There Are No Girls on the Internet - March 22, 2022


Stuff Mom Never Told You: Judge Ketanji Brown Jackson is the first Black female SCOTUS nominee

Topics
Whitney Houston: The Zombification of an Icon She was sexually assaulted during a Lyft ride. Now she’s fighting to make rideshares safer for everyone.

Episode Stats


Length

1 hour

Words per minute

178.32

Word count

10,731

Sentence count

696

Harmful content

Misogyny

44

sentences flagged

Toxicity

28

sentences flagged

Hate speech

28

sentences flagged


Transcript

Transcript generated with Whisper (turbo).
Misogyny classifications generated with MilaNLProc/bert-base-uncased-ear-misogyny .
Toxicity classifications generated with s-nlp/roberta_toxicity_classifier .
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
Topics generated with Qwen2.5-3B-Instruct.
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00:00:50.080 I survived nine months in captivity,
00:00:53.240 and I've spent my life exploring how other people survive what should have destroyed them.
00:00:58.780 I'm Elizabeth Smart, and these are The Survivor Files.
00:01:02.380 Every week, I'm with survivors who live through the unthinkable, abducted, stalked, controlled, and nearly silenced.
00:01:09.920 These are stories about what it takes to make it out alive.
00:01:13.740 Listen to The Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
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00:01:45.620 There Are No Girls on the Internet is a production of iHeartRadio and Unbossed Creative.
00:01:49.400 I'm Bridget Todd, and this is There Are No Girls on the Internet.
00:01:58.880 On March 21st, the confirmation hearing for Supreme Court Justice nominee Judge Kentaji
00:02:04.160 Brown-Jackson begins in the United States.
00:02:06.940 Now, her nomination is historic.
00:02:08.780 She's the first black woman ever nominated for the Supreme Court. 0.89
00:02:11.980 And because she's a black woman, her confirmation hearing is sure to be filled with disinformation
00:02:16.740 based in racist, sexist attacks on her character. 0.85
00:02:19.400 not her actual record, actions, deeds, or values.
00:02:23.660 And in fact, these attacks started before she was ever named as the nominee,
00:02:27.580 when she was just a hypothetical Black woman that Biden intended to nominate to the Supreme Court.
00:02:32.880 On the morning that Judge Jackson was named as the nominee,
00:02:36.060 I sat down with my friends Sam and Annie from the podcast Stuff Mom Never Told You
00:02:40.480 to talk through her historic nomination and how we can fight back against the kinds of racist, sexist attacks
00:02:46.000 we're sure to hear during our confirmation hearing.
00:02:48.240 It is so important that we have a digital media climate that allows for everyone to be judged by their merits, values, and records, not unfair caricatures and stereotypes of who they are.
00:03:04.280 Hey, this is Annie.
00:03:05.560 And Samantha.
00:03:06.340 And welcome to Stuff I've Never Told You, a production of iHeartRadio.
00:03:08.640 Today, we are once again thrilled to be joined by the amazing, award-winning, fantastic Bridget
00:03:26.040 Todd, who we count ourselves so lucky to know and call our friend. Congratulations, Bridget,
00:03:33.040 on your recent award for best technology podcast
00:03:36.240 at the iHeartRadio Podcast Awards.
00:03:38.900 Well-deserved.
00:03:39.580 That's so awesome.
00:03:40.680 Congratulations to you and your whole team.
00:03:43.260 Oh my goodness.
00:03:43.980 Thank you so much.
00:03:45.500 Yeah.
00:03:45.820 And you know what?
00:03:46.380 I'm going to say it feels freaking good to win.
00:03:49.400 I was kind of like, oh, like, you know,
00:03:51.800 just being nominated is nice.
00:03:53.300 But I deep down kind of,
00:03:55.540 you ever have one of those times in your life
00:03:57.400 where you just really need a win?
00:03:59.120 I would say that's where I was at.
00:04:00.460 So I have to, like, briefly shout out my team.
00:04:04.520 Tari Harrison is my producer and engineer.
00:04:06.500 She's phenomenally talented.
00:04:08.880 Jonathan Strickland is our EP, phenomenally talented.
00:04:11.980 Dr. Michael Amato is our chief science officer and producer, so talented.
00:04:17.600 I could not have won without them.
00:04:19.940 They're so awesome.
00:04:21.540 Yeah, so thank you.
00:04:22.920 Yay!
00:04:23.980 We love a win, especially when it's our personal friends.
00:04:28.640 Yeah, I said it.
00:04:29.420 I'm claiming you as a personal friend. 0.62
00:04:31.180 I know Bridget.
00:04:32.980 Thank you very much.
00:04:33.800 I mean, I feel the same way about you.
00:04:35.560 I feel very honored to know you all in real life.
00:04:40.600 Yes, yes.
00:04:42.120 And in case you don't know, listeners,
00:04:43.780 which I'm assuming you do,
00:04:44.780 this was for the podcast, 1.00
00:04:45.940 There Are No Girls on the Internet, 0.97
00:04:47.520 which is, you've got a new season coming, right? 0.91
00:04:50.040 Yes, yeah.
00:04:50.660 I probably should have said the name of my own podcast.
00:04:53.020 No, I do that all the time.
00:04:54.760 I'm trying to get better at like self-promotion.
00:04:56.960 Yes, the podcast is called 1.00
00:04:58.720 There are no girls on the internet.
00:05:00.160 We just won an iHeart Award.
00:05:01.420 And we're coming back for a brand new season on March 1st.
00:05:05.200 So we've kind of been on hiatus for a bit while we've been retooling.
00:05:09.000 And I'm so excited that we're finally launching.
00:05:11.000 So it would mean a lot to me if y'all checked it out.
00:05:13.280 Thank you for mentioning it, Annie.
00:05:14.800 I obviously cannot be trusted to remember to say the name of the thing I meant to be promoting.
00:05:20.260 But yeah, please check it out.
00:05:22.040 We have all kinds of interesting conversations about how women and queer folks and trans folks
00:05:27.020 and Black folks and other marginalized voices
00:05:29.000 how we show up or don't show up online and in technology.
00:05:32.540 So, yeah, please check it out
00:05:34.440 if that sounds like something you're interested in.
00:05:36.480 You absolutely should.
00:05:37.400 I'm still waiting for the fan fiction episode.
00:05:39.260 I'm ready.
00:05:40.240 Oh, yes, TBD.
00:05:42.720 Also, just a fun fact about Tari,
00:05:44.800 who's also a good friend of ours.
00:05:46.320 She always sings sitcom jingles at karaoke.
00:05:49.640 It's a thing I adore about her.
00:05:52.220 And she refuses to sing anything else.
00:05:55.060 And when someone interrupts her,
00:05:56.760 She gets very annoyed, rightly so, because this is her thing, and she wants it and has claimed it and has done well with it.
00:06:05.000 How have I worked with Tari for two years and have not—I mean, I guess COVID as hell, but I didn't know this. 0.87
00:06:10.980 I need to take her out there for karaoke to see this in action.
00:06:15.080 Oh, you know what's better? Bridget, we need you to come to Atlanta and we'll host a big karaoke night. 1.00
00:06:20.120 There are several great locations that we love, including my favorite spot towards Beaufort Highway, ran by a Korean family who is as Korean as you think, and we adore them, and they bring us fruit plates.
00:06:31.860 It's a delight while we sing karaoke to our heart's content.
00:06:35.600 Yes, please put that on the agenda.
00:06:37.540 The last time I was in Atlanta, I went to, what is that spot called?
00:06:42.000 Church of Ping Kong?
00:06:43.560 Church.
00:06:44.220 Yeah.
00:06:45.700 There was some karaoke happening.
00:06:47.360 It was pretty fun.
00:06:48.000 So yeah, Atlanta karaoke date, literally anytime I am in.
00:06:51.860 I need to see producer Tari in action singing these jingles.
00:06:55.720 It's the best.
00:06:56.280 She pulled me up one time and she's like, we're singing cheers together.
00:06:59.960 I was like, okay.
00:07:02.320 I love it.
00:07:03.180 I love it.
00:07:03.580 I love it.
00:07:03.920 I love it.
00:07:05.080 Okay.
00:07:05.640 So this topic you're bringing to us today, Bridget, is extremely timely.
00:07:10.500 We're very excited to talk about it.
00:07:12.660 And we have a lot to get into.
00:07:14.320 So let's get into it.
00:07:15.760 What are we talking about today?
00:07:16.820 So today is Friday, February 25th, 2022, and I want to talk about the just recently announced new nominee for the Supreme Court, Judge Ketanji Brown-Jackson.
00:07:29.860 So I have to admit, I was putting together all my notes for this episode last night, and so the notes were all like, oh, the potential nominee, like, when we have the nominee, it was all very, like, hypothetical.
00:07:40.020 And then this morning, the news just dropped that she is indeed the White House's pick to be the first ever Black woman Supreme Court justice on our Supreme Court.
00:07:50.220 So very historic, very important, very exciting.
00:07:52.880 But we know that it also comes along with racist attacks, sexist attacks, mis- and disinformation that women of color who are in public office, unfortunately, tend to face.
00:08:04.920 And so today, I really wanted to talk about how we got to this place of having this historic Black woman being nominated for the Supreme Court and what kind of attacks she's likely to be facing, what kind of attacks she's already been facing, and how we can sort of all work together to create the conditions to have a better conversation about her nomination.
00:08:23.200 Yes, and as you said, this is very ongoing.
00:08:27.700 We're trying to get this episode out as quickly as possible because things are changing very quickly.
00:08:32.160 But we've already seen some of these attacks.
00:08:34.320 I know we're going to get into that in a minute, but before we do that, can you give us some history and background on what's going on here?
00:08:42.100 Absolutely. So here's a little bit of background about the calls to nominate a black woman for the Supreme Court. 0.88
00:08:46.800 I have to shout out the She Will Rise campaign organized by a great organization called Sista SCOTUS.
00:08:52.640 And their whole coalition is full of dynamic black women, women like April Rain, who created the hashtag OscarsSoWhite,
00:09:00.040 a 1619 Project creator, Nicole Hannah-Jones, Alencia Johnson, who I love.
00:09:04.940 I used to work with her at Planned Parenthood, Broadway multi-Tony Award winner, Audra McDonald. 0.99
00:09:10.780 So just a huge coalition of dynamic, badass Black women who have been advocating to put a Black woman on the Supreme Court.
00:09:18.260 And so in the over 200-year history of the Supreme Court, not one Black woman has ever been confirmed or even nominated to serve on the Supreme Court.
00:09:27.000 There have been 115 men and women who have served on the Supreme Court, and only three of them have been people of color.
00:09:32.780 There have only been two black American members of the Supreme Court, Justice Thurgood Marshall and Justice Clarence Thomas.
00:09:38.560 And so that's obviously not a very inclusive track record in terms of representation.
00:09:44.560 And, you know, this idea of, I thought this was kind of a new precedent, you know, a presidential candidate saying, like, oh, if I'm elected, I will put this kind of person on the Supreme Court.
00:09:54.300 However, there is actually a long history and precedent for presidents pledging to pick a SCOTUS nominee who represents a certain demographic of our population.
00:10:03.400 So this is from a really great New York Times op-ed by Walter Dellinger, who was the acting Solicitor General of the United States under Bill Clinton.
00:10:10.580 He writes,
00:10:12.280 There is a long and important tradition of presidents taking into consideration the demographic characteristics of prospective justices,
00:10:18.780 including geographic background, religion, race, and sex,
00:10:21.700 to ensure the Supreme Court is and remains a representative institution in touch with the varied facets of American life.
00:10:27.860 More fundamentally, our history shows the process of reaching out to expand the personal backgrounds of the justices
00:10:33.720 has often produced stellar jurists who make historic contributions to our court and judicial system.
00:10:39.360 So he goes on to describe how President Reagan promised to nominate a woman to the Supreme Court.
00:10:43.820 And even though a bunch of his Republican colleagues were very vocally against it and kind of forced him to add some men to his shortlist, President Reagan was really adamant about picking a woman and eventually nominated Sandra Day O'Connor, making her the first ever female associate Supreme Court justice.
00:11:00.320 And so that's some, like, history that I didn't even know about, you know, how other presidents have set this precedent to make the Supreme Court more inclusive.
00:11:08.180 Yeah. And I think, I mean, it's kind of a waste of breath to call a lot of news organizations and Republicans perhaps if they're critical, but they would have you believe that this is a new thing. Like, oh, this has never happened before and it's ridiculous.
00:11:25.940 Right. And this is not just an issue of representation, correct?
00:11:31.960 Absolutely.
00:11:32.600 So representation is important.
00:11:34.300 People often say, like, representation matters.
00:11:36.440 And it absolutely does.
00:11:37.600 I'm not, you know, disagreeing with that.
00:11:39.640 However, it's not just a problem because representation matters.
00:11:42.600 It's also a problem because we deserve a representative democracy, a democracy where
00:11:47.500 the people who are governing actually are able to meaningfully represent the people
00:11:51.720 they are governing on behalf of. 0.84
00:11:53.380 And you can't have that if your Supreme Court is mostly men, mostly white, because then 0.81
00:11:59.040 you have a Supreme Court, is not actually able to, you know, meaningfully represent the people 0.63
00:12:04.600 they're meant to be advocating on behalf of or working on behalf of. A biographical database
00:12:09.100 from the Federal Judicial Center shows that of the 3,843 federal judges, less than 2% have been
00:12:16.280 Black women. And so, again, it's not just the Supreme Court. It really does go to show that
00:12:20.280 we have a long way to go in making sure that the people who are actually representing us in the
00:12:25.120 courts actually are able to meaningfully represent us and like look like the population that they're
00:12:30.060 actually meant to serve. Yes, yes. And I think right now, a lot of us, for good reason, I would
00:12:37.060 say, are on edge when it comes to the Supreme Court and decisions that they're tackling or
00:12:43.640 thinking about, including abortion. So this is very, very, very important that we are representing
00:12:48.460 accurately our country, the people in our country.
00:12:55.120 Transcription by CastingWords
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00:14:00.380 If your bookshelf and your For You page are equally important to your personality, welcome home.
00:14:06.320 This is Prose Society, the weekly podcast that's part book club, part group chat for thought daughters,
00:14:12.740 pop culture obsessives, and anyone who thinks Pride and Prejudice and Love Island deserve the same level of discourse.
00:14:18.780 I'm Eli Rallo, and every week we're connecting the dots between books,
00:14:22.480 the internet, and the conversations everyone can't stop having.
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00:15:00.540 When I was 14 years old,
00:15:02.800 I was kidnapped and held captive for nine months.
00:15:06.320 I survived, and I've spent my life exploring
00:15:09.020 how other people survive what should have destroyed them.
00:15:12.600 I'm Elizabeth Smart, and these are the Survivor Files. 0.70
00:15:16.240 I just remember this low, taunting voice next to my ear saying, shut up, don't say anything.
00:15:24.840 Every week, I'm with survivors who live through the unthinkable.
00:15:29.100 I knew if he woke up, without a doubt, he was going to hurt me.
00:15:33.660 I started feeling that there was someone at the end of my bed, and I just started screaming.
00:15:41.080 They are abducted, stalked, controlled, and nearly silenced.
00:15:44.900 But these aren't stories about what's taken from them.
00:15:48.580 They're stories about what it takes to make it out alive.
00:15:52.180 Listen to The Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
00:15:59.920 so can we talk a little bit about the promise biden made uh when it comes to nominating a
00:16:14.480 black woman to the supreme court absolutely so this is one of those instances where biden made
00:16:19.600 a very clear campaign promise certainly the administration has made other campaign promises
00:16:25.460 and TBD if they will come to fruition.
00:16:28.180 But this was a very clear one.
00:16:29.600 So this is sort of making good
00:16:30.720 on a very explicit promise.
00:16:32.580 You might hear Black women referred to 1.00
00:16:33.920 as the backbone of the Democratic Party. 1.00
00:16:35.940 And that's because we are reliable voters
00:16:38.200 who tend to vote Democrat.
00:16:39.740 And we tend to go out there
00:16:41.760 and organize our friends and our family
00:16:43.400 and our communities to also vote as well.
00:16:45.880 If you look at the numbers, 0.94
00:16:47.220 Black women, I think it was like
00:16:49.280 less than 1% of Black women voted for Trump.
00:16:51.560 So we pretty much,
00:16:52.380 we are pretty reliable voters
00:16:55.040 for the Democrats, I guess I'll put it that way. 1.00
00:16:59.360 And an overwhelming majority of Black women,
00:17:01.400 I think it was 93%, supported Biden
00:17:03.660 during his presidential bid in 2020.
00:17:05.760 Right before voting began in South Carolina
00:17:07.700 during South Carolina's primary,
00:17:09.500 Biden made a very clear campaign promise
00:17:11.620 to nominate a Black woman to the Supreme Court.
00:17:14.080 And so, yeah, this was a very clear promise
00:17:18.140 that he made to a constituency that is reliable,
00:17:22.200 that really did a lot of the work
00:17:24.360 and a lot of the ground game of getting out the vote
00:17:27.360 and organizing our communities to get out the vote as well.
00:17:30.760 Right.
00:17:31.120 And going back to what you mentioned
00:17:33.560 when it comes to all of these sexist, racist attacks
00:17:38.480 that a lot of women and women of color
00:17:40.540 and especially Black women face
00:17:42.040 when it comes to elections like this 1.00
00:17:45.160 or nominations like this,
00:17:46.440 and then also misinformation and disinformation,
00:17:49.400 it's one thing to kind of say that, 0.84
00:17:51.480 like, okay, let's elect a Black woman 1.00
00:17:53.520 and then another to provide the necessary support. 1.00
00:17:57.700 Absolutely.
00:17:58.580 So, you know, we hear, like,
00:18:00.100 I have a shirt that says, trust Black women.
00:18:02.960 You know, we hear a lot of slogans about,
00:18:05.360 you know, the importance of electing Black women
00:18:07.100 and really amplifying our political leadership.
00:18:09.760 And again, I feel like that is great.
00:18:12.740 Representation is so great.
00:18:14.220 However, it really does need to go along
00:18:16.840 with the work of creating the conditions 0.88
00:18:19.180 so these women will be supported,
00:18:20.980 but they're not, it's going to be, you know, 0.75
00:18:23.520 fodder for unfair, sexist, racist attacks purely based on their identity, who they are.
00:18:30.520 And so I don't want to just have Black women or women or women of color. I don't want to 0.99
00:18:36.540 just have us be amplified as leaders if we're going to be set up to fail, if we're going to
00:18:41.660 be set up to compete in a completely unequal playing field. I want to amplify the leadership
00:18:48.360 of women, but I also want to create the conditions that we actually can thrive.
00:18:53.900 And so I think that that's really what I want to get into today about some of the ways that
00:18:58.000 our media landscape are kind of set up to ensure that this person will not get a fair shake.
00:19:04.800 I have to say, like, I wasn't really thrilled watching Jen Psaki from the White House kind 0.99
00:19:09.040 of give this tepid acknowledgement of the kind of racism and sexism that would go along 1.00
00:19:14.180 with picking a Black woman for the Supreme Court nominee.
00:19:16.460 She said that Biden's intention to pick a black woman for the Supreme Court presented, quote, specific challenges.
00:19:22.400 But in my opinion, that really doesn't go far enough in naming and lifting up the kind of racist, sexist attacks and media climate that are setting this person up to face.
00:19:31.940 And that can really be tricky because, as I'm sure a lot of people listening can probably attest to, it can be sometimes difficult to call out the kind of unfair attacks that we face as marginalized people. 0.65
00:19:43.940 So if you're a woman who is facing sexism, sometimes if you if you are the one to vocalize that, that only kind of goes against you because then you're the complainer, you're the nag.
00:19:54.280 And so if you're in a climate where you can't really call out what you're facing and the people around you aren't going to explicitly call out what you're facing, then it's just allowed to fester like uncalled out. 0.63
00:20:06.960 Yeah, I found it interesting because as you had brought this to our attention, I hadn't realized he had made an announcement.
00:20:13.040 We just knew the promises that President Biden had given, finally naming a name and trying to look her up and seeing who she was.
00:20:20.240 Of course, one of the top things that I saw was a congressman going in on attacks and being repeatedly attacking them, just obviously already ready to go.
00:20:29.240 Oddly enough, the same congressman was the one that had been one of three Republicans who had voted her in her federal seat.
00:20:34.700 And we were like, wait, so how is she qualified then and not now? But we know the answer, obviously, of why they are very upset about this pick in general. In all of the game of politics, we understand that. But as it comes along, that is part of that conversation where I'm like, I know, I don't even want to mention who it is because I don't want to amplify that even more. Instead, let's talk about her qualifications and why she is qualified to lead us in this type of position.
00:21:02.780 Absolutely. 1.00
00:21:03.920 So even before Judge Jackson was named as the nominee, people were wasting no time lobbying these completely ridiculous, unfair, sexist attacks on her. 1.00
00:21:15.080 Just we don't even know who she is. 0.86
00:21:16.380 She was just a hypothetical person. 0.82
00:21:18.100 Senator John Kennedy, he told Politico, I want a nominee who knows a law book from a J.Crew catalog.
00:21:23.820 I want a nominee who is not going to try to rewrite the Constitution every other Thursday to advance a woke agenda.
00:21:30.100 And he was saying this, we didn't even know who this person was yet.
00:21:33.720 And they were already lobbying these racist, sexist attacks.
00:21:37.980 Like, why do you assume that she's not going to know what a legal brief from a J.Crew catalog? 0.70
00:21:42.220 Like, that's like reading between the lines that is obviously meant to be a sexist swipe because Biden had already expressed his intentions to nominate a black woman.
00:21:50.560 Why do you assume this person is going to be, you know, pushing a woke agenda?
00:21:54.780 And what does that even mean?
00:21:56.100 I think when you really pull apart some of these dog whistles that are used, it just reveals itself as unfair attacks rooted in identity or just complete hypocrisy.
00:22:07.820 Like, just like what you were saying, were you referencing Lindsey Graham, who was, you know, I think it was literal.
00:22:14.240 So I've been up working on this since like all day, right?
00:22:17.240 I watched the announcement come in.
00:22:18.640 I watched all the responses.
00:22:20.100 the responses. Lindsey Graham tweeted literal minutes after she was announced saying, quote,
00:22:25.560 the radical left had won over Biden. Yet Graham also voted to confirm Judge Jackson to the D.C.
00:22:31.780 Federal Appeals Court, which is the second most important court in the country, just eight months
00:22:36.140 ago this past summer. So which is it? Is this a win for the woke left? And like what was different
00:22:41.500 eight months earlier when you voted to confirm her? So it's just very interesting. At this point,
00:22:45.880 I wouldn't even like the hypocrisy is so clear that it's almost sort of like not worth pointing
00:22:52.040 out. It's like, of course, you are only interested in a bad faith assessment. You know, you don't
00:22:57.800 even expect people to look back at your own voting record to see where you actually stand on this
00:23:02.580 issue. You're just counting on people not actually spending a little bit of time and thinking about
00:23:07.260 what you're saying. Right. Yeah. We're both shaking our head with frowns. It's true, though.
00:23:13.240 It's so frustrating because it's like every time I point out something that's hypocritical, it doesn't matter anymore.
00:23:20.000 They're like, yeah, of course it is. 0.73
00:23:21.020 I mean, essentially, it's kind of what we were talking about when Amy Barrett-Cohen was confirmed, as well as Kavanaugh, about the ridiculous hypocrisy that happened between Obama administration and the Trump administration.
00:23:34.820 And now we're back again.
00:23:35.780 Now we're here again to the same conversation.
00:23:38.520 And literally half of the Republican candidates or the conservative politicians will agree. 0.98
00:23:44.600 Yeah, this is hypocritical. 0.96
00:23:46.000 This is what we do. 0.87
00:23:47.320 And they kind of just leave it at that and assume that nobody will notice.
00:23:50.980 And typically people who are already dug their heels in don't notice, won't notice because they want what they want in whatever agenda it is that they have planted themselves firmly in.
00:24:01.400 But yeah, let's talk about the fact, this is a whole different conversation, but that we have different types of terms and words like woke that have been used as a positive has now flipped so hard to a negative that everyone is automatically like, oh, he said it, he's right, it's bad.
00:24:16.900 Oh my gosh, I could talk all day.
00:24:20.540 I'll just say, so I have two things to say about this.
00:24:22.760 One is that you are so right.
00:24:25.520 There are so many words that have just become meaningless, right?
00:24:29.360 So if you're talking about a hypothetical Supreme Court nominee and you're like, oh, we don't want somebody who's woke, you don't know any – this person is a hypothetical person, so you're not – you don't know anything about their record.
00:24:40.360 You don't know anything about, like, where they stand on the issues.
00:24:42.600 So saying woke, it almost just – the only thing we know about this person is that she's going to be a black woman. 0.75
00:24:48.400 So saying you don't want someone who is woke, reading between the lines, you're using that as a stand-in for the word black, right?
00:24:55.140 And so I think that we see that time and time again where these words become stand-ins for identity and they also kind of become meaningless, right? 0.92
00:25:07.980 Like cancel culture is another one.
00:25:09.480 I remember reading, this is sort of silly, but there was this story a while ago where this guy who had been running a racehorse in the Kentucky Derby, his racehorse had been, I don't know, I'm sure there's more details to it.
00:25:22.600 but essentially his racehorse had been drug tested
00:25:26.440 and he had been like found to have drugs in his system.
00:25:29.680 So he was disqualified.
00:25:31.200 And in an interview, he was like,
00:25:32.480 oh, this is cancel culture strikes again.
00:25:34.800 And I was like, what are you even talking about?
00:25:36.520 Like, how is this cancel culture?
00:25:38.360 Like, in what way?
00:25:39.900 You got caught.
00:25:40.820 Yeah, you got caught doping your horse
00:25:43.360 and your horse was disqualified.
00:25:44.980 That's not cancel culture.
00:25:46.420 Even like, I just have a lot of questions
00:25:49.260 about the way that these words are being used.
00:25:51.420 But I think, and that's kind of the second point that I want to make about this, is that one of the reasons why I am so adamant about things like disinformation, misinformation, and just having a healthier, more honest conversation and a media landscape that facilitates those kinds of conversations is that we are no longer able to have substantive, thoughtful conversations about the issue when our ecosystem is flooded with bad faith,
00:26:19.980 clearly hypocritical rhetoric and discourse. And so, you know, even if you're someone,
00:26:25.880 let's say that you're listening and you are very conservative, you know, you probably have hated
00:26:30.760 this conversation that we've been having, but, you know, like, even if you're someone who is
00:26:34.640 very conservative, you deserve to be able to, you know, talk about your issues, talk, have a
00:26:40.700 substantive conversation and a substantive debate about where you stand on the issues.
00:26:45.200 And so I believe that when the discourse and the space is just flooded with, you know, charged rhetoric where we're talking about race or identity, but using different words, everybody loses because you're not able to have a substantive conversation about where you might agree or disagree with the Supreme Court nominee, right?
00:27:06.320 And so I think that that's my biggest issue is that we have a media ecosystem that really amplifies the most extreme, the most over-the-top statements or the most nonsense statements.
00:27:17.860 And so everybody loses, Democrat, Republican, conservative, lefty, whoever, everybody loses when we have an ecosystem that amplifies the least substantive takes because that takes away from the ability to have an actual substantive thoughtful debate or conversation about the actual issue.
00:27:36.320 And so I don't want to create the conditions for Judge Jackson to only be judged by racist, sexist tropes or caricatures or unfair attacks, because I want to talk about her actual credentials.
00:27:49.380 I want to talk about her actual record.
00:27:51.080 I want to talk about her actual character.
00:27:52.720 But disinformation and misinformation does not allow for the actual issues to take the center stage that they should.
00:28:00.100 Right.
00:28:00.820 You just kind of explained my whole conversation with my parents over the holidays.
00:28:05.400 But we won't get into that right now.
00:28:07.500 I'm just going to put that there.
00:28:09.280 It was interesting. 0.90
00:28:11.040 But, you know, and I'm thinking about this because when we talk about these terms and automatically just becoming used by media as an ecosystem to bring in the shock value, it makes me also realize that in terms of what they're talking about in woke, it is a black term that was created by the black community to kind of gift non-black people with, hey, you woke up. 0.81
00:28:34.800 congratulations you're finally seeing what we have been going through all of our generations
00:28:40.180 welcome you have woke like that's kind of that term and i hate that it has been weaponized to
00:28:46.360 this point of being used against people and when they're using it when kennedy used this he was
00:28:53.180 weaponizing this terms to a woman to an official to a judge to a professional who didn't need to
00:28:59.600 be woke. She was already there. This was her life. And not only that, if we do look at her
00:29:05.520 backgrounds and credentials, she has been doing this work. There's no conversation of her being
00:29:10.360 woke. She just is. So with that, because I'm angry about this, can we talk about some of those
00:29:15.680 qualifications? Oh, absolutely. So one of the best ways to counter all the kinds of BS, racist,
00:29:21.820 sexist attacks that you're definitely going to hear about, Judge Jackson, is to flood the space
00:29:26.780 to counter that with accurate information.
00:29:29.320 So I'm super excited to talk about her actual qualifications.
00:29:32.840 So a little bit of background information about Judge Jackson.
00:29:35.160 She was born in Washington, D.C.
00:29:36.520 Shout out to D.C., where I am also from.
00:29:39.060 She grew up in Miami, Florida.
00:29:41.080 Her parents started their career as public school teachers
00:29:43.640 and then later became administrators in the Miami-Dade County public school system.
00:29:47.540 I love this little fun fact about her.
00:29:49.880 Judge Jackson was a star student, 0.61
00:29:51.640 but she was told not to set her sights too high by a guidance counselor
00:29:55.000 when she told that guidance counselor
00:29:56.660 that she wanted to go to Harvard.
00:29:58.280 And guess where she ended up going to college?
00:30:01.660 Harvard? 1.00
00:30:02.440 Harvard.
00:30:03.100 Oh, yes.
00:30:06.400 That's right. 1.00
00:30:07.100 So she definitely like shut that guidance counselor right up. 0.99
00:30:10.240 She studied government at Harvard University
00:30:12.000 and attended Harvard Law School
00:30:13.400 where she was the supervising editor
00:30:15.200 of the Harvard Law Review.
00:30:16.800 So her educational credentials are pretty solid.
00:30:20.860 Yeah, yeah, I would say so.
00:30:22.700 I love that too.
00:30:23.500 I hope that the guidance counselor knows.
00:30:27.180 It's like, oh.
00:30:28.480 Oh, he knows now.
00:30:30.040 Obviously.
00:30:32.060 So something else about her is that she is absurdly qualified in experience.
00:30:36.300 So this is from Steve Ledeck.
00:30:38.280 Judge Jackson has 8.9 years of prior judicial experience.
00:30:41.860 That's more than four of our current justices, Thomas, Roberts, Kagan, and Barrett, had combined.
00:30:48.220 It's also more than four of the last 10 justices had at their confirmations.
00:30:51.500 confirmations, nine of the last 17, and 43 of 58 appointed since 1900. So anybody who tells you
00:30:59.000 she is not experienced, anybody that tells you that she's not qualified, anybody that tells you 0.67
00:31:04.340 that she only got this position because she's a Black woman is just misinformed, and they're 0.65
00:31:09.100 spreading misinformation. Because as we can see, she's very qualified, more qualified than, you
00:31:14.600 know, some of the current Supreme Court justices. Right. Which is infuriating. But yes, also,
00:31:21.500 as you mentioned, she's already
00:31:23.600 gone through a lot of vetting, right?
00:31:25.600 Absolutely. So this is something else that I think
00:31:27.540 people really need to understand.
00:31:29.620 She has been vetted a ton.
00:31:31.940 She has a proven track record of
00:31:33.440 attracting bipartisan support in the Senate.
00:31:35.940 She's already been confirmed three
00:31:37.540 times on a bipartisan vote, so
00:31:39.480 there is no reason to not expect 0.99
00:31:41.560 the same now that she's being considered for the Supreme
00:31:43.600 Court. Again, Lindsey Graham voted 1.00
00:31:45.480 to confirm her, Murkowski voted to 0.97
00:31:47.500 confirm her, and Collins voted to confirm
00:31:49.480 her, right? So these are Republicans who broke ranks with their party to side with Democrats
00:31:53.720 to vote to confirm her. And so having already gone through this process, I would really want,
00:31:59.480 you know, someone like Lindsey Graham to sit down with me and explain what changed over the last
00:32:03.440 eight months when he voted to confirm her to the second most important court in the country
00:32:07.400 to now if he is saying that she is not an appropriate choice. And the same with Collins
00:32:12.720 and Murkowski. There's no reason to expect that she should not be able to be confirmed by the
00:32:18.540 Senate, considering she's been vetted and gone through this process three different times before.
00:32:23.860 There are certain people that like thinking about talking to them makes my skin crawl.
00:32:28.900 Grandma's one of them. But yes.
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00:32:44.820 the veggies will the pesto survive the first bite will the lunchbox come home empty half full or
00:32:50.460 come home at all and will you finish episode 8 before you're done slicing the cucumbers
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00:33:39.500 If your bookshelf and your For You page
00:33:41.500 are equally important to your personality,
00:33:43.920 welcome home.
00:33:45.440 This is Prose Society,
00:33:47.680 the weekly podcast that's part book club,
00:33:50.080 part group chat for thought daughters,
00:33:51.860 pop culture obsessives,
00:33:53.060 and anyone who thinks Pride and Prejudice
00:33:54.860 and Love Island deserve the same level of discourse.
00:33:57.900 I'm Eli Rallo, and every week,
00:33:59.620 we're connecting the dots between books,
00:34:01.600 the internet, and the conversations
00:34:03.020 everyone can't stop having.
00:34:05.080 I'm going to have to look up this story.
00:34:06.940 I'm obsessed, I'm obsessed.
00:34:08.620 From best-selling authors and your favorite book talk creators
00:34:11.220 to the latest pop culture moments, nothing is off the table.
00:34:14.940 It's like if you can hide some real messages inside compelling characters,
00:34:20.520 then that is a Trojan horse.
00:34:22.400 Whether you're looking for literary deep dives, smart pop culture conversations,
00:34:26.420 or a community of readers who love to think a little too much,
00:34:29.920 you're in the right place.
00:34:31.280 Listen to Pro Society on the iHeartRadio app,
00:34:34.200 Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
00:34:37.540 See you between the pages.
00:34:39.580 When I was 14 years old, I was kidnapped and held captive for nine months.
00:34:45.440 I survived, and I've spent my life exploring how other people survive what should have destroyed them.
00:34:51.880 I'm Elizabeth Smart, and these are the Survivor Files.
00:34:55.580 I just remember this low, taunting voice next to my ear saying, 0.99
00:35:00.720 Shut up. Don't say anything. 0.99
00:35:03.660 Every week, I'm with survivors who live through the unthinkable.
00:35:08.200 I knew if he woke up, without a doubt, he was going to hurt me.
00:35:12.780 I started feeling that there was someone at the end of my bed, and I just started screaming.
00:35:20.200 They are abducted, stalked, controlled, and nearly silenced.
00:35:24.180 But these aren't stories about what's taken from them.
00:35:27.600 They're stories about what it takes to make it out alive.
00:35:30.740 Listen to The Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
00:35:45.340 I do find it interesting, and this is a whole different conversation again.
00:35:49.020 You know how I'll have to sidetrack.
00:35:50.620 It is an interesting strategy that Biden and his administration has pulled,
00:35:54.280 Not only because this is obviously telling, it's like, okay, this is one of the most qualified people that we could find that we think is deserving and has earned a place in this position.
00:36:05.020 If you, who oppose everything we do, are starting to start arguing, it's going to be a telltale sign of who you are and what you're doing.
00:36:13.320 So it's an interesting turn.
00:36:15.400 Again, that's a whole different conversation because I've always been interested in a good political thriller.
00:36:19.720 And this feels like, you know, I have to do everything a little fictional or movie-esque.
00:36:23.140 Yeah.
00:36:24.960 It's so true because, like, you know, I was thinking about that this morning.
00:36:29.680 I do think it's clear to me that the administration picked someone who had already been, like, gone through this process a few times just so that it would be, you know, to sort of shut down any kind of, you know, consternation there might be in terms of, like, you know, like vetting her and all of that.
00:36:47.000 And I think it really demonstrates something.
00:36:49.220 I'm not totally sure. This is not a completely fleshed out thought, and I'm not totally sure how it fits into this conversation.
00:36:55.300 But I do think there is this standard for women, women of color and black women where we have to be extra special qualified.
00:37:04.140 Kind of that standard of women have to do 130, 40, 50 percent more than men in general.
00:37:11.220 And then when you're a part of the marginalized community, add on another 20 percent. 0.80
00:37:15.220 And then if you're a black woman, add on another 30 percent of exceeding the standard, exceeding the qualifications, because for some reason you have to be on that level in order to be seen as serious. 0.86
00:37:29.540 So that's just in general. 0.50
00:37:31.080 So let's put that in this federal level where they are putting her under a microscope in every way and not only putting her under a microscope to twist and turn truce, they're going to tell flat out lies.
00:37:42.640 We know this.
00:37:43.620 It's already happening.
00:37:44.600 That's what they're doing.
00:37:45.780 And we saw this with Kamala Harris, which I really found fascinating because Kamala Harris has a track record as the attorney general. 1.00
00:37:53.240 They blasted her, rightfully so, for her track record in criminalizing people in general.
00:37:59.280 and when I found out Judge Jackson comes from the public defender field, correct?
00:38:05.260 That's right. So super, super exciting.
00:38:07.700 Not only would she be historic as the first Black woman on the Supreme Court, 0.88
00:38:11.300 but also the first public defender to serve on the court, which is a big deal.
00:38:15.880 She has a long personal history of working as a public defender.
00:38:19.040 While she was at Harvard, a relative was sentenced to life in prison for a nonviolent drug offense.
00:38:23.360 And she helped convince a law firm to take his case pro bono,
00:38:26.440 eventually leading to having President Obama commute his sentence.
00:38:29.560 And so it is a big deal to have somebody on the Supreme Court
00:38:32.940 who has this legacy of public service in this way.
00:38:36.540 My brother's a lawyer.
00:38:37.320 He got his start as a public defender in Durham, North Carolina.
00:38:40.180 I just love the idea of having someone who has this history
00:38:42.800 because it's important.
00:38:44.380 I think that it's often easy to forget that public service
00:38:51.200 should be a pipeline into bigger things.
00:38:55.240 You know, like, I want to see more teachers, public educators, public servants be elevated on a national way like this.
00:39:02.380 So I love that aspect of her.
00:39:04.440 Amen.
00:39:05.540 Former social worker.
00:39:06.780 Yes.
00:39:07.320 You know.
00:39:08.660 Amen.
00:39:11.680 It's like we have this attitude where it's like, if you choose to serve the public, you're some kind of a, like, I don't know.
00:39:18.560 So I don't I don't think we give people who serve the public that the like props they deserve and they deserve a lot.
00:39:25.500 And you know what? I have been feeling some emotions for our people in Texas who are social workers that we know what's happening there.
00:39:34.120 Most people do, I think, especially our listeners. And my heart has been breaking because I already know how divisive that type of conversation is.
00:39:40.700 But going back to Judge Jackson and her public defense, like, yeah, I have worked with many public defenders and a good public defender is invaluable in the way that they have to advocate and push for truth and justice, true justice, meaning that we are hearing the side and that they are not guilty till proven otherwise.
00:40:01.760 and how oftentimes, especially in, I'm assuming DC, Atlanta, it was very similar, how often that
00:40:08.160 gets wrong. And that when we would find as a social worker who worked in the judicial system,
00:40:14.600 when I found a good defender, I went and talked to them personally to try to get them onto cases
00:40:19.280 for my kids, specifically to make sure that they got what was fair. And that is so huge. So I do,
00:40:25.860 my heart is soaring to know that we have someone in that field coming to this point.
00:40:32.520 Yeah, it's a pretty historic thing. And yeah, people who serve the public,
00:40:38.000 like thoughtfully and meaningfully, they really care about people. And so I applaud you for,
00:40:44.860 you know, going the extra mile to create the conditions for your kids to get real justice
00:40:50.000 and to have a real advocate, because that's not everybody is like that. That's like a special
00:40:53.460 thing yeah this is something that's been on my mind and I think a lot of our minds lately which
00:40:58.380 is a separate podcast but I'll mention it here is like I feel in this country we have a real 0.77
00:41:03.200 problem with glorifying like male ass as being successful like oh you manage the system get your 0.98
00:41:12.640 money like it doesn't matter the kind of like what we're talking about here with the hypocritical 0.99
00:41:16.260 nature of all these arguments being made and it's more to me it feels more about the show and like
00:41:20.820 oh, I'm a politician. I'm on TV now. Like it's glorified. Whereas we have people who are working
00:41:26.040 for the public. And in a lot of ways, these are kind of more gendered as feminine and therefore
00:41:31.300 lesser in nature, like not worth the attention, not worth the accolades, not worth the money,
00:41:37.360 even though it's so critical to a functioning society. But yeah.
00:41:44.880 Oh, my gosh. I mean, I could talk all day. The way that we have harmed everyone, a deep, deep societal harm is our legacy of not respecting jobs that we code as feminine, like traditionally feminine.
00:42:00.840 So care work, you know, social work, education, all of these things that we have coded as feminine, the deprioritization and just like outright degradation and disrespect of those, I think that the ramifications we will never fully be able to contend with as a society how much that has harmed us.
00:42:19.460 The way that, you know, people who do care work are underpaid, if they're paid at all.
00:42:25.200 Just the way that we don't even factor it in and it just falls on unpaid women, right?
00:42:31.260 Like, this is what I mean when I say women are the backbone of our country and our society.
00:42:36.000 And oftentimes that work is just completely not just unpaid, but unseen, unacknowledged. 1.00
00:42:41.460 It's just like the cost of society functioning. 0.99
00:42:44.700 And so I think that this country, sometimes the only thing that is standing between our country and, like, complete collapse is the effort and labor of some f***ing exhausted women. 1.00
00:42:55.740 I'll just put it that way. 1.00
00:42:57.240 Right. And let's be honest, at this point in time, it's black women. 1.00
00:43:00.540 Like when we talked about the elections before Biden, the Biden administration, the amount of work that has to be done, when we talked about cases like Aubrey Ahmed and all of those, how women have been forefront in protesting and bringing up all of these conversations and the continued work that they have to do.
00:43:18.600 But not only that, like not only are they working to do good, but they're often having to combat all of the disinformation and harmful things that are being said about them because they are doing the hard work.
00:43:30.540 Exactly. I mean, that really leads us back to, you know, Judge Jackson. So Judge Jackson, I think I got the email that she was going to be the pick at like 8.30 this morning. And so we're talking at 2 p.m. And so already just in a couple of hours, here are some of the unfair or just completely misleading attacks I've seen on her.
00:43:50.500 One is that, you know, her decisions have been overturned, when in reality, of her roughly 600 decisions that she has authored, she has been overruled just 2% of the time, right?
00:44:00.500 And so if someone is telling you that in her career as a judge her decisions have been routinely overruled or overturned, that's just not true.
00:44:08.100 It's happened less than 2% of the time. 0.95
00:44:10.840 The idea that she's an affirmative action hire, that she only got the job because she's a black woman, when in reality she is clearly absurdly qualified to the point where even talking about it seems ridiculous. 0.95
00:44:21.100 This idea that she's too woke or too radical.
00:44:24.080 One thing I would say is really be wary of people throwing things like that around without being able to point to a specific ruling or policy or argument that she makes.
00:44:34.540 So just saying somebody, so-and-so is too radical and then not having it be attached to any kind of actual policy that you think demonstrates that, be wary of people who are saying that.
00:44:46.280 Because in my opinion, nine times out of ten when someone is saying that, what they actually mean is this person is a black woman. 0.59
00:44:52.220 And then this idea of just sort of kind of connecting her to things for no real reason with no real explanation as to like why you are connecting her to these things.
00:45:02.660 And so earlier today, Mitch McConnell tweeted, the Senate must conduct a rigorous, exhaustive review of Judge Jackson's nomination to the Supreme Court.
00:45:11.100 This is especially crucial as American families face major crises that connect directly to our legal system, such as skyrocketing violent crime and open borders.
00:45:19.040 So what does Judge Jackson have to do with open borders exactly?
00:45:22.500 What does she have to do with violent crime exactly?
00:45:24.140 You know, the fact that he's just throwing her in, you know, connecting her to these things, I think really, I think this is a moment where we will really be rewarded by really thinking critically about what people are saying and what they're saying in between the lines.
00:45:39.300 And I think that really, to me, demonstrates a tricky truth about the nature of racialized and gender disinformation.
00:45:46.700 I think most people can tell you that there is misleading or inaccurate information out there about like COVID or vaccines, but misinformation can be a lot trickier to spot and talk about when it relies on dog whistles.
00:45:59.200 You know, the same way that someone might say like, oh, a woman is too emotional to lead. 0.87
00:46:04.360 And that's just code for being a woman.
00:46:06.320 Oftentimes people are using dog whistles or coded language to attack women, women of color and other marginalized folks with this kind of like highly coded language that can be so tough to really call out and talk about for what it is.
00:46:20.960 Yeah. And it's such a, again, it's one of those things, it's such a double standard and it's so hypocritical. 0.80
00:46:27.420 but I think back to Kavanaugh 0.94
00:46:28.940 and he's like crying
00:46:29.820 these angry tears
00:46:31.060 at his like confirmation
00:46:33.260 and I'm like wait
00:46:35.160 this is what
00:46:36.380 you're not going to call him emotional
00:46:38.300 no it's
00:46:38.820 he's being awarded
00:46:40.800 for being emotional as a man
00:46:42.600 because that's difficult
00:46:43.740 for them to do
00:46:44.520 because he's crying
00:46:45.120 because he's being accused
00:46:46.100 of sexual assault
00:46:46.920 but hey no one really cares
00:46:48.400 alright
00:46:48.820 yes
00:46:51.320 isn't it funny how like
00:46:53.100 we've branded
00:46:54.620 anger
00:46:55.560 as not an emotion 1.00
00:46:56.980 So like, oh, women are too emotional.
00:46:58.900 It's like, well, men, if men get angry in public, is that not an emotion? 0.61
00:47:03.200 And how come the too emotional, you know, banner is not used to identify that as an emotion?
00:47:09.780 Yes.
00:47:10.420 Oh, I could talk about that forever.
00:47:12.720 I got so many thoughts about that.
00:47:14.220 Wait, what is that cartoon with all the emotions?
00:47:17.940 Oh, Inside Out.
00:47:19.520 Inside Out.
00:47:20.420 Well, Inside Out taught me different.
00:47:22.400 Anger is emotion.
00:47:23.120 I saw it.
00:47:24.660 I'm surprised you saw that.
00:47:26.020 You avoid those sad children.
00:47:27.480 I do.
00:47:28.180 I cried.
00:47:29.460 Well,
00:47:29.620 I cried a lot.
00:47:31.360 Again,
00:47:31.680 I was sad last night.
00:47:32.500 My partner tried to make me watch Paddington again.
00:47:34.080 I was like,
00:47:34.280 how dare you?
00:47:35.360 I cried.
00:47:35.940 I can't.
00:47:36.660 No,
00:47:37.060 it was Paddington too.
00:47:38.060 I didn't trust him after the first one.
00:47:40.200 Anyway.
00:47:40.380 That's fair.
00:47:41.720 That's fair.
00:47:44.120 Something else that I has been on my mind and has been a source of frustration for a lot of us and that we've talked about on your segments when you come on Bridget is this kind of what you mentioned is like,
00:47:56.020 Not only is Judge Jackson facing all of this job interview that's very intensive, but then there's all of these attacks online that are racist and sexist.
00:48:12.720 We've talked about it. It's not unique to this area because we've talked about it in terms of video games and we've talked about it in terms of entertainment, but I feel like that's already a term of gatekeeping.
00:48:21.400 that's already an extra thing you're asking people
00:48:23.360 and the people that know them,
00:48:25.120 like their families and friends, to deal with.
00:48:28.500 And we just seem to accept that as the status quo
00:48:32.120 of being a marginalized person
00:48:34.160 that exists in our media landscape.
00:48:38.100 Absolutely.
00:48:38.840 You know, I'm so glad that you put it that way
00:48:42.540 because I think that we have this understanding
00:48:44.860 that it's just the cost of doing business
00:48:46.840 as a marginalized person.
00:48:48.360 And if you don't want this kind of thing to happen to you,
00:48:50.900 then just don't speak and don't express opinions and don't strive and don't put yourself out there
00:48:55.880 and don't become a public figure and don't serve your public and don't, like, it's just a whole
00:48:59.480 list of don'ts. And so I really want to urge people to have a shift around their understanding
00:49:04.860 of that and say, like, we deserve to have a media landscape where everybody can speak up,
00:49:09.400 everybody can participate, and that you're not going to be attacked unfairly based on your
00:49:13.820 identity just for putting yourself out there. And so I want to quickly talk about some research
00:49:17.640 from the Institute for Strategic Dialogue.
00:49:20.000 They analyzed social media abuse of candidates 0.99
00:49:22.020 and found that women of color candidates
00:49:23.860 are targeted on social media at alarming rates.
00:49:26.400 They analyzed all these different messages
00:49:28.080 that these candidates were getting,
00:49:30.220 and they found that abusive messages
00:49:31.760 accounted for more than 15% of those 0.61
00:49:34.280 directed at every female lawmaker they analyzed, 0.99
00:49:36.720 compared with around 5% to 10% of the male candidates. 0.99
00:49:40.220 Women of color were particularly likely to be targeted.
00:49:43.000 Representative Ilhan Omar got the highest proportion,
00:49:45.820 39% of abusive messages of all the candidates.
00:49:48.840 And AOC got the highest ratio of abusive comments on Facebook.
00:49:52.560 And when you're talking about women,
00:49:54.420 the abuse directed towards women is much more likely to be about their gender
00:49:57.640 than the abuse that's targeting men.
00:49:59.840 Abuse targeting men was much more generalized and focused on their political stances,
00:50:03.440 while messages directed at women were much more likely to focus on either appearance or general competence.
00:50:10.080 And so, yeah, I mean, if you are a woman or a marginalized person
00:50:13.900 who is putting yourself out there in this way,
00:50:15.900 you deserve to be judged on your merits,
00:50:18.140 your record, your words, your deeds, your values,
00:50:20.660 not your identity, not racist, sexist tropes,
00:50:24.380 not, you know, nonsense about women or women of color
00:50:27.400 not being good leaders or being unqualified.
00:50:29.920 You deserve to really have your record speak for itself.
00:50:32.480 And I have to say, it's not just sort of,
00:50:34.920 I talk a lot about, you know, online bad actors.
00:50:39.120 It's not just fringe extremists.
00:50:41.020 We also see mainstream media outlets
00:50:43.400 playing a huge role in legitimizing and mainstreaming racist, sexist attacks on women of color in public office.
00:50:50.460 And so, you know, you might see things like an article about some complete racist nonsense or a complete racist attack being quoted in the headline of an article
00:51:00.240 so that when people share it on social media, it provides the impression that this is a legitimate grievance that somebody might have instead of just a racist attack, right?
00:51:08.360 And so we are really calling on media to not create the conditions for these kind of racist, sexist attacks to fester and spread.
00:51:17.000 Right. I think that this is a time that really requires everybody, whether you are a journalist or an editor or just a regular person on social media, to really be careful and thoughtful about how you are talking about this very visible black woman who is going up for this very visible position in the Supreme Court.
00:51:36.220 Okay. I feel like you just led us into this. So tell us, the listeners and us voters and constituents who are here to not only look and see and view and be the audience, but participate in help stopping this harmful disinformation.
00:51:53.320 What do we need to do to make sure that we are not only engaging in that, but not being a part of that, but not spreading that?
00:52:00.960 Oh, I'm so glad you asked.
00:52:02.000 So first is just, you know, if you see like a harmful racist, sexist attack or a conspiracy theory, first and foremost, don't spread it.
00:52:10.440 Nine times out of ten, if you see this kind of thing, if you retweet it or like comment on it, you're actually just helping it grow and spread because of the algorithmic nature of most of our social media platforms.
00:52:20.780 And so the platform is going to think like, oh, this person is engaging with this.
00:52:24.240 It must be good content.
00:52:25.180 I'm going to surface it for more people.
00:52:26.760 So don't do that.
00:52:27.700 Focus instead on sharing accurate, timely information about the issues and the candidates, right?
00:52:34.100 So talk to people about Judge Jackson's actual record. 0.56
00:52:38.400 Talk to people about her actual positions and where she actually stands. 0.96
00:52:41.860 That will kind of provide a little bit of taking the oxygen out of the kinds of racist, sexist, gendered attacks we are sure to see.
00:52:49.120 You can go to weareultraviolet.org and check out our media kit, really asking for the media to create the conditions for this person to be, you know, fairly judged and fairly talked about and fairly assessed by the American public.
00:53:02.980 And also the last one I would say is like, just really ask questions and be, I think this is a time where we will really be rewarded if we are interested in being critical thinkers, right?
00:53:13.880 So when someone says like, oh, she's too radical, but can't give you a single thing that backs up what they're saying.
00:53:20.000 Or when someone says like, oh, she's just going to be really woke, you know, really being able to ask, you know, what do you mean by that?
00:53:25.500 When you say woke, what does that mean?
00:53:27.680 What are you trying to say?
00:53:28.580 I have found that to be really useful when I'm having conversations, particularly with people that may not be aligned with me politically.
00:53:35.500 You know, really getting down to what is the substantive thing that you are trying to say? 0.83
00:53:40.800 And if the answer is, well, I just don't like her because she's a black woman and I don't like black women, then say that so we can, you know, address that for what it is. 0.99
00:53:50.720 Be loud about it because, you know, you're already pretty much saying it. 0.99
00:53:53.720 Right. Like say it with your chest if you're going to say it.
00:53:56.300 Right. I just do it. You're already doing it. It feels hypocritical for me to ask this. So I
00:54:01.420 apologize for the jump. But as non-black women and for our male identifying listeners, what can
00:54:09.720 we do to make sure because we know we already know black women are stressed the out. But the 0.97
00:54:17.260 fact of the matter is with this is going to come on to so many more attacks is visceral. We know
00:54:23.040 what's going to happen we know it and it's going to be harmful and it's going to be gross and not
00:54:27.260 only should we do all the things that you told us to do but what can we do to ease the load a but
00:54:33.700 help fight for y'all in general i love this question i would say first of all it's probably
00:54:42.460 a tall order but i would love to see a shift where we understand that this fight is all of our fight
00:54:50.060 Like, we are the, you know, the more marginalized you are, the more you are a target.
00:54:54.280 But this kind of thing really harms us all.
00:54:56.800 And so I think seeing this work as all of our work to create a healthy democracy is really key.
00:55:03.320 And so these kinds of attacks, they don't just hurt the women that are subjected to them.
00:55:07.840 They really have a meaningful impact on the health and well-being of our democracy.
00:55:13.420 because we can't have a fully functioning representative democracy if everybody is not
00:55:19.440 able to use their voice, if everybody is not able to participate. And so step one of that
00:55:24.280 really comes with having a healthy media ecosystem and a healthy climate for everybody to be able
00:55:29.900 to participate. And so I would say really working to see these attacks on marginalized people as
00:55:36.300 all of our fight, because all of us are invested in having a healthy democracy, whether you are
00:55:40.040 a man, a woman, black, white, like it is all of our fight. And so really being able to,
00:55:46.820 to see this as something that you're meaningfully invested in, not just because it's the right
00:55:52.120 thing to do, which it is, but because we all deserve to have a functioning democracy.
00:55:57.620 Yes. I love it. Well said as always, Bridget. Any other resources you want to shout out? Any
00:56:03.060 final thoughts? Yeah, I would, I have to just, again, shout out the work of Cistis Scotus. They
00:56:09.400 have been really doing a lot of the work of building this infrastructure to hold Biden
00:56:14.720 accountable for this campaign promise that he made. So their website is awesome. The women who
00:56:18.680 run it are awesome. So definitely check them out. You can check out Ultraviolet's work. You know, 1.00
00:56:22.900 we are doing a lot of the work of trying to inoculate folks against disinformation and,
00:56:28.340 like, help people spot it when they see it and identify it. So you can check us out at
00:56:32.380 weareultraviolet.org. And, of course, you can always check out my podcast,
00:56:36.520 There are no girls on the internet.
00:56:38.320 Check out our new season, which is dropping March 1st. 0.99
00:56:42.020 And yeah, we would love to have you there.
00:56:44.140 Yes, yes.
00:56:45.440 Award-winning podcast.
00:56:47.580 You haven't hit that subscribe button already.
00:56:49.960 Why?
00:56:51.260 Yes.
00:56:51.740 Why?
00:56:52.700 Yes, I agree.
00:56:53.900 Why?
00:56:54.300 What are you waiting for?
00:56:55.160 What are you doing?
00:56:56.440 What are you doing with your life?
00:56:59.700 Yes, which as this episode releases, that should just be airing.
00:57:04.380 So perfectly timely, very exciting.
00:57:07.300 And we can't wait to talk to you again, Bridget.
00:57:09.860 Thank you, thank you, thank you so much
00:57:11.400 as always for being here.
00:57:12.920 You are the best.
00:57:13.600 We love you.
00:57:14.700 Thank you so much for having me.
00:57:15.840 It's been kind of fun talking about this
00:57:17.600 like very timely issue that is like happening today
00:57:20.340 as opposed to looking back on it.
00:57:22.460 So thank you for giving me the space to do that.
00:57:25.080 Yes, absolutely.
00:57:26.260 Anytime.
00:57:27.400 And thank you listeners for listening.
00:57:29.360 If you would like to contact us,
00:57:30.420 you can or email us
00:57:31.480 stephaniamomstuff at iheartmedia.com.
00:57:33.180 You can find us on Twitter at MomStuffPodcast or on Instagram at Stuff I've Never Told You.
00:57:36.560 Thanks, as always, to our super producer, Christina.
00:57:38.480 We love you, too, Christina.
00:57:40.340 Yes, you're the best.
00:57:41.600 We love you.
00:57:42.440 And thanks to you for listening.
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00:59:04.260 Hey, this is Hayes Davenport. And Sean Clements. We host the podcast Hollywood Handbook.
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