00:01:04.780So Whitman reported out the book The Second Fifty.
00:01:09.000It's an indispensable guide for living well, well into your second decade.
00:01:14.120Now, I'm not exactly there yet, but Nick Astor just turned the 5-0,
00:01:18.620even though he doesn't look it. It's unfair. It is actually unfair, to be honest.
00:01:24.980And so many, so many of my friends are grappling with caregiving for their aging parents right now.
00:01:31.400So this is a book we should all be reading, and this is a conversation that we should all be
00:01:35.460having. I think we all need to get more comfortable with the things that make us uncomfortable.
00:01:40.060rule i was about to hit my 50th birthday and i realized there was like a lot of questions that
00:01:53.080i didn't know the answers to or knew pieces of them um or i'd never really saw it through how
00:01:58.980will i die so um so i wrote down i wrote down the questions i wanted to now and they're you know
00:02:05.000some basic things like how long will i live and will i be healthy um some practical questions like
00:02:12.660um how long will i work and will i have enough money and um then some tough questions will i
00:02:21.020lose my memory and um and how will i die and so for each of them i really dove into the research
00:02:29.800I talked to people. I did surveys. And I learned a lot. And hopefully, it's going to be helpful
00:02:37.840for people as they either are approaching their second 50 or are in it and are tackling one of
00:02:44.600these tough questions themselves. Yes, absolutely. I'm 44. My husband just turned 50. These are all
00:02:52.460things that suddenly we're facing as we're also still parents of a two-year-old. So in so many
00:02:59.960ways, it feels like, how are we here already? How are you here in the second half of your life?
00:03:07.220And there are things that I also think is easy not to face. And for a long time, a lot of
00:03:14.100generations just didn't talk about these things. They just said, well, you know, we'll just,
00:03:17.860we'll wait and see what happens uh and so diving into your book is such a treat i gave it to
00:03:25.780my husband nick who still really also doesn't believe he's 50 he's just and some people he
00:03:30.520has great hair so people don't think he's 50 but it's so helpful and so useful what were you most
00:03:37.980surprised about when you started digging into all this research so a few things one is things that
00:03:46.200I knew on the surface, um, the why is behind it. So things like, um, I knew women live longer than1.00
00:03:54.460men. Um, even though your husband is, um, is older in general, we live women in the United
00:04:01.620States live six years longer. Um, but I didn't understand why. And a piece of it's due to
00:04:08.060biology and a piece of it's due to differences in behavior between men and women. Um, men are less0.81
00:04:15.640likely to go to a doctor when they're sick. They're more likely to be in a war. They shoot
00:04:21.080war guns. You know, those types of things shorten men's life expectancy. And our home ones also0.57
00:04:28.820protect us at about a couple years of life. So things like that where I knew the what,
00:04:36.480but not the why. And then there were some things where I thought I was right. I thought I was going
00:04:42.060to write the chapter and know what I was talking about. And I called an expert and kind of got
00:04:47.280schooled because the information has changed. So I thought everybody needs an advanced directive
00:04:54.460to help them make sure that their wishes are respected at the end of life. And it turns out,
00:05:00.720A, they're not followed. And B, sometimes we check boxes that we think when we're young and
00:05:06.600healthy or what we want. And then COVID hits and you check the box that says, I don't want to be
00:05:12.540put on a ventilator. And so, you know, maybe that's not the best piece of paper, isn't your
00:05:20.380wishes. Maybe you should talk to somebody who can be there for you in the moment and sort of assess
00:05:25.360the situation. And that's what the experts told me. So, so throughout the whole thing, there was
00:05:31.100a lot of learning and what I've heard from people either looking at their own second 50 that it's
00:05:38.480helped them sort of think through and have conversations and plan or I have two friends
00:05:43.740that are taking care of their parents right now and are very heavily reading several chapters
00:05:50.140like where will I live trying to think through you know whether their parents can stay in their home
00:05:56.200And what is the care type things that they need and how do they afford it?
00:05:59.980All of those types of things that I raise.
00:06:03.280Yeah, I mean, those are things that we're already thinking about, honestly.
00:06:08.320I mean, also, I think, you know, life expectancies, as life expectancies are growing, we're not necessarily seeing, you know, the quality of life extending as long.
00:06:21.200So, you know, how do you stay as healthy as possible, as long as possible, as self-sufficient
00:07:38.700and you sort of had a sense that this was coming.
00:07:42.360There really hasn't been a what to expect
00:07:44.320when you're aging book in the same way
00:07:46.220that we have what to expect when you're expecting we really have it and i mean this is this is
00:07:52.240actually the closest that i've seen to what to expect when you're aging book i i had toyed with
00:07:57.620that topic or that title at one point um but it's kind of a whole industry so yeah i don't think it's
00:08:03.680as sexy as this either like i just don't i don't think it's gonna fly off the shelves
00:08:07.280and also because no one wants to think that they're aging right and so by calling it the
00:08:15.380second 50. It's like, oh, this is just like the second half of your life, not necessarily your
00:08:20.240aging or old. And so many people look at the, you know, 50 as the end of your life. I don't know if
00:08:26.500your husband celebrated his 50 with a big, you know, giant party for that he'd made it halfway
00:08:31.780or not. But it's not. And another key message of the book is it's actually not all bad. Yes,
00:08:41.640there might be more health issues but you also have more time um people are from here as they
00:08:48.060age actually the lowest rates of happiness are for us in our 40s and 50s that sounds i get that
00:08:54.760rates of happiness and even if we ask people about their health and they have lots of health issues
00:09:00.500um they say i'm doing pretty well um all things under consideration so um you know the the the
00:09:09.540fears that we have about aging, even dementia. Half of us think we're going to get dementia,
00:09:15.140but at least 17% of people in their 70s even have mild cognitive impairment. So we have all this
00:09:21.280built up worst case scenario rather than seeing I'm going to have time. I'm going to have wisdom.
00:09:30.140I'm going to have all these other good things that I can do. Right. Right. Exactly. Exactly.
00:09:35.000I want us to take a really quick break here. And when we get back, I want to hear about that last chapter, about what are some of the bipartisan solutions that can be put in place now to make aging just better for everyone, for the people that are doing it, and then also for the caregivers.
00:09:52.760okay we're back you've you've lived in the world of policy making for so long as you're doing all
00:10:07.760this research could you even help yourself but to think of solutions to every chapter that you
00:10:13.380were reporting on well that's been my day job for the last 20 years and trying to push through
00:10:20.780solutions and and there are solutions that are out there even bipartisan solutions so um for
00:10:26.840example half of workers today can't save through their paycheck for retirement we have a voluntary
00:10:35.180system for employers employer can offer you a 401k or not um and mostly small business have too much
00:10:41.780to do um and so it's people that work in small businesses more women more people of color that0.98
00:10:48.600are less likely to be able to save through their paycheck every time. And we know it's like 14-fold
00:10:55.400difference between whether you have that access or not, whether you save for your future.
00:11:01.360And it's not that people don't want to necessarily. It's hard to do by yourself. DIY
00:11:06.920is a difficult thing to think of for 40 years in advance. So we've been passing laws now in 20
00:11:14.380states, red states, blue states, purple states, to set up programs that allow workers who
00:11:21.300aren't covered by their employer to save through their paycheck through the state-managed
00:11:44.380You know, at this point, we need bipartisan solutions, and I don't think it should be a partisan issue, you know, to prepare people to have a wonderful second half of their life, you know, to prepare better for aging.
00:12:03.140Are there other countries that just do this really well?
00:12:07.840So one of the great things, part of my job is to look at what other countries do.
00:12:12.360um and also to try and make aging better all over the world so working with the united nations and
00:12:19.780the world bank and oecd and others and so so we have looked at a lot of other countries
00:12:25.520there's a couple differences between us and them um one is most of their programs are universal
00:12:31.460so it's not employer-based both health insurance and retirement savings in the united states
00:12:38.280people get through their employer or have to figure it out on their own that's not true in
00:12:44.280a lot of other countries a lot of other countries also don't just provide medical care in as part
00:12:50.820of their health system so you know if you uh need surgery if you need an expensive drug
00:12:58.020medicare covers that um if you need help at home it doesn't it also doesn't cover your ears your
00:13:04.560eyes or your teeth three things which age with the rest of you but for medicare was never part
00:13:11.780of medicare and still isn't so um so the holes in the u.s systems are different um and more people
00:13:20.800are falling into them over time as we have an aging population and so that's one of the messages
00:13:26.300of this is we have more of us aging but we we have not thought about it in a holistic way
00:13:33.400and created the policies that's not going to just help the current older generation,
00:13:39.400but your generation, your kids' generation, you know, these are issues that we need to fix now
00:13:45.120that can help families today, but also people as they age in the future.
00:13:51.340Why do you think there has, why do you think it has been difficult for so long to talk about aging,
00:18:38.980Oh, my gosh, many things. I told Nick Astor that if I were to pass quite early, you know,
00:18:45.080earlier than we expect, that he and his new wife will have to carry my ashes together up to the
00:18:51.220top of Mount Kilimanjaro. Kilimanjaro. Yes, because Nick and I, we wrote, I wrote a book
00:18:57.040called How to Be Married, uh, the first year of our marriage. And we climbed, we climbed Kilimanjaro
00:19:03.800together. And, uh, Nick, who's very fit, much more fit than I am, uh, was not able to climb it
00:19:09.340because he got altitude sickness, which you cannot predict, um, at the, at the very last second. So
00:19:14.700I told him that I want him, you know, with his lovely new partner, whoever she may be to, to
00:19:19.320finally complete this climb, but they have to take me with them and talk about me the entire way up
00:19:23.760the mountain it's every step every step every step is really about me my husband wants me to
00:19:29.480carry him to the top of um aspen mountain ajax uh which i've done in my fit days but it's not an
00:19:38.100easy hike at altitude um so my kids have promised if i have to take the gondola they'll they'll
00:19:45.000carry him up they'll carry him up our wedding vows were that we're gonna uh we're gonna love
00:19:50.600each other till we're 103 so you know he's not allowed to go before then and he's a year older
00:19:57.020so that's like makes you know that last year a little complicated for me because well yeah you'll
00:20:02.080just you know you'll be in mourning victorian mourning for that last year yeah exactly exactly
00:20:07.540invest in some beautiful black dresses let's take one more quick break we'll be right back
00:20:11.900so as you were writing this book this all these questions are impacting both you and your husband
00:20:25.640you open the book with a story about his heart attack what did the two of you learn about what
00:20:31.400you want from your relationship for the next 50 years so so this is really important i'm glad you
00:20:38.980actually ask because there's um there's several things that can keep us healthy and living longer
00:20:43.880um and i'm happy to tell you in your audience what they are i want to i want to hear i want
00:20:48.540to hear all of them the biggest question i get um but one of them is relationships um so i i
00:20:54.640interviewed um bob waldinger who's a professor at harvard um and he's done this study of people
00:21:01.020where they survey them um from their childhood to to um now they're in their 90s and you know
00:21:08.280adding adding more people of their family they took the healthy 80 year olds and compared them
00:21:12.980to the unhealthy 80 year olds and he looked back at their 50s and said what's different
00:21:16.540was it their cholesterol was better were they better exercisers and it was the quality of
00:21:22.660their relationships the people who were the healthiest had really solid relationships
00:21:28.380earlier in life and so you know we don't always think of our friends and family as
00:21:34.680health promoting um but it is really important um in our second 50 to have those close relationships
00:21:41.540um you want to hear the other things that i want to hear them all yeah bring bring it on
00:21:45.900i'll tell you the five five ones that you've could probably uh say off the top of your head
00:21:51.680yourself it's um uh exercise eat right don't smoke don't drink too much um and maintain a
00:22:01.280healthy body weight. That'll give you about a decade of healthy life. Even if you do one of
00:22:07.240those, you live an extra two years. But this research actually really surprised me. And it
00:22:15.480surprised me how strong and robust it is that if you have a positive view on aging, if you think
00:22:23.400that aging is a term of wisdom and ability to give back, you live seven and a half years longer.
00:22:30.400wow that's seven and a half years that's more than you're eating right and exercise
00:22:35.640and you have lower risk of cardiovascular disease um your dementia risk goes down
00:22:43.700um all kinds even when they looked at the brains of people who had died and then look back to see
00:22:51.140at their same rate with a positive or you know negative views um their brains uh had less plaques
00:22:57.500So, you know, when we think about healthy aging, mindsets and relationships really often aren't the first things that come to mind. It's the eating right and exercising and no alcohol. But the other things also really matter in our future.
00:23:15.380Yeah, I think that one is so interesting to me. I mean, I knew that was true about community, but it's become, I mean, it's become even more of a priority for me. I mean, it has been, you know, since having kids, I think that new mothers need a community desperately, but we don't talk nearly as much about how we need a community as we age.
00:23:37.320And I've been thinking about that a lot lately. I'm like, where do I want to be? Who do I want to be with? Starting now, you know, leading up to the second half and then in the second half of my life. How how have you two talked about this and planned for your future?
00:23:53.820so um glenn's heart attack really made him um both be really positive and appreciate where he
00:24:01.960is in life like you know i think the the rush with death um made him um very reflective on
00:24:10.940how lucky he is to be alive so he even wrote uh over 50 letters to uh friends and family
00:24:17.940former coaches, former teachers, thanking them. So that sense of gratitude is also really important
00:24:24.760to our health. And then, you know, I think we're just trying to invest more in our friendships
00:24:30.440and in our family. I had a good friend over for, cooked her dinner last week. We're headed to my
00:24:37.240husband's uncle's 90th birthday party this Saturday in New Jersey. Happy birthday, Barry.