00:00:49.980If your bookshelf and your For You page are equally important to your personality, welcome home.
00:00:55.400Pro Society is a weekly podcast that's part book club, part group chat for anyone who thinks Pride and Prejudice and Love Island deserve the same level of discourse.
00:01:04.060Each week, we're connecting the dots between books, the internet, and pop culture with your favorite writers, book talk creators, and plenty of overthought opinions.
00:03:12.140So I reached out to Emily Vanderwerf, the critic at large for Vox.com.
00:03:18.460Emily's piece, How the Matrix Universalized a Trans Experience and Helped Me Accept My Own, explores how the Matrix spoke to her own experiences as a trans woman.
00:03:27.840You can find the link to the piece in the episode description.
00:03:31.440Now, I was really excited to connect with Emily, but while we were going back and forth to confirm the details of our interview, I could tell something was up.
00:03:40.580That day, Harper's Magazine published a letter denouncing what is sometimes known as cancel culture,
00:03:46.060complaining that the freedom of speech and free exchange of ideas are being stifled by intolerant voices on the left.
00:03:52.020The letter was signed by people like Harry Potter author J.K. Rowling, who has a history of anti-trans speech.
00:03:58.440The letter fits a common pattern in which people with power attempt to portray public critiques of powerful people as unacceptable,
00:04:05.660even when they use their power to harm people less powerful than them.
00:04:10.780Someone who also signed on to the letter works with Emily at Fox.
00:04:14.860Pretty understandably, finding out that one of her co-workers also signed on to this letter
00:09:20.780On its most basic level, the movie follows characters
00:09:23.960who break free of their real life via the internet,
00:09:26.820creating online identities that feel more real than their physical ones.
00:09:31.520Once there, they choose new name for themselves,
00:09:33.980their clothes become a whole lot cooler and less traditionally gendered.
00:09:37.040In fact, rumor has it the role of Switch, the blonde side character in The Matrix, was originally meant to be a character who explicitly explores gender in The Matrix, but the studio ended up cutting it.
00:09:48.640So in terms of the character of Switch, there is this rumor that the Wachowskis wanted this character named Switch to be played by two different actors.
00:10:00.200I believe it would be a man in reality and a woman in The Matrix.
00:10:05.140and that was supposed to be kind of an example of like how the matrix could let you explore your
00:10:10.300truest self because um there is i believe that that um morpheus says at some point early in the
00:10:18.120film that like who you are in the matrix is like your your brain's self-image so in that case switch
00:10:23.460would be like oh my self-image is a woman and the only place i can be that is in the matrix and that
00:10:28.000would have complicated the whole clean dynamic between reality and the matrix so much more
00:10:34.080The rumor is that Warner Brothers wouldn't allow the Wachowskis to include it.
00:10:38.400It's been very hard for people to track down the source of this story.
00:10:42.160I tend to believe it because I have talked to people who heard about it.
00:10:46.360But, you know, and it also really fits with what we know about the Wachowskis now, which0.95
00:10:51.760is, I think, which is, I think, why it might be a little too clean and convenient.
00:10:55.000But it certainly would have been cool.
00:23:10.740At its core, The Matrix is about someone seeking out the framework for understanding who they really are and having a hard time figuring out what it all means.
00:23:20.020At the beginning of the film, Neo's life is, quote, normal.
00:23:24.640Life follows a specific routine, but online, things are different.0.93
00:23:29.300And while The Matrix can be read as a metaphor for trans identity, built by two trans women,
00:23:34.420it's pretty interesting that the language of the red pill has been latched onto by anti-feminist white supremacist groups.
00:23:40.460In those online spaces, being, quote, red-pilled is a means for men to open their eyes to all the
00:23:48.040ways that women and feminists have misled them. And it's kind of funny when you think about it.
00:23:53.340Yeah, I think there is this element of trying to build careful, scripted routines for yourself
00:24:00.040that I found to be often very true of pre-coming out trans people across the board. You don't0.98
00:24:07.200entirely understand the gender you were born into, but you can make rules for yourself. You can create
00:24:13.540a programming language. You can exist within it. That's exactly what Neo's doing at the start of
00:24:18.480the movie. He has all these routines. He has all these subsystems. He's a program working within
00:24:23.760a program. And when he breaks out of the matrix, he begins to understand the ways in which he was
00:24:31.580misled and the ways in which society, the ways in which society did not give him a language for who
00:24:39.800he was. So yeah, I think there is, I think there is a lot of metaphorical power to that idea of
00:24:47.520the red pill. Clearly a lot of people have taken different ideas from it, but there is metaphorical
00:24:53.780power to this idea that you're being lied to. Your life is a program. You do not have free will.
00:24:59.800You need to develop free will by any means necessary, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.
00:25:04.940And that is such a beautiful idea and a beautiful realization of trans identities that is simultaneously something that apparently spoke to the alt-right.
00:25:15.160so which is so funny i mean you point this out in your piece that the alt-right sees like taking
00:25:20.480the red pill as this you know breaking through this lie that you know that has been holding down
00:25:27.520men and we're so oppressed but it's like actually you're latching on to something that trans women
00:25:32.380like like a framework that trans women built for you you know it's like very it's like almost kind0.57
00:25:37.340of funny oh yeah yeah yeah um it's uh it's horribly hilariously misguided but at the same time0.91
00:25:47.400it makes sense because like i said earlier this movie is pretty anti-capitalist not like hugely
00:25:55.240anti-capitalist but quite a bit and there's this right there's this range of movies from the 90s
00:26:01.820that are sort of about the ways in which the quote unquote victory of capitalism over communism
00:26:09.980and sort of the end of history, as the writer Francis Fukuyama dubbed it, the end of history
00:26:17.740had resulted in neoliberalism triumphing over everything else and capitalism, the best system
00:26:23.500and all of this. And there's all these movies about, well, then why does that feel so empty?
00:26:30.760You know, you have, I think, an early example of that is Groundhog Day.
00:26:34.920Groundhog Day is about, like, being trapped in these routines that don't really make sense
00:26:39.080and then learning to become a better person through those routines.
00:26:42.300But right in the year The Matrix comes out, 1999, you have The Matrix, which is about
00:27:00.060it's like kind of a fucked up movie when you think about it yeah fight club is good but so0.76
00:27:05.820many people have taken the wrong message from it that um it's it's also harder to defend at least0.82
00:27:10.600with the matrix you can be like yeah a lot of people have taken the wrong message from this
00:27:13.740but it was directed by two trans women so um but yeah there's this element of anti-capitalism
00:27:21.200so when people are like i need to reject the prison that society has placed me in
00:27:26.100they're so they're so close to what this movie is about they're so close to this idea that like
00:27:32.080even if you don't want to go so far as to say capitalism is broken to say that consumerism
00:27:37.020is broken the idea that you can find freedom and self and identity in things like in essence i
00:27:44.460think every major philosophy every major religion rejects that idea things are not ourselves we are
00:27:49.820not our things so like at the very least that's what the matrix is really talking about so to talk
00:27:56.380about like to take get that far get that far in grasping its message and get to a place where
00:28:03.220you're like actually it's talking about how women have made the world bad like i don't know how you
00:28:08.560make that that swerve but every time i talk about this movie and i talk about it as an allegory for
00:28:14.360trans identities um you know like vox or someone posts it on facebook and the comments are full of
00:28:19.720people who are like, no, it's not about that. It's about this. And like, yes, that is absolutely
00:28:23.480your right to that interpretation. That's how criticism works. That's how our understanding
00:28:29.540of art and the death of the author and all of that works. But at a certain point, the fact that
00:28:34.600it was written by two trans women and directed by two trans women has to enter into your
00:28:40.560consideration of what it's all about. And that for a lot of people, the idea that it's a trans
00:28:48.420metaphor is mind-blowing. Like a friend of mine, Erin Reed, another trans woman posted on Twitter,
00:28:57.240you know, the matrix was directed by two trans women. And there's a metaphor for coming out
00:29:00.540something that simple. And like 50,000 people liked it. And we're like, this blew my mind. And
00:29:06.140the sis, I just don't know what we're going to do.0.69
00:29:09.800Why do you think the idea that the matrix is a metaphor for the trans experience kind of goes
00:29:13.640overlooked so often? I mean, it's metaphor. Let's take a look at Star Wars. Star Wars is probably
00:29:20.900the movie before The Matrix. Yeah, it's definitely the movie before The Matrix that changed the film
00:29:25.340industry the most. And The Matrix lives in Star Wars shadow in the way that everything after The
00:29:29.920Matrix lives in The Matrix's shadow. So you look back at Star Wars. Star Wars is a movie that George
00:29:36.220Lucas, when he started writing it, was like, okay, America's the empire, the Viet Cong are the rebels.
00:29:42.080yet Americans always self-identify with the rebels because, you know, that's how we like
00:29:48.120to think of ourselves. Our foundational myth is scrappy underdogs overcoming this gigantic
00:29:54.820colonial power. But we don't think about how the makeup of those scrappy underdogs was all white0.79
00:30:00.180landowning men, you know, many of whom were slave owners, many of, and even other people,
00:30:05.100you know, who weren't slave owners had done other horrible things. And we were displacing
00:30:09.220indigenous peoples and forcing them to move further and further west. And there's a lot to1.00
00:30:14.460that foundational myth that gets written out so we can see ourselves as the rebel alliance in Star
00:30:19.240Wars. But the movies continue to make more and more explicit that any colonial power like the
00:30:26.240United States is in line with the empire and the people who are being colonized are in line with
00:30:32.240the rebels. And yet, you know, we still continue to be like, yep, we're the rebel alliance.
00:30:36.840It's anytime you take a story that is based in reality and move it into metaphor, there's going to be so many people who are like, yeah, I see this metaphor as directly reflecting my experience.
00:30:46.440And like, that's fair. That's fine. You know, like all of those interpretations are valid.
00:30:52.560That's what happens when you're dealing with metaphor. And science fiction is inevitably always based on metaphor in some way.
00:30:59.120I think it's important to take into mind that two trans women made this film, but I'm also a trans woman.
00:31:03.360I like the fact that there's this gigantic, defining piece of pop culture directed by two trans women.
00:31:10.040When I got to interview Lily Wachowski, I nearly crumbled into dust.1.00
00:31:14.240Like I almost fell into fell onto the floor.
00:31:17.420And then she said she'd read my article.
00:32:47.680And I think especially when you grow up as a seemingly, when you grow up seeming to the world like a white, straight, cis man, you don't encounter a lot of structural oppression.
00:33:01.620One of the ways that film and television helps us understand ourselves better is exposes us to the stories of other people.
00:33:11.780um for instance i am never going to have the experience of growing up that uh barry jenkins
00:33:20.460and terrell alvin mccreary did but moonlight is a movie that opens that window to me i can't
00:33:27.620completely understand it but i can empathize with it because i've seen through that window i've seen
00:33:31.720people live those lives and the thing that happens is when you that film and television
00:33:37.340are such potent, powerful expressions of the self
00:37:35.500That is part of what I think is part of my reason to be on this planet,
00:37:38.440is to help those trans women find their way.
00:37:41.720And I wake up to two or three DMs from guys who are like,
00:37:46.040hey, you're beautiful. Hey, you know, and it's not even like bad. It's just kind of like,
00:37:50.780I don't need this. And I just delete them. And like, that's just become, I realized the other
00:37:56.440day that has become a low level radiation hump in my life. I'm just like, you know what? This
00:38:01.260is a thing I have to put up with. And I shouldn't have to put up with it. It's not a thing I should
00:38:06.980have to put up with, but you just get inured to it. You're just like, okay, I'm a woman online.
00:38:12.600This is just how it is. And that also goes for, you know, being a trans woman online. There are people who really don't like trans women, but I tend to have them blocked or I tend to have them, I tend to not listen to them and just, you know, immediately get rid of them from my feed.
00:38:29.140there are just as many people who and these are trickier to find usually there are people who
00:38:35.720fetishize trans identities uh there's people there are there are you know men who um love
00:38:42.580trans women and like want to but have turned it into kind of a fetish and have turned my identity
00:38:48.740into kind of a fetish and in the community we call them chasers um i don't know if i'm like
00:38:53.360breaking a breaking a law saying that among the cis but um uh and like they're harder to find
00:39:01.480because they're often just like they reply to you and they're like you're great way to go and you're
00:39:06.120like oh thank you for your support good male ally but sometimes and the problem is sometimes they're
00:39:11.740what we call eggs you know which is a trans woman who hasn't yet self-accepted but is knocking at
00:39:16.480that door and like them saying you're a great way to go like i remember when laura jane grace the
00:39:21.240singer from against me came out i posted a comment on my website the av club where i was
00:39:26.140writing at the time i posted a comment that was like good for her she did great and it's really
00:39:31.240good whenever anyone can overcome you know find themselves blah blah blah and if you go find it
00:39:36.180it's so obviously about myself and i don't know how to say that and it's just yeah but at the time
00:39:42.360i just was like yay what a great thing and like that's the problem you can't always tell the
00:39:48.320people who fetishize you from the people who really do just want to celebrate you or the
00:39:51.580people who are celebrating you because they want to celebrate themselves because there's huge
00:39:55.280overlap in all of those areas so i guess on some level i just got used to the low level
00:40:02.360radiation hum of terrible people on another level um i mentioned earlier my best friend
00:42:00.820And yes, I have been subject to Twitter harassment, um, both on a hugely large scale and on a really minor scale where you just learn to tune it out, which is maybe not what you should do. The second I came out, somebody on 4chan, um, doctored up an article supposedly written by me about how, uh, white babies are white supremacy.0.91
00:42:20.800that i had supposedly written this and it was obviously fake it didn't use any of boxes type
00:42:28.360faces it was uh written published under the the my old name and then the last name van werff which
00:42:35.200is a name i've never used it's so lazy honestly the thing i respect least is the craftsmanship
00:42:44.340like if you want to try to like get me uh in trouble with people you can at least like make
00:42:51.120it look real right yeah you google it it doesn't come up i identify myself as a person of color
00:42:56.980within it when i'm very obviously like just milky white um i and my friends used to call me the
00:43:03.080milkman corn fed captain america midwestern shocks and so many people have approached me
00:43:13.600about is this you did you do this and there's so many people who like are online and are just like
00:43:17.860yep this is yet another trans woman who uh just thinks you know blah blah blah blah blah it's0.99
00:43:23.780people project shit onto me all the time now people just project whatever they want to on me0.98
00:43:28.060that's the thing i've realized um i'm trying to write about this i'm trying to write about the0.99
00:43:31.160harassment trans women in in the world are our phantoms people hear us they see us but they
00:43:39.340don't really they they have conjured a version of us that they believe in so much more strongly0.54
00:43:44.760and we can be in the same room with them and there can be uh something making noise upstairs
00:43:50.820you know rattling chains or thumping around on the floor and people will be like there's that
00:43:55.180trans woman again and you can be there be like i'm not that i'm this person i'm someone else
00:44:00.680and that's all they'll hear is the phantom but then you'll find someone who's in the room with
00:44:09.080you and sees you and knows you and says, hi, you are the person I've been looking for my whole
00:44:15.300life. It's worth it. It's worth it for that. When people have, quote, intellectual debate
00:44:22.460about trans people, they talk about them like they're this abstract concept conjured up for
00:44:27.220the sake of argument. And even when media outlets wrote about the harassment Emily faced after
00:44:32.000speaking up when her co-worker signed the Harper's letter, they covered it like some
00:44:36.060kind of petty ideological workplace dispute. But this is about Emily's actual life and her actual
00:44:42.420lived experience as a trans woman. Gender is hard-coded into us in a way that I think is hard
00:44:47.260for cis people to understand or imagine. I think art is the best way to express that. I can tell
00:44:52.480you all the times until I'm blue in the face that womanhood makes more sense to me, that taking
00:44:57.240estrogen made my brain come alive in a way it never had, that my body increasingly feels like
00:45:04.460my body. And before it was just kind of like this abstraction that I existed within that now I can
00:45:10.820be like, yeah, it would be cool to look like Keanu Reeves for a day, but I would immediately want to
00:45:15.140come back to who I am right now, because this is home. This is what feels like home. I mean,
00:45:20.480it would be cool to look like Keanu Reeves for a day. He's very handsome. He's very handsome.
00:45:24.420Don't know if you've noticed, but more after this quick break.
00:45:34.460Behind every night spent making the kids' lunches, there's a lot of suspense.
00:46:58.880Every week, I'm with survivors who live through the unthinkable.
00:47:03.420I knew if he woke up, without a doubt, he was going to hurt me.
00:47:07.980I started feeling that there was someone at the end of my bed, and I just started screaming.
00:47:15.420They are abducted, stalked, controlled, and nearly silenced.
00:47:19.380But these aren't stories about what's taken from them.
00:47:22.820They're stories about what it takes to make it out alive.
00:47:25.960Listen to The Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
00:47:34.920If your bookshelf and your For You page are equally important to your personality, welcome home.
00:47:40.840This is Prose Society, the weekly podcast that's part book club, part group chat for thought daughters, pop culture obsessives, and anyone who thinks Pride and Prejudice and Love Island deserve the same level of discourse.
00:47:53.320I'm Eli Rallo, and every week we're connecting the dots between books, the internet, and the conversations everyone can't stop having.
00:48:00.440I'm going to have to look up this story. I'm obsessed. I'm obsessed.
00:48:03.920From best-selling authors and your favorite book talk creators to the latest pop culture moments, nothing is off the table.
00:48:09.960It's like if you can hide some real messages inside compelling characters, then that is a Trojan horse.
00:48:17.440Whether you're looking for literary deep dives, smart pop culture conversations, or a community of readers who love to think a little too much, you're in the right place.
00:48:27.040Listen to Pro Society on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
00:49:04.600you might just be a cis guy who has like these restrictions that have been placed on you that
00:49:10.400you don't feel comfortable with and learning what those are and better defining yourself
00:49:14.680is fine is good is optimal everybody should have to examine why their gender is the way it is and
00:49:21.640what about the ways it's been programmed in for them work for them and what don't i'm a very
00:49:26.580feminine trans woman i've run all the way in the opposite direction of how i was raised but i like
00:49:32.320it i like wearing dresses and i like you know going out for for for brunch with my girlfriends
00:49:37.100when we can leave the house um i like all those things that you associate with an extremely basic
00:49:42.980white lady because i'm an extremely basic white lady but like that feels good that feels like home
00:49:47.620i want everybody's gender to feel like home to them and i think for many cis people it doesn't
00:49:52.160and they don't look into it and they don't understand why when it might be just one thing
00:49:56.220It might be just like, okay, yeah, I'm a cis guy, but this thing where we all sit around and compare notes about women we've had sex with, it doesn't feel good to me.
00:50:50.440you're probably just going to land on yeah i'm a man or yeah i'm a woman but you might go somewhere
00:50:55.420more interesting you know i think i see one of the things that i think is really um encouraging
00:51:00.400to me is the number of people who use he they or she they pronouns which is like yeah okay i'm
00:51:07.580comfortable being identified as a man or a woman but there is this part of me that does not fit
00:51:13.860that binary. And that is where the they comes in. It's somewhere in the mushy middle. And most of us
00:51:21.400live in the mushy middle. Like, yeah, I'm very feminine, but I have several traditionally
00:51:27.180masculine things I like. That doesn't make me non-binary. I don't want to claim that identity.
00:51:32.000So that is encouraging to me, this idea that more people are accepting that gender is flexible,
00:51:38.640That it can change over time, that you can have better understanding of yourself over time, that whatever was hard-coded into you by society is not necessarily what's hard-coded into you by you.
00:51:50.880I mean, you're seeing so many seemingly heterosexual people now be like, you know, I think I might be bi, or I think I might be pan, because that door is open.
00:52:00.860and I think that's going to happen with gender and I'm excited for it to happen with gender and I
00:52:05.760hope it happens with gender because I don't think any of us is holy man or holy woman we're all
00:52:12.100some combination of things from those those types and then we just we use words and pronouns to
00:52:18.180describe who we are and it's always an exact really early on in transition I read um something
00:52:23.960along the lines of there's I don't I think it's eight billion people there's eight billion people
00:52:27.520on the planet's 38 billion genders. And that seems like a lot, but yeah, gender is a vastly
00:52:34.180personal experience. And then we create these umbrellas to place them under. And we only had1.00
00:52:38.020two for a long time. Now we have a bunch more and that's good. That's great. I think it is an
00:52:43.120exciting time. I think that in the US especially, there is a dawning awareness of the ways in which
00:52:51.060trans identities are real and intersect with other identities, be that, you know, womanhood,
00:52:57.720be that racial identities. There's a much greater awareness of the ways that trans women of color,
00:53:05.160particularly Black and Latina, particularly Black and Latina trans women are hugely at
00:53:10.780danger of violent crime. And like, but there is now increasingly an awareness of that. Awareness
00:53:15.220is not action. Awareness does not save the lives of any of those Black trans women.0.79
00:53:21.380But hopefully it makes it easier and better and more just for future generations. And hopefully
00:53:27.080that life expectancy raises up to a level where the same as any of the rest of us get to lead long
00:53:34.140and fulfilling lives. And we have things we need to work on in the US, where it's far worse as the
00:53:41.120uk the uk has become uh just a disaster area for trans people the structural uh barriers they face0.87
00:53:48.060the degree to which uh folks with very large platforms like jk rowling are making it harder
00:53:53.260for people to exist there i live in a country the united states where there's a a extremely
00:53:59.960conservative supreme court that is making the country demonstrably a worse place for equality
00:54:05.420and yet they enshrined trans rights basically um like the very baseline level of trans rights let's
00:54:12.980not go crazy like the least they could do the least they could do they enshrined it because
00:54:17.840they were like you know what the constitution forces us to do this and like that was the piece
00:54:22.180was like you know what i don't want to do this but i kind of have to so thank you thank you neil
00:54:28.860Gorsuch for that. That's not happening in the UK. The UK is increasingly run by transphobic people
00:54:36.920for transphobic people. And that's going to be a fight we have to win. That's going to be a fight
00:54:42.120I'm glad to undertake. But also I'm not in the UK. I have trans woman friends in the UK and they are
00:54:48.860terrified, you know, especially now that the UK is no longer in the EU and they can't just decamp
00:54:54.340for like Germany or a country that's better for trans rights, you know, I'm going to have to marry1.00
00:54:59.560all of them so they can move to the U.S. Where we have the, you know what, I don't want to do this,1.00
00:55:06.680but I have to. While Emily was offline, her friends took over her social media accounts
00:55:11.960so she wouldn't have to deal with the barrage of threats and harassment. Her friends used the
00:55:16.920opportunity to raise money for House of Tulip, an organization that supports trans and gender
00:55:22.560nonconforming folks experiencing homelessness as a way of finding a little light amidst all the
00:55:28.080darkness. So what have the last 48 hours been like for you? The thing I found so interesting is
00:55:34.680when I was harassed, it was about 48 hours of the worst I've ever been online. And I posted a thread
00:55:42.800about how hard it had been and just like how I couldn't sleep and how I faced death threats and
00:55:48.860how I just kind of wanted to no longer exist. Not in a self-harmy way, just like, oh, it's really
00:55:55.440hard to be alive right now. So I posted that. And a friend of mine who works at Twitter and then
00:56:01.320people at Vox Media who have contacts at Twitter, both were like, I think I can find a way to take
00:56:06.940care of this. Instantly, the harassment dropped by probably 90%. And it wasn't because it wasn't
00:56:14.040happening. When I go and look for it, I can still find it, but I really have to poke around because
00:56:18.680it's been hidden beneath so many layers and good i'm glad it's hidden beneath so many layers that
00:56:24.900kind of um hateful speech is i believe you know it exists within society but doesn't have to be
00:56:32.140on privately owned platforms like if somebody wants to stand in the public square and yell0.61
00:56:36.180about how trans women shouldn't exist i'm not going to stop them but they should not be given
00:56:41.460a bullhorn you know they should not be given a bullhorn a corporation should not come down to0.93
00:56:45.820that person and hand them a bullhorn emblazoned with their symbol or their logo rather, and let
00:56:51.120them just shout into it. Like if they want to shout in the park, whatever. But what happens
00:56:57.380functionally is that online, they, you know, one person becomes 500 people. Sometimes literally,
00:57:03.200sometimes they set up 500 accounts. And sometimes it's just like, they shout loud enough that other
00:57:07.780people start shouting what they're shouting. Other people start shouting what they're shouting. And
00:57:10.840like, sometimes that's how good ideas spread. But most of the time, that's how bad ideas spread.
00:57:15.640We know so much about how that takes people who maybe have a couple of questions about trans identities that they're not sure about, and it radicalizes them.
00:57:24.700It pushes them further and further in the direction of transphobia.
00:57:27.500And then there's somebody right there reaching out their hand to be like, have you heard about anti-Semitism?
00:57:32.500Or, you know, have you heard about racism?
00:57:34.940Here are some of the other things you can do to make the world a worse place.