being in a diner and ordering your favorite stuff

00:09:22.660 whatever god that's good and then the other is sort of this disturbing but oddly comforting

00:09:29.760 like bagels at the synagogue thing I've experienced a couple times yeah the thing that yeah have you

00:09:35.700 ever been a pallbearer no but my eyes are widening because my I once watched my father

00:09:41.540 be a pallbearer and then I you know kind of the celebrity of that like well my dad was a pallbearer

00:09:45.780 you know what the fuck did your dad do you know the celebrity at the funeral is one of my absolute 0.90

00:09:50.660 favorite topics okay because the closer you are to the death the bigger your celeb status your day 0.99

00:09:58.040 it's your special day yes and like fighting you know of course the i mean i remember yeah like

00:10:04.040 elbowing i remember like elbowing past people like kind of like you know i'm the cousin i'm

00:10:08.440 the granddaughter right i mean status fucking respect yeah grief-based status is major and then 0.86

00:10:17.380 oh my god but i've been a pallbearer a couple times and it's like it's like one of these 0.93

00:10:24.460 things in life where i'm like how is this like how is this always happening because

00:10:30.720 i felt like we're gonna drop this thing like i was like this is not like me and my cousin's

00:10:39.080 holding a coffin which is like what it's been a couple times oh my god that is i'm like we're not

00:10:43.240 strong no you can't give it to the kids yeah it's given to the kids and I remember specifically I

00:10:49.980 think it was I think it was my grandfather's funeral but we were like you know holding the

00:10:55.560 coffin and having to bring it right over the hole in the ground and like there were these planks

00:11:01.200 these wooden planks that were kind of there along the side of it to I don't know so that that's what

00:11:08.740 you walk on these planks so you're not on loose ground or something like yeah you're gonna fall

00:11:12.920 in and it was like rattling planks as we're all carrying something way too heavy for us no

00:11:17.340 and i i always think of it in my mind like i have a name for it's the pallbearer shuffle

00:11:23.240 okay i'll show it to you i'll show it to you it's very specific so like to me it's like

00:11:31.520 i'll hold something i'll hold something like uncomfortably like too big okay like

00:11:42.920 oh my gosh it's worse than that okay because it's it's like

00:11:50.660 you have to so to be clear it's like swift rapid movements of the feet so it's not

00:11:57.460 as much ground as possible yeah yes it's rapid shuffling and like we've seen in you know i

00:12:06.780 always like a movie where a corpse rolls out of a coffin that's like like i'm just like yeah like

00:12:11.860 them in yeah and it's yeah it's just it felt really it's just i don't think there should be

00:12:18.300 such high risk should we really be risking the possibility no no no that that and by the way

00:12:25.480 and then you're potentially putting imagine the weight no pun intended of that on somebody like

00:12:30.800 i dropped the body i mean it's just the horror of that seems like a huge risk

00:12:34.840 are you aware of you know so jews jewish there's an idea that the coffin should be 1.00

00:12:42.240 plain simple a wood box cedar yeah it's like maybe it's not cedar and look at cedar

00:12:48.640 cedar's so fragrant yeah cedar almost yeah like keep the mods how do you store your cashmere

00:12:54.160 sweaters how do you store your corpses yeah cedar cedar cedar yeah 1.00

00:12:59.260 what's your experience with open casket well that's the thing as so as a jew 1.00

00:13:07.000 same thing you don't really get the open casket generally thank god and so the only time you've

00:13:14.600 experienced open casket are um other people's relatives and i mean open casket is is like wild

00:13:25.820 psychedelic i mean i i've only seen it once but i was a child and i remember

00:13:32.860 going with my parents to this funeral and then there was the open casket and there was the person

00:13:38.060 and it was like yeah just psychedelic unimaginable and i wanted to run and of course what i wanted to

00:13:46.240 do is just run and stare i wanted to stare i wanted to be alone in a room with the casket

00:13:50.840 ideally to be able to just freely stare but you can't to not have to perform like what yeah no

00:13:58.260 they're dead and that's them like what could possibly be the problem there is no i mean to

00:14:03.800 me there's no greater intimacy because then to see someone's dead body right oh my god i'm imagining

00:14:11.520 that you like you i would allow you to see my dead body that is the ultimate vulnerability

00:14:19.220 my cousin rachel once said like because at one of our family members funerals like

00:14:26.560 you know we were taking turns throwing dirt on the grave but but actually

00:14:31.480 like actually filling in the hole completely like shoveling it right because that's like 0.99

00:14:37.260 i don't know again i think that's part of the jewish thing is like it's cool there's like the 0.76

00:14:40.680 gesture version like everyone's supposed to throw some dirt on i believe actual there's the actual

00:14:45.500 and i like really took to it no i think yeah yeah i like like really took to it and found it like

00:14:51.680 like i'm like it was like six feet under yeah like influenced but i was like like yeah like

00:14:57.860 this actually feels like sort of sacred and sort of beautiful i agree completely and even though

00:15:04.320 it's i remember my grandfather non-jew talking about experiencing that at the jewish funerals 0.60

00:15:09.920 and being like god you know like so horrifying like dirt hitting the casket and i'm like no i

00:15:16.340 love it and so i i don't know i took something and was really really getting into it and i was

00:15:20.860 like working i was like shoveling intensely like like like i'm gonna finish it up with the boys

00:15:25.940 because there was something crass about like well let's walk like let's head back to blah blah blah 0.99

00:15:32.000 these guys will finish filling it in yeah the women kind of with their umbrellas arms linked

00:15:37.400 kind of walk away toward the buffet and the men are left yeah umbrellas and arms linked is genius

00:15:44.760 yeah it's like to finish the job like it's very weird to walk away

00:15:51.940 but anyway it's like and my cousin rachel was like like saw it and was like i want you to do

00:15:58.400 that for me one day or something you know what i mean oh imagine me like well you know i was

00:16:04.100 listening to carolyn mace this morning carolyn mace as we all know my ss is one of my absolute

00:16:08.880 uh favorites and thank you for spelling because earlier today jack and texted me i woke up

00:16:13.620 listening to mace and i didn't know what she meant i was like who and then you're like oh yeah

00:16:17.480 yeah please forgive me absolutely clear because i don't have experience with her yeah and she was

00:16:22.160 just talking about you know our absolute denial of death and and our refusal to well the west

00:16:27.640 has failed us yeah think of you know acknowledge deaths and and that we're just um you know trying

00:16:34.620 to live longer and longer but but trying to look just i forget what you call it it's just like the 0.57

00:16:39.600 absolute rudeness to our own bodies like we ask them to endure we like do all this shit to make 0.92

00:16:45.320 them endure and then like absolutely hate and disgrace the signs of their endurance it's like 0.76

00:16:51.540 oh it's so rude it's so rude when like you know and it's it's uh it's not like the question of

00:17:04.360 women and aging is not uh is not like if you think you've covered it you still have it you

00:17:11.480 know what i mean like it's not as like it's endless it's not not fresh no no like yeah we 0.69

00:17:17.160 know women oh after a certain age they're tossed out like trash like like there's more to be said

00:17:22.340 we just have to develop a space for and she really she i i was saying and i say her name 0.92

00:17:33.040 because i think she would have no trouble with me um attributing this to her um brilliant writer

00:17:37.180 and i'm honored and shocked to say a friend sheila hetty um oh yeah i was talking to her

00:17:41.980 recently and she was like it's just true women become more powerful with age she's like it's

00:17:45.660 just the truth like more powerful like more beautiful more and it just it is I believe it

00:17:52.520 yeah well I've heard I've also read things about specifically like like um you know women who fear

00:18:01.520 menopause and then like and then I mean I I speak I can imagine people listening going there's it's

00:18:08.600 nothing like that whatever but I'm just saying I've read a couple things where like the other

00:18:11.860 and being like you know I was so afraid of this this and this and this but actually it freed me

00:18:16.440 oh my god totally yeah and um I read in one of these period sort of books that I was reading the

00:18:25.880 um the about the cycles and stuff like that kind of talking about like

00:18:31.100 being free from the monthly cycle allowing you to kind of like live this larger like live a large

00:18:37.900 like larger like you're in a different cycle like the big one yeah yeah like you're in the

00:18:45.100 the waning moon of that no it's it's it's truly fascinating to think about

00:18:52.360 we need to start visualizing now so it's not an after the fact thing us in menopause

00:18:59.800 yeah and and deeper like us at 98 oh dancing wildly and or not dancing wildly or like barely

00:19:08.020 moving but you know clinking a martini whatever it is doesn't it doesn't have to be defying it

00:19:14.020 could be like right but just well because that's exactly creating images that are interesting

00:19:21.180 and exciting that's enough my god absolutely yeah you're right because it's always like

00:19:27.220 the aging woman right it's like look at her you'd never know she's 74 look at her lifting those 0.98

00:19:32.300 weights look at that and it's like fuck you what about just yeah what if she's like having yeah 0.99

00:19:38.300 my mom always she's very like she's she's like you know like we all gonna die like she's been 0.99

00:19:43.640 saying it since 12 you know i i i feel lucky that my parents also have talked about death my dad has

00:19:50.080 always been like yeah i was always kind of like like yeah uh and i even remember one time him

00:19:55.960 kind of slapping down the will on the table like oh it's the will like you know like power of

00:20:01.300 attorney like you got you know obviously like unplug me you know like that kind of stuff and

00:20:05.500 i like kind of the the casual nature of that is really freeing and and i totally lost what i oh

00:20:13.200 my mom i remember during covid as i say it as if it's over i meant like early covid pre-vaccine

00:20:18.620 yeah pre-vaccine covid being very concerned for their their safety obviously and my mom kind of

00:20:25.940 being like oh god and you know she was very anxious but she's like if we get it we die we die

00:20:30.800 you know it's like it's like if we die we die almost like what what has become the sort of

00:20:37.680 thinking is this kind of idea of like well i only want to die on my terms right or avoid death at

00:20:44.700 all costs and it's like well good luck we did it all costs we can we can try to not die and we do

00:20:50.540 usually through various mechanisms you're always bargain making a bargain like like you're always

00:20:59.540 saying what you're willing to do like how much you're willing like some people i don't know

00:21:05.920 don't wear seat belts and that's the bargain they're making with life they're like yeah

00:21:09.620 i don't know for me that's not a worthwhile bargain to me too i always i'm maddened by that

00:21:15.000 what's his name um i got to put it on protect your career if not yourself well and i feel like

00:21:22.220 i've talked about this recently but also protect the other people in the car you not wearing a

00:21:26.280 seatbelt can kill someone else that's what you have your their body flies forward and kills you

00:21:30.920 oh wow so that's what i say when i get one of these seatbelt people who tries to act like they're

00:21:36.720 only hurting themselves you know or not hurting themselves god i i guess there's just this i guess

00:21:40.880 like part of my way of putting off the idea of death is I imagine like as if like I'll be so old

00:21:48.100 it's like it's like all right I'm like oh let's just try to be as old as possible right you start

00:21:51.700 there and then you got to look at that and go why why does why is that what I want and it's like

00:21:55.980 oh because if I'm as old as possible I won't be me anymore and that's almost like I'm not dying 0.98

00:22:01.320 it's like someone else is dying and it's like nope bitch that'll be you right there continuous 0.98

00:22:06.980 consciousness from here to there just the way you know your your your consciousness has been 1.00

00:22:12.620 continuous since childhood like now yes childhood feels far away but also does it I don't know I

00:22:20.200 guess that's really the horror is that it's going to be you and you it's going to be you even at 120

00:22:26.300 yeah I mean that's why it's like maybe it's superior for the mind to go before the body is

00:22:30.860 what i'm saying i don't know i mean the desire to have a clean way out i don't know it seems

00:22:36.820 like sudden death is the answer i would hope to the mind going first disturbs me more but yes

00:22:45.260 sudden death i think the the bus to the head the coconut to the top of the head

00:22:50.080 imagine both of us die in the next week oh well well yeah i mean it's your i'm it's hard for me

00:22:58.480 not to quote your genius joke here the hair the big problem for me with death uh is that i and 0.98

00:23:07.120 this is why well it's all it's all my fucking show so we'll just leave it come on okay well we should 0.88

00:23:14.020 go to break when we come back we'll talk about that time to the show folks tickets are on sale 0.98

00:23:18.700 okay all month in los angeles okay tuesdays

00:23:22.660 this is writer strong and i have a new podcast called the red weather it was many and many a

00:23:33.100 year ago in a kingdom by the sea in 1995 my neighbor and a trainer disappeared from a commune

00:23:39.840 it was hard to wrap your head around it was nature and trees and praying and drugs no i am not your

00:23:46.840 and back then i lied to my parents i lied to police i lied to everybody there were years

00:23:54.480 right where i could not say your name i've decided to go back to my hometown in northern

00:23:58.400 california interview my friends family talk to police journalists whomever i can to try to find

00:24:03.640 out what actually happened isn't it a little bit weird that they obsess over hippies in the woods

00:24:08.260 and not the obvious boyfriend they have had this case for 30 years i'll teach you sons of

00:24:13.920 You come around here with my wife.

00:24:15.880 Boom, boom.

00:24:17.200 This is The Red Weather.

00:24:20.180 Listen to The Red Weather on the iHeartRadio app,

00:24:22.780 Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

00:24:27.060 Crook and Chase Nashville chats with the coolest cat in country music.

00:24:31.020 He is edgy.

00:24:31.840 He's fun.

00:24:32.840 He is Chase Matthews.

00:24:34.320 Keith Urban helped make him a global sensation last year,

00:24:37.100 but it's his recent number one hit, Darling, that put Chase on the map

00:24:40.120 and launched a fun and difficult conversation about lovers who cheat and lie.

00:24:45.360 That's why I'm scared to get married. You're giving me trust issues, brother.

00:24:48.260 Crook and Chase Nashville Chats with Chase Matthew.

00:24:51.000 Listen and subscribe on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

00:24:57.600 Hello, it's me, Anna Sinfield, from The Girlfriends,

00:25:01.060 the number one hit true crime show that puts women right in the center of their own stories.

00:25:07.520 I'm back with more one-off interviews 0.97

00:25:09.640 with some truly kick-ass women on The Girlfriend's Spotlight. 1.00

00:25:14.560 I want to introduce you to Sylvia. 0.97

00:25:17.080 I'm going to climb this.

00:25:19.440 And then there's Vaisaka.

00:25:21.560 Let's see how we can stop killing and save lives.

00:25:25.680 Leila dared to ask the question.

00:25:28.160 Is badness hereditary?

00:25:30.180 And finally, we'll meet Rosamund.

00:25:31.980 If it wasn't for the year where Ella lived,

00:25:34.920 she wouldn't have died on that fatal night you'll even get to meet my mum in that one

00:25:39.680 who i can always count on to keep my feet on the ground i'm not too intimidated by her what are

00:25:44.400 you talking about listen to the girlfriend spotlight on the iheart radio app apple podcast

00:25:51.420 or wherever you get your podcasts

00:25:53.560 and we're back um yeah yeah wait what no no i'm just just thinking about death yeah oh i had a

00:26:13.940 major realization the other night gummy induced i mean yeah well not gummy induced i got news for

00:26:19.700 you folks there is no notion inside of a weed gummy of a gummy yeah still has to happen in your

00:26:26.420 head of course so what was it give it to me there's still fresh insights i had this like

00:26:31.820 moment about and it's you know how the things that are the most profound are the most obvious blah

00:26:37.780 blah okay so i'm like this might this might not this might sound like nothing but i saw it in a

00:26:42.900 way that felt like something, which was okay. Your life as a substance time that could run out

00:26:49.400 the bottle of shower gel that you're afraid to use, whatever. Right. And I was thinking about

00:26:55.080 like, live your life, live, live your life, juice it, juice it, juice it. Right. And in order to do

00:27:00.480 that, you have to, well, you could either be like a, you know, a raving spiritual loon, right. Just

00:27:07.600 like in pure present tense just whirling about in ecstasy right I guess that is an option

00:27:14.160 yeah but otherwise you know there has to be a certain amount of like thinking about your life

00:27:21.180 in order to make the most use of it right yeah there has to be some arguably there's some

00:27:27.340 thinking some planning so I mean you can't just be a raw nerve you can't just be ecstatically

00:27:32.760 rolling on the front lawn coming in because first of all like what home are you in if you haven't

00:27:39.440 you know like there are some basics to be taken care of survival wise right so so but but even

00:27:45.700 settings like that even just trying to live a life well okay um like take some time to like work

00:27:53.360 shit out psychologically for yourself anyway it was just this moment where i realized like

00:27:57.940 that there's this ongoing bargain where I go, I'm going to, I'm going to, I'm going to allocate 0.96

00:28:03.860 some of the time, um, I have towards making another time in my life better. And in order,

00:28:12.400 and in doing that, I'm continually, I'm shrinking the amount of time that I'll have to enjoy the

00:28:18.160 thing, but I'm still, I still think that's the right choice. So it's, but it's weird. It's weird

00:28:26.780 because I could suddenly see it like this line and I'm taking it's like I'm taking some of the

00:28:30.560 thread or the rope I'm using some of the slack it's like I'm depleting yet purposely it's like

00:28:36.780 cutting more hair to get the bangs straight you know what I mean no it's brilliant it's like

00:28:41.760 there's something it's like the metaphor's not there but I just I saw it very clearly

00:28:45.440 and it wasn't just this oh so you gotta live life in the present you gotta throw it all out the

00:28:50.040 window and whatever it was like so we were talking a couple weeks ago about oh you have one day left

00:28:54.420 to live or whatever right and we're like it's dinner it's dinner of course it's it's dinner

00:28:58.120 is what we plan right yeah yeah now if you and me are like okay we have you know we have 12 hours

00:29:03.120 left to live i'm at the market immediately do you think we're not spending one hour of that

00:29:08.240 crying planning the dinner you know choosing the foods right oh my god i think i would i would

00:29:14.460 focus all my attention i 12 hours left i would go what yeah what are you planning yeah yeah and i

00:29:22.020 would be you'd find the only difference would be that instead of washing the dishes i would just

00:29:26.820 let them pile up but aside from that it would be or that would be more poetic as opposed to wash

00:29:31.700 the dishes and put them away can you imagine yeah i could see a solemnly washing the dishes as like

00:29:36.960 as the weird light of the world's end some green uh glowing you know chernobyl as it as it comes

00:29:45.040 yeah it comes closer and you're scrubbing like nobly yeah nobly scrubbing like you missed a spot

00:29:51.620 oh my god mitchick is kind of like that would be so stressful if you had because i would be like i

00:29:58.140 want a dinner party that would be a really hard occasion if there was someone that you didn't want

00:30:02.700 to see like if there was some like social obligation like someone that ordinarily be like

00:30:08.180 yeah yeah no of course we're gonna invite them or whatever and well yeah i mean i've actually spent

00:30:16.000 a lot of time thinking about that since not a lot of time but no i mean end of the world plans

00:30:21.340 just the the way the ranks would close you know closing up ranks real fast and

00:30:27.080 where secrets drop and you know what i mean like well it's force majeure a little bit right

00:30:34.760 like in force majeure brilliant basically ski resort family um avalanche comes down they're

00:30:45.840 sitting there at lunch I mean this is a spoiler alert but of course it doesn't matter spoilers

00:30:54.780 the father bolts right and it's like no it's this vision of like all the people are about to die

00:31:03.160 the mother and children duck under the table they're screaming the father bolts and then I

00:31:08.480 mean it's so brilliant I'm so jealous of that concept and then the snow starts to clear oh

00:31:13.040 we're fine everyone realizes oh that was really scary but we're going to be fine

00:31:16.580 and they have to reckon with the fact that the patriarch fled

00:31:19.900 you just you just die when you say things like that it just it gives me such joy the

00:31:31.700 extremeness of the language it's just fled like that is why i dream of being through the ages

00:31:37.840 with you in different time periods like oh my god you being like he he flew or he fled

00:31:43.980 i got confused flew is a nice word also oh it flew it just flew over there flew right out

00:31:51.600 yeah i mean it's always the thing of how do you really act in a crisis or an emergency and i've

00:31:58.980 always assumed i would you know fears about you know as we all know my my crushing uh anxiety

00:32:06.200 about parents dying of course inevitable but like my own fears about how would I act in what I'm

00:32:12.420 trying to say is that I've been I forgot who it was that told me that sometimes people with

00:32:17.440 heightened anxiety like daily anxiety when there's actually a crisis are the ones that can kind of

00:32:21.660 like they're great yeah buckle down and deal with it and I have well they've been preparing for that

00:32:26.720 the whole life right right right and I had a couple glimpses yeah I had a glimpse where I was

00:32:32.040 like well i'm actually not i thought right now i'd be on the floor a puddle and consolable or

00:32:38.000 unable to you know and i'm the one picking up lunch baby no exactly and you're prepared i i do

00:32:44.780 think um i remember one time this guy we were in high school hanging out ow mother oh wow what was

00:32:53.300 it tell me just hit my elbow i'm gonna hit my elbow so hard on this chair okay keep going oh 0.95

00:32:59.140 my god it's fine it's right god i really knock into shit i knocked into something 0.94

00:33:03.420 solutions again what's god what's god my trick i've gotten this to you when you've been in pain 0.90

00:33:07.760 oh you hit it count no i go 10 seconds i'm like count down from 10 and see how you feel yeah

00:33:13.040 it's like it just get through 10 seconds it'll be better then and it like you have done that for

00:33:17.100 me and it does it's already gone okay continue there's still kind of a radiating pain but it's

00:33:22.520 fine it's dull just a little touch point oh the memory of pain

00:33:27.900 well it's an interesting there's some ideas about like that you can't truly remember it

00:33:35.560 or something it's like pain pain is something there is something unreal like okay now i'm

00:33:42.100 just being like but hitting my elbow it's like that kind of fleeting pain is bizarre yeah or

00:33:49.100 just like the reminder of having a body like that is so startling like you knock into something

00:33:55.960 like pain in the brain right like pain is you're experiencing through the travel signals yeah

00:34:00.800 right then it seems like you should be able to outwit it like and be like that's a sensation

00:34:09.480 look at that yeah i'm noticing that i'm having pain instead of being or like yeah a radical

00:34:17.120 acceptance of pain my body has pain instead of being like i have pain or something like oh look

00:34:23.180 how interesting my leg is gone

00:34:26.240 closing down ranks around emergency oh your parents running to your parents the dinner

00:34:39.020 um oh but just like yeah how long would i spend like how many hours would we spend planning the

00:34:46.560 food i think you and me we would balance it like okay well we don't want to plan so much that the

00:34:51.440 dinner only lasts an hour right yeah be like no the dinner we need to have six hours start to

00:34:57.160 finish come now we'll put the pasta water we'll start boiling the pasta now but we'd also be like

00:35:03.660 well it's going to take me 40 minutes to secure that cheese right and so and it'd be like is it

00:35:08.940 worth it and i think we'd be like yeah yeah yeah i mean imagine the looting seven hours yeah six

00:35:13.800 is fine it's fine i think we would right right right the fact that it takes time to consider

00:35:20.720 time i guess is my yeah it's it's hell and i've told you this probably about my father's time

00:35:27.980 management stuff where he was tracking in days of his early days of his business and probably still

00:35:33.760 i don't know but tracking what he was doing with his time like down to the 15 minute mark wow and

00:35:40.120 then putting it in you know to his graph or whatever like charting it and being like okay

00:35:48.020 like you know i spent this much time on new business you know like seeking out new business

00:35:54.280 this much time on admin this much time on you know doing the actual work whatever and like

00:36:00.000 and and basically like he did his system and he realized he was spending too much time on his

00:36:05.240 time tracking that is unbelievable the system revealed it that's amazing i love that couldn't

00:36:13.540 you just like die for that so god i just i have been struggling this week with fantasies of

00:36:19.500 the question of habits has been coming up a lot in uh particularly in the last like number of

00:36:24.980 years not like it's new but you know there's that book atomic habits and i feel like eight years ago

00:36:31.680 there was a lot of talk about ben franklin's habit tracker thing and nerd i know i know but

00:36:42.460 But the only thing that's kind of like disturbing about it is because I go like, that's not how I live.

00:36:50.160 It's easy to build a habit when all you have is like, you know, when there's like a chicken screaming outside.

00:36:56.780 You're like, I could go tend to the chicken.

00:36:58.780 I could toss this rock against that rock. 0.99

00:37:02.000 I could like have sex. 0.94

00:37:05.320 yeah or i could like write down something or i could gaze you know in onto into the horizon 0.99

00:37:13.040 i'm not impressed by like pre-printing press habits oh yeah no no no certainly but

00:37:23.340 ben franklin was not pre-printing press

00:37:26.400 oh my god um you're like you're like in the 1300s when

00:37:33.700 when america was formed america is like prehistoric yeah well atomic habits oh but i was

00:37:43.220 saying living free like and then but the the disturbing realization is like you're not 0.85

00:37:48.360 habitless i love when i'm a complete airhead yeah you're you're not the the hell is that

00:37:55.400 like you actually can't escape it it's the question of are you pleased with what yours are

00:37:58.780 like so i think of myself as living free and yet of course i am you know my habits what are they

00:38:05.640 i habitually watch television at night television is fine start the morning with coffee i mean

00:38:11.280 whatever it's just i mean i'm sorry to interrupt with the complete obvious thing i'm going to talk

00:38:15.880 about but this is what the social media thing because i was thinking about how i use my time

00:38:20.020 as well recently i was actually forcing myself to write it down like what are the things i do the

00:38:24.180 most and I was like oh my god well guess one of the top two things I do the most look at my 0.84

00:38:32.080 fucking phone yeah and that hit hard and I have to say I'm three weeks tomorrow um no phone and I 0.94

00:38:40.000 did log on briefly to post something um and then logged off and like getting in and getting out 0.99

00:38:46.640 no and I got in and got out and it was it was really clarifying to get in and get out it gave

00:38:50.600 me hope for the future that i that i can continue to use that system because yeah the time lost is

00:38:57.120 is harrowing there's a there's a old self-help book that is like called something like how to

00:39:06.680 survive on 24 hours a day or something like that i mean from like 1901 and i read it years ago and

00:39:11.820 i was like what do you mean how to survive like like how to for how to live on 24 hours a day

00:39:17.500 he's like he's a real um like bastard and pointing out like how like the average man like 0.92

00:39:25.700 you know you know wastes his life like i don't know it's it's um which is also rude it's like 0.99

00:39:31.600 just of course we're gonna waste time we're not here to not waste time like absolutely absolutely

00:39:37.780 no i i mean frivolities are the stuff of life although i always felt it was sort of rude like

00:39:45.040 do you remember the whole thing i think it's attributed to john lennon like life's what

00:39:47.960 happens when you're making other plans yeah john lennon said that yeah yeah and it's it's sort of

00:39:52.460 like it's easy to sort of say that when your big life plans are being the most massive major

00:39:59.760 musician ever do you know what i mean yeah easy for you to say killing it bud yeah like easy for

00:40:05.480 him to be like it's actually the times between the tour yeah yeah yeah versus i feel like the

00:40:12.140 the person saying life's life's the stuff that happens when you're making other plans

00:40:15.000 their plans have gone well yes correct like if you're trying to get out of your life you're

00:40:21.800 trying to escape your life into a new thing get a new thing started yeah i feel like i want to go

00:40:27.400 higher these earthly these earthly achievements are they've lost something for me right yeah right

00:40:34.680 it's easy to renounce money when you have money blah blah blah you know that whole thing if you're

00:40:39.260 not happy with what you're with what your main plans are then it's a little bit annoying to have

00:40:46.300 to like savor the details or whatever but but one thing carolyn mace did say this morning when i was

00:40:53.660 listening to entering the castle one of her audio lectures it talks about the work of teresa of

00:40:59.140 avila etc etc she's like people come to my workshops and they want to be told what's my

00:41:03.060 highest potential what's my greatest potential like what am i here to do kind of thing and

00:41:07.840 she's like they want you know great big huge is how she always says it she's like they want to

00:41:13.180 operate their highest potential they can't even function at their lowest potential damn okay

00:41:20.340 they're like can't get out of bed they can't command their spirit to like forgive their friend

00:41:25.220 like i'm a ceo but they're at a workshop asking her yeah yeah yeah and um so there have been a

00:41:33.200 couple times in my life like i remember her saying that and maybe all right what if i went the other

00:41:37.460 way than how I normally think like I normally think start from the biggest most upstream

00:41:43.220 essential thing and work from there like what if I went the other way and was like I'm gonna try

00:41:49.300 to live at my lowest potential well like literally get my shit together around you know my laundry

00:41:56.620 but but all I'm saying is that uh there was a period where once I was like all right let's let's

00:42:03.620 let's start with the basics.

00:42:05.060 And it was kind of interesting.

00:42:06.940 The basics are tough.

00:42:08.060 Like, to live my lowest potential well

00:42:09.980 and, like, and then kind of build off that.

00:42:12.140 I don't know, because I'm always dismissing the small.

00:42:14.440 And then I find myself absolutely crushed by mess.

00:42:18.860 You know what I mean?

00:42:19.440 It's just, whatever.

00:42:20.940 We'll circle these things again and again.

00:42:23.220 We've got to go to break.

00:42:27.340 This is Ryder Strong,

00:42:28.760 and I have a new podcast called The Red Weather.

00:42:30.780 It was many and many a year ago in a kingdom by the sea.

00:42:36.800 In 1995, my neighbor, Anna Trainor, disappeared from a commune.

00:42:40.560 It was hard to wrap your head around.

00:42:41.880 It was nature and trees and praying and drugs.

00:42:45.480 No, I am not your guru.

00:42:49.280 And back then, I lied to my parents.

00:42:51.920 I lied to police.

00:42:53.200 I lied to everybody.

00:42:54.160 There were years right where I could not say your name.

00:42:57.120 I've decided to go back to my hometown in Northern California,

00:42:59.560 interview my friends, family, talk to police, journalists, whomever I can to try to find out

00:43:04.540 what actually happened. Isn't it a little bit weird that they obsess over hippies in the woods

00:43:08.900 and not the obvious boyfriend? They have had this case for 30 years. I'll teach you sons of

00:43:14.560 to come around here and my wife. Boom, boom. This is The Red Weather. Listen to The Red Weather 1.00

00:43:22.040 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

00:43:29.560 the coolest cat in country music.

00:43:31.660 He is edgy, he's fun, he is Chase Matthew.

00:43:34.960 Keith Urban helped make him a global sensation last year,

00:43:37.740 but it's his recent number one hit darling

00:43:39.620 that put Chase on the map

00:43:40.740 and launched a fun and difficult conversation

00:43:43.800 about lovers who cheat and lie.

00:43:46.000 That's why I'm scared to get married.

00:43:47.360 You're giving me trust issues, brother.

00:43:48.900 Crook and Chase Nashville Chats with Chase Matthew.

00:43:51.300 Listen and subscribe on the iHeartRadio app,

00:43:54.060 Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

00:43:56.660 hello it's me anna sinfield from the girlfriends the number one hit true crime show that puts women

00:44:04.940 right in the center of their own stories i'm back with more one-off interviews with some

00:44:10.960 truly kick-ass women on the girlfriends spotlight i want to introduce you to sylvia i'm going to 0.99

00:44:18.520 And then there's Vaisaka.

00:44:26.280 Leila dared to ask the question.

00:44:30.800 And finally, we'll meet Rosamund.

00:44:38.480 You'll even get to meet my mum in that one,

00:44:40.420 who I can always count on to keep my feet on the ground.

00:44:43.140 I'm not too intimidated by her.

00:44:44.880 What are you talking about? 1.00

00:44:45.840 Listen to The Girlfriend Spotlight on the iHeartRadio app, 1.00

00:44:51.240 Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

00:44:58.600 And we're back?

00:45:04.880 Yep. 0.90

00:45:05.980 Well, I'm considering paying for an Erewhon membership.

00:45:14.840 Well...

00:45:15.480 I can't figure out the math though, of course.

00:45:19.480 What are the numbers?

00:45:21.380 The Air One membership is $200.

00:45:25.180 And what you get is 10% for the year.

00:45:27.680 And you get 10% off everything.

00:45:31.240 All right, hold on.

00:45:32.120 I'll do it for you, right?

00:45:33.820 Okay.

00:45:34.980 Well, I go every 45 minutes.

00:45:37.640 How often are you going?

00:45:39.380 So here's the thing.

00:45:39.960 And this is something that I chronically struggle with.

00:45:41.740 So I go and I'm spending a lot in small purchases.

00:45:45.700 So it's not like I'm going and going, oh, here's, you know, it's like, I rarely spend

00:45:50.540 over $40 in one go, but maybe I do that, you know, six times.

00:45:56.820 Like I'm bad at understanding what the value is of that.

00:46:03.280 Time to look at my credit card statement.

00:46:07.820 It's not that hard.

00:46:10.060 It seems like it's hell.

00:46:11.380 it's not that bad just add it up or you just add it on download it into excel never could never

00:46:18.560 could never would um no i i feel you but let me just think about this two hundred dollars a month

00:46:26.480 and the sneeze is coming it has to happen in order to be made in order for it to for you to

00:46:31.640 be making money not losing money or whatever yeah right bless you you have to get two hundred dollars

00:46:38.420 um off okay so is so you have to in getting 10% off you have to save $200 so you have to

00:46:49.880 so is $200 10% of 2,000 yeah so are you good Kate look at me look at me she was rubbing her

00:47:01.080 eyes and it just flew out of you okay you act like I was hot you know yeah oh yeah 10% yeah

00:47:06.320 so wait is that what am i trying to say do you spend 2 000 at air one no i don't even know no

00:47:18.220 this doesn't even make that's for the year that's off i shouldn't if i spend 2 000 in the year oh

00:47:23.540 whatever we'll figure this out tim kicking it down the stream to another time 200 i really i i abuse

00:47:32.100 the hot bar because like right now I just live so close to it so it's like right now I'm hungry

00:47:37.440 right you could just go over there and get get a uh what do you like to get at their hot bar

00:47:42.880 you know I do cook of course they do they do it they do a chicken nugget a coconut breaded

00:47:49.060 um coconut flour chicken nugget um they do they do good sushi yeah they do I didn't know they did

00:47:56.440 that oh yeah no I mean I didn't know they did a coconut flour they do a breaded oh yeah and

00:48:01.920 they do do they call it you know they have salads they've yeah they have keto stuff for sure and

00:48:07.700 then they have no but the nugget oh i don't know if it's a nugget because they'd call it that if

00:48:12.460 it was i'm thinking it's coconut flour plus wheat flour no i don't think they're keto um and you

00:48:18.460 know sometimes i get it and i go this is not great like this is not but it's just the as we've said

00:48:24.280 convenience is is a killer convenience we'll do everything out of the devil lives now inside a

00:48:31.620 convenience the devil had to look for a place to get us and it found its way home instantly

00:48:38.500 all of here yeah yeah all of here it's an interesting idea i feel like i'm really cheesy

00:48:45.700 today on poog do you feel this i feel like i feel like i've been continually saying things and i'm

00:48:50.260 like who's that like i did something i don't even recall but i feel nervous or something it's

00:48:55.400 strange well we'll listen back and we'll cut anything we don't like i you know i can't bring

00:49:01.800 myself to listen to this thing what

00:49:04.200 jinx um i bought jinx robert durst a headlamp yeah the jinx oh my god i need to re-watch

00:49:16.580 i uh the jinx is so terrifying and so good where's mommy mommy's on the roof hi mommy

00:49:24.020 oh wait what is that i don't remember where's mommy he's talking about his mother like on the

00:49:29.820 yeah and like and his voice oh well mommy's you know oh and it's like yeah well he was

00:49:38.760 abused oh yeah beverly hills and the letter of course of like maybelle or something we talked

00:49:45.140 about on christmas pook we went live on the instagram we talked about the staircase but

00:49:48.340 and didn't really dive deeper, but I'm about

00:49:50.340 to do a rewatch. It's

00:49:52.180 deeply influential.

00:49:54.660 Mysterio's case is exquisite, and it's on

00:49:56.320 Netflix now. Maybe it has been for years.

00:49:58.400 I'm revisiting Dexter. It's heaven.

00:50:00.080 Never seen it. I was saying

00:50:02.200 Michael C. Hall, though. The luck,

00:50:04.600 honey, lightning doesn't strike twice, but it

00:50:06.300 does if you're Michael C. Hall.

00:50:08.080 Six feet under, and then Dexter,

00:50:09.760 his agents are going,

00:50:11.800 you kidding me? Two hits.

00:50:14.320 Two hits like this.

00:50:16.220 Two hits.

00:50:18.340 and new blood is is the joy it's um a recent uh dexter additional season we didn't know we

00:50:29.040 were gonna get oh my called dexter new blood i just love the world of dexter i love riding around

00:50:34.700 in his brain sorry i'm distracted because i have a cabinet on the way um what drawers another one

00:50:41.580 oh honey it's happening the office is happening okay so no so actually i was on offer up and i

00:50:46.800 almost bought this set of drawers and then i was at my parents house and i noticed this drawer this

00:50:51.480 drawer set in my old bedroom and i said do you need this and my mother said absolutely not so

00:50:56.280 i'm having that brought here that's exciting yeah wow and so i'm gonna have that and you know what's

00:51:04.200 happening i have to get a handyman in here to help me hang a few things my really arms are too weak

00:51:09.600 you know it's been haunting me what the big thing i want i want a big mirror i want okay i want

00:51:17.400 mirrors dance mirrors so that when i'm doing my tracy well i mean my dance mirror in my bedroom

00:51:24.060 is my dream the thing that's fucking with me is the anti-tip technology okay you know the whole

00:51:32.760 secure this against the wall with this thing they're like this mirror don't worry it comes

00:51:37.720 with um anti-tip technology oh I see what you're saying yes and it's like you can lean this huge

00:51:43.240 thing against your wall yeah I'm afraid of leans of course because of also the cat yeah even though

00:51:48.920 like my big bookshelves just stand there they're not secure to anything and I'm like not afraid

00:51:55.680 it's a little scary maybe you should be actually we are an earthquake country

00:51:59.580 but that yeah but then I start to break down about whether or not I am you know how can I

00:52:06.480 safely mount the hardware can we trust that i'm choosing the right i know drill size to put the

00:52:13.300 little thing in that then the screw goes in do you even know what i'm talking about honestly

00:52:18.180 the drywall anchors oh yeah oh god oh yeah having to find the stud in the wall i mean i want to be

00:52:25.340 able to do that i really really do i have a stud finder if you can imagine wow but you can you know

00:52:32.860 you can do kind of knock knock knock and you'll hear the hollowness where there is no stud i don't

00:52:37.440 trust myself to do that no you really feel it it's like it's it's actually and then you drill in and

00:52:44.260 sometimes you hit it and um but but yeah i've gone through phases it's one of those things where i

00:52:49.740 like don't believe it's real like like like i remember i don't know early in my semi-adult life

00:52:59.340 like hanging shelves somewhere and just being like i'm not the anchor what is this no like i'm

00:53:03.460 just screwing this thing into the wall it's fine yeah and then like watching it slowly

00:53:07.140 fall out of the wall like refusing to really find out what my walls are made of that sort of thing

00:53:13.880 that's the constant i feel like that's the thing that i'm always bucking is um directions like i

00:53:18.720 get so impatient reading directions that i'll read the first three sentences and i'm like oh

00:53:22.440 yeah and i'm just like no i'll just figure it out i'll figure it out my way and then it's like

00:53:25.900 no there's just a way it's not intuitive you just have to follow this direction and it will

00:53:29.860 but I become so impatient and I become overwhelmed with with directions and then I suffer in the long

00:53:37.580 run me accepting the truth of wall anchors me accepting okay I have to drill a hole I have to

00:53:42.000 tap a wall anchor in and then in goes my screw like the once I accepted that and it didn't seem

00:53:47.540 like something other people do oh it's so free I know it was like oh no that's something you do I

00:53:53.940 do now i guess that's so cool and um but there was resistance because it's sort of like you know

00:54:01.060 when they're it's it's the same to me as you know test a small amount on a inconspicuous area of

00:54:08.660 your garment oh yeah or the inside of your wrist or the back of your wrist whatever you know

00:54:14.180 i'm like no just risk it yeah can you imagine like i didn't go to i didn't go to cvs at 3 a.m

00:54:21.720 for hair dye to do a test and wait and wait you know I came because I have an emotional problem

00:54:29.460 yeah yeah and I want a quick fix yes and so I'm gonna go with well I can't do anything that bad

00:54:36.880 or you know they couldn't put it on the market if it was that danger I never trust I always

00:54:42.080 that's the whole retinol to the water line thing you know it's like what they say don't put it up

00:54:47.400 to the waterline i don't even know i can't even remember i feel like the retinol oh because what

00:54:52.360 do people say about retinol is that it's like it makes you very sensitive to the sun right so the

00:54:56.380 idea is that it prevents acne and helps with lines with wrinkles well the sensitivity of the sun is

00:55:04.140 not like is not being framed as a benefit no no i mean that that's a problem like if you're on

00:55:10.120 retinol you have to be really careful about the sun yeah now thankfully we already are right

00:55:14.080 correct i mean it's one of those things where it's like it feels almost like now you can have

00:55:19.720 the dog if you promise you will feed it every day and pick up its trash yes daddy okay yeah yeah

00:55:26.580 i'll do it this is something i've seen on television yeah but it's almost like that it's

00:55:31.640 like okay you can have the retinol if you are if you are vigilant about your sun protection because

00:55:36.940 and this is what's scary to me the responsibility inherent they're like because if you don't you'll

00:55:43.040 make your skin worse like like if you're extra sensitive to the sun then the sun damage will be

00:55:47.280 worse and so it's like it's like what a threat this is where this is where visors come into play

00:55:52.760 for me right right i still struggle with wearing a hat when i never forget a t-shirt is only spf 10

00:56:00.540 oh god don't say it i know it's so it's so upsetting isn't it wonderful

00:56:05.780 a wonderful here's a question do our windows protect us i don't think they know they don't

00:56:12.940 and that's one of the things that's you know the hell the realization that you're supposed to wear

00:56:16.600 spf even if you're inside never leave the home right we've talked about this they say blue light

00:56:21.440 can also damage the skin so even people go well i'm just inside all day on my computer well guess

00:56:26.180 well honey you're gonna want to slap on some spf 30 just sit in front of your mac just sit in front 0.99

00:56:31.040 of your goddamn macbook and watch the years falling out of your feet yeah oh we we we did 0.98

00:56:38.020 get a code for light path uh to wellness red lights poog 10 off with yeah very fancy which 0.99

00:56:45.740 I'll post on the stories but that's a deal I was reading again about red light and and using it as

00:56:50.980 your ambient light at night for the couple hours before going to bed and I was like okay yeah I

00:56:56.660 love and oh you know what I you know what I just got I'm so excited about what and I mean not to

00:57:02.880 you know oh I forgot to tell you I had this is where I wake in the night let me just get this

00:57:07.080 out okay I'm like I'm struggling because I'm about to tell you about a low-carb chip and that makes

00:57:12.720 me not happy about who I am oh please okay so there's that number one like the mystique you

00:57:18.840 know not that there is any but you know what I mean right like oh great and then secondly as a

00:57:24.000 result would you like to hear the most vain possible response to joan didion's death um beyond

00:57:29.620 like her work meaning a lot to me as it does to many you were like fenspo yeah

00:57:36.900 no worse i was like whatever just looking at the pictures of joan didion and i was like 0.91

00:57:43.140 when you realize there's something that you've fucked up that cannot be 0.93

00:57:48.140 turned back and mine was smiling in pictures 0.94

00:57:51.760 i was like she never smiled i was like she never smiled in photos yeah i mean there are some i

00:57:59.300 think where she is but it's very sly yeah young like when she's like young woman hot whatever

00:58:06.620 she's like windblown yeah when like i would try to smile for daddy because i'm a fool yeah

00:58:13.400 she's just like i'm a writer and i'm looking at the camera and i just i i felt devastation 0.96

00:58:20.200 i felt devastation i'm not surprised that like i was like fuck why didn't anyone tell me like 0.99

00:58:27.560 why didn't i clock that you can do it now 19 you can cut the fucking smiles i wouldn't have been 0.99

00:58:33.120 walked walked all over guess what folks is the last smile you're getting out of me no no we love 0.99

00:58:40.120 it okay i'm gonna bring it down we love those pearly whites i think this has been wonderful

00:58:45.140 we're at the hour mark i think we should go well well well another conversation in the can

00:58:52.960 another day another dollar and the dollar spent

00:58:56.960 um i love talking about death me too you know you know we're gonna bring a lot of that a lot

00:59:03.920 of that here yeah it's time to go deeper with death great well anyway uprising is the chips

00:59:11.880 i'm very excited about and paid through the nose for and i'm open to partnership opportunities

00:59:17.140 with uprising chips they're like bagel chips erwan actually has an explosive keto cheesecake

00:59:22.700 i was thinking about for you is it allulose or is it is it monk fruit or is it erythritol because

00:59:28.520 if it's erythritol i think it's erythritol it has a cooling effect and i won't have it

00:59:32.660 no no there's no cooling effect okay some are more sensitive to it than others no no i know

00:59:38.920 that effect i know that effect this is not that hell i'm good actually there's well well yeah i

00:59:45.560 have some more baked goods coming coming your way well um you also turned me on to lily's

00:59:51.300 peanut butter the fact that you didn't know unbelievable i want one right sugar-free baby

00:59:56.720 um well stevia sweetened love you lots i love you bye bye that was poog if you enjoyed poog

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01:00:21.200 In 1995, my neighbor, Anna Traynor, disappeared from a commune.

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Poog with Kate Berlant and Jacqueline Novak - January 25, 2022

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